BBC: Vietnam court jails US citizens (for "terrorism")

[Eugene]

Last Updated: Friday, 10 November 2006, 10:57 GMT

Vietnam court jails US citizens

Three US citizens and four Vietnamese have been sentenced to 15 months
jail for terrorism, a Hanoi court has ruled.

Taking into account time already served the seven could be freed in a month,
when the US citizens face expulsion.

The seven were accused of trying to set up illegal radio transmitters to make
anti-communist broadcasts.

Correspondents says the case threatened to complicate ties with the US ahead
of President George W Bush's visit next week and a Congressional vote on trade.

-snip-

Full article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/6134746.stm

Earlier thread: Vietnam charges 3 U.S. citizens with "terrorism"

[ixion]

1. this is a textbook example of the problem with the so-called

"War on Terror".

Terror is abstract, and the defintion varies from culture to culture, and even from person to person. What causes one person 'terror' may be something altogether different for someone else.

You cannot declare a 'war' on an abstraction, by the very definition of 'war'.

[MrPrax]

3. Good point...

Most are revolutions and national liberation movements with distinct, regional, historical and legitimate , while others are simply 'proxies' chiefly working on behalf of particular national interests and causes already established by various intelligence agencies.

As you rightly point out, it comes down to definitions and whose propaganda is best able to harness aspects of pure geopolitics; there are few countries in the west that wouldn't shutdown and prosecute people who set up illegal radio transmitters and you are almost guaranteed under the new laws, to be charged with 'terrorism' if in fact your illegal radio station is calling for the overthrow of the host government.

That realpolitik -- Kissenger understood this when he did PR for China just after the Tianemen Square massacre -- he asked rhetorically (and quite rightly), "well what western country in the world, especially the US, would allow a growing 'revolutionary movement' to camp in front of it's country's government for months on end, gathering momentum daily".

I think we 'westerners' know the answer to that question.

But by that set of definitions and realpolitik 'spin', the actions of the Chinese government were perfectly acceptable and would be lauded by most in the west.

[laheina]

9. And I think that the Bushies set a dangerous precedent

with their tactics. If we manage to stamp them out here, we are still going to have to deal with the world wide repercussions for years to come.

[malaise]

16. The stupid concept will come back to

haunt Bushco.

[lateo]

17. Well, you can but...

Then you have to use an abstract definition of the word "war".

[AIJ Alom]

2. Communism has worked well for Vietnam, it is still primarily an

agrarian society. Of course it hasn't worked as well for US interests in Vietnam because we can't sell them everything under the sun for corporate gain yet.

[Amused Musings]

6. I think

I think the government of Vietnam renounced Marxism in the early eighties and introduced Deng Xioping style economic reforms in 1986. So while they call themselves communists, they are more akin to contemporary Chinese "Communism." Which means not very much.

[NuttyFluffers]

7. i'm still amazed at their wise handling of Khmer Rouge after US-Vietnam war

unstable Cambodian state, also communist, nearby. Vietnam goes in, kicks Khmer Rouges ass, deposes Pol Pot (or as it is loving referred to in FR, "Paul Pot"), and... then walks away back into Vietnam letting the Cambodians solve their own problems. stunning to say the least, especially in the context of all the previous "nation building" in the last 2 centuries.

[Norquist Nemesis]

4. Maybe Bush is planning to break them out when he visits n/t

[uppityperson]

5. So, are these people "enemy combatants"? Thinking about torture.

Not that they were tortured, but could another country decide to go the GeorgeBuSh way and say they could?

[anotherdrew]

8. I wouldn't be surprised that they are there as "missionaries" n/t

[0rganism]

10. here we'd nail them with FCC violations...

IIRC, the maximum sentence for operating a pirate radio station is 12 months in prison, not much different from the Vietnamese version.

Of course, they make it sound a bit more alarming. 15 months jailtime for "terrorism"? Hmm... That's almost misdemeanor stuff.

[Judi Lynn]

11. 3 Americans convicted of terrorism in Vietnam

3 Americans convicted of terrorism in Vietnam
Defendants charged with taking over radio airwaves to call for an uprising

Updated: 6:52 a.m. CT Nov 10, 2006
HO CHI MINH CITY, Vietnam - Three Americans were convicted by a Vietnamese court on terrorism charges Friday after being accused of trying to take over radio airwaves and call for an uprising against the communist government.
(snip)

All on trial were accused of plotting to smuggle radio equipment into Vietnam to broadcast a call for a revolution to topple the government.

California-based group said behind scheme
An indictment said the scheme was hatched by the Government of Free Vietnam, a California-based organization that the Vietnamese government considers a terrorist group.
(snip)

Adoption agency used to disguise plans?
Prosecutors say the defendants convicted Friday set up an adoption agency in Cambodia as a front to disguise their plans. Authorities seized their equipment, including 14 radio transmitters, which had been smuggled into the southern Vietnamese province of An Giang.
(snip)

The case has attracted attention from Sen. Mel Martinez, R-Fla., who raised the issue with the Bush administration and reportedly blocked a key vote in Congress that would normalize trade relations between the former foes.
(snip/...)

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/15650357/



Florida Cuban "exile" Senator Mel Martinez and _friend.

[Peace Patriot]

12. "When will they ever learn?/ when will they e-e-ever le-e-earn...?" n/t

[cureautismnow]

13. Martinez supports terrorism?

Well then, perhaps, he should be held as an enemy combatant. "You're either with us or against us."

[Haole Girl]

14. Something doesn't sound right about this story.

Didn't they think they would be arrested and thrown in jail? :shrug:

[Eugene]

15. AP: Vietnam Deports American in Terror Case

Vietnam Deports American in Terror Case

By BEN STOCKING
The Associated Press
Sunday, November 12, 2006; 10:36 PM

HANOI, Vietnam -- Vietnam deported an American woman who was convicted
last week on terrorism charges for plotting to seize radio airwaves to call
for an uprising against the communist government, her brother and a court
official said Monday.

Nguyen Thuong "Cuc" Foshee, 58, of Orlando, Fla., flew out of the country
from the Ho Chi Minh City airport Monday morning, said her brother, Nguyen
Phu Tri, who dropped her off at the immigration department.

Phan Tanh, deputy head of the Ho Chi Minh City People's Court, said the
court decided to release Foshee 29 days before the end of her 15-month
sentence because of health reasons. She had been held without charge
since September 2005 before being convicted Friday with six others.

-snip-

Full article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/12/AR2006111201158.html