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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:23 AM
Original message
STOCK MARKET WATCH, Monday January 7
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 08:33 AM by UpInArms
Source: du

STOCK MARKET WATCH, Monday January 7

COUNTING THE DAYS
DAYS REMAINING IN THE * REGIME 380
LONG DAYS
DAYS SINCE DEMOCRACY DIED (12/12/00) 2546 DAYS
WHERE'S OSAMA BIN-LADEN? 2268 DAYS
DAYS SINCE ENRON COLLAPSE =2229
Number of Enron Execs in handcuffs = 19
ENRON EXECS CONVICTED = 10
Enron execs conveniently deceased = 3
Other Arrests of Execs = 54


U.S. FUTURES & MARKETS INDICATORS
NASDAQ FUTURES-----------------------------S&P FUTURES



AT THE CLOSING BELL WHEN BUSH TOOK OFFICE on January 22, 2001
Dow - 10,578.24
Nasdaq - 2,757.91
S&P 500 - 1,342.90
Oil - $27.69/bbl
Gold - $266.70/oz.

AT THE CLOSING BELL ON January 4, 2008

Dow... 12,800.18 down 256.54 (1.96%)
Nasdaq... 2,504.65 down 98.03 (3.77%)
S&P 500... 1,411.63 down 35.53 (2.46%)
10-Yr Bond...3.854% down 0.047
Gold future... $863.00






GOLD, EURO, YEN, Dollars and Loonie



PIEHOLE ALERT

Heads Up!
Preliminary info on appearances by Bush & Co. throughout the country. Details & links are added as they become available so check back. And if you know more, are organizing something, or would like to, contact actionpost@legitgov.org

For information on protests and other actions



(UIA - just filling in for Ozy!)


Read more: du
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
1. Today's WrapUp by Brian Pretti
Will the Truly Efficient Market Please Stand Up?

Although it always seems this way, it sure feels as if we’re entering 2008 with some of the most pressing issues for the financial markets and real economy we’ve faced in quite some time. Very important fundamental issues that for now remain very unresolved. Here’s a very short list of highlighted topics:

Balanced on the proverbial conceptual fulcrum at the moment is whether or not the US will enter recession in 2008. Maybe more importantly, if indeed a recession does lie in our future, will the true nature of US economic circumstances under such an environment ever be “published” in the headline economic stats so heavily adjusted and massaged these days? As you know, many an honored and experienced financial market pundit believes recession has already arrived domestically. Of course whether or not an official recession actually comes to pass, it's corporate earnings that ultimately count.

The US consumer is a major question mark as we enter the New Year. After the demise of the US consumer has been predicted by so many for so long, and so many have been so wrong for so long, is this now the ultimate and perhaps most important contrarian stance as we look into the year ahead? US consumer DOA? I guess it all depends on whether you are referring to their brains or their wallets (credit usage), between which there has been quite the disconnect for some time now.

Although the debate over potential inflationary or deflationary economic outcomes has been growing in pitch as of late, factual evidence of the moment points much more strongly toward stagflation as an important economic and financial market theme for 2008. Have the equity markets, individual sectors, or the aggregate bond market yet priced in such a possibility?

Without question, the near consensus theme of global economic decoupling has certainly underpinned really worldwide equity prices recently. In short, this is the thought that the largely consumption driven US economy could easily slow meaningfully, but the strong foreign and emerging economies would barely flinch in reaction, continuing their movement ever northward in economic trajectory and helping to support US export sectors. Will that indeed be the case, or will this conceptual hope prove but a fantasy as the reality of the magnitude of US consumption driving approximately 20% of the global economy ultimately shift thinking regarding decoupling toward recoupling? The answer to this important question lies dead ahead.

...more...
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
2. What an Up Front Cartoon!
Ain't it the truth!
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
3. dollar watch
http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX&v=i

Last trade 76.055 Change +0.132 (+0.17%)

Dollar - Recession Coming?

http://www.dailyfx.com/story/topheadline/Dollar_Recession_Coming__1199687579030.html

Not a happy start to a New Year for dollar bulls as US data turned decidedly dour last week ending on a depressing note of very weak NFP print of only 18K jobs. The job picture, which was the last bastion of relative strength for dollar longs is now a very serious cause for concern. If US labor environment begins to deteriorate the Fed will be forced to ease unremittingly at least through the summer doing further damage to the greenback as interest rate differential with the euro continues to compress.

On Friday, the dollar’s only source of solace was risk aversion as the Dow slipped by more than -200 points and forced carry trade liquidation in the high yielders keeping the buck relatively buoyant. However, that dynamic may not last for much longer if the market becomes convinced that the risk of US recession is real. Under that scenario the greenback is likely to fall irrespective of equity flows as speculators anticipate a series of rate cuts from the Fed.
This week the US calendar is relatively tame with Pending Home Sales and Trade Balance data the only key markers on the docket. One key data point that may receive more attention than it usually gets is the Consumer Credit survey report. The market anticipates a large expansion to $8.5 Billion but if the number fails to meet its forecast it will serve as yet another piece of evidence that the US consumer is slowing markedly and the line between a slowdown and recession will only become thinner as the woes in US housing finally begin to impact the broader US economy.



...more...


Could the Federal Reserve Cut by Another 100bp in 2008?

http://www.dailyfx.com/story/bio1/Could_the_Federal_Reserve_Cut_1199486106356.html

Last year, the Federal Reserve cut interest rates by 100bp to prevent a major slowdown in the US economy. Although their efforts have forestalled a recession, it has not prevented one from potentially happening in 2008. Non-farm payrolls in the month of December were abysmally weak, leading many bank analysts to revise their calls for how much the Fed will ease on January 30th. One week ago, the futures market was only pricing in a 30 percent chance that rates will be at 3.5 percent by the end of April (which is 75bp below current levels). However after the release of December non-farm payrolls, the market started to price in as much as 100bp of easing over the next 4 months. 100bp in 2007 and 100bp in 2008 would bring rates down to 3.25 percent, the lowest since June 2005. We believe that the chance for interest rates in the US to be 3.25 percent or lower by the end of 2008 is high, but whether half of that easing will happen in January remains to be seen. The growth of 18k jobs in the month of December was the weakest that we have seen since August 2003 when the US economy shed 42k jobs. Unfortunately there was no silver lining in the report. A look into the details reveals that if the government did not increase public sector hiring, job growth would actually be negative last month. On top of that, the unemployment rate increased to a 2 year high while the annualized pace of earnings growth slowed from 3.8 to 3.7 percent. These levels indicate that we are either already in a recession or headed for one. Within seconds of the data release, the US dollar fell 100 pips against the Japanese Yen as the futures market began to price in a greater chance for a 50 vs. 25bp rate cut at the end of this month. Although the Fed could cut rates by 50bp, we doubt that today’s non-farm payrolls number has cemented their decision. There are still 18 trading days until their monetary policy meeting. If oil prices break $100 a barrel and consumer prices or retail sales surprise significantly to the upside, the Fed could opt to drag out their easing cycle into the summer and lower rates at 25bp clips instead of acting more aggressively by cutting rates 50bp in January. In the week ahead, there are a lot of speeches by Fed officials but no meaningful US data until Friday. The US dollar should continue to weaken, but we would not be surprised to hear see new measures from the Bush Administration to stimulate growth.

...more...
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
4. no reports today
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TalkingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
43. News from the trenches: It's time to play Inflation or Deflation?
Is it inflation when Goodwill raises their prices by 7%? (granted, for the first time in 10 years. But still, they sell FREE stuff for Pete's sake...and yes, I know they have all kinds of costs...but that's sorta my point.) And frankly the "junk" and household goods have been creeping up without the official increase. Today I bought a small cast iron skillet for $5.50 and thought to myself "Who's been drinking whilst pricing?"


Is it inflation or deflation when you see a bag of Ghirardelli Bittersweet chocolate baking bits for $2.50 at Big Lots and the same bag in the grocery for exactly the same price? And while I am using them for cookies, quite honestly a few of them have gone, quite directly, from hand to mouth. (OMG they are soooo good!)


Is it inflation or deflation when the 30 local farm eggs you used to buy for $3.50 has gone up to $4.00, but the dozen free-range in the grocer has gone down to 1.75 per dozen from about 2.25?




My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
5. Wall Street Heads to Higher Open As Investors Hope for Fed Rate Cut
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080107/wall_street.html

NEW YORK (AP) -- Wall Street headed for a rebound Monday amid speculation that the Federal Reserve will cut interest rates to ward off a recession.

There is little in the way of corporate or economic news expected during the session. Instead, investors are looking toward Thursday's speech from Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke for clues about the central bank's intentions.

Further moves by the Fed at its Jan. 29-30 meeting can't come soon enough for some traders. Wall Street dropped sharply on Friday after a government report showed a jump in the unemployment rate and sluggish payroll growth.

In just the first three trading days of 2008, the Dow Jones industrial average lost 3.50 percent, the Standard & Poor's 500 index fell 3.86 percent, and the Nasdaq composite index dropped 5.57 percent.

On Monday, Dow futures rose 37 points, or 0.24 percent, to 12,924.00. Broader indexes also indicated a higher open, with S&P 500 futures up 5.00, or 0.35 percent, at 1,427.90; and Nasdaq futures up 2.00, or 0.10 percent, at 1,987.00.

...more...
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #5
21. Deosn't Look Higher To Me--Down 30 at 10:40 The Hits Just Keep On Coming!
I was shocked by NASDAQ on Friday, though.
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
6. Oil Prices Extend Decline on Worries About US Economy
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080107/oil_prices.html

VIENNA, Austria (AP) -- Oil prices fell Monday as a report of growing unemployment in the United States raised concerns of an economic downturn that could curb oil demand.

The U.S. Labor Department said the unemployment rate jumped to 5 percent in December -- its highest level in more than two years -- from 4.7 percent in November. Analysts had expected December unemployment at 4.8 percent.

"Many economists in the U.S. have talked about the potential of the U.S. getting into a recession," said Victor Shum, an energy analyst with Purvin & Gertz in Singapore. "This latest government report ... has added to the concerns about the economy."

Vienna's PVM Oil Associates also focused on the unemployment figures, noting, in a research note that they "revived fears of a recession that might reduce oil demand and have a negative impact on oil prices."

Light, sweet crude for February delivery dropped 52 cents to $97.39 a barrel by midday in European electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange. The contract fell $1.27 to settle at $97.91 a barrel on Friday.

The government also said in the report that employers created just 18,000 jobs last month, less than the 70,000 analysts had expected and the smallest increase since August 2003.

...more...
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #6
20. Morning Marketeers.....
:donut: and lurkers. I hope all is well with you and you had a Happy New Year. I had a very restful visit with my Mom in Arizona-but more about that at a later time. I have not been able to post on a regular basis but I have been watching the markets with much interest as of late.

I also find it interesting that suddenly the oil markets are worried that the US unemployment rate has gone up and that we might be going into a recession. I can't believe that they have been buying those phony employment numbers for a long time.

When Houston went through the 80's Bust....Real Estate prices escalated, the Savings and Loan scandal erupted, and then the price of oil dropped like a rock after being inflated with the arab oil embargo. When the bottom fell out of the oil market-Houston underwent a long protracted recession that lasted until midway through Clinton's first term.

I am interested in what this will mean for all of us. The Houston economy is much more diverse-but I still see folks here in Houston that are clueless. I think the recession will soon hit us with full force. Some folks will be able to withstand it but I fear we will have folks that will not survive this down turn. I was fortunate in that I was young when this happened the first time. I recovered somewhat. It took me getting another degree and 5 years on the job as a Nurse to make what I did when I worked in the oil biz. You can do it when you are young, but it gets harder as you approach retirement and the money used to retool yourself is not recouped so quickly.

I learned from my mistakes and mis-steps but I would be further ahead in my retirement planning had this economic upheaval not happened. This is one of the reasons why I am so in favour of pensions and Social Security. These 401K's and 403B's just don't cut it-you assume too much risk. You have to be careful about the risk you take on in you retirement planning. I have been always been one to save, and yet life has happened-and not always as I have planned. You can do the right thing and still wind up with nothing.

With those thoughts in mind-I wish you a prosperous New Year. Happy hunting and watch out for the bears-they are once again stirring from their deep winter's nap.
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. Welcome back! Have you heard about State Street Bank?
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 11:21 AM by DemReadingDU
We have missed your postings!


It is sad that so many companies are dropping their pensions. But some pensions are not even safe. Some of them that used to be invested in safe Treasury funds were instead invested in those nasty subprime mortgages...


State Street Corporation Is Sued Over Pension Fund Losses
The State Street Corporation, which manages $2 trillion for pension funds and other institutions, ousted a senior executive on Thursday and said it would set aside $618 million to cover legal claims stemming from investments tied to mortgage securities.

State Street made the announcement after five clients sued it, claiming they had lost tens of millions of dollars in State Street funds that they were told would be largely invested in risk-free debt like Treasuries. One fund lost 28 percent of its value during the credit troubles in the summer after placing big bets on mortgage-related securities, according to the lawsuits.

The lawsuit asserts that State Street last year used borrowed money to invest in subprime mortgages and related derivative contracts in a fund that was supposed to invest only in Treasuries and corporate bonds.

more...
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/04/business/04state.html?


edit to add SMW for 1/3/08, more about State Street
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=3122815


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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #25
31. Thanks DemReadingDU.....
I missed you guys too.

They are right to set aside $618 million, but if they were smart, and that sounds like an oxymoron at this point, it would be to pay the investors-not the lawyers. If it is as they said and they used money from conservative funds and diverted it from T-bills to these riskier forms of investments-that is nothing more than misappropriating funds (theft) and they are guilty. It should be easily settled by giving the investors the money plus interest lost and maybe damages, a fine and they pick up court costs.

If they win this case-all investors-big or small-don't have a prayer. They lied, they stole, and they would have gotten away with it but they got caught in their fraud. They lied,damage was done, and they need to fess up, take the blame, and promise to sin no more. Anything less is a rigged game. It's like when the job secretary skims off money to bet on a sure winner at the race track. She might win and pocket some extra bucks for herself (which is what I think this company wanted to do). You might win, but you could lose: either way you are a thief, you stole, and you need to be held accountable.

But there sometimes isn't justice in this world-so we will have to see.
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #6
24. Oil jumps above $98 on new U.S.-Iran tensions
http://www.reuters.com/article/hotStocksNews/idUST3904820080107?sp=true

LONDON (Reuters) - Oil rose above $98 a barrel before falling back on Monday as reports of rising tensions in the Middle East outweighed concerns of demand outlook in top consumer United States from a feared economic recession.

CNN reported that five Iranian Revolutionary Guard boats harassed and provoked three U.S. Navy ships in the Strait of Hormuz on Saturday.

Citing unidentified U.S. officials, CNN said the Iranian vessels came within 200 yards (meters) of the U.S. ships and that after a threatening radio communication, U.S. sailors manned their ships' guns and were very close to opening fire.

Relations between the two countries are already tense over Iran's nuclear program.

Traders said the news had helped put the focus back on geopolitical risks in the oil market.

"Crude rallied 60 cents on the news," Addison Armstrong, analyst at TFS Energy wrote in a report.

U.S. light crude for February delivery rose 14 cents to $98.05 a barrel by 9:07 a.m. EST, off lows of $97.11 hit earlier during the session. Oil had fallen by $1.27 on Friday.

...more...
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unhappycamper Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
7. Question:
I remember that M4 reporting was canceled in 06/07. Have we heard anymore about that?
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. actually that was the M3
and it was discontinued March 2006

Discontinuance of M3

On March 23, 2006, the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System will cease publication of the M3 monetary aggregate. The Board will also cease publishing the following components: large-denomination time deposits, repurchase agreements (RPs), and Eurodollars. The Board will continue to publish institutional money market mutual funds as a memorandum item in this release.

Measures of large-denomination time deposits will continue to be published by the Board in the Flow of Funds Accounts (Z.1 release) on a quarterly basis and in the H.8 release on a weekly basis (for commercial banks).

M3 does not appear to convey any additional information about economic activity that is not already embodied in M2 and has not played a role in the monetary policy process for many years. Consequently, the Board judged that the costs of collecting the underlying data and publishing M3 outweigh the benefits.
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unhappycamper Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Thank you. n/t
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:29 AM
Response to Original message
8. S&P 500 Performance during the past 7 years
Based on the closing price on the last trading day of each year, here is the annualized performance of the S&P 500 index:



Despite squandering the Clinton surplus and running up massive debt, the stock market has performed much worse during the past 7 years than it did during any other presidency, going back to Carter.

Maybe it would help if we gave rich people a tax cut.
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CGrantt57 Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. Yanno...
I read this stuff every day.

This is the first time I've been compelled to say anything.

I've argued this point with so many right-wing idiots who still don't get it.

Their logic is: If we give the rich a tax break, they'll reinvest it in business and everything will get better.

However, I think rich people are just as lazy as anyone. If you give them back money, they'll just say, "Oh, thanks. This means I don't have to work as hard."

However, if the government taxes the rich, they see the bottom line and say, "Oh, damn. I'm not earning as much as I used to. I'd better make some money here."

When the rich decide to make money, they employ the poor working slobs to do it, and the economy gets better because of it.

Witness the Clinton years when the tax rate on the rich went up.

Now, counter that with the Bush years.

See the difference?

Tax the rich = more money for everyone.

Regards,
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #11
18. Demand Side Economics is what we need
Here's a quote from former Reagan Treasury undersecretary, Paul Craig Roberts' Feb. 2, 2006 column, disavowing Junior's tax cuts:

The George W. Bush regime was faced with no stagflation and no worsening trade-offs between employment and inflation. The Bush administration did not use changes in the marginal rate of taxation to correct a mistaken policy mix or an oversight in economic policy. Moreover, global labor arbitrage is causing American jobs to be outsourced abroad. As Americans are experiencing declining opportunities to work, the response of labor supply to better incentives is small. Similarly, US companies are locating their investments in plant and equipment abroad. The substitution of foreign for American labor and the relocation abroad of US plant and equipment prevent reductions in marginal tax rates from having any appreciable effect on aggregate supply in the US.

I am not a partisan of Dubya’s tax cuts. Income distribution is a legitimate issue. This is especially the case when offshore production and jobs outsourcing are destroying the American middle class.

Just as Dubya hides behind "freedom and democracy" to wage wars of naked aggression, he hides behind supply-side economics in order to reward his cronies. There seems to be no American value or legitimate principle that the Bush regime is incapable of despoiling.

http://www.vdare.com/roberts/060227_economics.htm


Even this famous supply-sider from Saint Ronnie's administration condemns Junior's tax breaks for rich people. The point he makes is that Bush's tax cuts were simply rewards to his rich cronies and campaign contributors. They had nothing to do with any economic theory, principal, or doctrine.

WORST. PRESIDENT. EVER!
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #11
26. That's a great way to look at it.....
:rofl::rofl: Never thought of it in those terms. You may be on to something!
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. methinks you forgot your sarcasm tag on that last sentence
:hi:
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Didn't think I'd need it.
Despite squandering the Clinton surplus and running up massive debt, the stock market has performed much worse during the past 7 years than it has during any other presidency, going back to Carter. Supply-siders have certainly had their chance with the current administration's trickle-down-theory-on-steroids economic policies. These numbers are in sharp contrast with Junior's assertions that the tax cuts worked and the stock market is booming.

Maybe it's time for us all to conclude that supply-side economics have never been anything more than an attempt to find moral justification in taking from the poor and giving to the rich.
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. supply side and "free" market economics
have done nothing but privatize the profits and socialize the risks and made all of the risks for failure much greater.

The party of the Greedy Oil Pigs has proven that they must be run out of town with torches and pitchforks.
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. These forces are working together against us.
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 10:22 AM by Lasher
Supply siders might have had a point back in the day when you could pretend the rest of the world didn't exist. But Junior's enormous tax giveaways didn't trickle down, they trickled overseas. Relieved from the burden of being re-invested domestically to evade taxes, this money was then used to build plant elsewhere - directly contributing to more US job losses.

The tax cuts did exactly the opposite of what was promised; they promoted US job losses.

Edit to say: Thanks for putting these stock market watch OPs together. I for one appreciate it.

Lasher
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
35. oooops
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 01:55 PM by fascisthunter
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:33 AM
Response to Original message
10. 9:32 EST and opening with rate-cut jubilee
Dow 12,867.16 66.98 (0.52%)
Nasdaq 2,516.93 12.28 (0.49%)
S&P 500 1,419.90 8.27 (0.59%)
10-Yr Bond 3.89% 0.036


NYSE Volume 72,534,851.562
Nasdaq Volume 56,517,097.656
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:38 AM
Response to Original message
12. Analysts at American Economic Association now see recession as a given
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/economists-say-2008-year-forget/story.aspx?guid=%7BF1BD8B30%2DB628%2D4AA3%2D853E%2D1FDD8D54A33E%7D

NEW ORLEANS (MarketWatch) -- Gathered in this city struggling to regain its footing after Hurricane Katrina, a group of leading economists said the U.S. is getting hit by another damaging storm: the global credit crunch.

Many analysts gathered at the American Economic Association's two-day annual meeting spoke of a recession as almost a given but differed over how severe it will be.

"The recession is likely to be a serious one," said Dean Baker, co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research.

He estimated losses in prime mortgages will be two to three times the $160-$200 billion hit seen in the subprime sector. This, he said, will lead to large losses at banks and difficulty for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

University of Chicago professor of finance and former chief economist at the International Monetary Fund, Raghuram Rajan, said questions in the media over whether the U.S. economy will fall into recession are really only about semantics.

"We are going to have very low growth in the first two quarters of the year. Whether it is negative or zero, it is going to feel like the same thing," Rajan said.

...more..
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. Roubini: Mood and Views at the American Economic Association Meetings: Recession Ahead
1/7/08
This author spent the weekend in New Orleans at the Annual Meetings of the American Economic Association (AEA). At a session on the subprime mess moderated by David Wessel of the Wall Street Journal I was a panelist together with Paul Krugman, Bob Shiller and Larry White, a housing expert at NYU/Stern; a crowd of over 400 listeners followed the two hour debate and asked probing questions.

The mood at the panel was gloomy. Bob Shiller spoke of the subprime meltdown, of how households are still deluding themselves – in polls – that home prices will keep on rising for the next decade while they have already fallen by 10% in real terms and need to fall by a cumulative 30% before they bottom out (a loss of home values of about $6 trillion); he also argued that the probability of an economy wide recession is now about 75%.


And by now inside academia senior folks such as Marty Feldstein and Larry Summers – among many others – believe that the risks of a recession are now more than 50%. And outside of academia Morgan Stanley (Berner), Bill Gross of Pimco, John Bogle of Vanguard expect – with high likelihood - a mild recession in 2008; while Merrill Lynch (Rosenberg) and Goldman Sachs (Hatzius) are also now in the 2008 recession camp.

So, as argued before in this forum, at this point the debate is not anymore about whether we will have a soft landing or a hard landing recession; it is rather on how hard the hard landing will be, i.e. whether the upcoming recession will be mild – and lasting only a couple of quarters – or more severe and lasting several quarters. I have argued that this will be a severe recession rather than a mild one like the mild ones in 1990-91 and 2001; and that the risks of a severe systemic financial crisis are now very serious.


lots more...
http://www.rgemonitor.com/blog/roubini/235798
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
22. 10:50am - Oops. The markets now have a case of the Mondays.
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 10:52 AM by Roland99
Dow 12,770.42 -29.76
Nasdaq 2,481.79 -22.86
S&P 500 1,409.71 -1.92
Oil $96.57 $-1.34
Gold $863.00 $-2.70

10 YR 3.86% 0.00


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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. US STOCKS-Wall St turns lower on economic worry
http://www.reuters.com/article/bondsNews/idUSN0717544020080107

NEW YORK, Jan 7 (Reuters) - U.S. stocks fell on Monday, reversing an earlier rebound, as concerns about the economy's health persist after Friday's sell-off. A pullback in crude prices also weighed on energy shares.

The Dow Jones industrial average .DJI was down 23.01 points, or 0.18 percent, at 12,777.17. The Standard & Poor's 500 Index .SPX was down 2.13 points, or 0.15 percent, at 1,409.50. The Nasdaq Composite Index .IXIC was down 18.63 points, or 0.74 percent, at 2,486.02.
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #23
27. 11:33am - Oh! Happy pills!
Dow 12,837.32 +37.14
Nasdaq 2,509.25 +4.60
S&P 500 1,418.03 +6.40
10 YR 3.87% 0.02
Oil $95.35 $-2.56
Gold $859.90 $-5.80


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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. Quite an Abrupt Turnaround
Paranoia....
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #29
32. And our theme song for today.....
Mother's Little Helper Lyrics
Artist(Band):The Rolling Stones Print the Lyrics

(Jagger/Richards)

What a drag it is getting old
"Kids are different today,"
I hear ev'ry mother say
Mother needs something today to calm her down
And though she's not really ill
There's a little yellow pill
She goes running for the shelter of a mother's little helper
And it helps her on her way, gets her through her busy day

"Things are different today,"
I hear ev'ry mother say

<snip>

Doctor please, some more of these
Outside the door, she took four more
What a drag it is getting old

"Men just aren't the same today"
I hear ev'ry mother say

<snip>

"Life's just much too hard today,"
I hear ev'ry mother say

<snip>

http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Mother's-Little-Helper-lyrics-The-Rolling-Stones/825A3CEFF6AF8B764825689A00269AFE
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. Bush Opens His Mouth and BOOM!
Back into the downside again!

It's so predictable....
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
28. U.S. economy in recession, Merrill's Rosenberg says
01. U.S. economy in recession, Merrill's Rosenberg says
11:51 AM ET, Jan 07, 2008 - 3 minutes ago
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
30. 12:37pm - Whoa! WTF hit NASDAQ? (edit: oh wait...nevermind)
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 12:51 PM by Roland99
Dow 12,840.98 +40.80
Nasdaq 2,516.25 +11.60
S&P 500 1,420.97 +9.34
10 YR 3.86% 0.01
Oil $94.90 $-3.01
Gold $863.00 $-2.70


Marketwatch had a typo on their numbers. I thought something didn't look right. 12:50pm numbers above.
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. Mother's little helper....
is kicking in.:popcorn:
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. I Sure Could Use Some of That In My Personal Life
I'ts been a bad day, already. I mean really bad. Haven't had a day like this since the kids were kidnapped.
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. Hope....
the part about the kids are hyperbole, but if not...yuck, what a sucky day. I always remember what Mom would tell me-some days you're the wind shield, some days the bug. She also said some days you are the fire hydrant and all the world's a dog. She might also say some days you are the pigeon and some days the statue. But my fav when she was particularly frustrated....."Some days I can't even pee right".:rofl:

I use to tell some of my coworkers that, although I was physically at work, I was mentally vacationing in Tahiti or maybe Bora Bora. They use to laugh until they would see me swaying a bit while doing something. Every time they would ask me, I'd be swaying to island music, whale watching, feeling a breeze, etc. That cup of cold coffee was coconut milk, etc-you get the idea. Once, after a really tough day, one of my coworkers (that had been asking me all day what I was doing on my mental vacation-came up to me after work and said that my mental vacation was one of the best vacations she had ever been on. :spray: Once you get really good at it-it works wonders. And always remember.....Tomorrow is another day.:hug:
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. NO Hyperbole, Anne
I wish it were. I have been doing something rather like your vacation, too, but only when not frantically calling lawyers.
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #37
41. OMG....
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 03:26 PM by AnneD
Is it spousal related or stranger....my heart felt prayers to you. I don't think there are enough drugs to ease that pain. My, my ,my.....

PM me if you need to. I have a big ear, a broad shoulder, and plenty of kleenex.
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #34
48. ...
:hug:

wish I could help - let me know (pm) if I can
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kineneb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
39. Citigroup Plans New Round of 'Massive' Job Cuts
Uh, oh.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/21974307

People inside Citigroup say the firm hasn’t set a target number of cuts from its roughly 320,000 employees. But people with knowledge of the matter have described the pending job reductions as "massive" and "large." The total number could reach as high as 45,000, these people estimate.

In a statement, Citigroup said: "We are engaged in a planning process in anticipation of our new CEO and our business heads are planning ways in which we can be more efficient and cost effective to position our businesses in line with economic realities. Any reports on specific numbers are not factual."
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
40. 3:03pm - Markets turning red
Dow 12,787.17 -13.01
Nasdaq 2,493.42 -11.23
S&P 500 1,411.36 -0.27
Oil $95.10 $-2.81
Gold $862.00 $-3.70

10 YR 3.84% -0.02


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Danascot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
42. Market Tanks - It's Clinton's ... oops, Obama's Fault
I was wondering when the Republicans would start to blame the market's problems on Obama's victory. Well -- it's didn't take long. Hewitt had Kudlow on his show on Friday and they agreed that Obama's victory was a reason why the market's tanked hard.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hale-stewart/hewitt-and-kudlow-econom_b_79949.html
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TalkingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. That's mighty damned impressive.
I guess having dark skin is worse than a BJ. :eyes: (hmmm... is there really a way to say that so it actually makes sense? Nevermind...)




My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. Unless....
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 04:54 PM by AnneD
you have dark skin AND get a BJ by someone with fair skin. That could still get you lynched in some areas. Makes impeachment look like a walk in the park.

Edited to add...never thought much about it until Hubby and I married. We are careful where we travel.
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AnneD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #42
45. What complete and utter....
nonsense. Everyone knows it was because of the weather.:eyes:
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
47. fork stickin' time
Dow 12,827.49 27.31 (0.21%)
Nasdaq 2,499.46 5.19 (0.21%)
S&P 500 1,416.18 4.55 (0.32%)
10-Yr Bond 3.839% 0.015


NYSE Volume 4,221,267,000
Nasdaq Volume 2,622,767,250

4:15 pm : On Monday, stocks traded in a choppy and volatile manner as investors remained uncertain about the economic outlook. Stocks were poised to end the day with a loss, but a late-day surge in the last 15 minutes of trading sent the Dow and S&P into positive territory.

The S&P 500 closed with a modest gain, with six of its ten economic sectors advancing. The Nasdaq finished with a slight loss, marking its seventh straight decline.

The technology sector (-0.8%) extended Friday's steep declines. IBM (IBM 100.15, -0.98) was a drag after being downgraded to Neutral from Buy at UBS before the open. UBS also lowered its targets on Sun Microsystems (JAVA 16.11, -0.20), Dell (DELL 21.26, -0.83) and EMC (EMC 16.04, -0.95). UBS expects lower server and PC spending in 2008 due to economic pressures. The sector is now down 7.9% year-to-date.

The energy sector (-1.2%) was the worst performing sector, as it followed crude prices lower. Crude for February delivery fell 2.7% to $95.26 on concerns that slower economic growth would lead to less demand.

There were not any economic releases, but there were plenty of officials speaking about the economy.

Atlanta Fed President Dennis Lockhart said negatives in the U.S. economy may be gaining momentum, and market contacts have serious concerns about more market deterioration and spill over. He also said the continued depreciation of the dollar is a risk.

President Bush emphasized his belief that Congress must keep taxes low. There was speculation that he would be revealing an economic stimulus plan, but he made no reference. There is an indication that one may be in the works, however, as Treasury Secretary Paulson said Bush has not yet decided on a fiscal policy stimulus, according to Reuters.

Meanwhile, Paulson said the overhang of unsold homes will be a prolonged drag on growth, which added to the day's volatility.

Defensive sectors outperformed, and Treasuries saw some buying interest as investors showed concern that the U.S. economy may be facing a recession. Briefing.com believes the U.S. will avoid recession, but expects growth to remain sluggish for some time. DJ30 +27.31 NASDAQ -5.19 NQ100 -0.3% R2K +0.3% SP400 -0.3% SP500 +4.55 NASDAQ Dec/Adv/Vol 1577/1421/2.60 bln NYSE Dec/Adv/Vol 1384/1783/1.71 bln

3:30 pm : The major indices remain in negative territory, with the Nasdaq Composite once again underperforming the other indices. So far, 2008 has not been good for the bulls. At current levels, the Dow, Nasdaq and S&P 500 are down 3.7%, 6.1% and 3.9% respectively, year-to-date.

Five of the ten economic sectors are posting a gain, but the underperformance of heavy-weights energy (-1.8%) and tech (-1.4%) are keeping the major indices in the red.

Tomorrow, November pending home sales and consumer credit are slated for release.DJ30 -37.07 NASDAQ -20.44 SP500 -2.28 NASDAQ Dec/Adv/Vol 1633/1371/2.08 bln NYSE Dec/Adv/Vol 1483/1673/1.24 bln

3:05 pm : More choppy action as the Dow and S&P briefly traded in positive territory before falling back into the red. Currently, the major indices are trading modestly above their worst levels of the session.

Bush's speech emphasized that Congress needs to keep taxes low, and did not mention any kind of plan to stimulate the economy. There is an indication that one may be in the works, as Treasury Secretary Paulson said Bush has not yet decided on a fiscal policy stimulus, according to Reuters.

The Daily Telegraph reports that Merrill Lynch believes the U.S. economy is already in a recession, citing a weakening employment picture and declining retail sales. Briefing.com believes the U.S. will avoid recession, but growth will be sluggish.DJ30 -20.16 NASDAQ -14.15 SP500 -1.44 NASDAQ Dec/Adv/Vol 1558/1411/1.94 bln NYSE Dec/Adv/Vol 1470/1681/1.15 bln

2:30 pm : The major indices fall into the red, in a broad-based decline. The market has traded in a choppy manner, as market participants remain uncertain about the economic outlook.

President Bush is currently speaking about the economy. He noted that the housing slump and high energy prices are among today's challenges. He also said he is determined to make sure taxes stay low. His comments have not had any dramatic effects on the stock market, and he has not mentioned anything about an economic stimulus plan. There was previous speculation he may announce a plan to spur economic growth.DJ30 -24.15 NASDAQ -14.46 SP500 -1.96 NASDAQ Dec/Adv/Vol 1583/1368/1.79 bln NYSE Dec/Adv/Vol 1335/1797/1.03 bln
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