Women 'forced to wed rapists or die'

[Thom Little]

Rape victims in Turkey can be forced by their own families to marry their rapists - or risk being killed in the name of family honour, according to a United Nations report released today.

The report, by the United Nations Population Fund, is the first in-depth study in Turkey of the different motivations behind "honour-killings", where women and young girls are murdered by their relatives for allegedly bringing shame on the family.

.......

"When a girl is raped by a man, since she is no longer a virgin, it is usually believed that the best way to solve the problem is to get them married, especially if the man is not already married," the report says.

It goes on: "If the man is already married and the raped girl is pregnant, this creates a more complicated situation and usually ends in the girl's murder."



http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=2279292005

[DRoseDARs]

1. Yes, what a lovely candidate for EU membership. n/t

[I Have A Dream]

2. Very good point, DRoseDARs. n/t

[PsychoDad]

3. I don't know... Might fit right in.

Consider this poll from England :

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1940203

[murielm99]

4. You got that right,, Psychodad.

[GemMom]

7. Honor killings happen elsewhere not just Turkey

This goes on in many countries - not just turkey.

http://womensissues.about.com/cs/honorkillings/a/honorkillings.htm

Honor killings have been reported in Bangladesh, Brazil, Ecuador, Egypt, India, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Morocco, Pakistan, Sweden, Turkey, Uganda and the United Kingdom. Honor killings tend to be prevalent in countries with a majority Muslim population, but many Islamic leaders and scholars condemn the practice and deny that it is based on religious doctrine. Honor killing is actually a pre-Islamic, tribal custom stemming from the patriarchal and patrilineal society's interest in keeping strict control over familial power structures.

Because these crimes often go unreported, it is difficult to determine the actual number of victims in honor killings. The United Nations Population Fund estimates as many as 5000 females being killed each year.

Current Status of Honor Killings:

Many people find the practice of honor killings to be unacceptable, but the practice still continues. In some countries such as Jordan, Morocco and Syria, “honor crimes” are legally sanctioned and defense of the family honor is considered a mitigating factor.

Article 340 of the Penal Code of Jordan used to contain an exemption from penalty if a man killed his wife or female relative after finding her “committing adultery with another.” This Article has since been repealed, but there are other Articles that allow for a reduced sentence if the men were "provoked" into performing the murder. Article 548 of the Penal Code of Syria also provides an exemption from penalty if a man kills or injures his wife or female after finding her committing adultery or other “illegitimate sexual acts with another.”

Honor Killings in the News:

Sixteen-year-old Hsehu Yones was stabbed to death by her father, Abdullah Jones, on October 12, 2002, for having a Christian boyfriend and becoming "Westernized". According to Scotland yard, the stabbing is believed to be among 12 honor killings in the UK last year. On September 29th, 2003 Abdullah Jones was given a life sentence for his crime, showing the intolerance of honor killings in the UK.

[Laelth]

9. Same in several US states for adultery.

Finding one's wife in bed with another man is a complete defense to murder (of both your wife and the other man) in Texas if you kill them right after you catch them in the act.

This law, or a variant of it, is probably still on the books in many other U.S. states. We're not that much better than those we criticize--which is not to say that we shouldn't criticize. It's just that we're quite guilty of sharing and condoning these "tribal" and "family-honor based" attitudes.

-Laelth

[Orangepeel]

13. do you have a cite for that?

it may be wishful thinking, but I have a hard time believing that that is still true in Texas.

[Laelth]

18. American Jurisprudence, 2005

This is what AmJur has to say about it:

§ 119. Sexual misbehavior with spouse or other child of accused

The common law justifies a woman in killing one who attempts to ravish her, and, coextensively, the husband or father may justify killing a man who attempts a rape upon his wife or child. Rape is generally recognized as a crime of violence in the prevention of which life may be taken. But the law, in the absence of statute, does not recognize adultery or seduction as a complete excuse for homicide, but merely as a matter which goes to the degree of the homicide. According to the modern rule, a man who, moved by the passion naturally engendered in finding his wife in the act of adultery with another, immediately kills her or her paramour, is guilty of manslaughter only. Even though one finds another in the act of adultery with his wife and kills him directly, upon the spot, the killing is not deemed justifiable in law. A fortiori, the breaking up of the home of a person does not justify the taking of human life.

In some jurisdictions, however, statutes admit a finding of justifiable homicide where the deceased is killed when taken in the act of adultery with the wife of the accused, or to prevent sexual relations between the deceased and the spouse or daughter of the accused, or where the killing is done in a sudden heat of passion caused by the attempt of the deceased to rape or defile the female relative of the accused, or when the defilement has actually been committed.

In general, and in the common law, it's not justified to kill either the wife or the paramour, but, as the entry shows above, killing the paramour is justified, by statute, in a number of US states.

My research indicates that Texas, in fact, has repealed that statute. I could have sworn a read about a case where the husband killed both the wife and the lover and escaped any punishment, and it was a Texas case too, but I can't seem to find it now. The following poster is correct to say that adultery is almost always, at the very least, a mitigating factor.

-Laelth


Edit:Laelth--html error.

[Streetdoc270]

14. I think you are talking about...

Crime of passion

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_of_passion

Its not a real defense but rather a mitigating circumstance that lawyers use to get reduced sentencing in these type cases

[Megahurtz]

15. No kidding. n/t

[Wabbajack]

5. Just when you thought nothing could sicken you anymore.....

[China_cat]

6. Well, it IS biblical.

[GemMom]

8. It is pre-biblical

based in tribal culture.

[nodehopper]

10. sorry but "tribal culture" is a misnomer

unless you are talking about a particular, specific tribe. Historically, small-scale societies had a wide range of sexual and marital practices, and "honor killings" were certainly not a universal staple of every small-scale society. Many small communities had other ways of sanctioning social behavior such as adultery. "Honor killings" of women is a phenomenon largely characteristic of theocracies.

[China_cat]

12. And codified in the bible.

[Gregorian]

19. Old testament.

And not valid because it was probably just reiteration of some standing law. Not the teachings of Jesus.

That's really misleading, what you posted.

[China_cat]

20. No it's not.

According to the Jesus character, he came to fulfill the law not to change it...not one jot or tittle was to be changed.

So that bugfix needs Raid.

[Gregorian]

21. Show me. Where?

I'm still looking for any reference, in the bible. About the best I can come up with is the book of Ruth.
But nowhere, to my knowledge, is there anything in either bible that is even similar to this rape analogy.

[China_cat]

22. Exodus

22:16 And if a man entice a maid that is not betrothed, and lie with her, he shall surely endow her to be his wife.

There is no 'enticement' in biblical days. Consent by the woman would only get her stoned and would be the man's out for having to marry. Even if she is raped while 'betrothed' (a condition that allows sex for the couple) then she must be stoned.

[Gregorian]

24. Here's one that IS about rape

Mind, these are both old testament. And as such, they are nothing more than law of the day. I believe Exodus as well as the one I found are simply laws that pertained to Jewish slaves in Egypt.
None of these are things that the bible proclaims to be useful in our lives today. In fact, the only thing Jesus says that anyone must remember is- love. Even the Ten Commandments are just old tired words. And that's where most people have gone totally astray.

edit- Oh, I forgot to say, the following passages are actually the exact opposite of what that Turkish thread post says. The man who rapes the virgin should die, according to the following.

This is Deuteronomy 22

But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her; then the man only that lay with her shall die:
26 but unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbor, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:
27 for he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.
28 ¶ If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.

[Colorado Blue]

26. A lot of this has to do with supporting women who would

otherwise be unmarriageable.

We can't interpret these ancient ideas as though they were taking place in downtown Chicago 2005. Women in many cultures were and are completely dependent upon men for their livelihoods - not that they don't work, because they do, but within the context of family and tribe. An unmarried woman might literally die, uncared for and unsupported. The tribal system recognizes this and tries to provide for her. This is one of the rationalizations behind the polygynous system. People need to remember also, life is hard, often marginal, in many regions where such customs are practiced.

Another poster pointed out that not all tribes had the same ideas and this is true. Berber women, and the women of the Tuareg and other matriarchies, aren't similarly constrained, though these women are coming under pressure from patriarchal Islam.

The concept of "honor" in many Middle Eastern cultures in particular, but probably others as well including Pakistan and parts of India and Afghanistan, resides in the woman. A man's honor is reflected by the way his women behave. There is a book about this called, I believe, "The Price of Honor." It's worth reading.

Thank you for your contributions from the Old Testament.

[China_cat]

31. I'm really curious

Since when is the OT NOT part of the bible? It sure gets used enough for the justification for discrimination of/hatred of/killing of gays.

[Colorado Blue]

32. Did I say the Old Testament isn't part of the Bible? Fundies

of all 3 "Abrahamic" religions, for want of a better term, fall back on these ancient texts to justify sexual discrimination and other forms of repression. However, there are similar proscriptions in many cultures and religions, so sexual repression isn't limited to the Judeo/Christian/Islamic tradition. Rather they're a means of controlling people and maintaining a status quo, ESPECIALLY in patriarchal (male-dominated) cultures.

I find nothing "G*dly" about this and therefore, no reason why customs shouldn't change and become more open, inclusive and compassionate.

Most Jews and Christians have reformed considerably, many Muslims in practice as well. However some still rely on ideas that were fashionable several thousand years ago, most disturbingly, to my mind, the increasingly powerful fundamentalist Christians. At least people living in mountain and desert regions in remote parts of the Middle East have the very real excuse that their cultures haven't changed much in thousands of years and that social and economic pressures that probably created the OT in the first place are still the norm.

I was very disturbed by the Catholics' recent declaration that gays can't be priests. I think that's a huge step backwards.

[China_cat]

33. "Did I say the Old Testament isn't part of the Bible? "

It sure looked that way when you specified OT when thanking the other poster for his references. It seemed that you were separating that part out as something other than biblical.

Levitican proscriptions are very popular with fundamentalists...except for the ones that would also serve to send them to hell.

[Colorado Blue]

35. I think there is the core spiritual meaning of the OT, and then

there are the cultural ideas, things specific to the time and place of Leviticus. The one is timeless, but the cultural references must be seen in context. For example we don't endorse owning slaves anymore.

And I apologize if my previous comment was misleading. I didn't mean to imply anything when I thanked the other poster for his references, merely that I found them interesting. To me they're a sideline to what's important about the religion itself.

I agree the fundies are misusing these ancient texts. I find it maddening, actually, but also sort of funny because, as you say, it's pretty hypocritical:)

[China_cat]

29. Uh, no, the man does NOT die for raping a virgin

But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her; then the man only that lay with her shall die:

[Colorado Blue]

25. "Entice" is not the same as "rape". I should think they had

figured that out even back in the day.

[China_cat]

30. It is when the woman has no real

right to refuse. Remember, this was a time when women were the property of their fathers until they were the property of their husbands and, no matter what they said, if a man contradicted them they were wrong.

A woman couldn't even testify to anything unless she had 3 men to back up the truth of her statements. So, entice means diddly squat. Sex without consent or the ability to consent is rape.

[Colorado Blue]

34. That's a good point, and repression of women, as I mentioned

above, is very common in patriarchal cultures, as you obviously know.

This hasn't changed much, alas. I read an article just yesterday, about domestic violence. It's endemic, all over the world, in just about every culture.

But as to the question of consent, women's sexuality is rigidly controlled in many cultures - if the fundies have their way, it will again be in ours. I ran into it all the time when I was a belly dancer. Men (Middle Eastern, Greek) seemed to think they should be the ones to control what I did (as if). It was actually a quite a shock because I'd been raised, obviously, as an independent and free-thinking American. But it was a valuable experience because it gave me a taste of what women experience in certain cultures. It was upsetting, frightening and frustrating.

Very seriously, the possibility of a Supreme Court full of anti-choice judges represents a real threat to women's freedom.

There's an Iranian film that touches on this issue, women's freedom and sexuality, called "Gabbeh". It's wonderful.

[sistersofmercy]

11. I've been to Turkey and this article does not reflect Turkey as a whole

Not at all! The Kurdish population has been a source of trouble for the Turks for decades, particularly in the southeast part of Turkey. I was in Istanbul a few years ago and I can attest to the fact that the women overall are very westernized. They walk the streets in jeans and are well educated. Our tour guide, a female who spoke 7 languages and wore jeans. On the streets I only saw 1 or 2 women wearing head scarves. A friend I met there told me that most Turks resent the religious radicals. His daughter was studying prem-med and spoke english and french. The school system is based on test scores, the better the score the higher the student will be allowed to go with education. I had the honor of going to an authentic Turkish restaurant that was off the beaten tourist path. The bathrooms were a bit funny but at the tables were women and men enjoying a pleasant atmosphere and great food. Bottomline they want to correct the problem with the radicals because they want the tourism revenues.

[Colorado Blue]

27. This is true. Thank you for pointing this out. I hate to see

stereotypes get started from articles like this. Turkey has done a great deal to move forward and is actually a very complex and sophisticated society.

[LiberalFighter]

16. If there was true honor...

the family of the rapist would kill the rapist

Thereby impressing on the minds of those that think of raping to suppress that urge.

There is no real penalty for the rapist under therir current system. Thus no concern for their actions.

And the family of the rapist forced to support the ex-virgin.

[DanCa]

17. Disgusting and I bet hannity and the rw wing goons want this over here.

[superconnected]

23. oh, they call it "honor killings"

So much for civilization.

I bet the rw is taking notes. Bet they'd love to invoke that here.

[RagingInMiami]

28. It's a disgusting and criminal tradition

Which also happens in the U.S.

Just take a look at the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. And how often you see the government crack down on them?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamentalist_Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter_Day_Saints