‘Military voters' could threaten Bush's bid for re-election

[Nambe]

WASHINGTON (MNS)

The increasing disenchantment among military personnel and veterans with the Bush administration's handling of the American occupation in Iraq may create a liability for President Bush in his 2004 re-election bid, said journalists at a briefing Wednesday.

Defining "military voters" as U.S. military personnel, veterans, and voters with friends and families in the U.S. military, Ben Wallace-Wells, editor of the Washington Monthly, told the audience this predominantly Republican group could represent a new breed of swing voters in the next presidential election.

Voters in "Bush country," like Fayetteville, Beaufort and Jacksonville, and other small, conservative coastal towns of North Carolina, are showing signs of discontent with the administration's policies on Iraq, said Wallace- Wells, who recently spent time in the South taking the pulse of military voters. ---

Ride Don’t Drive It’s Global Cool

[onehandle]

1. No shi*t....

Calling General Clark.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

2. Or John "Vietnam Veteran" Kerry

no shit.

[lovedems]

3. Could threaten?

I hope that it WILL threaten! He doesn't deserve the support of the military that he doesn't support.

[Code_Name_D]

20. I think there is still some doubt on weather millitary votes will even ...

counted. After all, you can't expect Deibold to be every where, can you.

[omshanti]

4. thousands of military ballots will 'mysteriously' be lost in the mail...

these shameless power-hungry neocons will stop at nothing.

[jayfish]

8. They Won't Need To Disappear.

They'll just arrive late. But this time ShrubCo. will argue against including them in the vote count instead of including them. The Dems. in power will roll over for them again, and the rank and file will be told to just "move on".

Jay

[underpants]

9. Or they will did what they did in Fla. in 2000 in the "Gore Counties"

The Repubes (ever the most respectful of the military :eyes: ) contested every absentee ballot in the counties won by Gore in the regular vote and guess what.............2/3 of them were thrown out.

[Eloriel]

12. And hundreds of thousands of others are being cast on the internet

Poof!

Instant victory, for that demographic anyway.

Eloriel

[NNN0LHI]

18. Thousands more of their family members vote in a booth n/t

[sleipnir]

5. Calliing Howard Dean!!

[samsingh]

6. Bush treats the military as a tool

for his own interests. he does not care for their wellbeing at all. why would anyone in the military vote for him?

[Zhade]

15. You would think he'd want to NOT piss off the ones with the guns.

But as for the Traitor's continuing attacks on both the military and the CIA, I say "bring 'em on!"

He will DESTROY himself.

[Atman]

7. Because Bush is a dumbass

He seems to think, "Well, I'm commander in chief, so I get the military vote." He doesn't seem to see a connection between his screwing the soldiers and their not liking him. Like, they are just one more entitlement he receives as part of being a republican president.

That's what happens when you are never held responsible for the consequences of your actions.

[eileen_d]

10. I'm loving this headline! n/t

[Jivenwail]

11. My husband's military vote

will be cast against Bush and for the Dem candidate. He voted for Gore in 2000 because he didn't trust Bush then and now knows he - and all military - were used, totally abused and stabbed in the back by Bush. As more and more of the military and their families begin to see the light, Bush will most definitely lose their votes.

[Ernesto]

13. Who exactly has bush not screwed?

Except ofcourse the rich, offense contractors, energy corporations, religous nuts and the bin laden family.

[LittleDannySlowhorse]

24. His wife!

Rimshot.

Sorry, I'm at work and bored.

[TacticalPeek]

36. ROFLMAO!

:silly:

[Bozita]

27. You left out the drug industry

[0007]

43. You left us old folks out!

My drug prescriptions from Canada are screwed - Medicare just refused to pay my last months blood work stating that these are noncovered services because this a routine exam or screening procedure done in conjuntion with a routine exam. Exact wording - Does anyone here understand?

I've spent the last six hours calling, writing and waiting......to get this fucking mess straighten out. Talk about jumping through hoops!

Now I know why folks take the pipe.

[Occulus]

54. I'm starting to wonder

if perhaps seniors everywhere should simply start refusing to pay. Of course, that's not possible when you need the drug in question in order to stay alive.

Y'all are a truly captive market. I hope things change before I grow old...

[Skwmom]

14. But you have to give the military voter somewhere to go

One of the guests on CSPAN pointed out the other day that the Dems would need to put up a candidate that could attract the military vote. I hate to tell you but for the most part the military (in numbers that could really count) will not support someone who is perceived as a draft dodger.

It's really sad when you think about how big the Dems are blowing it. Will you ever get tired of losing?

[Spazito]

16. That's good news then, because there are at least 2 dem candidates...

that have served, Clark and Kerry, versus the Bush that went AWOL. If what you said is true, the military won't be voting for someone who ran away and had other serve in his place, like Bush did.

[burrowowl]

21. Gore served

Draft Gore! His speech was great yesterday!

[RandomKoolzip]

17. Bush WAS a draft dodger!

What are you talking about?!! WE'RE blowing it? Your post makes little sense.

[SahaleArm]

53. Yeah and that needs to be exposed.

AWOL Chickenhawks :mad:

[Grins]

46. Military will not support a draft dodger...?

If that's true, then the military vote, even "...in numbers that could really count...", is immaterial anyway. If it was that important, how does it explain Bill Clinton?

“Draft dodging” is overrated as an issue. It’s perceived as a big issue, mostly by the right that never served, and looking for any kind of wedge issue. If it was, the military should be up in arms over Bush, Cheney, Herr Ashkroft, Speaker Hastert, former House Majority Leader Dick Armey, Tom Delay, Roy Blount, Bill Frist, Mitch McConnell, Rick Santorum, Trent Lott, and on, and on, and on. And, where the hell were they on Dan Quayle?

I know that Rumsfeld served, but none of his cabal – Pearle, Feith, Wolfowicz, (and certainly not Gingrich) – did. And don't get me on Saxby Chambliss of Georgia either. If they really believe that, then explain that draft dodging SOB in the Senate!

(I also believe that making movies in Hollywood in the 40’s is not "serving" either.)

The military will vote like the rest of us – in their own best interests and for the nation.

Look out George. You played them in their hearts, and now they know it.

[TacticalPeek]

57. Draft dodger is one thing.

Being AWOL, possibly a deserter, is entirely another.

Scrubbing military records and concomitant conspiracy is yet another.

If the story of aWol's AWOL received wide national coverage, say one-tenth of KobeLaci, then the chump would be burnt toast.

[The Backlash Cometh]

19. The more reservists he sends over there, the more Democratic

votes he creates.

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. The backlash has started

I know, there are whispers now, and some articles in papers from
very angry wives

I might add some letters in Stars and Stripes

Then there are the military papers running stories on betrayal

The backlash is not commeth, it is here

[Melinda]

23. Nambe!! You're back!!

Scuse my off topic post, but I noticed you've been mia (good reporters are easily missed), and I'm glad to see you post again. Hope all is well with you and yours... welcome back, Nambe. :)

[Wickerman]

25. Entire small towns missing their young men

Reservists and Guard called up. The small towns of mid America are pissed. I predict it isn't just the military vote - I believe it is also going to be the local towns voting down Bush.

I was in our local diner this weekend. Never a bastion of liberal thought, but certainly a hangout for the retired coffee drinking set. Two cartoons on the wall were decidedly Anti-bush*, one referring to soldiers in Iraq as ducks in a shooting gallery - the other actually discussed the BBV issue and indicated that no matter who you voted for electronic voting machines would decide for you and select the candidate of the machine's choice - in this case a chimpanzee! Times are changing and the public is fedup with the totallitarism of Bush*.

[Scott Lee]

26. Use Cheney's line - "I have other priorities"

Hey if its good enough for that blackhearted ruling elitist, it's good enough for the young men and women of Average Smalltown, USA.

What say you?

[Okole]

28. Wishful Thinking

In my opinion this is highly unlikely. Military families and the military are overwhelmingly conservative and there is no way in hell they will swing to the D side if they perceive the candidate as being subversive to the cause, like Dean. No offence all but the D candidates are not portraying themselves in any way that would appeal to R swing voters in the military. Maybe Leiberman though.

[Dr Fate]

30. Lieberman appeals to military, but not Clark????

Nah, that's just who Bush/media would rather run against.

Clark could get more military votes than Holy Joe anyday- Holy joe is the top candidate for Republicans, because they think he is easiest to beat...

[Okole]

34. True

But from what I have read Clark is viewed as a climber and not a soldiers soldier. Beyond that he is a tool of the Clintons and the Military hates the Clintons, so even in that case he probably wouldn't get very many votes.
This is why I don't think the military vote will shift and it is only wishful thinking.
Dean is probably the last candidate Military would get behind.

[Dr Fate]

37. What about Bush's status as a soldier???

Was he a "soldier's soldier?"

You say Clark is a "tool" of the Clintons? Can you back that up?

[Okole]

42. Hell no!!

Bush was no soldiers soldier but that was overlooked in the first election and will not come back to bite him in the second election. He was a rich boy hiding out, snorting coke. If his lack of being a soldier’s soldier comes back again it is going to be viewed as old news.
Conservatives do not view Clark as a soldier’s soldier and view him as a political climber; most military is R and conservative, including the military.
Nope, I can't back it up, it is only my opinion but I am basing it on commentary about Clark and that is not the point.
My point is...the military is not going to shift to D because none of the candidates can pull it off at this time. It ain't gonna happen. Unless the war gets even worse and there are more deaths and the area becomes even more unstable.

[Dr Fate]

51. No one is going to view Bush's AWOL as "old news"

Because most people are not aware of it. Remember, the media refused to report this in 2000, so most military guys dont even no about it- yet.

If Bush tries to smear Clark for being a successful military man, then he will have no choice but to bring this up.

The media sure will look stupid, because if Clark and Kerry bring it up, everyones going to be wondering why the media refused to report it in 2000...

Bush and the media know better than to to attack Clark's career- they dont want to have to discuss Bush and Cheny's refusal to serve.

If everyone in the military actually knew about Bush's AWOL, this "old news" would hurt him in 2004...

I hope republicans do make the mistake of attacking Clark's successful military record. You call it "climbing", but most Amercians will see it as hard work. Contrast Clarks record to Bush & Cheneys cowardly refusal to ever serve, and I think most military voters will see the difference...

[Okole]

55. I hope you are right...

and it happens, believe me.
I am surprised you say that most people are not aware of Bush going AWOL, I thought most people knew about this from the last election. Wasn't it even on 60 minutes?

[Dr Fate]

56. Ask the person in the grocery line if they know this...

ask them if they know Cheney refused to serve on 5 occasions when he was asked to fight.

No, thanks to the media, most people think Bush is a naval or airforce Flight veteran. I've never seen reporting on his AWOL scandal on TV, except mabey Carville on Crossfire saying it once or twice.

You say 60 minutes covered it, what about the 24 news networks? Did they cover this "Monica style", or even at all???

Ask the next person you see if they know the details of Bush's military "careeer"- 9 times out of 10, they wont know much about it all.

THIS is why Bush probably will not attack Clark as a "climber"- But I'm sure Fox news, CNN, and CBS (We do what ever the RNC tells us to do) network already are attacking him for Bush...)

...because it would expose his and Cheney's cowardly past...he could keep the media from reporting it like they did Clinton, but he cant keep Clark or Kerry from talking about it...

[Okole]

58. I'm not sure

about 60 minutes, just thought it was covered before the last election.
Hey, I agree with you, he was a coward and is fake fake fake. Clark definitely has a better military record than either of those two; I just think the military is so conservative he won't have a chance to swing the vote unless it gets worse.
Maybe I live in a bubble about Bush's AWOL status because I honestly thought everyone knew about this. If you are right, it could be a big contentious point for Clark to bring up in the debates and could seriously damage Bush credibility.
If this is true, that the majority of the population do not know about him being AWOL, it would make Clark the better candidate to swing some of the military vote, if the military vote could be swung.

[tabasco]

40. I'm military

I greatly respect Clark. I also enjoyed the years of peace under Clinton. Maybe your "friends in the military" are not really clued in. Repeating RNC talking points doesn't make them true. Bush is in serious trouble with the military. But keep hoping, pubbie, maybe Clark will go away.

[Dr Fate]

41. He says Lieberman would get more military votes!!!

I've heard RW editorialists like George Will also stump for Holy Joe and Gephart.

Republicans are VERY TERRIFIED of Clark- they would love to pick our candidate!!!!

[Okole]

45. Wha?

Repeating RNC talking points?
I am sorry I am not towing the line here in questioning the original article and getting excited about the military becoming a swing vote. Crimony, I can assure you that I am not repeating RNC talking points, I am just not buying in to the military shifting to D in the next election as things currently stand. If it gets bad enough the military shifts, it won't matter anyway because Bush will loose at that point because of the general population.
Keep yer pants on.

[aquart]

33. You speak of what was, not what is.

Conservatives are realizing Bush is not conservative. He is profligate, especially with American lives.

[Okole]

35. I agree

But when it comes to choosing between a fake conservative playing on their team or a true liberal/progressive/whatever playing for the other team, I can't see them switching. From what I understand the vast majority of Military is R and is that way for a reason, they dislike the politics of D's. So why would they vote for someone who embodies the politics that they stand against when they can at least vote for someone who is somewhat what they agree with.
This is just my opinion but I base it on people I know it the military. I hate to say it but there just hasn't been enough casualties to cause a shift yet.

[Dr Fate]

39. You "hate" the fact that there are not enough American casualties???

Did you really mean it that way?

I'm not so sure a vast majority of the military does agree with Bush's policies at this point- especially his lies about supporting the troops and vets.

I dont know any DEMS who want more things to go wrong- but I have heard Rush the narcotics addict and Hannity say this.

[Okole]

44. No no no

I am sorry it came accross like that. I meant to say that there aren't enough casualties to cause a shift yet. I hate the fact that there will need to be more casualties to cause this shift.

[Dr Fate]

49. An honest media would cause the shift btter than more violence...

...If networks like CNN and CBS would actually report how Bush has lied to troops and vets, we would shore up more deserved support. The media also REFUSES to tell them the truth about Bush's disrespectful failure to serve in the military...Instead they cave in to the RW...

You claim that the military opposes DEM views. I'm not so sure they do- is your average private going to get a tax cut? Do military guys really support Bush's cuts in veterans benefits???

You also claim that soldiers would rather support an AWOL coward (Bush)and a man who took 5 deferemnts (Cheney) as opposed to Clark or Kerry.

If this is true, it's because the GOP owned media refuses to report the fact that most republicans in power refused to ever even serve. THIS would help us more than hoping Bush's policies kill more innocent troops...

[TacticalPeek]

50. Its not the casualties, its the incompetence.

"Wrong war, wrong time"

General Anthony Zinni, USMC (ret)

[Noordam]

29. I have been saying this for some time now

North Carolina and other states with big military counts could go Dem in 2004.

On here today is a piece of a National Guard getting ready to go to Iraq and he has to go out and BUY a good pair of Fucking boots, because the military does not supply "good" desert boot

[aquart]

31. Tee hee.

Bush's genius advisors were so sure this war would put them on top for the millenium.

[bushisanidiot]

32. Anyone Know How To Find Out Where The Units In Iraq are deployed from?

just curious to see how many are from 'red' states and how many from 'blue'..

[FuseONE]

38. hmmmm

I believe that the overwhelmingly conservative military families will have plenty of good reason to not vote for bush. he's cut their pay, took away their doctors and otherwise shown nothing but contempt for them. and most important, the democratic candidate would likely get them out of iraq quicker. if their life is not worth their vote, I don't know what is.

[eissa]

47. I dunno know.....

....the whole country has been screwed by shrub (and not in a good way), yet he still retains about a 50% approval rating. I could see some independents swinging to our side, but strong conservative groups, including the military and the south, will be tough. Unfortunately, no strategy from our brainiacs in the democratic leadership have devised any plans on how to get to these traditionally repug voters. The one candidate who tried to reach out to this group got his hands slapped by his own party.

[Okole]

48. I agree.

After all that has happened it will take much more to get the Military vote.

[TacticalPeek]

52. Perhaps,

but if many are turned off enough to stay home on election day, this also has it's effect, as aWol's old man can attest..

[raysr]

59. Sign

I put up an "IMPEACH BUSH" sign on a well traveled road where I live and it's still there! Either it's too high for them or maybe some agree. Not that it could happen but maybe the "times they are a-changin'"

[Myra]

60. Fight Diebold and computerized voting fraud!

Der Fraud nothing to worry about as long as
computerized fraud machines like Diebold
are strategically placed where he needs them.

It won't matter how the soldiers or the soccer
moms or anyone else votes.