Draft U.S. paper allows commanders to seek preemptive nuke strikes

[ECH1969]

The U.S. military plans to allow regional combatant commanders to request the president for approval to carry out preemptive nuclear strikes against possible attacks on the United States or its allies with weapons of mass destruction, according to a draft new nuclear operations paper.

The paper, drafted by the Joint Chiefs of Staff of the U.S. Armed Forces, also revealed that submarines which make port calls in Yokosuka, Sasebo and Okinawa in Japan are prepared for reloading nuclear warheads if necessary to deal with a crisis.

"There are numerous nonstate organizations (terrorist, criminal) and about 30 nations with WMD programs, including many regional states," the paper says in allowing combatant commanders in the Pacific and other theaters to maintain an option of preemptive strikes against "rogue" states and terrorists and "request presidential approval for use of nuclear weapons" under set conditions.

Citing North Korea, Iran and some other countries as threats, the report set out contingencies for which U.S. nuclear strikes must be prepared and called for developing earth-penetrating nuclear bombs to destroy hidden underground military facilities, including those for storing WMD and ballistic missiles.

http://asia.news.yahoo.com/050501/kyodo/d89qa7lo0.html

:nuke:

[alexisfree]

1. I guess the Maya's were right Dec 2012 the end as we know it.

[havocmom]

4. Dec 2012: the end of the Material world and the beginning of

the Ether world. Hmmmm, had hoped that was prophetic about our communications via computers, but perhaps not, huh?

[lovuian]

16. well that real date would be 2007 because our calendar is

technically behind 5 years...

Who ever did our calendar was off but I'm thinking the Mayan are right on here...

[nodehopper]

23. you know

and this is not directed at just you personally, but I finally figured out why references to the Mayan calendars that are so frequent on a certain type of threads on DU bother me so.

Because, structurally, as a reaction it is no different from the fundamentalist literal interpretation of the Revelations texts in terms of the impending Rapture and how it's on the verge of happening.

[Eloriel]

27. And you find them no different because

they're NOT different, they're integrally related. They are, in fact, slightly different interpretations of the same expected event.

So expected that I don't know of any societies/cultures in the world which did not have prophecy about this era. You can ignore all that if you wish -- it's certainly no skin off our noses -- or you can be interested in this phenomenon and what it actually means for our future.

[nodehopper]

29. there were end-of-the-world prophecies for every era

And certainly every end of the century or big round date.

[Eloriel]

30. True, but this is really an order of magnitude different,

IMO.

Most of the rest of the end of the world/end of century and millennia panics didn't have quite the match with the prophecies as THIS era does.

For the record, the world isn't going to end, but there are significant changes happening, even as we speak.

[nodehopper]

35. first-world industrialized countries

are the ones where such prophecies/ideas catch on as memes with greatest ease. This is not the case in third-world countries, including the places where the cultures that worded such prophecies originated (be they Mayan or Aboriginal Australian, etc.) I'm just saying, as an anthropologist, the first thing I'd look at is what makes a culture susceptible to popularized eschatological hysteria, and capitalism and rapid technological boom seem to be common factors.

[Dhalgren]

50. When has there ever been capitalism on the scale we have now

and a "technological boom" as we have now? Never. So "common factors" as you use the phrase makes no sense. It would be like someone in the nineteen twenties saying that "every time a communist regime takes over a large agrarian country you get the same kind of thing that is happening in the Soviet Union today." The thing that makes the Mayan calendar so thought provoking is that over fifteen hundred years ago a date within the next few years was predicted to be the end of one world and the beginning of another. The date was actually given - so it is something that gives one pause, if for no other reason than that the Mayans were so sophisticated mathematically. Their numbers were good...

[nodehopper]

51. I think that's a circular argument

I'm just saying that this anxious attention to a particular set of metaphysical data that supposedly predicts a change that will affect the entire world is only a source of such intense interest and anxiety in parts of the world with a very specific socioeconomic structure and the cultural psychology that stems from it. You are saying that my argument is invalid because there has never been a technological boom like there has been now.

1. I would argue that, in fact, you had equally transformative, if not more so, technological/industrial leaps, at the end of the 19th century and then again in the 1950s, with the Space Age and

2. That does not really matter because I am not making an argument that has anything to do with WHEN the technological boom happened, I am saying that right now there are countries with very different cultural climates as a result of where they are at, economically and technologically, and despite rapid developments of their own in the developing countries, this eschatological focus is just not a part of the public consciousness the way it is in America. Which tells me more about America than about the Mayan prophecies.

[Dhalgren]

52. I understand what you are saying.

And it is a good point of departure for a general discussion of the phenomenon, but I would simply question the emphasis on the economic and technological development of any particular culture that has an acute eschatological element. The Jews, of course, were a very eschatological culture and our eschatological emphasis is derived from theirs (I would think). Native Americans (generally) has had a distinct eschatological vein running through their myths, from the Iroquois to the Mayans. So, if what you are saying is that given our leisure (which is a product of our economic and technological advancement) we have the time and energy to give reign to the demons of our eschatological underpinnings, then I would probably agree with you. Last night it was pretty late and I may not have fully grasped you meaning.

:hi:

[makhno]

55. Your second point is excellent

As is the rest of your analysis.

The simple fact is that late-stage capitalism and the depraved socio-political atmosphere it creates inevitably result in a pessimistic worldview among its victims, conditioned as they are not to question the inevitability of the system that they clearly (and correctly) perceive as inhuman. Unable to envision a future without the corrupting influence of the current system, people's natural wishes for the system's demise take the form of mystical beliefs into a supernatural chain of events that will ultimately liberate humanity, even if it is by death.

It's the suicidal thinking of a culture driven to desperation by capitalism and yet unable to contemplate any practical solutions to the ills that plague it.

[pokercat999]

28. Guess I'll play golf tomorrow and the next day and the next day

[havocmom]

2. Just more ducking responsibility: let's let the commanders nuke 'em

Of course, this is AFTER what amounted to a purge of the top military brass of anybody who did not follow the PNAC plan. Rummy and the Wolf got rid of enough reasonable military leaders to assure they were gonna get to see those nasty nuke mushrooms sometime on their watch. This makes it easier for them to nuke and blame others. 'See, it was the local commanders and that idiot in the White House! We didn't do anything bad!'

Bastards. There is no punishment great enough for them and that is way they just do as they please.

[cornermouse]

3. Scarey.

[Last Lemming]

5. No

terrifying

[cornermouse]

6. No point in being terrified.

Scared, yes. Terrified, no.

[seemunkee]

17. If your terrified doesn't that make them

terrorists

[blm]

7. Sounds like Bush doesn't want to be held responsible for his decisions

and while he IGNORED the advice of the military about how to go into Afghanistan and their advice NOT to go into Iraq, NOW he wants to be able to point to the military commanders and blame them for when he wants to use nukes.

[daleo]

8. Is there any wonder why some countries are trying to get there own nukes?

The current U.S. leadership is mad - how can they talk about the NNT when they are threatening to use nukes at the president's pleasure preemptively on any target they desire?

[nodehopper]

9. too bad this plan wasn't in place two years ago

We could have nuked Baghdad and all those WMDs would have disappeared forever in the atomic blast, no need to look for them.

[clem_c_rock]

10. The PNAC is the modern SS

This is all about world domination folks and nothing more.

These people could easily spark WWIII.

[tom_paine]

14. You mean the Modern Mein Kampf

The OHS (Office of Homeland Security) is the Modern SS.

[clem_c_rock]

18. exaclty - In the pentagon, the PNAC are referred to as the

brown shirts.

Quite fitting I must say.

[Frederik]

11. what a brilliant idea

:eyes: :nuke:

[lovuian]

12. Getting ready for June!!!

gotta have the paperwork all in order!!!

[potone]

13. Whatever happened to the no first use policy?

I don't know how much more of this sickening, destructive, nihilistic regime we are supposed to take--not to mention the rest of the world. Up the revolution!

[tom_paine]

15. Calling General Jack D. Ripper! Calling Slim Pickens!

I'd say the Busheviks are Crazy as Shithouse rats, but they are crazy as Hitler.

Pure and simple.

[IndianaGreen]

21. Atomic cowboys all of them!

The scariest thing about General Ripper is that he was a fictionalized version of the real-life psycho SAC Commander Curtis E. Le May. Lemar wanted President Kennedy to launch a preemptive nuclear strike against the USSR in 1962. Good thing that JFK ignored that lunatic!

[designforce]

19. Did you say Plan "R"

Seems that the premise of Dr. Strangelove is about to become reality.

Wonder if there are any generals named Ripper.

Scary man....

[Prisoner_Number_Six]

20. So each commander will have their own "football" with them

and if they happen to be captured and the codes given over to a terrorist enemy...

:nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke:

Wellll, only a LITTLE idiotic, perhaps... :sarcasm:

[liveoaktx]

22. Nuclear strikes don't constitute declaration of war, which

constitutionally is only authorized by Congress. Congress may have been idiots for Iraq but it wasn't a blank check for any and all strikes in the future.

[nodehopper]

24. you really think CONGRESS is going to be a deterrent

to this administration?

[followthemoney]

38. The only deterent will be a union of nuclear powers allied against

any first user. Bush went into Iraq only because he knew there was no nuclear strike capacity in that country. North Korea could make a mess of things so caution is the operative plan.

The fate of the world is out of our hands, America. Only external powers interested in their own personal survival can save your ass.

[bloom]

31. These are some of the same people

who did Iran Contra.

Plus I think it was Seymour Hersh who wrote about them giving themselves run-around powers.

[bloom]

32. "THE COMING WARS"

"...Rumsfeld will become even more important during the second term. In interviews with past and present intelligence and military officials, I was told that the agenda had been determined before the Presidential election, and much of it would be Rumsfeld’s responsibility. The war on terrorism would be expanded, and effectively placed under the Pentagon’s control. The President has signed a series of findings and executive orders authorizing secret commando groups and other Special Forces units to conduct covert operations against suspected terrorist targets in as many as ten nations in the Middle East and South Asia.

The President’s decision enables Rumsfeld to run the operations off the books—free from legal restrictions imposed on the C.I.A. Under current law, all C.I.A. covert activities overseas must be authorized by a Presidential finding and reported to the Senate and House intelligence committees. (The laws were enacted after a series of scandals in the nineteen-seventies involving C.I.A. domestic spying and attempted assassinations of foreign leaders.) “The Pentagon doesn’t feel obligated to report any of this to Congress,” the former high-level intelligence official said. “They don’t even call it ‘covert ops’—it’s too close to the C.I.A. phrase. In their view, it’s ‘black reconnaissance.’ They’re not even going to tell the cincs”—the regional American military commanders-in-chief. (The Defense Department and the White House did not respond to requests for comment on this story.)..."


http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?050124fa_fact

THE COMING WARS
by SEYMOUR M. HERSH
What the Pentagon can now do in secret.

[CHIMO]

25. How In The Hell

Did we get here. Now we are going to give the decision for a world wide nuclear war to regional combat commanders.
Better take those 25 countries on the list and make it the rest of the world.(They do not publish the list, so every country can assume that they are on the list)

The simple fact that this is a point for consideration means that it is just a matter of time, and not a very long time before...

[Charon]

40. Decision

The draft does not give the regional combat commanders the authority to release nuclear weapons. It allows them to request release authority from the President.

[Demeter]

26. I Support This Policy

As long as the only place they can target is the location of the idiots who gave them the green light to nuke.

[followthemoney]

42. The people of Earth need a commitment by nuclear powers

to retaliate against any first use of nuclear weapons. The only deterent to violence is a violent response.

[bloom]

33. ...

:nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :argh:

[understandinglife]

34. May 2 2005 - is just THE BEGINNING OF MNA........

.......www.missionnotaccomplished.us

[Goldeneye]

36. Hey, it worked in Iraq right?

:crazy: :wtf:

[Fovea]

37. This is so very crazy.

Even entertaining it in public documents is pathological.

This is the most transparent way to generate *the big war*, the war to return us to the bronze age. Praze cheeses!

The end timers in this administration, and their military toadies are acting like dervishes on bad acid. Really, this must end.

[OneBlueSky]

39. I honestly believe that Bush and company don't see nuclear arms . . .

as anything other than just another weapon in their available arsenal . . . nuclear weapons are, to them, something to be USED in pursuit of Pax Americana, with no consideration that they could spell the end of civilization on this planet . . . or maybe, given the coming rapture, they just don't care . . . either way, these are the most dangerous idiots in power anywhere since the advent of nuclear weapons and intercontinental missiles . . . scary mf's, indeed . . .

[chlamor]

41. Nominate-Disseminate

[malmapus]

43. Eddie Vedder might have it right as well

"I am ahead, I am advanced
I am the first mammal to make plans, yeah
I crawled the earth, but now I’m higher
Twenty-ten, watch it go to fire
It’s evolution, baby " - Do the Evolution

[Bridget Burke]

44. One longs for the good old days of MAD....

That's Mutually Assured Destruction.

Philip K Dick's "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep" was the basis for the movie "Bladerunner." The filmmakers changed quite a bit, of course. But--one thing was explained in the book that was still true in the movie--just not "explained." Why was the weather so messed up--rain all the time? Why were so many animals extinct that fakes were manufactured? Why were so many people sick--like the inventor with progeria?

There had been a nuclear war. Not The Big One, just a few bombs here & there. Just bad enough to make everything a bit worse.

[ContraBass Black]

45. Policies like this will unite humanity

As the world rises up and binds together to fell the raging elephant that has replaced the American eagle, in response to a nuclar atrocity.

:scared: :cry:

[Roland99]

46. These people are MAD with power! Dr. Strangelove would be proud

Iran is a threat?? BS!

If Iran obtains a nuke it will be as a DETERRENT not to be as an offense weapon. What would Iran have to gain by launching a nuclear strike against one of its neighbors?

[Megahurtz]

47. Our Feared Leaders

are just dying for a fight, aren't they?:nuke:

[chlamor]

48. kick

[struggle4progress]

49. This sabotages NPT renewal. These f***ers really want WWIII. eom

[raccoon]

53. Do these nitwits who are in power

think that if there is a nuclear war, that they themselves will be exempt from the radiation, nuclear winter, and other mild discomforts?

Do they think they can stay in a frigging bunker for the rest of their lives, without losing their minds (assuming that hasn't already happened)? Not quite as pleasant as a golf course on Hilton Head Island.

Do these nitwits who are in power even think?

[Lorien]

54. They WANT the rapture

read the Bill Moyers essay "The delusional is no longer marginal".