ABC News headline: WalMart Heir dies in Small Plane Crash

[muriel_volestrangler]

http://abcnews.go.com/

Why the hell does anyone travel in small planes if they can avoid it?

On edit: full link: http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/050627/nym213.html?.v=15

(Thanks, truthisfreedom)

"Walton was killed when the ultra-light aircraft he was piloting crashed shortly after take-off"

So this would seem to be a recreational flight.

[The Straight Story]

1. Was the plane made in china....

ok, so I am insensitive.

[displacedtexan]

4. Gawd! That was my first thought!

You and I could get into some serious trouble together!

[The Straight Story]

7. Maybe he will be re-incarnated as a slave laborer...

I am still insenstive....

[Matilda]

49. We may hope that he reincarnates as a slave.

n/t

[Greylyn58]

101. If there is any justice

he'll come back as a single mother with two kids, no health insurance and work as a cashier in one of his own stores.

I'm joining in the insensitivity. :evilgrin:

[ElsewheresDaughter]

132. he resisted being involved in the WalMart business and only joined the....

the board in 92 ...he was one of the good guys...and endorsed The People for the American Way org. any also donated to many dems...yes he also gave more to repukes. I see he gave $20,000 to "Softer Voices"
is this them?

Softer Voices
Anti-Bush group
PO Box 8206
Jackson Hole, WY 83002


http://www.publicintegrity.org/527/search.aspx?act=com&orgid=809

[bitchkitty]

136. It's never the evil

shits who die in light plane crashes. I think there was one Republican some years ago but he was called "liberal" (whatever that means) by some.

[5thGenDemocrat]

156. kitty

I believe that would have been John Heinz (R-PA), Threasa Heinz-Kerry's first husband.
John
I don't know how liberal Senator Heinz was (greetings from Michigan), but he struck me as real liberal for a Republican. More so than anyone out there today.

[China_cat]

5. The trained pilot's job was outsourced

and he was being flown by a minimum wage employee off the clock after a full shift.

[genieroze]

105. You are so bad, making me laugh at that. lol

Someone had to say it.

[despairing optimist]

162. No, but the fuel was a blue-light special

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[politicaholic]

9. Hear hear!

I don't understand how they can be so blatantly anti-american and get so much support from the GOP...Ohhh, the GOP are whores...riiiight.

[driver8]

12. GOP loves WalMart because they are anti-union, anti-worker,

anti-benefits. They are all about the bottom line.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

44. The GOP loves The Waltons because...

The Waltons buy them off with great gouts of contributions.

[President Jesus]

96. John Walton's campaign contributions (complete list)

http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_donations/John_Walton.php

Donated 4 times more to GOP over the past 30 years.

[anitar1]

110. It did say he was a philanthropist .Wonder if that was about

the donations to the Pugs ?

[Bake]

77. Was the plane built by a non-union worker with no benefits?

Just asking.

Bake

[uppityperson]

3. It is fun and safe, if you know what you're doing and are careful.

Why the hell does anyone travel in cars if they can avoid it? I like to fly.

[napi21]

6. If you go the $$, you want the toys!

I will never have enough, but if I did, I would love to have my own plane! I'd be a bit overly concious about who was flying though!

[waynew706]

8. Yep, these people do not get much of my sympaty..

as a union person. I doubt that this will change much in the payment structure of WalMart, but not sheading any tears here I can tell you.

[Endangered Specie]

10. *walmart jingle* "Smile!.... Put on a happy face!"...

"Put on a happy face! We're slashing our prices planes all over the place... so put on a happy face!"


Walmart, always low prices altitudes, always.
:evilgrin: :hide:

[malaise]

147. Rapture

Bet that wasn't one of his last words.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

11. I've flown to Alaska and the Bahamas in small Cessna planes....

If you trust/know the pilot (also, very experienced pilot) it is very safe and fun.

Checked the link, just lists as a breaking headline with no story yet. I hate Walmart, but I don't exactly want them to die.

[St. Jarvitude]

28. Especially not the Silver Star Green Beret Vietnam vet in the family

He may have been the only decent Walton.

[PinkTiger]

75. Actually, all the Waltons are decent people.

I live near Bentonville and I used to be a news reporter at a newspaper Jim Walton, the youngest son, owns. He is one of the most decent people I know.
Their mother, Helen, is a wonderful woman, who is very incapaciated these days because of a stroke.
Jim and his wife Lynne live like paupers. They have taught their children concrete values. John has always been the rogue one -- he has not had a real hand in the business. The oldest son, Robson Walton, (Rob) is the one who has been the most involved. Jim owns a chain of banks (Arvest) and Alice, the girl, used to have an investment company but now has a ranch in Texas where she raises Llamas; she is also involved heavily in a new art museum they are putting in Bentonville -- it will be a showplace of American Art.

The Waltons are great people.
Wal-Mart, however, is another matter altogether. When Sam was alive (yes, I knew him), the company was different. Today it has grown so big and out of control, and it is run by a group of middle-aged men who have it in a vice grip. There is so much money there, it is sickening. And you know what they say, when money enters the equation, it gets ugly. That is why Jim and Lynne have worked so hard to keep their children out of the spotlight, and raise them like ordinary kids.

Don't confuse the Waltons with Wal-Mart. They were born in it; they had no say.

[Bake]

79. Decent people don't treat their employees like slaves

Sorry, but they just DON'T DO IT. In their position, you can't separate the "personal" from the "business."

Bake

[PinkTiger]

80. But they aren't the COMPANY.

They are just the heirs.
You guys are so silly. Wal-Mart is a publicly traded company. The people who run it are a bunch of morons.

[Bake]

82. Are you saying they don't own a BIG CHUNK of the company?

If they don't, then I apologize. But Sam Walton can burn in hell. But if they do, as I suspect they do, then they have a responsibility to treat their employees with dignity, and no foundation can erase that responsibility.

Bake

[PinkTiger]

88. They have like Zip to do with it all.

John didn't live in the area; he only served on the board as a token. He, personally, was involved in other things. But he had no real voice in how the company operates. None of them do. Rob has the most, but he is just a figurehead.

I know you don't understand, and I can't help you understand. You would just have to be here and see it. They have no power. They have the stock, but they can't do anything with it. They aren't allowed to divest themselves of it. As Lynne told me once, "I'm a billionaire, but only on paper."

I would rather be myself than one of them.

[Bake]

91. Then I pity them their riches. It must be such a burden.

I hope their consciences are tortured. They certainly should be.

Bake

[high density]

97. Sorry, but they own many shares of the company

And this fellow was on the board of directors. So yes, the some of the Waltons do have a direct say in how the company is run. That said, I don't want these people to die. I just would like to see them go out of business. I'd be curious to hear what Sam Walton would have to say about the current state of the company, self-checkout kiosks and all.

[ima_sinnic]

104. "not allowed to divest"? how does that work?

yeah, my heart bleeds for them. it must be such a burden to be the principal owners of the world's greediest and most unethical corporation. :sarcasm:

The Waltons have no class at all, they are wallowing in more money than several small countries combined and control enough riches to feed the world.

[JNelson6563]

121. The bulk of their fortune is

Wal-Mart stock. They are huge shareholders and have some say in things.

And Sam was a cheap bastard who fought minimum wage and thought it was fine for his employees to get gov. benefits while on his payroll. According to his autobiography he admits he never gave a thought to doing anything for the employees till his wife mentioned it.

Julie

[PinkTiger]

123. Ignorance,I suppose, is bliss. You don't have a clue.

Wal-Mart was a small, local company when these kids were growing up. It became a behemoth and changed -- and about the time their father died, in the early 1990s, none of the Waltons, even Sam, had much to do with the real workings of the company. Sam, as chairman of the board, had been ill with leukemia for 10 years. He had not really been watching anything but the bottom line for a long time. He was obsessed with making the company profitable for the investors, because he had gone broke once before, and didn't want that to happen again.

Also, you know what they say, the emperor has no clothes. But nobody will tell him.

A group of insiders took the company over and made sure that profits and perks went to a core group of managers and administrators. To do this they had to screw over the front line workers, while throwing them a bone once in awhile and grabbing the attention and support of the community in Bentonville, Ark. by increasing the property values and bringing vendors into the area with a policy of requiring vendors to have a local presence.

When he died yesterday, John and his brother Rob were the only two Waltons with ties to the company. And these ties are and were simply ceremonial in nature. Rob is chairman of the board, but he has no real power. The company CEO and those under him are the ones who run things. The board has enough busy work to keep it busy without worrying about the humanitarian issues you are so concerned about on this board.

Before you all criticize and call names, you should look into issues better. You have no clue about the way it all works. I am not pro Wal-Mart -- but I have to say, the Waltons are all very nice people, and they have had some real challenges. John was the son who never really took to the company. He lived out west and dabbled in several ventures, some that failed,etc.

Alice lives, I believe, in Texas. In recent years she has devoted her time to collecting art for the new art museum they are building in Bentonville, Crystal Bridges, I think it is called. Alice is a sad individual -- I wouldn't trade my life for hers for anything. She is single, and not very attractive, and has a serious substance abuse problem that I hope is now under control. Alice is the one member of the family, though, who seems to have a strong business sense and a desire to do exciting things.

Jim, the brother I know so well, is a great business man, but he simply followed his father's example. He bought a local bank and then another, and with his sister Alice formed Arvest Bank. (She had the investment company that was originally Arvest, under Llama Co. title.) Jim is also involved with Community Publishers and Wehco Media, now the Stephens Group.

Politically, all the Waltons are rather conservative, which is to be expected. They give to the GOP. I wish they were more liberal, but they buy into the GOP philosophy of hard work and self reliance. When Clinton was Governor, though, they supported him. So I think they are more aligned with us in philosophy than is apparent by their giving. They are not the Asa Hutchinson type of Republican.

[Toucano]

160. Depositing the dividend checks is more than "ceremonial in nature"

The Waltons are THE stingiest billionaires on the planet. Bill and Melinda Gates have given something like 60% of their wealth away. The Waltons, by contrast, have give less than 1% away.

Each of them takes their share of the profits of the exploitation of others. Whether they have any influence on the policies that create the exploitation is irrelevent.

"Very nice people" don't profit from the destruction of multitudes of other people.

[PinkTiger]

164. And where do you get your figures for this?

You are comparing apples to oranges.

The Walton Foundation is a private foundation that gives to 503 (c) (3) organizations and public entities. In 2003 it gave $106,921,428.76. Much of this was in matching grants, meaning the organizations were required to match all or a portion of the grants with monies they raised. The money for the foundation was given by the family members from their private, personal funds. Not from Wal-Mart. The foundation had $733.9 million in it at the end of 2003.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Walton_Family_Foundation

The Gates Foundation is wonderful. It also funds public entities, many of which are not reached by other grants. Our library, for example, of which I am a member of the board, received $40,000 in computer equipment so far. But it operates differently.

A major difference in the two foundations is, while both the Gates' and the Waltons' wealth is mostly on paper, ie in unsold stock, the Gates don't share their stock with family members who have a trust agreement not to sell. As a result, they include $27 billion in stock in their company in the assets of the foundation, which at the end of 2003 totaled $33.6 billion. There are huge tax benefits in including most of his wealth in the foundation. The dividends from the stock go to this foundation, but the foundation is not able to sell the shares. Go download their balance sheets and read them.

Also, Gates often releases information on grants planned for future years, lumping them into one amount. This is not the same way the Walton Foundation operates. As I said above, the Waltons individually hold stock in Wal-Mart, but as heirs and in holdings that are not open for divestiture. Two of the sons, John and Rob, held/hold substantial private holdings in stock that they could sell; these shares were given to them as payment for serving on the board.

http://www.gatesfoundation.org/default.htm

Please do your homework before mouthing off about things you don't understand.

[Algorem]

83. The Waltons are scum.

[Algorem]

85. Yay!He wins!Richest man in the graveyard.

[Catfight]

117. That's the truth, no one beats death, he'll decay like everyone else. nt

[PinkTiger]

90. Wal-Mart is scum.

The Waltons are not. Do you KNOW THEM????
All you know is the store.

Not the same.

[Algorem]

93. The Waltons are scum.

[auburngrad82]

120. When Sam Walton was alive things were different

He did treat his people well. The employees had decent benefits and he genuinely liked and cared about his employees. He was a good man. It really pisses me off that once he died the rest of them destroyed what was a good company and turned it into the Wal-Mart we know today.

[liberalmike27]

126. So

It seems like you are saying the Waltons have no control over their company? I'm sorry, not buying that, even for reduced every-day low-prices.

They have so much power to help massive numbers of people, who are employed by their stores, but they choose to not do so.

I wonder how much inheritance tax he will pay?

[PinkTiger]

144. You are so wrong.

It is not THEIR company. Their father started the company. They do own a lot of stock, but most of it is collective stock that is tied up in some type of family voting block, and they have no real control over it. The only two who hold significant shares of their own stock were John and Rob. John, however, could not sell his without the approval of the SEC. Neither could Rob. And the family is unable to divest without a vote of the board and the SEC.

So, now who's butt is the stinkiest?

[Bake]

148. And how exactly do you know this?

There are restrictions in the securities laws which govern how and when insiders (and Walton would certainly have been an insider) may sell their stock, but he would never have had to get the SEC's "approval." He could have divested. I also seriously doubt that dumping his personal stock would require a vote of the board.

Bake

[PinkTiger]

163. When someone owns a large amount of stock

They have to get approval of the board and the SEC, especially certain types of stock.
I'm not an expert on this, but I do know that they can't just dump a million shares of stock or so without notice.

it could devastate the company's stock price, and especially with Wal-Mart, the Dow.

[warrens]

134. Yeah, they are

I interviewed Sam and I've met Helen and Rob, and they are decent people. The Wal-Mart corporate culture is the offshoot of Sam's workaholism, which he regretted as he was dying. I interviewed him about a year before he died, and he said that ignoring his family was his biggest regret. Working at Wal-Mart, even for the top guys, is total hell if you're not a workaholic. They work 70 to 80 hours a week, travel constantly, and if they're lucky, retire rich at 60, with nothing but Wal-Mart in their lives.

[yebrent]

157. A little about the Walton heirs activities.

The Waltons have become the biggest financial supporters of charter school and voucher programs, says Egan of the National School Boards Association.

The push for repeal (estate tax) comes from a coalition of anti-tax groups, business trade associations, newspaper owners, and lobbying firms like Patton Boggs, representing some of America's wealthiest families, including the Mars and Walton clans. But the fiscal, moral, and political case for complete estate tax abolition is weak.

Common Dreams Article

The elder Gates for years has argued that individual wealth is a product not only of hard work and smart choices but also of a society that provides economic development, education, health care, and property rights protection. Such an economy's top dogs benefit the most from tax-funded institutions and programs and therefore should not resent or seek relief from having to pay taxes, he has said.

He still has some convincing to do.

Facing off against Gates and Responsible Wealth are families including the widow and heirs of Wal-Mart Stores Inc. founder Sam Walton and influential lobby groups including the National Federation of Independent Business.

Led by Sam Walton's only daughter, Alice, the family spent $3.2 million on lobbying, conservative causes, and candidates for last year's federal elections. ''That's more than double what it spent in the previous two elections combined,'' USA Today reported Wednesday, citing public documents.

[truthisfreedom]

13. very good question for traveling, but he was having fun. ARTICLE here:

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/050627/nym213.html?.v=15

Philanthropist and Entrepreneur John Walton Killed in Airplane Crash
Monday June 27, 8:19 pm ET

BENTONVILLE, Ark., June 27 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- It is with great sorrow that Wal-Mart Stores, Inc., announces the death of John Walton. A Vietnam War hero, member of the Wal-Mart Board of Directors and philanthropist, Walton was killed when the ultra-light aircraft he was piloting crashed shortly after take-off from the Jackson Hole Airport in Grand Teton National Park. The crash occurred at approximately 1:20 p.m. CDT and the cause has not yet been determined. Walton, 58, was the aircraft's sole occupant.
ADVERTISEMENT

Walton was the second son of Wal-Mart founder, Sam Walton.

As a board member of the Walton Family Foundation, Walton played a leading role in guiding the Foundation's contributions to elementary and high school education, including scholarship programs to provide parents with greater choice in education.
<snip>

Walton attended the College of Wooster. He is survived by his wife Christy and their son, Luke; his mother Helen; two brothers, Rob and Jim; a sister, Alice; and their families.

[Jacobin]

17. It was an ultra light

Those are a bit, shall we say, um, dicey.

[DemoTex]

52. Especially in mountain turbulence. Pay your money; take your chances.

BTW: Wasn't one of the Bin Laden boys killed in an ultra-light accident in south Texas a number of years ago?


Give me something with meat on its bones!
Two turnin', two burnin'!

[SoCalDem]

25. G'night, John Boy

Shame on me ..I might need my ticket now, after all

[Piperay]

32. "Philanthropist" (???) somehow that

and the name "Walmart" or "Walton" do not go together at all. :shrug:

[all.of.me]

59. that was my first reaction - philanthropist?!

[high density]

98. It's a Wal-Mart press release

What did you expect? :)

[DainBramaged]

106. With a net worth of $18.2 billion, what will Jesus say

as the gates of Hell open for him?

He broke the back of the lower middle class with his destructive tactics in the US and fed his stores from child and slave labor in China. He stole from everyone of us by pawning health care and supplimental food allowances for his employees off the state and local governments while he enrichened himself. He claimed toprovide jobs for the poor, while denying taxes to the communities they occupied and bleeding the local economies dry. He helped make Wal-Mart into a giant colony of army ants, leaving death and destruction behind it.

What would Jesus say to him as he leaves his legacy of broken families, premature death, and bankruptcy?


I have a feeling that Jesus didn't speak to him, but Diablo did.

[saigon68]

109. Diablo did speak to him

And offered him riches in exchange for his soul.

[Catshrink]

14. With fewer heirs to share the booty they can afford an employee raise.

Or at least be able to lower the insurance premiums. Oh wait. They'll just divide that share among the remaining sharks.

[Roland99]

39. Fat chance..it'll just be rolled into the surviving heirs

Too bad he died like that, though.

[PinkTiger]

76. You guys don't get it, do you????

The Walton Foundation has nothing to do with Wal-Mart. It is something they do with their own money. It is a wonderful foundation and it truly has enriched the lives of many people. They provide bricks and mortar money to education. This is almost unheard of. They also provide charitable contributions to smaller community projects.

You are all out of line here.

[Bake]

81. The foundation is a tax break.

You cannot separate the personal from the business, in this or any other case. "It's just business." My ass.

Bake

[Charlie Brown]

84. Do you feel the same way about the Kennedys and the Heinz-Kerrys?

Just 'cause someone is from a wealthy family with ties to corrupt businesses does not mean they aren't decent people.

[Bake]

87. And what currently-corrupt businesses do you tie the Kennedys to?

Why are you defending the Waltons? Their employees TODAY are treated like slaves -- forced to work overtime off-the-clock, no benefits, minimum wages? Why defend them? Because to assuage their consciences, they set up a foundation to do some good?

Do the balancing equation! Open your eyes. If, as you suggest, they are "just the heirs," with no reposnsibility for the acts of the corporation, then SHAME ON THEM!! SHAME ON THEM!! They're still living (and dying) on the backs of the corporation's employees.

Bake

[Charlie Brown]

92. Joseph Kennedy most definitely made his fortune from crooked stock trading

and his influence on Roosevelt was influential in keeping the US out of the Spanish Civil War and the first two years of World War II. He was a lousy guy, and his decisions probably ruined a lot of lives. Nonetheless, I respect most of his family for what they accomplished in politics and humnaitarianism.

Why is John Walton's death being celebrated here? He was a human being.

[Bake]

94. So are Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, et al.

Although "human" might be a bit of a stretch.

Sometimes there are limits to compassion.

Bake

[420inTN]

130. I thought that Joe Kennedy made his money during prohibition ...

by running booze?

And the Forbes family made a lot of their money by smuggling opium into China for the British during the Opium Wars.

[Bake]

150. Yeah, I thought Joe was a bootlegger too!

Bake

[liberalmike27]

127. I can't speak for the others

But I think all of the people you mention have far too much money. Huey Long, LA socialist wanted to take all money over a million and redistribute it. I don't support that, but we definitely need the inheritance tax.

If you disagree, realize that "you" will make up the difference if we don't have this progressive tax, only levied on vast wealth. It is due to come back in 2010, I think currently it kicks in at 3.5 million.

Too many people have far too much money, especially when folks have so much they can open up ten or twelve think tanks, to influence politics even more then their direct contributions do, and buy up all the media so they can control the minds through the hypnotic effects of boob-tubes and talking-head-newsreaders.

[420inTN]

152. Do Soros, Heinz-Kerry, and the Kennedys have too much money?

How about all of the folks in Hollywood?

It's not only folks on the right who will be affected by this.

Do you think that Senators Kerry and Kennedy will vote for it, knowing that it will affect their families and heirs? Or will they just create/use the loopholes in the system.

[SquireJons]

167. The simple answer is yes.

If you begin the year with five hundred million and end it with five hundred and fifty million having done nothing, you have too much money. I wish I had too much money, sort of.

But what they do with that money does matter. I'll go with Kerry, Soros, and the Kennedy's over the Wall-Mart or NASCAR clans any day of the year.

[PinkTiger]

89. The Foundation has nothing to do with the company.

They have no obligation to do anything. They could just as easily done nothing.
The foundation is their personal way of giving back. YES, it is a tax break. But give these people a break. If you don't know them, you can't criticize them.

You are all acting like children.

[daleo]

99. Foundations do have legal obligations.

To receive the tax break they do actually have to do things - charitable type things.

[SquireJons]

112. Give Me a break....

Having married a trust baby, I know a little bit about the super rich. Yes, almost all of them participate in charitable foundations. My ex and her entire family contribute to a philanthropic trust.

Big Deal.

Collectively, they spend more on a weekend jont, and far more for their obscene 'christmas extravaganza' than they give away annually. And btw, they do give in the 5 figure area and that will go up considerably when the elders die.

So, is it a good thing that people who live off of non earned income, and pad that wealth in the 6 to 7 figure range each year, give a very small fraction of that wealth to charity? It's a hard call. They do some good but it hardly offsets their selfish, lazy and egotistical lives.

I have no wish for the death of anyone, but death comes to us all. It's what we do with our lives that truly matters. Other than building a few yachts and amassing a fortune that he could not spend if he spent/gave away $10,000 a day, this man did almost nothing to help the society that provided for his god-like lifestyle. Jackson's Hole? Was he there to pay a visit to Mr. Hoffman, aka Dick Cheney? Or merely spending more that weekend then he gives away annually?

Our concepts of what is truly generous have taken a huge hit in the last 30 years, and I am ashamed. Not just for the wealthy, but for just about all Americans.

At least the mormans, who are required to give 10% of their annual income to charity spend more to help others than they do on the 'magic underwear.' Not sure that could be said for any of the Waltons.

Having said all that, I admire his volunteering for med corp in Vietnam more than anything he did subsequently.

[TX-RAT]

154. 10% of their annual income to charity

That's to the church.

[SquireJons]

161. Mormons

i don't know very much about what they do with the money, but it is my understanding that contributions to charity is very important to the Mormon church. I had the impression that they actually do a lot of good with it. But perhaps we should avoid the issues of Kalob, the city of Kalob on the planet Kalob, magic underwear and polygamy.

[liberalmike27]

129. Dude

I can't believe that you think the Waltons have absolutely no influence on Wal-Mart. Do you realize that a big portion of their stock is held in Wal-Mart. Do you understand the voting power they have together?

Sorry, I'm neither saying they never did a good thing, or that they have no influence on Wal-Mart. I am saying they could do one hell of a lot more for their employees, and that it would make our society much better.

By the Way, I believe Walmart just passed Hallliburton as the largest non-union employer. I believe they are the top two of all non-union employers, but I'm not positive of that.

[TX-RAT]

153. Do they own 51% or do they have controlling interest?

Otherwise, they have no control.

[0rganism]

145. Are you saying the Waltons have NO influence on Wal-mart's policies?

Throughout the thread, you maintain the position that although they own significant stock and one of Sam's kids is the Chairman of the Board of Directors, they have zero control over the actual workings of the Wal-mart business and hold these positions as ceremonial figureheads. Now this may be the case; you certainly allege to have a better claim to first-hand knowledge of the "inner workings" than damn-near anyone else I've seen at DU or any other message board.

However.

I cannot bring myself to imagine that if a Walton family member decided to speak out publicly against the vicious employment, franchising, and purchasing policies of Wal-mart that they would be ignored. The various unions and Wal-mart boycott groups could have no greater ally than an heir to the Walton fortune, were he or she to openly deplore Wal-mart's labor, locating, and manufacturing policies.

Does the Walton family, or at least those of them you know, have ANY conscious remorse or concern for the effects the agressive business practices of their father's enterprise has on workers and small businesses? If not, why not? If so, why don't they DO something about it?

[shockra]

118. I knew I'd read about that education foundation somewhere before.

Features > March 31, 2004
No ‘Choice’
Wal-Mart prepares to bury the left under a mountain of money

By Glen Ford and Peter Gamble

<snip>

Such a vast project of political economy is far too complex for four middle-aged children of wealth and the 84-year-old matriarch, Helen. The family’s immediate personal ambitions are more modest: to destroy public education in the United States. To that end the Waltons, through their Walton Family Foundation and in close collaboration with Milwaukee’s Bradley Foundation, literally invented the national school “choice” network and its wedge issue-weapon, vouchers.

It is the existence of the school vouchers “movement” that allows the Bush administration to savage and massively disrupt the nation’s public schools while positing “alternative” forms of education, both vouchers and charter schools that often operate very much like public-funded private schools. “Choice” has become national policy under Bush’s Department of Education, which has doled out more than $75 million to organizations birthed by the Waltons, Bradley and their allies. (See “Funding a Movement” by People for the American Way, http://www.pfaw.org.)

Public education’s defenders, already outgunned by the combined resources of the right-wing political funding network plus the full weight of the Republican executive branch, now await the deluge: an infusion of $20 billion into the Walton’s private philanthropy, most of it earmarked for education “reform”—the euphemism for school privatization. At the usual rate of foundation disbursement, this would translate as $1 billion a year—a tidal wave of money, enough to reinvent the voucher “movement” many times over.

<snip>

The public schools by far are the most pervasive public institutions, social spaces, in American society. Therefore, they must be made fully subservient to private capital. To the world-coveters of the Waltons’ class (all several hundred of them, plus their legions of hirelings), public education is more an obstacle than a potential convertible asset.

http://www.inthesetimes.com/site/main/article/717/P40/

[vanboggie]

119. I always wondered

...why Sam's kids changed the company philosophy so dramatically. Now I understand - they didn't. Like the others here, I assumed they co-owned and ran the place. I never was a big Wal-Mart fan, but did notice a huge difference in pricing and merchandise at Sam's Club.

So he did raise children with values after all and they don't have a say in the business. Interesting. Thanks for clearing up that misconception, PinkTiger.

[420inTN]

124. When have the uninformed ever let ignorance get in the way of an opinion?

eom.

[TX-RAT]

151. "You guys don't get it, do you????

No they don't, theres a night and day difference between the way the company was when Sam was still alive and the way it is now. I had the chance to hunt with Sam many years ago. He would fly out to hunt quail with a friend of mine who had a ranch south of here. He would fly in by himself, it was funny, he always carried his 2 pointers with him. As soon as that plane pulled up to the hanger, the dogs started piling out. Had you met him on the street you would never know he was (at that time) the wealthiest man in the world. He was very humble and quiet, always had smile,
I'm sure he would be rolling over in his grave at the way thing operate within the company now.

I liked him.

[truthisfreedom]

15. ultra-light crashes are remarkably common and in the news this month...

go to news.google.com and type in a search for ultra-light.

[customerserviceguy]

137. I guess

we have to look out for more than just "falling prices".

[rzemanfl]

16. This is insensitive, but now that he's dead, do you think they will

say he had a one-night stand with Princess Di?

[meganmonkey]

18. "Small Plane Crash"

Those words always sound suspicious to me

:hide:

[Jacobin]

22. NOT a small plane

It was an ULTRALIGHT

[benburch]

23. A kite with a motor.

I've heard of pilots with thousands and thousands of hours in all manner of aircraft who were killed flying ultralights.

[zann725]

107. My thoughts exactly.

How much and what DID he control at Wal-Mart? Who else would rather do it for him?

[rateyes]

19. I wonder what he had on Bushco...

and if he was getting ready to reveal it. I wouldn't be paranoid if they weren't out to get me.

[St. Jarvitude]

27. ummm

[RebelOne]

122. I think you better loosen your tin foil hat. n/t

[guitar man]

20. one down...

....four to go....

[Straight Shooter]

21. Vietnam war hero? Philanthropist?

Every family has a black sheep. In the Walton family, that means giving back to society. Perhaps JW was the black sheep, or maybe he was cut from the same cloth as the rest of them.

If I were going to fly a small plane, I'd choose a Baron. But, hey, that's just me. ;)

[noamnety]

29. He's cut from the same cloth

At least, judging by his contributions.

http://www.opensecrets.org/indivs/search.asp?NumOfThou=0&txtName=Walton%2C+John&txtState=AR&txtZip=&txtEmploy=&txtCand=&txt2004=Y&Order=N

[Straight Shooter]

31. Oh, dear. Just when I was trying to think kind thoughts of the dead.

x(

Thanks for the info.

[PsN2Wind]

35. Just looked at the first page

but it seemed his "philanthropy" was giving money to people that were going to make sure he kept more of his. But then I don't consider political contributions as philanthrophy.

[PassingFair]

41. Look! He was into Joementum...

musta been what powered the plane.

[insane_cratic_gal]

50. He donated to Joe!

WALTON, JOHN T
BENTONVILLE,AR 72712
WALTON ENTERPRISES/INVESTOR
11/12/2003
$2,000
Lieberman, Joe

Is that saying much?

In all honesty.. as a fellow human being .. my condolences to his family.

[Tommymac]

60. I guess Joe likes his bread buttered ...

on both sides. Eye opening list to be a part of....

As far as Mssr. Walton, sorry, not much sympathy here. No glee either. Can't get worked up about someone like that. The tears of grief I have left in me belong to the brave soldiers murdered because of * in Iraq and the innocent civilians murdered there by *.

[insane_cratic_gal]

71. Not shedding a tear

but I don't see the point in tearing the guy up either.

I guess my point is, should Chelsea Clinton die, I would hope the other side of the isle doesn't go into a feeding frenzy with "she deserved it" crap.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

24. Ultralight = Easy Darwin Award nomination. There, I've said it. (nt)

[KC21304]

37. I believe you don't even need a pilot's license

to fly an ultra-light.

[Porcupine]

74. Nonqualifier for the Darwin. Acknowlged offspring.

Of course if we could get the kid into an ultralight....

Sorry as far as I am concerned the Walton family is the worlds leading family of slavers. These people buy stuff from factories where the working conditions on a slave plantation would be a break.

On a plantation work slowed in winter and stopped when the sunlight ran out. There's no such luck for some Asian factory workers. May Sam Waltons seed whither root and branch and bear no fruit. I'd salt his grave if I could find it.

[wicket]

26. RIP

n/t

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

33. The last sound he heard?

:hide:

[The Straight Story]

36. His plane went "rolling rolling rolling...." (nt)

[patalicat]

30. Look out below...

Prices.. uh "princes" are falling


maybe that annoying smilyface will be whistling taps???

[Piperay]

34. I wish that this

would cause the family to think about how life can be short and it doesn't matter how much you have you still die. Other things are more important, like doing right by others.

[Charlie Brown]

38. Very disheartening to see folks dancing on a man's grave

Can't we put politics aside for just a few hours and offer sympathy to a grieving family?

[AX10]

43. Would Wal-Mart give a damn if one their employees were killed in..

their stores? :eyes:

[Charlie Brown]

45. So he deserved to die b/c of Wal Mart's business policies?

That's a pretty heavy dose of moral relativism.

[amber dog democrat]

46. Well, I guess his time was up.

Not that he will be greatly missed. Being taken out, its just that much less harm he will do to others.

[havocmom]

53. "deserved to die" was notwhat was said. Why should we care is the point.

The Waltons do not show much concern about others. So they reap what they sow.

edit: typo

[woo me with science]

57. what a mom you must be

yeah, you don't like wal-mart, so a deadly plane crash is just peachy keen with you.

sheesh.

[havocmom]

78. People who know me tend to think highly of me

sheesh back at ya. The point I was making was that a poster did not say he deserved to die, just that they wouldn't mourn. Some people won't get a lot of mourners when they go. They reap what they sow. That is life and death.

[lastliberalintexas]

133. Actually, they might

Since Walmart has/had a practice of purchasing life insurance policies on their employees without their consent, the proceeds of which were paid to the company, they just *might* care if an employee passed away.


As for those saying the family has nothing to do with the store and that they're really open, liberal, tolerant people- I have a bridge for sale. Really, really cheap. Please PM me if interested. :eyes:

God, some of you people have much to learn. The Waltons do still have controlling interests in the Walmart corporation, no matter how much they try to spin it. Their "charitable" contributions are to right wing think tanks which promote religion, school vouchers, and oppose inheritance taxes, universal healthcare and living wages. Walmart has been sued for forcing employees to work OT hours without OT pay, for forcing employees to work off the clock, over the life insurance scam, and for gender discrimination. Walmart also closes departments of the store or even entire stores if the employees vote to unionize.

If the Waltons wanted any of that corporate policy to change, they could force it since they are controlling interest holders. They do not, because those policies make them even more money that they and their heirs will never burn through.

[Misunderestimator]

149. Thank you.... GREAT post.

Let's take the opportunity to clear up the confusion up-thread about the "generosity" and good works of the Waltons.

Good job pointing out the deviousness of their support of education.

:thumbsup:

[PinkTiger]

166. Wal-Mart is not a person.

Wal-Mart is a company. A publicly traded company. Get a grip.

[clovis29]

47. Well, if he had been a better person

we wouldn't have to deal with our ambivilance.

[onenote]

72. what do you know about him to make such a judgment

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Pretty much all any of us know about John Walton is that he was a member of the Walton family and a non-executive member of the Wal-mart board. To make a judgment about how good a person he was based on that information..man that's arrogance. Remember, Hillary Clinton was on the Wal-Mart Board of Directors for six years.

onenote

[lolly]

102. Yeah, he was utterly helpless, right?

Even if, as a multi-gazillion shareholder in the corporation, he had no say (which I find INCREDIBLY hard to believe, but y'all keep saying it) every day he failed to buy television time to denounce the WalMart corp he was living in sin. He was making money off of people being mistreated, and it was direct and it was traceable and he had to know it.

I didn't cause his death. I'm not celebrating. I just have no grief.

As for the Freepers, nothing we do or say will have any effect on how they behave the next time a prominent liberal dies.

[DeepModem Mom]

48. Or we could just stifle ourselves. This man's death will do nothing...

to improve the Wal-Mart situation. Why, as you say, dance on his grave? IMO, this kind of thing does DU no good. But, hey -- to each his own.

[woo me with science]

58. some people

can't resist being ghouls. i just wish they didn't choose to do it where it reflects on me.

[mitchum]

146. And some people can't resist being apologists for the rapacious idle rich

But if it makes you feel good to haul big rocks for the pharaoh, carry on

[dansolo]

55. Have you forgotten the "dead peasant" insurance?

Walmart used to take out life insurace policies on their employees and named Walmart as the sole beneficiaries. May they all rot in hell.

[Charlie Brown]

86. What does this have to do with John Walton?

I really doubt the Waltons had much to do with these decisions, and even if they did, does it really warrant wanting them dead? Do you have similar feelings toward the Clintons, Kennedys, and Heniz-Kerrys?

[Henny Penny]

116. perhaps thats the point.....

If the Waltons are such good people, and for all I know they may be, don't you think they have avoided the responsibilities that have come with their great wealth? i.e the responsibility to ensure that Walmart did not develop into an entity that seems to have brought such misery to so many.

I know if my name was associated with a company like that, I'd be doing my best to make sure it behaved in a way I could live with.

As regards this guy's death, it is sad to see someone cut down prematurely and I am sure it is a terrible time for his family and friends.

[earth mom]

95. He couldn't take all that money with him now could he?

If he had been a better employer and cared about how his employees were living then you wouldn't see as much "dancing" going on.

All that money and very little good done with it. Now that's disheartening. :(

[sleipnir]

40. Recreation off of the backs of the poor.

Fuck him and his family.

Their ways and business have led to misery and suffering for millions if not billions. Don't expect me to shed a tear for this man dying while on his elite free time while millions toil under his family name.

[pinniped]

42. Philanthropist, man, he must have given away more money...

than David Packard & Gates combined.

Where is the Walton Aquarium? I would like to visit it one day.

[barbaraann]

51. Here's one of his philanthropic recipients. (KIPP)

http://www.kipp.org/

(Knowledge is Power Program)

[lovuian]

54. I can't help putting on my tinfoil hat here!!!

:tinfoilhat:

Its very suspicious!!!

[americanstranger]

56. 'Night, John-Boy...

I'm surprised no one's said it to this point. :)

-as

[Javaman]

61. Son of Wal-Mart founder killed in plane crash

58-year-old John Walton, one of world's richest, was piloting ultralight craft

BREAKING NEWS

Updated: 9:29 p.m. ET June 27, 2005
BENTONVILLE, Ark. - John Walton, the son of Wal-Mart founder Sam Walton and a member of the company’s board, died Monday in a plane crash in Wyoming.

Walton, 58, was piloting the ultralight that crashed shortly after takeoff from the Jackson Hole Airport in Grand Teton National Park, the company said.

In March, Forbes Magazine listed Walton as No. 11 on its list of the world’s richest people, with a net worth of $18.2 billion, tied with his brother Jim Walton.

Walton had been a member of the board of Wal-Mart Stores Inc. since 1992. Company spokeswoman Mona Williams said the company notified its employees worldwide late Monday of his death.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8381553/

(my heart breaks for them :sarcasm:)

[medeak]

62. husband is not getting ultralight now

that does it!

[Javaman]

63. I heard they just went on sale at china-mart ;)

[kanrok]

64. Yep...prices for ultra-lights are falling at Wal-mart!

[Javaman]

67. That's prices right? ;) lol

[Democrats_win]

65. Remember how they insured their old employees and collected when they died

leaving the employees' family with nothing. I think it was called "geezer insurance."

This family is truly a disgrace.

[theshadow]

68. I thought that was an urban legend...

.... until I Googled and found the story linked below. Talk about a ghoulish, obscene practice! I'm so happy that our country values the sanctity of life!

http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Insurance/P64954.asp

[karlrschneider]

66. Weird...ultralights almost have to be persuaded to crash...

:eyes:

[BRLIB]

69. Is some of the life insurance going to the WalMart workers?

Imagine if you have that much worth and never worked an hour for any of it. You likely have several times that in insurance!

More Chinese factories!

The Red Star rises higher!

[mitchum]

70. I imagine the other heirs are happy tonight

Hey, it's not like those rapacious pigs have ever shown any decency before. Why would they start now?

[hootinholler]

73. OMG! There was just a Dilbert like this...

Here is the start of the series. Well, bungee jumping, but you can see the similarity, can't you?

-Hoot

[Sandpiper]

113. Ruthless Reviews said it best

June 27, 2005

John Walton, Wal-Mart founder Sam Walton’s second son, was killed in an airplane crash today, which proves that, unlike Overkill’s killer tune to the contrary, evil does in fact die.


http://ruthlessreviews.com/rants/matt/orgasms.html

[deadparrot]

100. My prayers are with the family.

I hate Wal-Mart and everything they stand for, but I certainly don't wish anything close to death on the Walton family.

[OzarkDem]

103. Dumb rich guys + experimental aircraft

= disaster.

Truly sad, but a high risk situation. Having a lot of money doesn't change the odds.

[nolabels]

108. I have seen a lot of fools so this does not surprise me

One those that can be chalked up as the result of hubris unattended

If you think you can do no wrong you might also think you can fly with or without your ultralight :shrug:

[ngGale]

111. An ultra-light - wasn't that the same type plane...

Salem bin Laden was killed in, Texas?

Edit:Wrong state.

[TheModernTerrorist]

114. think any of them learned

that "you can't take it with you", after this incident?????




......I doubt it

[SKKY]

115. You know, for a minute there, I thought this board would be riddled...

...with expressions of sympathy for the family. It wasn't. You guys never seem to disappoint me.

[Algorem]

158. Those poor,poor billionaires.

[Politicub]

125. RIP n/t

[noonwitch]

128. Sad, but at least he had some beautiful scenery to look at before he went

That part of Wyoming is so beautiful, I travelled through there as a teenager once. I can think of worse ways to die, than quickly in a plane crash, with such natural beauty as the last image to see. I'm sure a guy his age has kids and maybe even grandkids, so my sympathy is with them.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

131. was he a Progressive, not warned him to stay out of small planes?

i was just writing a cover letter for a grant i found listed on the "People for the Amercian Way" site.


regardless of his political persuassion, i feel sorrow for him and his children...may he rest in peace.

[SquireJons]

140. Progressive Wall-mart heir?

Now that's an oxymoron. What's next, NASCAR for Kerry? I think not.

[Brooklyn Michael]

135. Who the #$%^&*@ cares????

I'm sorry....not to be rude or anything, but why exactly should I give a sewer rat's ass about a billionaire dying?

Just getting a little fed up with this obsession with rich people and celebrities. Just takes attention away from, I don't know, news that MATTERS.....:rant:

[captain jack]

138. good riddance to bad rubbish. Lookout satan!!!!

[RetroLounge]

139. But what will become of John-Boy and Walton's Mountain?

Karma is a bitch, ain't it?

RL

[Megahurtz]

141. Karma???

:shrug:

[nolabels]

143. Seems to me Karma would effect everybody equally if not for a few other...

details. The acceptance that even things written in stone are not permanent, the rule for all rules is all will be broken sooner or later.
Looking at life's occurrences and events as a way to get from point A to B makes a lot more sense than trying to cure the world of all it's evils. Running to danger instead of away from it one must always prepare for not always winning

Definition of Karma

Satguru Sivaya Subramuniyaswami explains in the lexicon section of his book, Dancing with Siva, that karma literally means "deed or act" and more broadly names the universal principle of cause and effect, action and reaction which governs all life." As he explains it, karma is not fate, for man acts with free will creating his own destiny. The Vedas tell us, if we sow goodness, we will reap goodness; if we sow evil, we will reap evil. Satguru Sivaya Subramuniyaswami further notes that karma refers to the totality of our actions and their concomitant reactions in this and previous lives, all of which determines our future. The conquest of karma lies in intelligent action and dispassionate reaction. Not all karmas rebound immediately. Some accumulate and return unexpectedly in this or other births.

As he explains it, unkindness yields spoiled fruits, called papa and good deeds bring forth sweet fruits, called punya. He further notes that as one acts, so does he become. One becomes virtuous by virtuous action, bad by bad action."


Three Kinds of Karma

Satguru Sivaya Subramuniyaswami, further explains that there are three types of karma, 1) sanchita karma, the sum total of past karmas yet to be resolved; 2) prarabdha karma, that portion of sanchita karma that is to be experienced in this life; and 3) kriyamana karma, the karma that humans are currently creating and will bear fruit in the future.


Karma in Hinduism, differs from Buddhism and Jainism as it involves the role of God.

While the action of karma has often been compared with the Western notions of sin and judgment by God, karma instead has been commonly perceived by Westerners to operate as an inherent principle of the Universe without the intervention of any supernatural Being. That notion is incorrect and holds true for only Buddhism and Jainism.

Karma in Hinduism, differs from Buddhism and Jainism as it involves the role of God. Notably, unlike Buddhists, and Jains who believe that karma, as natural law, on its own, joins the soul when it reincarnates and comes to fruition, Hindus, believe in the role of God for linking karma to the person.
(snip)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_in_Hinduism

[rlc]

142. Poor poor Luke

Since the "Death Tax" has not yet been repealed poor, poor Luke will never be able to work the family farm. How will a single mother be able to raise her child now that she won't have access to the fortune that John worked so hard to obtain.

Perhaps we can start a fund raiser, Think of the children!

[Algorem]

159. It is sad.Darkness,sadness,all around.

[MrScorpio]

155. Karma is a bitch

She is NOT to be fucked with

[PinkTiger]

165. Karma had little to do with it.

He was in an accident and died. Period.

[derbstyron]

168. As always, in such situations, my feelings go out to the family

Regardless of their political affiliation.