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Newsjock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:35 AM
Original message
Fourth Grader Suspended For Not Answering A WASL (test) Question
http://komotv.com/stories/36813.htm

ABERDEEN - A fourth grader has been suspended for a week because he refused to answer a question on the statewide test known as the WASL. Opponents of the test say it is proof the WASL has gone too far.

... Tyler paraphrases the question saying, "You look out one day at school and see your principal flying by a window. In several paragraphs write what happens next." He's asked, "So why didn't you answer that question?" He says, "I couldn't think of what to write the essay without making fun of the principal."

He refused to answer the question even after his mother was called to the school. Tyler's mother Amy Wolfe says, "And he said he didn't know the answer. He just didn't know what to write. And they were telling me to make him answer the question."

He still didn't, so Tyler was given a 5-day suspension. In the letter that went home to mother, the principal writes, "The fact that Tyler chose to simply refuse to work on the WASL after many reasonable requests is none other than blatant defiance and insubordination."

more
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darkism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:40 AM
Response to Original message
1. Kids these days can't write worth a damn
He should've been able to come up with SOMETHING.

But, suspending him is WAY overboard.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. The appropriate punishment for not completing a test question is
a zero on that test question. If it lowers his score that's his and his parents' business and nobody else's.
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rhite5 Donating Member (510 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 04:03 AM
Response to Reply #6
18. Look at the rest of the story before reacting ..... Here it is:
(after receiving the letter - emphasis mine)

Amy and her son were shocked. Just then the phone rang. It was the superintendent calling to apologize.

"Because I think a mistake was made and over reacting to Tyler's refusal to complete the test," said Aberdeen school superintendent Marty Kay. ..... "The situation highlights the stress that both students and staff are put under in a high stakes testing environment and I think under those situations mistakes are more likely to be made both by students and by staff members," Kay said. ....

The superintendent wants Tyler immediately re-instated at school. But Tyler’s mother says the damage has been done. Mom tells son, "Well, nobody will scream at you again. I promise you that."

Tyler wants to go to another school. And after being a supporter of the WASL, Tyler’s mother has joined the “anti-WASL” movement. WASL opponents also believe the principal and teachers broke the law by interfering with the WASL test.


btw "WASL" = Washington Assessment of Student Learning
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northzax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #6
39. actually, given the fact that WASL results
are linked to the amount of money the school gets, it becomes obvious that teachers and administrators will overreact. Imagine if the plan to tie teacher pay and bonuses to test scores comes to fruition, that one kid leaving his test blank might mean $1000 to the teacher. And we wonder why people overreact?

bah. testing. it's a joke. everyone knows it's a joke. it's like basing someone's physical fitness on their ability to run 100 yd. dash. Sure, everone can train, and almost everyone can learn to do it, somehow, but some people will be better based soley on genetics and temperment. It punishes the person who's genetic and tempermetal gifts allow her to run a marathon in under three hours or throw a javelin 150 yds. It's stupid to base everything on one assessment of one particular type of skill. And yes, I say this as a test taker, I would love it if life was based on taking standardised tests, I have never in my life tested below the 99th% on any standardised test (one exception, the Achievment test in Japanese, only did 75th%. Does that make me smarter? a better student? hell no, it makes me a better test taker. That's something useful to know, but not really relevant to anything else.

imagine basing your entire future on your ability to play Trivial pursuit, I'd be rich and famous. and yet, somehow I'm not.
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LiberallyInclined Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #39
42. yep. i'm in the same boat-
I've always tested well, and since grade school have always been a 99th percentiler, but i was never able to make it all the way thru college to the point of getting a degree- I've probably attended classes at more colleges & universities- 12 different schools, than anyone else who's never gotten a degree.
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Scairp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
13. Information
Should anyone here feel like emailing these bozos, here is a link to the district's website. I don't think that they mentioned the school this happened at, but you can email the superintendent, Marty Kay.

mkay@asd5.org

http://www.asd5.org/asd/school.htm
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Mizmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:07 AM
Response to Reply #1
28. Generalize much?
:eyes:
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MARALE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:58 AM
Response to Reply #28
49. Rude much?
:eyes:
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Mizmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #49
53. yes, darkism was rude to young people
by claiming that none of them can write worth a damn. That's why I pointed it out.
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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #1
45. he was AFRAID OF THE PRINCIPAL !!! that is why he didnt write anything
about him...
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msanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #1
71. He could come up with something----as he said, he just
couldn't write it without being disrespectful to the principal.

Cue the lietmotif of the wicked witch of the West.
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american_mutt Donating Member (36 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:41 AM
Response to Original message
2. Well, of course, he is a danger!
The most dangerous thing in a regimented society is independant thought...
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Zomby Woof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:41 AM
Response to Original message
3. WASL is a sick joke
I actually held a temp job in Seattle's wonderful economy scoring those suckers - 4th grade writing being one of the areas I scored. The teachers just spoonfeed them the key words they are supposed to include so that we can match them to the rubric. The better they were at this, the better their score. Original essays were few and far between.

This child is being punished for NOT CONFORMING, which is the Ultimate Sin in American Life, as incubated in our schools. Poor kid has the makings of a freethinking iconoclast, but it appears they are trying to smash him in his pupae stage.

No Child Left Behind, my ass.
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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 02:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
15. EXACTLY what I thought.
I've seen it done many times.
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Hekate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 03:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
17. Well said, ZombyWoof
He failed to conform. What a crock.

Hekate
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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #3
46. Child suspended for...."defiance and insubordination"
Face it, education is NOT what they are doing. They are mashing kids heads into forms for the cogs of corporate machinery.

Noticed this back with way too many formula spewing, cookie cutter MBAs back in the 80s. In the work world, too many MBA-bots were easy to beat by presenting them with something they had no formula for. Business took note of this shortcoming. So now they are deforming brains at a much earlier age so the problem of people who can think critically and independently won't come up in the workplace.

In the meantime, the rest of the workforce is being put out to pasture as the wild, useless (to Big Business) mustangs we are.

Yeah, our kids get tested seven ways to Sunday. But ask some high school students who Samuel Gompers was and you see there are some problems with their education.
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #46
54. Very good post
I especially liked the:

"They are mashing kids heads into forms for the cogs of corporate machinery."

I noticed this also during my own experiences with schooling in the 50's-60's. And in my children's schooling, being 'tested' in the 1st and 2nd grade.

I think in my case the testing, and subsequent course curriculum selections were to bring a sort of efficiency to the task of educating the youth to fill certain roles within society. Think of it as stamping out fenders in an automobile plant: this ones a Chevy, uh, definitely a Ford, hmmm, looks like a Cadillac on this one. But, at what point do the assessments become a self-fulfilling prophesy?

For example, if there is a fixed amount of money available to teach the youth, say $2000/year/student to make the example easy, and some of the education paths need $3000/year, isn't it easier to select a small group to receive the $3000/year education (these will be the titans of industry) and then some others, well they get the $1000/year education (these will be the fender stampers of the future). Do you get my drift on this thought?

So what will be the criteria used in this selection process. Lets ask our experts, the brain shrinks, they can come-up with some sort of testing that insures that only the "best", those with the right genes, you know, our own kids, get the education they deserve. And the rest? Well, the world needs ditch diggers too.

Who is it that makes the decision on if this testing is done, and what is in these tests and how the information from the tests is used?

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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #54
57. Re your experiences in education in 50s & 60s
... hmm, I was a school kid then. Tested really high in some areas and put on a different course track with a few others. More in-depth stuff and definitely different math methods. There would be men in suits watching us sorta regularly. A gaggle of nameless men in dark suits just observing.

About 65-67, they stopped coming around and we were returned to regular classes (where most of us were bored outta our minds). Some of us figured we were no longer interesting since we became teenagers. Looking back, I see a whole different view.

Funny thing, though pegged as very bright, most of us sort shrugged off
everybody else's plans for us and became champion underachievers (in the view of the powers that be). Maybe that is what they saw in 67 - rebellion of their 'cream'. Guess we curdled their 'cream' dream pretty fast.
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #57
60. To bad really,
they were able to kill so many of us in 67-72. Sometimes I think they got the best of us then. <Sigh>

I think it is being done again today, too. There are actually many uses for war, and I don't think some of the uses are discussed much.
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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #60
63. War keeps the rabble down to manageable numbers and occupies a
certain percentage of others. Keeps us un-rich focused on some enemy besides the one really harming us. Makes for great photo ops for the scions of industry posing as real people.
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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #54
58. The real criteria for who gets the good education is now just based on $$
Edited on Fri May-13-05 09:54 AM by havocmom
Thems dat gots, gets. No longer much to do with native intelligence. It is all designed to maintain class order. They ones at the top get the real facts. Everybody else's kids get programmed to be good little cogs.

And then there is the bit about testing for mental illness in all kids? And just who gets to decide what is illness and what is acceptable before the meds get forced down small, young throats?

The last thing the corporate kings want is a populace full of independent thinkers capable of critical thought.

As evidence: no more inheritance taxes for the top 2% of brats. They have to keep the $$. And the rest of the people are being trained to be totally dependent on the trickle down. NOBODY is encouraged to be self sufficient. Hell, they want farmers to have to by patented seeds now! When ya can't grow your own food from your own seed, they own your ass.
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:09 AM
Response to Reply #58
61. I hesitated t mention this was a form
Edited on Fri May-13-05 10:24 AM by Jose Diablo
of class warfare, but yes, it is.

Edit: It's a brave new world, eh?
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havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #61
62. Do NOT ever hesitate to call it what it is
Somebody needs to start speaking truth to authority AND the American people!
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CornField Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #3
68. The mantra in Iowa is "teach the test -- teach the test -- teach the test"
Nevermind problem-solving skills! Teach the test!

I'm sick of all the stupid-ass tests.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
4. Way to go, Tyler!
:headbang: :headbang: :headbang:
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
5. In Cal we can opt out of Stand. tests with a note to the school. But
the school teachers and staff are forbidden to inform you of this unless you ask directly. She should go online to read the states ed code on standardized tests.

http://www.pipeline.com/~rgibson/ca-law.html

http://www.cde.ca.gov/re/lr/rr/documents/starregs090304.pdf

scroll to page 5
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:45 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. I've heard this is also true in Oregon
but have no first-hand experience with it.
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Syncronaut Seven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:45 AM
Response to Original message
7. Sounds like a good kid
Make sure they deduct the federal funding for the child for every day he misses.

Get a lawyer, sue, write LTTE's, activate the PTA phone tree, Picket int he morning and afternoon.

I'd go PTSD on their ass.
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funflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Find another school.
Sounds like they've already been pretty successful in humilitating this guy, as it's made the local TV news.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 12:49 AM
Response to Original message
9. its too much testing, This year was the worst for us
Edited on Fri May-13-05 12:50 AM by caligirl
Junior year SAT in March, AP exams(two) this week, state testing all last week an hour and a half each day thru to this past Tues I think. SATII exams in June he has three in one day. I think he took SAT 9's last fall too.
In our district they tell the kids the standardized tests go on there college transcripts. That didn't stop my kid from filling in holes with a pattern them like his name. and for the essay question he used a great quote from Pulp Fiction.
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burrowowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:01 AM
Response to Original message
11. Hey
had he answered it wrong, he might have been given meds and suspended.
I think the kid is reasonably paranoid.
The question is typical of American so-called written questions. Better questions: what is the difference between mammals and reptiles?; What are volcanoes?, What is your favorite animal and why?; etc.

This shows he was on to them: He says, "I couldn't think of what to write the essay without making fun of the principal."
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Hekate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 04:19 AM
Response to Reply #11
19. You have a point -- the adults are humorless and repressive
The clue is in his fear of "making fun of the principal," which makes it sound like the adults in his life are humorless and repressive martinets, who have made him afraid to be creative.

The essay question as presented should have evoked a lighthearted response, e.g.: "I was staring out the window last Tuesday while my teacher was droning on about long division, when to my astonishment I saw Principal Jones go by. This wouldn't have been so unusual, but my classroom is on the third floor. What was he doing, you ask? The backstroke, I think." And so on and so forth.

But Tyler was afraid of making fun of an authority figure? Judging from their over-the-top reaction, he was absolutely right in his assessment of these idiots.

I had a fifth-grade teacher who called my mother in for a consultation about my mental health. What got her knickers in a twist was a watercolor I did of a clown with buttons down the front of his costume in the form of eyes. I actually remember enjoying painting that thing, and feeling that the eyes were a humorous touch for a clown. My mom told my teacher that my inspiration was undoubtedly Salvador Dali -- which evoked a completely blank response from this educator.

Mom, bless her, years previously had found a source of a series of cheap but good quality art books with beautifully colored reproductions. She sent away for them one by one until we had quite a large stack of about a thousand years of Western art. We kids were encouraged to look at them all we wanted to, and we did. Some ended up on our walls because the books were designed so the pictures could be removed easily.

But my fifth grade teacher thought I must be cracked because she had never heard of Surrealist art. God only knows what she would have done if Hieronymous Bosch had been on my mind that day.

Hekate
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Rainscents Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
12. Good for Tyler!!! I also believe, Teacher broke the law!
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 02:19 AM
Response to Original message
14. This Young Fellow Deserves A Medal
He is clearly an honorable lad, with plenty of guts....
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PennyLane Donating Member (240 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 02:59 AM
Response to Original message
16. Whatever Happened To The Good Old Days?
When the teacher would try to encourage a student? I listened to a coed at another table while dining out last week, who was bragging about getting a child suspended because she had poor hygiene. I can remember teachers getting a "care" package of toiletries together for kids like that when I was in school. They would discreetly take the odorous pupil aside and offer suggestions on personal care. Sometimes they would have an "improv" class on bathing. But I never remember anybody being suspended for that? I thought as she crowed to her friend, "wow, what a FINE teacher, you're gonna be!" NOT.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 04:25 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. juggling the ethics of high stakes testing and caring has got to be
tough for teachers.
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cmd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #16
33. That still happens in schools every day
You would be amazed at the number of teachers who quietly subsidize the children in their classrooms with items they know they can't afford. From basic pencils, paper and crayons to prom dresses; teachers still see that their children have the items they need.
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HeeBGBz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:00 AM
Response to Original message
21. What a stupid assed question.
So your principle is flying by the window...

Any potential answer could give those mofos reason to define the child as mentally iffy and reason to pump some medication into him.

Good on the child for refusing to answer.
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GCP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #21
69. My thought too. he was obviously too intelligent for the test
as he saw through the absurdity of the question in the first place.
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bdot Donating Member (298 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:19 AM
Response to Original message
22. man... I miss those kinds of questions
I used to love doing things way back in around 3rd grade (maybe earlier) where they give you something like that and you write a brief story about it.
Couldn't the kid have just written, "I have no idea." That would have at least been a reply.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:19 AM
Response to Original message
23. What a dumb ass question in the first place
Edited on Fri May-13-05 05:21 AM by MADem
If they want kids to be creative in their response, tell them to make up a fairy tale or a story about something or someone they are interested in. What is this shit with flying Principals? The kid IS right, how can you do that without being "disrespectful" on some level to authority??

Obviously, these tests really ARE a waste of everyone's time. Pity the poor teachers who are stuck trying to teach around this horseshit--no time for teaching reading, writing, and math, but all the time in the world for flying school officials!!! Is this part of the faith-based initiative? What if the kid said in his essay that the Principal was being raptured? Or that the Principal had morphed into Sally Field in her famous role as the Flying Nun? Would he then be suspended for bringing Jeeeeeeesus into the school?

Talk about FUBAR!

Edit, poor grammar!
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:30 AM
Response to Original message
24. This is the sad, natural consequence of ODing on tests
First, I can't believe the teacher and the principal didn't break the rules of the test and possibly state law by doing this. If they did they may well lose their licences. So there are likely to be very big consequences for this action, as there should be.

Second, the Superintendent seems to realize the mess they caused and is trying to make up for it.

What needs to be noted here though, is that in many school districts this student may have ended up having to repeat the grade for failing the test. That is perfectly legal and a much harsher punishment in my book. A kid can have all A's but if he fails the test he can be held back.

The fault for this isn't entirely the teachers' but a huge amount of blame falls on politicians for requring these tests in the first place.
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truthisfreedom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 05:56 AM
Response to Original message
25. you look out one day at school and see your principal flying by the window
because he's fired and someone booted his ass out of the school.

end of story.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:36 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. lol! oy -- that was funny!
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One_Life_To_Give Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 06:37 AM
Response to Original message
27. Principal Flys by Window
No Tornado warnings sounding.
Principal hits school wall and goes splat.
Do you really want several paragraphs describing the splated principal?
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #27
50. I agree - the kid should have been applauded for recognizing that it
was a stupid question that was offensive to him. The correct response was to not answer the question rather than make up some bullshit answer that made him feel disrespectful to the principal. The solution is to have several questions that the students can choose from to answer - or give them the option of writing on a topic of their choice - Oh that would make the test harder to "grade" wouldn't it? Sorry, I forgot that the point was to make it easier on the Educational establishment than to find out if the students can actually express themselves in writing. Haven't the powers that be in Washington State ever heard that the best writing occurs when students write about something they know about rather than some imaginary bullshit?
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #50
52. Makes sense, kid can't answer a test question so suspend him from school.
:sarcasm:

After 5 days of video games and cruising the internet I'll bet he can answer that question!
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MountainLaurel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #27
64. If that were the story
The kid would be arrested for threatening violence against the principal!
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:16 AM
Response to Original message
29. Wanna hear something stupid?
Edited on Fri May-13-05 07:16 AM by lateo
My oldest daughter is going to kindegarden this fall. My wife and I attended a meeting for the parents last night. The school administrators read us the riot act about school attendance. If a kid misses more than 3 days unexcused they will call the local Juvie detention center and have a cop come out and "talk" to us. And she you "will" talk to the cop or there will be legal consequences.


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MadisonProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:55 AM
Response to Reply #29
34. I guess we are living in Nazi Germany...your papers !!!
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Sabriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #29
43. It's really not their fault
Attendance is tied into NCLB. Absences affect the school's performance rating. Attendance problems = less money for your kid's school. What do you want them to do...ignore it and lose valuable resources? They've got their hands tied.
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marions ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:18 AM
Response to Original message
30. let this child
watch more South Park. He'll feel right at home.
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:23 AM
Response to Original message
31. Images of the Wicked Witch of the West come to mind. . . . n/t
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fed-up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 07:39 AM
Response to Original message
32. My son has been "opted out" of testing up until now (11th grade)
I saw no reason to stress my child out over standardized testing that rewards schools and teachers that "prep" their students. Since he has homeschooled for about half his school career I know that his reading, writing, reasoning skills are up to par. This year is the first year he has taken any tests as he may need them at some point for scholarships.

If a student is going to junior college first there are already qualifying tests to take that don't cost $$$ of dollars. Even those tests are easy and he passed the English and Math portions so that he was able to take college classes while in 9th grade.

He said the High School Exit exam was a joke.

Testing is just a money maker for the test makers/graders and the tutoring companies (check out Jeb Bush) and a complete waste of class time. Instead of teaching students reasoning abilities they are taught to pick the "one right" answer.

Some students don't do well in testing situations and punishing them is absurd!
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:11 AM
Response to Reply #32
35. I have to ask, when you homeschooled did you receive a stipend
from your local school district to assist with it?

If so, then why were you not required to have your son take these standardized tests?

Sadly the standardized tests are just one of many ways to determine whether or not kids are learning.

Additionally, what is your background that you determined your child was already reading and writing on par? Are you an English major? In Pennsylvania, there are strict standards for home schooling, what about your state? I am pretty sure the kids that are home schooled are also required to take the standardized tests.

I am not trying to be rude but I really want to know these answers because I see more children being pulled out of our local school district and our district is now paying over $100,000 a year for these kids to "cyber" school.
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fed-up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #35
73. No stipend, but Community college classes only cost $15 total per semester
There was no stipend, as he was homeschooled through a Charter School through the local district. Books, field trips and a monthly meeting with his certified teacher were provided.

I just signed a waiver to opt him out of the tests. Nothing covered in them that wasn't already tested via his textbooks. I take it back, he did take a test or two in 3rd grade (which was a repeat of everything we had done in second grade) and he scored in the high 90's percentile. Third grade had almost no science and little art as "those are not on the test", which was the answer I got when I asked his teacher about those subjects. I wanted my child to have a well-rounded curriculum and to learn how to think for himself, not to spend his time in school learning how to study and regurgitate for testing purposes.

My background is former EBP student (Extended Basic Program equivalent to GATE), 3 1/2 years of college-math major, former daycare provider (add some ECE credits in there) and the ability to read my son's homework. I am aware I lack really good writing skills, but do have the ability to read his work.

My son is a "GATE-Gifted and Talented" student and was frequently bored in traditional school. He now has completed two years of Japanese which was not offered in traditional school. He had 1 year of junior college credit at age 15. Cost to us-$60 total, including books. A huge difference from what it might cost him if he had to pay living expenses, books and tuition for a year as costs of education keep going up, up, up here in California!

He couldn't believe how uniformed people were in his sociology and health classes, and these were students that had gone to "traditional" high school. He was the only one in his class that stated most people were not homeless because they chose to be. They had no awareness of current events.

There are some parents that don't care if their kids learn how to learn, but I am not one of them. At least he has a love of learning for things that interest him and knows how to research things to make his own judgement on various topics.

I pulled him out of classes for at least half of the last half of 4th grade as his former "Teacher of the Year" was a psychotic nutcase. She would frequently belittle the students and was never clear about what she wanted done for homework. She said she couldn't be bothered anymore as nobody read her notes anyway, so she would then mark kids down if they couldn't figure out what she wanted.

Ten out of 32 of her students were frequent visitors to the school psychologist. Other parents I talked to said their children had nightmares, self-hairpulling incidents, were told they were dumb etc...I should add the my sister had also had her as a teacher 30 years prior and she was just as evil back then, ridiculing her for being admitted to the GATE program. Never got in trouble for his absences as I would just call the principal and let him know that I would send my son back when she got her act together, evidently he was aware of her "issues". And yes, she had taken a leave of absence a few years prior for "stress". At least that is what the rumors were.

Public school is not the answer for every child, a teaching degree means nothing if you lack people skills.
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
36. my son, in 4th grade left the entire essay blank because the picture ....
Edited on Fri May-13-05 08:20 AM by ElsewheresDaughter
the test used of 3 frogs at night sitting under a street lamp did not inspire him(the directions were to write a story just by looking at the picture). Most of the children wrote a Budwiser beer commericial ads.

and he still passed the state tests in the top 5%
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
37. What a petty little nobody of a principal.
"than blatant defiance and insubordination."

Sounds like Cartman from South Park "You will respect my authoriTAY!"

And all because the child drew a blank and didn't know what to write...but that couldn't have had anything to do with teaching primarily geared toward taking a test.. instead of teaching a child to think could it? Nah...that couldn't be it.


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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #37
44. he DIDN'T draw a blank... he said he didn't want to embarrass the principal
He was AFRAID of the principal.. that is why he wouldn't write anything
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #44
48. Yes, I READ that....caps are such fun!
Edited on Fri May-13-05 08:58 AM by Solly Mack
I don't have enough info to determine if he was AFRAID of the principal though.

Perhaps he's just a nice kid who doesn't like making fun of people? One could equally derive that from the information available as well.

Oh and (from the article as well)

"...Tyler's mother Amy Wolfe says, "And he said he didn't know the answer. He just didn't know what to write..."





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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
38. This is what the PEOPLE VOTED FOR, our citizens wanted this
we wanted "accountability" at no costs. In fact, there are a ton of people who voted for Bush to make public education more accountable...instead of funding it properly.

Yep...so when kids don't perform well on the tests and they leave stuff blank...well the teachers freak out...this is how they and these kids are going to be "judged"...is it nuts..yeah but this is the type of environment that our lovely government has put into place and it was due in part to the votes of citizens...

It bothers me also that this kid was punished but it is just a symptom of a bigger problem.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #38
40. You know, I don't think they wanted "accountability" really
They wanted teachers to feel the pain.

You know how a job looks better from a distance? These folks see teachers working a shorter work day (never mind the correcting papers at home at night), getting school vacations, summer vacations, all of the holidays, and they are resentful, because while the teacher is "off on holiday" (probably serving food or bartending at a summer resort to supplement the income) they have to go to a crappy office every day. Plus, over the last few decades, teacher salaries have made some gains as well, instead of continuously losing ground to inflation.

The teachers' unions, after years of sitting down and shutting up, got aggressive, proactive, and acquired some power...and "they" don't like that.

To my mind, I saw a lot of "putting teachers in their place" in that whole NCLB bullshit.

Of course, the idiot who spearheaded it probably has a secret hatred of teachers, being a poor student himself.
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. I think to some degree you are correct
Edited on Fri May-13-05 08:36 AM by bleedingheart
I am not against testing kids, but I think that so much weight has been given to this testing that it is making people nuts...including parents.

There are parents paying for special tutoring to aid their kids for these tests.
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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 08:55 AM
Response to Original message
47. HandCuff the little bastard and beat his ass with a rubber hose !!!
:sarcasm:
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GoldenOldie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #47
51. State Legislature reps and School Superintendents/Admins
should be required to take similar tests as those given to Junior High and Highschool students.

Even reporters should be required to take the tests before they can hand in a report on the subject.

A few years ago, 3-highschool students from my State discovered some major errors in the questions on their tests and pointed it out to the teachers, yet very little was reported on this.

I would love to see if our Administrative Educators (?) and our Reps could pass any of these contracted tests.
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:46 AM
Response to Reply #47
66. Is THAT all you'd do -- you must be a stinkin' Democrat
I'd tie him up in a large sack with a rabid badger. That would teach the little cretin.
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BiggJawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
55. Every unanswered question cost the School system MONEY...
You wanna bet that's the rationale for making a fuckin' FEDERAL CASE out of this?

"Teach the Test", that's all schools do anymore...Benchmark, Benchmark, Benchmark...
"How do OUR schools measure up"?

Pretty poorly, if you ask me, because European kids are actually being taught how to THINK, instead of just regurgitating the answers to the State "Acheivement" Test and say "Welcome to Wal-Mart!"
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MountainLaurel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #55
65. But if American kids were taught to think
Who would be there to supersize your McMeal, or handle the landscaping, or join the military to fight a war for rich white oil barons? And they might actually complain about the class gap in this country, or the poisons in their water and food. And they might realize the power that advertising holds over the masses.

Can't have that, now can we?
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coffeenap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
56. My favorite kind of kid--honest, unafraid to do what he felt was right.
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tjwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
59. Good for him. His parents deserve a bumper sticker for their car...
...that says "my child resisted efforts to assimilate him into the American corporate consumer culture, and actually attempts to think on his own"

On the other hand, who cares? This is as much breaking news as the runaway bride story.
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Miss Chybil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
67. I'd want to call a lawyer, but I wouldn't. But, I'd want to. nt
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fob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
70. Was the title of the "essay", 'At this school we threw our principles
out the window long ago'?

WTF? NCLB is underfunded AND the responsibility to make it work is heaped on the backs of 4th graders?

Jeebus Fucking Keericed, is there nothing bush* touches that doesn't end up fucked up to the nth degree?

Tyler, I'm sad to say you are an enemy in bush*s amerika. You obviously see through the state mandated bullshit and demonstrate independent thought and those are like kryptonite to bush*s theocratic agenda. Keep it up.
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fob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-05 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
72. Was the title of the "essay", 'At this school we threw our principles
out the window long ago'?

WTF? NCLB is underfunded AND the responsibility to make it work is heaped on the backs of 4th graders?

Jeebus Fucking Keericed, is there nothing bush* touches that doesn't end up fucked up to the nth degree?

Tyler, I'm sad to say you are an enemy in bush*s amerika. You obviously see through the state mandated bullshit and demonstrate independent thought and those are like kryptonite to bush*s theocratic agenda. Keep it up.
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