Allawi: this is the start of civil war

[ECH1969]

IRAQ’S former interim prime minister Iyad Allawi has warned that his country is facing civil war and has predicted dire consequences for Europe and America as well as the Middle East if the crisis is not resolved.

“The problem is that the Americans have no vision and no clear policy on how to go about in Iraq,” said Allawi, a long-time ally of Washington.

In an interview with The Sunday Times last week as he visited Amman, the Jordanian capital, he said: “The policy should be of building national unity in Iraq. Without this we will most certainly slip into a civil war. We are practically in stage one of a civil war as we speak.”

Tension has increased in the past two weeks following the return of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the Jordanian-born head of Al-Qaeda in Iraq. Zarqawi left the country in May to seek medical treatment for a chest wound suffered in an American airstrike, but has now recovered sufficiently to resume his activities.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1687910,00.html

[The Backlash Cometh]

1. Can someone get Wolfowitz on the line?

What is America's clear vision? I mean besides going into Vietnam II?

[ooglymoogly]

30. according the the bush admin...isn't al zarqawi a quadriplegic

on a ventilator and on the run?

[bin.dare]

33. no, he is the black knight from the "Holy Grail" ...

"'tis but a scratch"

"It's only a flesh wound"

"I'm invincible!"

"Running away eh? You yellow bastard, I'll bite your legs off!..."

[MadisonProgressive]

39. I thought he was on dialysis too.

[hopein08]

43. I think that's Osama...but it's all the same n/t

[barb162]

35. why, what does he give a shit, he's busy screwing up the World Bank

[The Backlash Cometh]

37. Oh, now let's not forget that Wolfowitz was hitting the television

circuit hard. Rove may have been behind the curtains, but Wolf was shameless;y in front of the cameras sounding the bugle charge. I don't think the World Bank will provide him sanctuary.

[barb162]

44. Oh I certainly do remember him on TV with all his lies, plus he

and Perle were basically the architects of the neocon philosophy .

[The Backlash Cometh]

46. Arrrrrrrgh! The Black Perle!

[grytpype]

2. Wow, this is 100% bad news.

1. Iraq is in the first stage of civil war.

2. The only way to prevent it from getting worse is to do a whole bunch of things George W. Bush will never, ever do.

3. We can't leave.

Wow, are we fucked.

[Zorra]

14. We CAN end the occupation of Iraq tomorrow. n/t

[acmavm]

3. Allawi badmouthing the bush** administration now? Interesting.

.

[bahrbearian]

8. He has no other recourse, he can't say things are getting better.

[MisterP]

9. announcing the new Ngo Dinh Diem!

[hatrack]

15. Dunno - I'd say Diem is closer to Bush than to Allawi

At least Allawi is able to (even if only for political purposes) allow reality to intrude from time to time. This is a capacity utterly lacking in Diem and Bush.

But then who would be this administration's Madame Nhu? Rove? Cheney? Jeff Gannon? :evilgrin:

[Spazito]

4. The moment the US and Britain invaded Iraq, civil war was

inevitable and predicted by many here on DU. Allawi may very well be fostering that if it is something the PNAC group (the ones who really are in charge of the US, imo)want to foster.

Anything Allawi says is simply regurgitation from his masters, imo, and should be accessed accordingly.

[Jacobin]

5. No shit, Sherlock

[jrthin]

6. *...The Americans have no vision and

no clear policy...," sums up the * gang philsophy of governing.

[BillZBubb]

7. Duh, Allawi, master of the obvious--now that he's out of power!

Of course a civil war is coming. There is no power on earth that can stop that. Busholini just made sure it will be sooner rather than later--and much more bloody.

[ckramer]

10. "building national unity in Iraq"?

Hasn't Saddam done that already ?

[Disturbed]

12. Iraqi Miltary Alliances with Iran and Syria?

This will be a challenge for the Bush Regime.

[MadisonProgressive]

40. Wouldn't it be rich

if Syria, Iran, and Iraq ganged up on US? Then we would be forced to RETREAT!!

[Theduckno2]

45. National unity? What about the attacks on Najaf and Fallujah?

Didn't Allawi sign off on those? Where was his push for unity then? He was just doing what Bushco told him. Still it takes some guts to bad mouth them now, just look at how Chalabi's fortunes would swing.

[meow2u3]

11. You heard it first on DU--last year!

DUers to America: we told you so!

[Pallas180]

13. You haven't heard the latest? Iraqi minister has made agreement with IRAN

to bring Iranian army into Iraq to train Iraqi army, and they say
Syrria will help.

Iran & Iraq tried to kill each other for centuries.

That George, he's the best uniter the world has ever seen,

just think of the consequences of that joining of forces.

The announcement says so that the Americans can leave and they will do the training of Iraqi forces so Iraq can take of itself.'

Think Georgie is going to pull our forces out so they can train?
after he built 14 euphemistically called "embassies" ?

and the latest excuse for being in Iraq, btw, is to prevent China
exploding and growing industrially and economically, from grabbing all the oil reserves left in the Middle East. (I think I heard that on Fox news).

Take a good look at the map of the area. China can march down through Afghanistan or Turkey and take over the whole ball of wax with their 1.7 billion population anytime they're ready to.

And of course the oil companies which used to be American are loyal to no country...to extrapolate, after they built all those pipelines and used American soldiers and lives to protect private corporations building the pipelines, China could and might march in and nationalize them for China. Actually I'd enjoy seeing the oil companies screwed.

[alfredo]

16. Could this be what the Neo Cons wanted?

Create chaos, let them destroy each other, then come in and exploit the victor and the vanquished.

http://www.foreignaffairs.org/19950701fareviewessay5058/john-b-judis/trotskyism-to-anachronism-the-neoconservative-revolution.html


The neoconservatives who went through the Trotskyist and socialist movements came to see foreign policy as a crusade, the goal of which was first global socialism, then social democracy, and finally democratic capitalism. They never saw foreign policy in terms of national interest or balance of power. Neoconservatism was a kind of inverted Trotskyism, which sought to "export democracy," in Muravchik's words, in the same way that Trotsky originally envisaged exporting socialism. It saw its adversaries on the left as members or representatives of a public sector--based new class.

[NVMojo]

17. Allawi: this is the start of civil war

July 10, 2005

IRAQ’S former interim prime minister Iyad Allawi has warned that his country is facing civil war and has predicted dire consequences for Europe and America as well as the Middle East if the crisis is not resolved.

“The problem is that the Americans have no vision and no clear policy on how to go about in Iraq,” said Allawi, a long-time ally of Washington.

In an interview with The Sunday Times last week as he visited Amman, the Jordanian capital, he said: “The policy should be of building national unity in Iraq. Without this we will most certainly slip into a civil war. We are practically in stage one of a civil war as we speak.”

Allawi, a secular Shi’ite, said that Iraq had collapsed as a state and needed to be rebuilt. The only way forward, he said, was through “national unity, the building of institutions, the economy and a firm but peaceful foreign relation policy”. Unless these criteria were satisfied, “the country will deteriorate”.

more...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1687910,00.html

[alittlelark]

18. The BFEE gets just what they wanted... can't loot during peacetime...

[Robeson]

27. Actually, you're right....

...the more division they can create, the more they are able to manipulate the various factions.

[Hissyspit]

19. Dupe. Go vote for original. It is not on Greatest Page yet.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4061066

[IndianaGreen]

21. The other thread is in GD, where it will sink to the bottom quickly

This one is properly posted in LBN. An interview of Allawi warning of civil war, published by Rupert Murdoch's Sunday Times (the same newspaper that published the DSM), is certainly worthy of more attention.

[Hissyspit]

22. I agree it belonged in LBN. Orig GD post is on Greatest Page now.

We can keep kicking both.

[WCGreen]

24. Read the New Yorker profile on Alawi

from January before the election...

Very enlightening.....

No post, it's not on line. You'll have to find it at the local library....

[IndianaGreen]

26. I voted for the GD thread as you suggested

but this is really LBN. GD is a horrible forum, despite its popularity, because of the short life span of threads.

[Hissyspit]

28. I know you did. I could tell. They're both on Greatest now!

:-) I just wanted to make sure one of them got there, and if two people vote for one thread and two people vote for another, it won't get there. Also, I believe the original poster should get preference. Anyway, daytime crowd will keep these kicked now.

[IndianaGreen]

20. So Allawi is forming a secular coalition for December's elections...

More than 1,400 people have since been killed, and many Iraqis who regarded Allawi as a ruthless leader now speak wistfully of the relative calm enjoyed under his rule.

Allawi is in intense negotiations to create a new multi-ethnic secular coalition before the general election.

“If we don’t build a state we will lose,” Allawi warned. “Not just as Iraq, but the region as a whole and Europe should say goodbye to stability and so should the United States. Iraq will become a breeding ground for terrorists.

Obviously the only way to keep Iraq together, and keep it secular, is to put Saddam or someone like him in power. It wouldn't be democratic, but it would be preferable to the chaos and violence Iraq is going through.

Here's an idea: pardon Saddam, put him back in power, give him money and Jenna Bush for good measure, and he will take care of the rest.

[Erika]

23. Bush is killing our kids with no cause

Michael Savage also recommended putting Saddam back in charge.

[NVMojo]

25. I wouldn't be surprised if the Iraqis as a whole want him back ...

We have made it hell over there.

[LiberallyInclined]

36. throw in barbara too, and we'll call it even-

after all, saddaam lost his two sons...(puto and zeppo...?)

and both sets of siblings are fairly equivilent, level-of-evilwise.

[NashVegas]

29. Oh, * Has a Clear Policy, All Right

It's just not a policy that they can speak about publicly.

[leesa]

31. So can we stop repeating "they'll descend into civil war if we leave now"

Our presence is driving them there. Get the US out.

[rateyes]

32. Note to Allawi:

According to Shrub, Iraq is now a sovereign nation. The US has to leave if your government tells us to get out. Please, tell us to get out.

[gulliver]

38. He does that and they won't let him on the helicopter ...

... as it leaves the roof of the U.S. Embassy.

[natrat]

34. who needs vision if all you want is to heist $$$$$$$

[MadisonProgressive]

41. No problem! Let's just STAY THE COURSE!!!!!

:puke: :mad: :eyes:

[Roland99]

42. *Now* he comes out and says the US has no clear plan?

Fucking piece of shit puppet.

[Disturbed]

47. As I have posted many times, if..

the U.S. and it's few allies left Iraq, the country would split into at least three seperate territories. Iraq was never a nation to being with.Would the Bush Regime care about that? They could still have a Military presence in the Kurdish section and in the South where most of the oil is anyway. Leave the Sunni triangle to the Sunnis.

[Roland99]

48. I was talking about that last night with a buddy of mine.

Iraq was carved out by the British. It's one of the reasons why Kuwait was felt to be part of Iraq by Saddam (and others)

[stickdog]

49. More "good" news from Iraq. (nt)