STOCK MARKET WATCH, Tuesday October 14

[ozymandius]

Source: du

STOCK MARKET WATCH, Tuesday October 14, 2008

COUNTING THE DAYS
DAYS REMAINING IN THE * REGIME 98
DAYS SINCE DEMOCRACY DIED (12/12/00) 2821 DAYS
WHERE'S OSAMA BIN-LADEN? 2546 DAYS
DAYS SINCE ENRON COLLAPSE = 2837
Number of Enron Execs in handcuffs = 19
ENRON EXECS CONVICTED = 10
Enron execs conveniently deceased = 3
Other Arrests of Execs = 54

---

U.S. FUTURES &
MARKETS INDICATORS>
NASDAQ FUTURES-----------------------------S&P FUTURES

---

AT THE CLOSING BELL WHEN BUSH TOOK OFFICE on January 22, 2001
Dow - 10,578.24
Nasdaq - 2,757.91
S&P 500 - 1,342.90
Oil - $27.69/bbl
Gold - $266.70/oz.
$1 USD = EUR 1.06678
$1 USD = JPY 116.6200

In recognition of those prescient of the Dow's precipitous return of Bush values (9/29/08): JuneBourder and AnneD

AT THE CLOSING BELL ON October 13, 2008

Dow... 9,387.61 +936.42 (+11.08%)
Nasdaq... 1,844.25 +194.74 (+11.81%)
S&P 500... 1,003.35 +104.13 (+11.58%)
Gold future... 842.50 -16.50 (-1.92%)
30-Year Bond 4.14% +0.02 (+0.41%)
10-Yr Bond... 3.86% +0.03 (+0.70%)






GOLD,EURO, YEN, Loonie and Silver

---

PIEHOLE ALERT

Heads Up!
Preliminary info on appearances by Bush & Co. throughout the country. Details & links are added as they become available so check back. And if you know more, are organizing something, or would like to, contact [e-mail]

For information on protests and other actions Citizens For Legitimate Government

---

Read more: du

[ozymandius]

1. Market WrapUp

The World Is Not Ending
But Jim Rogers may be right
BY TONY ALLISON

After one of the most tumultuous weeks in stock market history, it may be best for most of us to take a breather and gain some perspective. The best advice is to get outside and away from the ubiquitous computer screens. Take a walk along a lake, play with your children, savor the changing leaves of fall. Life continues. The world at large is not imploding, although the hedge fund industry may be.

It is certainly understandable that the majority of Americans are frustrated and worried. For decades the purchasing power of the middle class has been shrinking as the dollar continually loses value. In the last decade the costs of life’s essentials have taken off (food, energy, insurance, transportation, medical care, etc.). Now Americans must deal with imploding 401-k’s to go along with imploding housing values. The great era of easy money is ending. The transition back to more traditional ways will be difficult, but not catastrophic. America is resilient and flexible, and most citizens will be willing to make sacrifices if they are equally shared and there is a plan to move forward.

.....

Easy money - a warning to future generations (unheeded)

One of the few economists to question the Federal Reserve’s actions during the 1920’s was Benjamin Anderson, Senior Economist for Chase National Bank. Immediately following the crash of October, 1929 Anderson summed up the situation and left an explicit warning for future generations. “Basically, our present troubles grow out of the excessively cheap money and unlimited bank credit available for capital uses and speculation from early 1922 until 1928. There is no intoxicant more dangerous than cheap money and excessive credit.”

.....

Over the next few months, the de-leveraging of the financial system will continue apace, as the weak-hand hedge funds finish exiting from the commodity sector, setting up the next dramatic advance driven by stronger hands. The hedge fund sector collapse will continue to be painful to valuations short-term however, as excellent companies are dumped overboard in a wave of forced selling and redemptions.

http://www.financialsense.com/Market/wrapup.htm

[Hugin]

9. That 'toon has me chuckling...

Especially, the touch of having A-1 Steak Sauce available for that delicious looking Roast Wingtip. :9


My beefs for today;

1) How come someone hasn't started printing up mocking tee-shirts with the slogan, "Save the Banks!" emblazoned
on them reminiscent of the "Save the Whales!" tees of yesteryear?

2) I overheard the talking heads saying it was a great thing Crude Oil was going back up in price... I doubt it's
good for the common folks... Uh, and they know it and the people who would be happy to hear it aren't watching the
Corporate Media. So, keep the dumb talking points to a minimum. Most people don't want to hear it.

[ozymandius]

11. They really said that? It wasn't just irony or metaphor?

They're happy that crude oil is going back up in price? That's odd and, to a further extent, just plain callous.

One pound of private label cheddar cheese at the grocery store yesterday cost sixty cents less than it did three weeks ago. I firmly believe declining oil/transportation prices have something to do with the price decline. Similar declines in the price of food stuffs was noticeable elsewhere on my shopping list.

So these talking heads are high-fiving themselves because the cost of hydrocarbons is rising? Let me rephrase that: these talking heads are high-fiving themselves because the cost of food is rising? That's just nuts.

[Hugin]

12. Yes, and it was more than informational...

I would specify a report, but, I've heard it multiple times from various sources. Granted, it's hard to distinguish
between the typical perky happy discussion of a fatal accident and the style of these reports. If I can find a specific
example I'll post it.

I totally agree with you and I must say, you've done a better job of conveying the impact of the reports than
I did.

[TalkingDog]

34. I had NPR on yesterday while I was canning

and I agree with you Prag, a couple of different people on different programs said that the rising price of crude was a positive indicator (of what?). One context was that it signaled confidence that (paraphrasing and conjecture here) people would ignore that pesky 0 balance bank account now that they could borrow again and go out shopping.....

On the positive side, 14 quarts of soup on the shelf are 14 meals I don't have to buy for or cook later....

The SMW is officially invited over for soup.

[ozymandius]

39. I'm having trouble finding Mason jars at the usual places.

In fact, my trouble is that I'm finding none. I'll snap up another case when I lay eyes on it.

On economics: the worldview of the media whoredom class reminds me of an oddball saying that I learned a few years back. It still retains its relevance. "Personifiers of the world, UNITE! You have nothing to lose but Mister Dignity."

Understated is the notion that we must undergo a radical transformation in how our economic system works. An economy based on debt, consumption with debt, obscenely leveraged growth toward commodity investment (rather than manufacture of marketable goods) and the like cannot sustain itself. There is not a point in launching into some great screed here. We all know how the consumer has been driven off a cliff. However, this point, such as it is, does not get so much airplay to the greater public as I feel it should.

Econ blogs take Reaganomics, Greenscamomics and Rubinomics to the woodshed. But one has to be a pretty hardcore econ junkie to find that point-of-view and analytical reasoning.

[TalkingDog]

47. Big Lots has some off brand jars. KMart carries them too

but more costly.

I have plenty having inherited my mother's stash and am the local repository because "nobody does that sort of thing anymore". Although that tune might change soon.


And the other reason I get them is I give them...full of goodies like soup and watermelon rind jelly....

[Dr.Phool]

54. I wish that I had learned how from my mother.

Usually, I dehydrate about everything I can, and it stores indefinitely in a ziplock bag on the shelf.

[TalkingDog]

66. This guy has a whole series of lessons:

http://www.expertvillage.com/video/387_how-to-use-pressure-cooker.htm

http://www.fcs.uga.edu/pubs/current/FDNS-E-37-3.html

Here's the canner I got from my mom:
http://www.canningpantry.com/pressure-canner-915.html

others will work, but I like hers because its heavy duty....

Tips:

super clean everything: sterile is the word of the day

processing can take a while, so learn to keep your eye on the pressure gauge. group chores in and around the kitchen because wandering off to take care of that "one little thing" can result in scary....

[llmart]

93. It's not that hard....

Just find a Ball canning book and follow the instructions.

[AnneD]

112. The greatest legacy I got while they were alive????

My great Aunt Jene was reputed to can anything that stood still for more than 5 minutes. I was visiting her (she had not seen me since I was a toddler). I commented how delicious the pickled sides were.
Oh honey, let me give you something, I know it by heart now-I'm sorry it is a bit worn. It was her dog eared copy of the Bell Canning book.
Now let me mark the recipes for you.
But Aunt Jene-you already have.
What?
The ones you like are the ones that have the most stains on the pages.
She laughed so hard and poked Mom. Dang, we thow off some sharp ones don't we.

I wish I had more of Aunt Jene (and Uncle Earnest) in my life-she was a teen in the depression and I could listen to her for hours, him too. They were wise old souls and funny too.

[RedLetterRev]

67. FWIW

(I read daily and appreciate the education I'm getting!)

Didja know that the spaghetti sauce jars, like Classico, have the same threading as mason jars and the lids and rings fit perfectly? I rued the fact that we had a double-bumper-crop of tomatoes this year and I ran short of jars. My ever practical partner went into nooks and crannies I didn't know our house even had and came out with boxes and boxes of Classico jars he'd been squirrelling away against a time we'd need them. Lids and rings? Gotten on sale over the last few years and hidden with the treasure trove of spaghetti-sauce jars.

Well, I'll be. We put up 22 pints of beans in jars, another 30 quarts of tomato concentrate, froze another 20 or so pints of concentrate, froze another bushel of green beans, dried about 5 pounds of black beans... and so on.

When you've been raised by grandparents who went through the Depression, then you watch Reaganomics unfold, ya tend to remember what grammaw and grampaw did and be prepared for whatever. You never know what you'll need until you'll need it.

Well, kids... here seems to be "whatever". See ya in "Outdoor Life" and the "Rural and Farm" forums :D

[ozymandius]

121. Thank you for your suggestions.

This is all news to me. I remember when canning supplies was as common as sugar and flour in the grocery stores where I grew up. That's all changed now. Thanks to your tips there's another angle to tackling this issue. Classico's tasty too.

:hi:

[Dr.Phool]

53. I made a big pot the other day.

Mmmmmmmm.

[AnneD]

71. Morning Marketeers.....

:donut:and lurkers....I am so fortunate to have been forced labour for my Mom and Aunties canning projects. I picked up dehydrating later in life. Those pings are music to my ears.

I can't tell you how great I think it is. I am here to tell you that Hubby and I were so thankful to have had our own food bank during the Hurricane. The Red Cross and FEMA tell you to have enough food and water for 3 days and that is pure unadulterated horse crap. I have yet to see an emergency THAT short. One thing I did learn that is very important. Pack double and triple what they tell you to have for water. If you are stressed (and if you are using your pantry, you are) you take far more water than you think. The other thing I noticed-folks had no clue about rationing esp to their kids. Folks are so use to eating and drinking when and where and however that they have forgotten about rationing and folks-most of the world rations. I was actually embarrassed as to how some folks were acting. I had plenty so I didn't ask for stamps, MRE, or water. Ice was a luxury for me-but not for hubby or his meds.

And when the power did finally come on, I happily paid to have a good hot meal with friends that we had helped and we said grace before the meal too. Folks at the cafe didn't stand on appearances either. We were clean just not as nice or fashionably dressed as we might have been otherwise.

Folks- those canned goods and your pantry are better than money in the bank and it will give you a far better return on investment now than WS. I know it sounds basic-but it is important to your family survival. Just because we don't experience shortages, doesn't mean they don't/won't happen.

Edited to add that these happy talk people of the media are spending what little is left of their creditability and like Congress soon will find themselves irrelevant to the discussion as they already are. My press credentials Anne-from the journalistic Schools of Isiah and Amos. Preaching truth to power for centuries.
(or as my fav Nursing T says-I'm here to save your ass not kiss it)

Happy hunting and watch out for the bears.

[TalkingDog]

94. here to save your ass....nice I'll have to remember that one n/t

[llmart]

96. Oh, my.....

that joggled my memory of my sister and I having to peel tomatoes in the summers when we were growing up out in a rural area. It would always be the hottest damned day of the summer, too. We would sit there and grumble the entire time as my mother would say, "Girls, you'll appreciate this in the winter." We had a large family and my father didn't work most winters because he was in construction and we lived in the snow belt of Cleveland. We always had stewed tomatoes and grilled cheese to fall back on. Plus many other canned items. The local farmers knew we were pretty poor so they would tell us to take a bushel of some overripe produce home (we had to work on the farms to make a little spending money - very little).

When I was a newlywed and we bought our first house we put in a huge garden and I canned. My young hubby who grew up in a family that wasted everything had never seen anyone can anything before and he was all excited about the process. His favorite to this day are the bread and butter pickles.

[AnneD]

102. The Great Beet Battle of 1969....

Two teenage conscripts, an ice bath to plunge the drained par boiled beet, seven bushels of beets to remove the skins off.

Once we were shown how easy it was to pop the skin off the cooled beets-no moving target was safe. By the time the battle was over... it looked like Pucci, Versache and Peter Max had thrown up on the 2 of us and the entire bathroom. We didn't get the beet stains out until the following Spring. :evilgrin: Those were good times. And welcome to the board.:hi:

[Demeter]

118. "I'm Here to Save Your Ass, Not Kiss It"

Definitely fit for a T-shirt--you could fund yourself with a slogan like that.

[Demeter]

68. Party Time! What Else Could It Indicate?

Party, party, party, go to the Ritz, go to the Caymans, and party, party, party,



SLAP!


Thanks, I needed that.

[AnneD]

74. I'm there

:9

[Dr.Phool]

27. Two different worlds that people live in.

Yammering Idiots, aka talking heads, make enough money that rising prices aren't even an irritant. Their maid does the shopping and the accountant writes the paycheck and the grocery bill. Commodities to them aren't food, they're investments.

[Tansy_Gold]

37. Thanks, Dr. You said it so much more succinctly than I

You saved me a good 15 minutes of typed ranting, time I can spend on my little paid gig and maybe make a buck or two! :hi:


Tansy Gold, to whom food is food is food is food

[Dr.Phool]

52. Even my dog was feeling the pinch.

He was overweight, so we cut his dry food in half, and were substituting a 1/2 can of pumpkin. Lots of vitamins, fiber, nutrients, and low calorie. Plus he loves it. It was selling for $.79-89 per can. Last spring it jumped to $1.39. We quit buying it.

Yesterday my wife found it for $.99 and bought 2 cases of it. The Fudd is happy again.

[Tansy_Gold]

73. I hear you.

I may skimp, but the four pooches come first.


BF comes a distant sixth :evilgrin:


TG

[kineneb]

79. dog food additive

Mom adds canned green beans to her dogs' food for bulk and vitamins. The vet recommended it when they got too fat (samoyeds eat until everything is gone).

[Dr.Phool]

91. We feed them that stuff too.

This guy, a Golden-Lab mix, is a big couch potato. He weighed in at 130lb for a while, but we got him down to about 100 now. He'll eat a salad if you fix it for him.

His companion, whom we recently had to put down, a Golden- Newfoundland mix, was a real athlete. She ate the same things as him, but was always lean and fit.

[AnneD]

76. But Tansy....

she whined....I love your rants. More caffeine than coffee. They really get me going in the morning.

[Tansy_Gold]

83. LOL -- I had to make up time from dinner last night

BF actually took me out for my birthday, and I lost two hours of tiem I should've spent on the job. Had to make up for it this morning.

More rants later, I promise!!



Tansy Gold, in chilly AJ

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

65. The IRA had the right idea:

A drill. In the kneecap.

[ozymandius]

2. Today's Report

(which stunningly looks quite a bit like yesterday's report)

14:00 Treasury Budget Sep
Briefing.com NA
Consensus $45.0B
Prior $112.9B

http://www.briefing.com/Investor/Public/Calendars/EconomicCalendar.htm

[UpInArms]

114. U.S. federal deficit widens to $455 billion, or 3.2% of GDP

09. U.S. 2008 federal outlays hit 21% of GDP, most since 1994
4:01 PM ET, Oct 14, 2008

10. U.S. government borrows $1.04 trillion in 2008
4:01 PM ET, Oct 14, 2008

16. U.S. federal deficit widens to $455 billion, or 3.2% of GDP
4:01 PM ET, Oct 14, 2008

[ozymandius]

3. Oil rises above $83 as financial panic eases

SINGAPORE - Oil prices rose above $83 a barrel on Tuesday in Asia as panic selling over a global financial crisis eased after the U.S. and Europe pledged to pump capital into ailing banks.

Light, sweet crude for November delivery was up $2.38 to $83.57 a barrel in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange by midday in Singapore. The contract rose overnight $3.49 to settle at $81.19.

.....

In other Nymex trading, heating oil futures rose 3.84 cents to $2.38 a gallon, while gasoline prices gained 5.29 cents to $1.97 a gallon. Natural gas for November delivery rose 10.1 cents to $6.79 per 1,000 cubic feet.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/oil_prices

[lamp_shade]

4. Good morning.. and thanks.

[ozymandius]

7. Good morning.

:donut: :donut: :donut:

You're welcome.

[truthisfreedom]

5. PIEHOLE ALERT!!! 8AM bUSH SPEECH! EWW!

http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=57701

on edit, another link:

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081014/financial_meltdown.html

[Demeter]

13. Just Trying to Maintain Bush's Fictional Relevance and Importance

Which is funny...

[AnneD]

78. Bagdad Bush.....

BWAAAAHAAAH:spray:

[ozymandius]

18. Bloomberg: Paulson, Bernanke and Bair news conference scheduled at 8:30

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601068&sid=a0DqEDw4VVzE

[UpInArms]

30. a triple helping of piehole spew: (Paulson, Bernanke, Bush)

06. Fed plan to fund commercial paper to begin on Oct. 27
8:35 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

09. Paulson: Banks receiving govt. funds must stem foreclosures
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

10. Paulson: Rescue plan designed to rstore confidence in banks
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

16. Paulson: Banks must not hoard new capital, must deploy it
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

17. Paulson: Did not want to do rescue plan, but it must be done
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

18. Bernanke: Key is global nature of rescue plan
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

19. Bernanke: Financial sector rescue plan should work
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

20. Bernanke: Rescue plan is not late
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

21. Bernanke: Path ahead will not be easy despite rescue plan
8:30 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

27. Bush: Government's role in banking is temporary
8:07 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

29. Bush: FDIC to insure non-interest-bearing deposits
8:06 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

30. Bush: Fed to act to unfreeze commercial paper market
8:06 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

31. Bush: FDIC to insure new bank debts
8:05 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

34. Bush: U.S. government to buy equity shares in banks
8:04 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

[UpInArms]

31. more spew: Banks can seek maximum $25 bln under rescue plan

01. Banks must request minimum of 1% of risk-weighted assets
8:45 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

02. Banks can seek maximum $25 bln under rescue plan
8:44 AM ET, Oct 14, 2008

[Demeter]

69. No Kidding Paulson Didn't Want to Do It

He hasn't done his job yet. It's BushCo policy--nobody put in a position of power must actually do anything, esp. not enforce laws and policies that don't involve enriching themselves and their patrons.

[Wednesdays]

92. "Fed plan to fund commercial paper to begin on Oct. 27..."

Commercial paper. I don't know why, but I keep picturing 4-inch-wide rolls.

[Demeter]

119. You Mean Toilet Paper?

:rofl: :spray:

[ozymandius]

6. The piehole gapes at the cameras this morning.

Bush to announce new details of bank rescue plan

WASHINGTON - The Bush administration will spend $250 billion this year to purchase stock in banks and take a number of other bold steps in an effort to combat a global credit crisis that is threatening to push the country into a deep recession, industry and government officials say.

President Bush was scheduled to announce the new initiatives early Tuesday after executives of the country's biggest banks were summoned to a remarkable meeting at the Treasury Department on Monday. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson basically told the bank CEOs that they had to accept the government stock purchases for the good of the U.S. economy.

.....

After the purchase of preferred stock in nine large banks, the program is expected to be expanded to many others. Among the initial banks participating will be all of the country's largest institutions, including Citigroup Inc., Wells Fargo & Co., JPMorgan Chase & Co., Bank of America Corp. and Morgan Stanley, said one official, with each institution expected to receive billions of dollars in return for the sale to the government of preferred shares.

The advantage to the taxpayer is that if the rescue plan works, then the shares can be sold for more than the government initially paid, providing a profit on the transaction.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081014/ap_on_bi_ge/financial_meltdown

[ozymandius]

8. World stocks soar after US rally; Nikkei up 14 pct

HONG KONG - World markets soared for a second day Tuesday, led by a record 14 percent jump in Tokyo, after Wall Street rallied from its worst week ever on optimism that government rescue efforts will heal the crippled global financial system.

Japan's benchmark Nikkei 225 index surged 1,171.14 points, or 14.15 percent, to close at 9,447.57, its biggest single-day gain in history. That's a stunning reversal after the index plunged 24 percent last week. Tokyo financial markets were playing catch-up to recent developments because they were closed Monday for a holiday.

European markets followed Asia higher in early trading, with benchmarks in Britain, Germany and France opening up more than 4 percent.

Hong Kong's key index gained 3.2 percent, while South Korea's market jumped over 6 percent. The Philippine market surged more than 7 percent and Indonesia's market — shut half of last week due to dramatic declines — was up more than 6 percent.

Only China's main market index fell — sliding 2.7 percent.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081014/ap_on_bi_ge/world_markets

[ozymandius]

10. FASB Rules Come Under Fire by Banks (faith-based accounting still lives)

Mark-to-market accounting came under fire on both sides of the Atlantic, with banks pressing for relaxation or suspension of the practice, which has been criticized as exacerbating the financial crisis.

The American Bankers Association asked securities regulators to override recent guidelines from the Financial Accounting Standards Board on mark-to-market accounting, contending the proposed rule changes don't address bank concerns about the practice.

....

The International Accounting Standards Board concurred Monday on the mark-to-market guidance issued by FASB. The IASB is the FASB's international counterpart, setting rules for many countries outside the U.S., including nations in the European Union.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122394624672131283.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

[ozymandius]

14. So this preferred stock purchase will carry compensation limits.

From a Bloomberg article:

The companies are Citigroup Inc., Wells Fargo & Co., JPMorgan Chase & Co., Bank of America Corp., Goldman Sachs Group Inc., Morgan Stanley, State Street Corp., and Bank of New York Mellon Corp., the people said. One of the people also said Merrill Lynch & Co. will receive an investment.

.....

None of banks getting government money was given a choice about it, said one of the people familiar with the plans. All of the banks involved will have to submit to compensation restrictions, said the person.

Naked Capitalism says that compensation limits will be cosmetic. If so, not surprising. That was a major issue that nearly doomed TARP 24 hours before passage. Other worthwhile NC analysis: how the bailout money is allocated.

[Demeter]

15. What Goats? By Glenda Moore

http://www.opednews.com/articles/What-Goats-by-Glenda-Moore-081012-171.html


Considering economic models using goats gave me a much better understanding of Enron venture capitalism:

You have two goats. You sell three of them to your publicly listed company, using letters of credit opened by your brother-in-law at the bank, then execute a debt/equity swap with an associated general offer so that you get all four goats back, with a tax exemption for five goats. The milk rights of the six goats are transferred via an intermediary to a Cayman Island Company secretly owned by the majority shareholder who sells the rights to all seven goats back to your listed company. The annual report says the company owns eight goats, with an option on one more. You sell one goat to buy a new president of the United States, leaving you with nine goats. No balance sheet is provided with the release. The public then buys your bull.

With the startling and generous gift of the contents of our Treasury to an unapologetic and unaccountable financial sector on October 1, 2008, I tried to use goats once more to get a little clarity and perspective on what had just happened.

First of all, here's what made all this such a surprise. For years, when we've wanted to fund Head Start, children's healthcare, higher education, job training programs, or infrastructure maintenance, we've heard endless arguments in Congress concerning the scarcity of funds to pay for these things. We don't even have money for disaster relief, one of the basic services for which taxpayers in any country expect a return on their investment in their government.

So here we thought we hardly had any goats left, let alone enough for everyone to have milk and cheese and cabrito, and we were all going to have to learn to live much more austerely. Then we discovered that we did, have goats, but only very briefly.

We have, or had, as it turns out, 700 billion goats that we did not know about. We never would have known of the existence of this veritable windfall of goats except that the financial sector in this country wanted them. They demanded them, in fact, claiming a complex and dire emergency in which a cataclysmic economic meltdown would occur if we did not turn them over, immediately and without question.

I guess my first question was, "We have 700 BILLION frigging goats?"

Well, not for long. Here's what I understood about these greatly coveted goats of mysterious provenance. If we did not turn them over to the Secretary of the Treasury, who would then distribute them as he saw fit, enabling those with large flocks of dead goats to give us those goats for our live goats, we would never see our live goats again. Not that we'd ever laid eyes on them to start with.

All of this, of course, is enough to challenge anyone's concept of object permanence.

We have now turned over our goats that we did not know we'd had to companies that say they might rent them back to us sometime in the future, if we have ironclad credit ratings proving we are hard-working and accountable, and responsible with the goats we do have.

What goats?

[ozymandius]

16. This is a classic story.

I've heard it told before (ages ago) using different livestock. Still, its stands paramount in describing Enron accounting practices and shell company games. It's refreshing to see this used to epitomize the absurdity of national priorities with a $700 billion bailout after being told that we could not afford funding the basic needs of our taxpaying population.

[AnneD]

82. It's Classic

for a reason.:think:

[DemReadingDU]

33. That's great!

explained in simple terms, forwarded to family and friends

[Tansy_Gold]

38. Ditto!

(No, Tansy Gold is NOT a ditto head so stop saying that!) :grr:



:evilgrin:

[ozymandius]

17. Essence of the "Rescue" Plan In Comic Form

Mish directs his venom, again, at the bailout.

---

Yesterday I wrote Essence of the "Rescue" Plan. Here once again is the pertinent snip.

To stimulate lending, the bailout plan will attempt to recapitalize banks. The method of recapitalization is best described as robbing Taxpayer Pete to pay Wall Street Paul. In essence, money is taken from the poor (via taxes, printing, and weakening of the dollar) and given to the wealthy so the wealthy supposedly will have enough money to lend back (at interest) to those who have just been robbed.

Sinfest has captured the very essence of this robbery in comic form.

[Karenina]

109. That pretty much says it.

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

[ozymandius]

19. “Why is the Fed Paying Interest on Excess Reserves?”

That’s the question that perplexes Alex Tabarrok. But he has a theory (which is endorsed by William Polley):

“Today the Fed starts to pay interest on reserves. The zero interest on required reserves was an opportunity cost to banks, a tax if you like, so paying interest lifts the tax…

“More interesting is why the Fed will pay interest on excess reserves. In the long run, there are again efficiency gains but why would the Fed want to make it more profitable for banks to hold excess reserves now when we want every dollar in the credit markets? My best guess is that the Fed wants to play more Operation Twist and in Brad DeLong's terms this gives them an additional tool to do it on the Pan-Galactic scale.”

Operation Twist refers to monetary policies deliberately aimed at manipulating the prices of particular assets. The idea is for the central bank to “buy” the targeted assets with central bank money—reserves—or short-term government debt. In the original instance of Operation Twist, the targeted assets were long-term government debt. In the present instance, the assets are presumably the various classes of illiquid private assets that have been targeted by various Federal Reserve lending facilities.

http://macroblog.typepad.com/macroblog/2008/10/why-is-the-fed.html

---

A simpler explanation follows.

[Demeter]

70. It's an Apology For Robbing the Banks of Fannie and Freddie Dividends

[ozymandius]

20. early futures

S&P 500 +29.70 1046.40 10/14 7:11am

NASDAQ +37.50 1496.00 10/14 7:04am

Dow Jones +220.00 9728.00 10/14 7:11am

[Festivito]

21. STILL: 10/09/2008 10,266,382,646,543.62 (FRIDAY not posted--Closed Mon.)

At least I assume Friday's closing not posted yet since Columbus day was a holiday.

Link to my post from yesterday:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3541762&mesg_id=3541863

[Festivito]

122. Debt: 10/10/2008 10,294,381,432,306.10 (UP 27,998,785,762.50) (Friday)

(Average for last 30 calendar days: 20,319,627,360.04. Average for last 22 reported days 27,708,582,763.70.)

= Held by the Public + Intragovernmental(FICA)
6,024,947,413,171.24 + 4,269,434,019,134.87
UP 30,017,806,473.99 + DOWN2,019,020,711.50

Source: Debt to the penny:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

HISTORICAL:
President's term ends/begins: Jan 20
01/20/1993 _4,188,092,107,183.60 BC Inaugural
01/22/2001 _5,728,195,796,181.57 BC (UP 1,540,103,688,997.97)
10/10/2008 10,245,247,740,307.58 ** (UP 4,566,185,636,124.53 so far since Bush took office)

Fiscal Year ends: Sep 30
(Guess who might want to hide the Reagan Bush years.)
Borrowed in FY1993: (OLDER DATA IS MISSING)
Borrowed in FY1994: 281,261,026,873.94
Borrowed in FY1995: 281,232,990,696.07
Borrowed in FY1996: 250,828,038,426.34
Borrowed in FY1997: 188,335,072,261.61
Borrowed in FY1998: 113,046,997,500.28
Borrowed in FY1999: 130,077,892,735.81
Borrowed in FY2000: _17,907,308,253.43 Bill alone
Borrowed in FY2001: 133,285,202,313.20 Bill and George
Borrowed in FY2002: 420,772,553,397.10 All George
Borrowed in FY2003: 554,995,097,146.46
Borrowed in FY2004: 595,821,633,586.70
Borrowed in FY2005: 553,656,965,393.18
Borrowed in FY2006: 574,264,237,491.73
Borrowed in FY2007: 500,679,473,047.25
Borrowed in FY2008: 1,017,071,524,650.01
Borrowed in FY2009: 241,657,749,631.20 so far.

For a prettier and more explanitory view of our nation's debt:
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock

(Debt to the penny keeps changing. Stuff is missing. Best to keep our own history.) YESTERDAY'S:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3541762&mesg_id=3541863

[struggle4progress]

22. "Iceland's stock market crashed Tuesday when trading resumed after a three-day suspension."

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/14/business/15marketsA.php

[Tansy_Gold]

107. Okay, so here's my question:

In what way or ways does the U.S. "rescue" plan differ from the Icelandic version? And that includes potential/projected end result as well as current/causative circumstances?

Personally, I don't see any of this bullshit accomplishing anything beyond a momentary flash of short-term boosting to the Dow. I don't see real recovery in the overall stock market, the money market funds, the banks, the economy, nothing. Yes, it's gonna shift what little wealth that remains in the hands of the workers into the hands of capitalists, and there you have it.

To quote the insurance adjusters whose claim interviews I transcribe: "Is there anything else you'd like to add to this report that I may not have covered in our interview and that you think might help us in our investigation of this accident?"



Tansy Gold, who has (very briefly) been to Iceland

[Wednesdays]

23. TED Spread 4.45

Still pretty high.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/quote?ticker=.TEDSP:IND

[struggle4progress]

24. Net Assets of Japan Stock Funds Show Record Fall in Sept.

Tokyo, Oct 14, 2008 (Jiji Press) - Net assets of publicly offered stock investment trust funds in September showed their steepest fall on record due to the global financial crisis, the Investment Trusts Association said Tuesday.

The net asset value stood at 52,828.6 billion yen at the end of September, down 6,833.3 billion yen, or 11.5 pct, from a month before, the association said.

Including trust funds investing in bonds and other financial products, the net asset value of all publicly offered investment trust funds stood at 64,862.1 billion yen, down 7,009.6 billion yen, or 9.8 pct, the second-steepest drop ever ...

http://www.japancorp.net/Article.Asp?Art_ID=20299

[struggle4progress]

25. Thrift stores a shopping salvation: Second-hand outlets see rise in business as economy falls

By Coloradoan staff and news services • October 14, 2008

COLUMBIA, Mo. - ... The Salvation Army and Goodwill Industries International, the nation's two largest charitable resale organizations, report year-to-date sales increases of 6 percent to 15 percent.

The gains are even more pronounced in the private sector. In an industry trade group survey of more than 200 resale and thrift shops, nearly two-thirds of those businesses reported higher sales in 2008 compared to the previous year. The average sales increase: 35 percent.

Ric Berninzoni, Goodwill's vice president of retail operations in Denver, said Fort Collins' Goodwill stores on JFK Parkway and Walnut Street are experiencing nearly double-digit sales increases over last year.

Consumers "can't change the price of gas. They can't change the price of food. They can't make the stock market go up again," said Adele Meyer, executive director of the National Association of Resale & Thrift Shops ...

http://www.coloradoan.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081014/LIFESTYLE/810140301/1024

[struggle4progress]

26. Asian markets jump after rescue plans unveiled (2nd Lead)

... The blue-chip Hang Seng Index rose 520.4 points, or 3.19 per cent, to close at 16,832.56. However, Hong Kong shares are still off almost 50 per cent from their peak of just below 32,000 in October 2007.

Taiwan's Taiex surged 5.4 per cent to close at 5,291.56 while Sydney's ASX 200 index posted its highest one-day points gain in history. The ASX opened opening 5.8 per cent higher, jumping to 4,423, but succumbed to profit taking near the close at 4,335, up 3.7 per cent.

The lift came as Prime Minister Kevin Rudd announced an economic stimulus package worth 10.4 billion Australian dollars (7.2 billion US dollars) that gave one-off handouts to 4 million Australians, mostly pensioners and low-income families.

New Zealand's NZX 50 finished up 5.65 per cent, up 166.58 points at 2,948.97, after rising by nearly 7 per cent in early trading ...

http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/business/news/article_1436831.php/Asian_markets_jump_after_rescue_plans_unveiled__2nd_Lead__

[DemReadingDU]

28. GMAC ceases all financing to buyers with credit rating below 700

10/13/08
Automotive lending and mortgage firm GMAC has announced it will further restrict automotive financing by ceasing to offer any money to buyers with credit scores lower than 700. The move puts most American buyers out of contention for GMAC financing, as the average credit score in the U.S. is 680.

more...
http://www.motorauthority.com/general-motors-reportedly-exploring-strategic-options-for-gmac-finance-arm.html

[AnneD]

85. OK, I AM showing my age.......

but I remember when you had to put up a down payment to buy a car.

[Dr.Phool]

89. And you couldn't roll in the balance of what you owe on your old car.

Onto the loan for the new car.

[UpInArms]

29. dollar watch

http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX&v=i

Last trade 80.846 Change -0.572 (-0.74%)

U.S. Retail Sales on Tap - Will Fading Demands Push the Dollar Lower?

http://www.dailyfx.com/story/trading_reports/trading_news_reports/U_S__Retail_Sales_on_Tap_1223984600165.html

The economic downturn in the U.S. may only get worse as economists project retail spending drop another 0.7% after falling 0.3% in August. In fact, the final GDP reading for the second quarter was revised lower to 2.8% from a preliminary reading of 3.3%, indicating that the economy is slowing at a faster pace than initial expected.

Trading the News: U.S. Advance Retail Sales

What’s Expected
Time of release: 10/15/2008 12:30 GMT, 08:30 EST
Primary Pair Impact : EURUSD
Expected: -0.7%
Previous: -0.3%



...more...

Euro and Pound Choppy Ahead Of U.S. Bank Recapitalization Plan Announcement

http://www.dailyfx.com/story/topheadline/Euro_and_Pound_Choppy_Ahead_1223978909554.html

After yesterday’s rally the Euro saw choppy trading throughout the overnight session as markets await the details of the U.S. recapitalization plan. A sharp fall in the German ZEW Survey failed to impact price action as the EURUSD actually appreciated following the print of -63. Economists were expecting -51.1 after last month’s -41.1, which was the first decline in three months. Meanwhile, industrial production in the Euro-zone rose to 1.1% from -0.2% led by Germany.

The credit crisis is weighing on sentiment in Europe and although the German ZEW survey was conducted before the recent bank bailouts, the sharp drop underlines the level of concern. The declining sentiment will assuredly impact growth going forward as businesses and consumers have retrenched and will continue to be conservative in their future spending. Although, the region saw a brief improvement in industrial production led by a jump in energy output to 1.3% from -0.9%, it isn’t expected to continue given the current market conditions. ECB’s Stark stated that the recent rate cut by the ECB will help stabilize the situation in the medium term, but that price stability must remain the focus of the central bank. The rhetoric shows that the MPC will most likely leave rates unchanged in November and unless inflation abates, for the remainder of the year. This should help the Euro hold on to recent gains and we may see further appreciation as interest rate expectations decline.

Inflation in the U.K. rose to 5.2% from 4.7% in September which was the highest on record since 1997. The majority of the gain was from the rise in utility costs to 12.0%% from 5.2% the month prior, as the effects of oil’s ascent to $147 per barrel filter through. However, expectations are that the recent drop in oil prices and the global slowdown will bring con prices back toward the BoE’s 2% target. The Pound saw whipsaw action as markets digested the yesterday’s nationalization of RBS,HBOS and Lloyds and the potential for further rate cuts by the central bank. Indeed, Credit Suisse overnight index swaps are pricing in a 117 bps worth of cuts over the next twelve months, which is down from 145 bps on October 10.

The USDJPY has consolidated at 102.00 as the markets await an unscheduled BoJ meeting at 11:30 GMT, where they are expected to join the global initiative. Although there has been some speculation that a rate cut may be in store, given the current 0.50% rate, there isn’t room for cuts. The central bank will most likely announce measures to improve liquidity as they look to do their part in stemming the current crisis.

The U.S. is scheduled to announce the details of their recapitalization plan at 8:30 EST, which is expected to include a $250 billion direct investment in troubled banks with $125 billion earmarked for nine major banks. The plan will also call for a guarantee of on interbank lending which follows the action from Europe and was necessary to prevent arbitrage opportunities and the flow of funds overseas to safer havens. The FDIC will also build upon their insurance coverage, by guaranteeing all business non-interest bearing deposits. The dollar could benefit from the announcement of cash flows come back to the safety of the U.S. However, if the plan continues to fuel risk appetite the greenback could see the weakness form yesterday continue as investors more their money from U.S. treasuries to riskier assets overseas.

...more...

[ozymandius]

32. Will the U.S. lose its position as the world's financial superpower?

Will the U.S. lose its position as the world's financial superpower?
Yes 50%
No 50%
Total responses to this question: 61838

http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/14/news/economy/bank_bailout/index.htm

[ozymandius]

35. U.S. pulls the trigger (top story on the above page)

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- President Bush announced an extraordinary and historic investment in the nation's banks early Tuesday - the biggest bet ever made with taxpayer dollars on the U.S. financial system.

Sources said the investment will amount to $250 billion. Nine of the nation's largest banks have already agreed to take the capital in return for preferred shares going to taxpayers and accepting limits on executive pay. It is widely expected that half of the $250 billion will go to those nine banks.

The president also announced insurance on all deposits in non-interest bearing bank accounts, a move that allows businesses to no longer worry that their payroll and checking accounts exceeding the limits backed by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. And the government will also back most new bank debt.

.....

The move was something that the Bush administration and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson resisted even as the crisis in the nation's financial system mounted over the last month. But a previously announced plan to simply buy the bad mortgage debts held by major banks and Wall Street firms had done little to assure investors or get financial institutions providing the loans necessary to keep the U.S. economy functioning.

---

This opens a huge can of worms any "conservative" administration would rather avoid. What is not so important that the government can avoid using its power to facilitate?

Healthcare?
Job training?
Mass transit/urban renewal?

We're all Keynesians now.

[Roland99]

45. Which banks may get the most under the Paulson plan:

http://www.marketwatch.com/?dist=ctmw

Citigroup $25 billion
J.P. Morgan $25 billion
Bank of America $12.5 billion
Merrill Lynch $12.5 billion

Goldman Sachs $10 billion
Morgan Stanley $10 billion
State Street Bank $3 billion
Bank of New York $3 billion

[bread_and_roses]

36. "US Surrenders Power to Appoint World Bank President"

This from yesterday over at commondreams http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2008/10/13-1

WASHINGTON - The US is to lose its power to appoint the president of the World Bank after the UK's development secretary, Douglas Alexander, brokered a deal to throw open the post to candidates from any country.

Backed by European governments and developing countries, Alexander overcame resistance from the US and Japan to secure a reform he described last night as "a significant step forward".

Washington has had the right to hand-pick the president of the World Bank since the institution was founded after the second world war...

[SpiralHawk]

59. Yet another massive Republicon FAIL

The republicons are at least consistent: fail, fail, fail.

[antigop]

40. WSJ article has some info as to why Treasury decided to go with equity injections

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122398468353632299.html

The government's new focus is raising questions about why it didn't adopt such an approach sooner. Mr. Paulson actively opposed the idea of investing in banks because he worried about picking winners and losers, though Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke was an early advocate. Mr. Paulson was also concerned banks wouldn't participate because of the perceived stigma and the potential for the government to meddle in their affairs, according to people familiar with the matter.

Senior executives and advisers to some of the nation's leading banks pitched such a plan at various points earlier this summer but were rebuffed by officials at Treasury and the Fed, according to people familiar with the matter. Instead, Treasury initially marched ahead with a plan to buy distressed assets directly from banks.

House Democratic leaders, including Speaker Nancy Pelosi and House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank, held a closed-door session Monday with 11 economists and other advisers. The group threw its weight behind Treasury's decision to inject capital into the banking system.

"The consensus was so strong towards direct equity injections that there was literally no dissension on the point," said one of the invited economists, Jared Bernstein of the liberal Economic Policy Institute. "The only head-scratching is why did it take us so long to get here?"

Officials at the Treasury and Federal Reserve have been looking for a comprehensive approach to the credit crisis after a series of ad hoc interventions and say they didn't have the authority to make such a comprehensive move until Congress passed the bailout bill. The government's various moves, from saving mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to letting Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc. fail, have confused investors and frozen many in place at a time when the banking system was desperate for fresh capital. That contributed to what in essence was a high-level run on Wall Street banks, with funding drying up overnight.

[spotbird]

41. On October 30, 1929 the DOW gained 12.34%

History doesn't repeat, but it rhymes.

[ozymandius]

42. Youtube video: 1929 Stock Market Crash (Part 3)

Events then rhyme with those of today. See the part about Dick Whitney's famous walk across the NYSE floor at 1:55 into the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCX-6rmBA4I

[antigop]

43. Credit swaps dragged out of shadows

http://financialweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081012/REG/310139993

The push to bring credit default swaps out of the shadows gained momentum last week, with formal trading platforms for the esoteric derivatives winning fresh support from industry players and federal and state officials clamoring for more oversight of the $55 trillion market.

Some swaps watchers say an exchange or clearinghouse could satisfy the calls for regulation by addressing two of the biggest issues hanging over the swaps market right now: a lack of transparency and fears about counterparty risk.

“There is so much need for a clearinghouse,” said Robert Claassen, a partner in the corporate practice of law firm Paul Hastings. “We are just getting inundated with questions about counterparty risk. There is so much concern about counterparty risk and a clearinghouse eliminates that.”

[Roland99]

44. 9:51am - Opening euphoria (+400 pts) fades some

Dow 9,611.90 +224.29
Nasdaq 1,856.30 +12.05
S&P 500 1,028.69 +25.34
Oil $83.60 $2.41
10-year 4.00% +0.14
Gold $839.00 -$3.50

[Systematic Chaos]

46. My personal feelings about the next few days:

Today will see a moderate gain (100 - 200 pts.)
Tomorrow will see a very slight gain (1 - 50 pts.)

After that, it's back to the bloodbath.

[Roland99]

49. I predict some large swings in bargain buying and profit taking

now is not the time to be a day trader. large buys will fuck them (and shorts) over

[radfringe]

50. I agree - this "upswing" is from bargain hunters

the underlying problem of strangling the goose (i.e. middle class as golden egg layer) it still there. I don't care how high the markets go - if people don't have money in their pockets or fear for what little they do have - they aren't going to spend

winter is coming, oil just bounced up again - people will be hurting bad to heat their homes - and the northeast is predicted to be colder than normal w/more snow than normal.

[AnneD]

86. Bargain Hunters are all that are driving the market.....

Buffett and Rogers among others have been holding a cash position and are bargain shopping now. I also agree about the colder than normalrelated to IKE. That sucked out a lot of heat from the gulf-which heats the water of the NE. Too bad you can't get some of these downed trees here. It is like a lightbulb went off all over town at once. A lot of these oaks are now being gotten for firewood.

[Roland99]

48. Down to +118. NASDAQ and Russel2K now in the red.

[dweller]

51. Wall Street Soars on Bank Rescue Plan... headline

now reads: Wall Street Mostly Higher on Bank Rescue Plan

actual story: Stocks mostly advance on government bank plan

i predict at day's end: Wall Street Sours on Gov't Socialist Plot



:eyes:

dp

[theDash]

55. I am not that bright when it comes to all of this

but how is injecting all of this money into banks going to help if we don't move quickly to solve the underlying problems? Do we just give them money so they can continue on with business as usual, giving out risky loans and credit to businesses and individuals who may not have the means to repay them? Everyone is already in debt up to their ears, but it seems as if we want people to be even further in debt, and somehow that is economic progress? I know the stock market is cheering, because the scam on the american public and good is being propped up by our very own government, but this thing is going to come crashing down even harder if they don't fix the problem. But of course that's not going to happen, because the only way that will happen is by the 'redistribution of wealth' in the form of more jobs, better pay, affordable healthcare, lower food prices, lower oil prices/less dependence on oil. The american public is being screwed over, and the sad thing is, half of these people don't know they are being screwed by their own party. Obama must win this election, or this country is headed for a disaster like we have never seen.

[dweller]

62. you know, imo, you have a good handle on the situation

so don't doubt your insight. Perhaps one of the market guru types here can provide you with more details, but as i'm not an investor, but an observer, i mostly am astounded by what goes on Wall St.

now, with that said, CBS radio news clip just now was reporting the mood of the last hour and at the end added an alarming one-liner, that the gov't proclaimed "it would not stand down until prosperity is restored" ...

which worries me as much if not more.
dp

[AnneD]

87. Translation from Busheese to English (American)

As long as the Bush Admin can find another dollar in the bank vault-the government will not stand down.

[TalkingDog]

64. Disaster either way.

They can't make mfg. jobs out of thin air.

Even the WPA during The Depression, took some time to get under way. This is a very large bureaucracy we're talking about after all....

If Obama is smart - and we suspect that he is- he will have some sort of proposals in hand the day he walks through the door. And hopefully they will focus on alternative energies and permaculture research and implementation to maximize food production while minimizing human impact.

Hopefully we (and I mean the people on DU and other progressives) can see clear to make this into an opportunity to introduce people to progressive issues like universal health care, resource management, labor issues and so on in moments where those issues are hitting home.

Yesterday on NPR there was a heartbreaking story about a woman in Las Vegas. She and her husband have 6 kids. She lost her job and he could only make money as a low wage as a steelworker trainee.

They had no money, no means. The power had been turned off days before due to non-payment. No baths, no cooking, no laundry no air conditioner.

The woman made a secret decision and beg on a busy street corner. She explained that before, she wouldn't give money to beggars because she "knew" they would spend her hard earned money on drugs or booze.

Yet there she stood with her cardboard sign that explained that she was not homeless, that she had 6 kids to feed. And she said when the first woman rolled down her window and gave her a dollar, she started crying.

It just so happened that a social worker was traveling across town and saw this "soccer mom" as she described her begging on the street. The social worker stopped, got the information to help the woman and got her electric bill paid that day.

Now the "soccer mom" has a more understanding attitude about those less fortunate than herself.

If we can't avoid the pain, we can at least make sure it counts towards something positive.

[AnneD]

97. Those of you long time readers know my story...

and what I had to go through during the 80's. My experiences made me the flaming in your face liberal I am today. Once you have been broken down-you can remake yourself into a better person. It is not by accident that God sent every great leader into the desert. It clears your thinking, hardens your resolve, and removes the stone from around your heart and strengthens you to remove obstacles in your path...it prepares you for what lies ahead.

And how many have saved themselves lots of grief from listening to me warn about this economy being like the 8o's in Houston with all the S&L debacles. I was not just a prophet crying in the wilderness( sorry I can't resist the pun)-because I know folks here have listened and warned their family and friend. At first some folks thought I was nuts when I started speaking to my family and friends about this...after this month however-they think I'm a f#*@!ng genius. Frankly I don't give a rats ass what they think, say, or do. Those that needed to hear me did and we are in good shape today and hopefully will weather the coming storm.

I sure hope this woman take away the good lessons and teaches them to her kids. She will enjoy a much richer life. The difference between being poor and being down on your luck is you attitude. One is easy to overcome-the other isn't. Take the help you get and learn to pay it forward when you can.

[BelgianMadCow]

106. Well AnneD, and all of the SMW crew, you're right, we did listen.

I warned those in my family to get out of (US) stocks a year ago and they did.

So thanks to you and all the contributors!

:thumbsup:

[natrat]

80. somehow i think you pose a rhetorical question. Asking crooks to reform themselves, wonderful

[dysfunctional press]

56. 9:45 central time...going DOWN.

everything is red.

[Roland99]

57. 10:46am - All in the red. Techs down 2.5%

Dow 9,348.03 -39.58
Nasdaq 1,799.31 -44.94
S&P 500 997.89 -5.46
10-year 3.99% +0.13
Gold $834.00 -$8.50
Oil $81.61$ +0.42

[Dr.Phool]

58. What happened to the ponies?

Everything is in the red now.

[ThePowerofWill]

60. Back up to +20 now.

A lot of wild swings are going to be the nature of the beast. Seem the new plans are not going over so well.

Gonna be an interesting day......again.

[AnneD]

110. They were Icelandic horses.....

they are frozen for the moment.

[Festivito]

61. DU meisje: After the crash in '29 there was a sucker rally in '30

meisje
...six separate bear market rallies during that brief 3-year span...

DU:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4232627&mesg_id=4232627

GRAPHS:
http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2008/06/chart-of-day-dow-1928-1932.html

[Davis_X_Machina]

63. There'll be bargain-hunting by sector...

...and by individual company. Expect a lot of stochastic noise even if this is the bottom.

[Zenlitened]

72. Fund that "broke the buck" delays reimbursing "shareholders"

I put "shareholders" in quotes because the whole notion of who owned what seems to be a bit, ah, less-than-transparent. :crazy:

Reserve Misses Target for Distributing $20 Billion to Investors

By Christopher Condon

Oct. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Reserve Management Corp. said it failed to meet its target of returning $20 billion to investors in its frozen Reserve Primary Fund yesterday because it couldn't calculate their holdings.

"The process of determining accurately the number of shares each investor held in the Primary Fund has proven extremely complex and could not be completed in the originally anticipated time frame,'' the New York-based company said in a statement posted on its Web site. Ming Lee Hatch, a Reserve Management spokeswoman, didn't immediately return a phone call seeking comment.

Reserve Primary on Sept. 16 became the first money-market mutual fund in 14 years to fall below $1 a share in net assets after its losses on debt issued by bankrupt Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc. The company's $785 million of Lehman debt, which it wrote down to zero, accounted for about 1.5 percent of assets.

Reserve Management had said it would distribute $20 billion, or about 38 percent of the $52.5 billion the fund held on Sept. 15. The payment was expected to be made ``on or about Oct. 13,'' the company said Sept. 29.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aPFXXUvIOUK4&refer=home

[Zenlitened]

75. When is a bank run not a bank run?

Why, when it's an "intense competition for deposits," of course!

Sovereign Deposits Fell by $4.2 Billion, 9% of Total

By Linda Shen

Oct. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Sovereign Bancorp Inc., the lender that agreed this week to be bought by Spain's Banco Santander SA, said customers pulled almost 9 percent of their deposits in the weeks leading to the U.S. government's $700 billion financial-industry bailout.

Sovereign, based in Philadelphia, said in a statement late yesterday that customers withdrew $4.2 billion, most of it early in the third quarter. Deposits ``stabilized'' after Congress approved the industry rescue and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. raised insured limits.

(snip)

Sovereign is the latest bank to say deposits came under siege as customers grew concerned about the soundness of U.S. banks. Washington Mutual Inc., Sovereign's biggest rival, was seized in September in the biggest U.S. bank failure in history after customers withdrew $16.7 billion in 10 days.

The lender blamed ``intense deposit competition as well as general safety and soundness concerns following the failure of IndyMac.'' Pasadena, California-based IndyMac Bancorp Inc., also a savings and loan, was seized by regulators July 11 after customers withdrew more than $1.3 billion of deposits.

Link:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aU3_0c_e6gVk&refer=us

[dweller]

77. Government moves again to unclog credit lines

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081014/financial_meltdown.html
WASHINGTON (AP) -- President Bush on Tuesday announced a $250 billion plan by the government to directly buy shares in the nation's leading banks, saying the drastic steps were "not intended to take over the free market but to preserve it."
Nine major banks will participate initially including all of the country's largest institutions, he announced, in a move that sent stocks soaring on Wall Street.
Some of the nation's largest banks had to be pressured to participate by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson, who wanted healthy institutions that did not necessarily need capital from the government to go first as a way of removing any stigma that might be associated with banks getting bailouts.

"We regret having to take these actions," Paulson said. "Today's actions are not what we ever wanted to do -- but today's actions are what we must do to restore confidence to our financial system."


i do love these headlines...so inspiring!

I call it: Plunger, Snake and Drano :D



now, i'm off to my real job, which i'm lucky to have still, so i'll keep it.
dp

[AnneD]

113. Don't you know ...

that's got to be one ugly hair ball clogging up the works..........


or we have finally found the body of Jimmy Hoffa.



Anyone else have some industrial strength Drano?

[Joe Chi Minh]

115. Isn't that kind of nonsensical? Restoring confidence in a catastophically-

failed system? In fact, one that makes the same catastrophic mistake/scam, again and again.

[Zenlitened]

81. When is CNBC going to do its "We Were Wrong and We're Sorry" prime-time special?

They have been wrong wrong WRONG about virtually EVERYTHING for the entire year-and-a-half of financial collapse.

They not only didn't see any of it coming, they led the charge in proclaiming -- daily -- that everything is great! great! GREAT!

Just yesterday, they spent the day chortling about what a great time it is to buy! buy! BUY! stocks because "the bottom is in." (That, after counseling viewers to sell at a loss on Friday.)

And today... I tune in just now and they've got half a dozen talking heads crammed into one screen and whining about how Obama is going to "ruin the economy" by "sticking it to the rich" with taxes.

Unreal.

I watch CNBC because they're a good lagging -- if not outright reverse -- indicator of Financial Reality. So I guess the only conclusion to take away for now: The markets still have further to decline. And the Obama years are gonna be GREAT for the economy.

[Dr.Phool]

88. The Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders keep dancing.

Even when the Cowboys are getting blown out.

Instead of a coked-up Hollywood Henderson mugging for the camera during a blowout, we've got Jim Cramer offering all the insight of a meth head overdosing on PCP.

[AnneD]

101. I will.....

get my virginity back AND have a kid at 90 before THAT every happens at CNBC. Even Jimmy the Greek is laughing and telling me he wouldn't give me odds-he'd like to see it but he won't give me odds. He can be such a jerk at times-funny but a jerk.

[Blue_Tires]

84. the dow is up 48 to 9436 as of 1:05 p.m.

[specimenfred1984]

90. Banks doing well while everyone else loses their jobs, ain't fascism grand?

Corporate welfare for the biggest frauds in history just so they can charge you 19% to 29% interest after they change the date your payment was due or make their online payment feature "unavailable".

[Roland99]

95. 2:06pm - Whoops! Breaking down. Session lows. (down +100)

Dow 9,282.32 -105.29
Nasdaq 1,793.92 -50.33
S&P 500 996.35 -7.00
10-year 4.02% +0.16
Gold $840.00 -$2.50
Oil $81.60 $0.41

[holly111]

98. Economy

Greatest economic boost in decades was under Clinton. Obama will exceed that!

[truthisfreedom]

99. I doubt it. He'll certainly help more than any ridiculous republican, though.

The economy is headed for disaster after 2012. Demographics are in control at that point... the invention of the pill in 1960 reduced births so much throughout the 60's and 70's that we have a real shortage of investors from 2012 to 2018.

[Winterblues]

100. Down 135 and dropping fast.

:shrug:

[Roland99]

103. 2:48pm - Lookout below! ... -263

Dow 9,123.82 -263.79
Nasdaq 1,763.12 -81.13
S&P 500 977.20 -26.15
10-year 4.02% +0.15
Oil $79.70 -$1.49
Gold $839.50 -$3.00



EDIT: -290


nope... -268...-279


up....down...all around.

:)

[ThePowerofWill]

105. Damn! i go take a nap and the bottom falls out.

It was like +60 when i layed down. I had today pegged for a wild day.

Glad my money has been out of the market for a good while. I watch and i wince, but for no real good personal reason. :shrug:

[AnneD]

111. A fav quote

Sheriff of Nottingham: Wait a minute. Robin Hood steals money from my pocket, forcing me to hurt the public, and they love him for it?



Sheriff of Nottingham: That's it then. Cancel the kitchen scraps for lepers and orphans, no more merciful beheadings, and call off Christmas.

I guess the people are calling off Christmas this year, AND NO MORE NAPS FOR YOU WILL!!!!!!

[ThePowerofWill]

120. Good quote....

True repuke lol!

However i must protest about the naps! I laid out of work kinda (i'm semi retired, just work for the insurance)to get some rest, and try not to freak out.

So many things happening it makes times very anxious. I used to giggle when i heard people say they got physically sick from worry. I now relent after getting physically ill myself. Funny thing is i always thought i was in control. Despite telling myself over and over "it's all in my head, you control it" i lost it. I don't worry for myself, but my kids are just entering adulthood, and starting their own lives......i really worry about their future,


Damn, i need another nap now.

[antigop]

104. Degrees of Hank Paulson

http://www.propublica.org/special/degrees-of-hank-paulson/

If it sometimes seems that Wall Street is a small world, well, it is. For all its global reach, and for all the bitter conflict in recent months, where, for example, Lehman Brothers was left to tumble into bankruptcy while American International Group was bailed out, these are people who know each other, often well. Nowhere are the ties more evident than with U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. Many of the CEOs of companies touched by the financial crisis have links to him. Some, such as Goldman Sachs CEO Lloyd Blankfein, have direct connections via that company, which Paulson used to head. Others connect through a network of fellow CEOs.

[ozymandius]

108. closing time -- recovery team put to the test

Dow 9,310.99 Down 76.62 (0.82%)
Nasdaq 1,779.01 Down 65.24 (3.54%)
S&P 500 998.01 Down 5.34 (0.53%)
10-Yr Bond 4.023% Up 0.162
NYSE Volume 8,184,852,500
Nasdaq Volume 2,912,513,500

4:15 pm : The stock market saw some swings on Tuesday, eventually settling with a modest loss, after the government's latest financial relief efforts were offset over fears that the broader economy will still face challenges. Some investors decided to take some money off the table following the previous session's massive gains, which added to the selling pressure.

The S&P 500 opened at its highs with a 4.1% gain, fell to a loss of 3.1% in the final hour of trade and then recovered to finish with a modest loss of 0.5%.

Eight of the ten economic sectors posted a gain. A strong 6.4% advance in financials, aided by the government's relief plan, helped offset weakness in tech (-3.9%), materials (-3.0%) and small-cap stocks (-2.9%). The weakness in tech caused the Nasdaq to underperform with a loss of 3.5%.

With regard to the governments efforts, the Treasury will buy up to $250 billion in preferred stock from qualifying U.S. financial institutions, with the funds and authority coming from the $700 billion plan authorized by Congress earlier this month. To participate in the program, financial institutions will have to agree to executive compensation limits, including the elimination of golden parachutes. Participation in the program is voluntary, although it appears that firms will be taking the Treasury up on its offer.

Nine of the largest financial institutions in the world will receive $125 billion, including Bank of America (BAC 26.42, +3.63), Citigroup (C 18.70, +2.95), JPMorgan Chase (JPM 40.80, -1.19), Morgan Stanley (MS 21.96, +3.86) and Wells Fargo (WFC 33.25, +2.85).

In addition, the FDIC will guarantee the newly issued unsecured debt from banks through June 30, 2012. Meaning that if a bank fails, holders of newly issued debt will be paid by the FDIC. This includes interbank lending, which had seized up as banks hoarded cash. Separately, noninterest bearing deposit accounts will now be fully guaranteed, up from the current limit of $250,000, until the end of 2009.

The U.S. government's plans are similar to action taken in Europe yesterday.

Credit markets showed some signs of improvement, although they remain tight. Dollar Libor -- the rate that banks charge each for short-term loans -- fell across all terms. The Ted Spread fell 21 basis points to 4.36%. The TED spread measures the difference between what banks charge each other for three month loans (three month Libor) and what the Treasury pays (3-month T-bill).

Earnings were mixed. Johnson & Johnson (JNJ 64.97, +2.29) posted third quarter earnings growth that topped estimates and raised its full year outlook. Conversely, PepsiCo (PEP 53.90, -7.87) reported smaller-than-expected earnings per share growth, excluding nonrecurring items, gave a downside full-year earnings outlook and announced job cuts.

In commodity trading, oil prices came under selling pressure in conjunction with the pullback stocks, settling with a 2.3% loss at $79.35 per barrel after being up as much as 4.5%. Commodities as a whole fell 0.8%.

Treasury prices declined as the government's plan helped calm financial markets. The 10 year note fell 24 ticks, sending its yield above 4% for the first time since August.DJ30 -76.62 NASDAQ -65.24 NQ100 -4.5% R2K -2.8% SP400 -2.3% SP500 -5.34 NASDAQ Adv/Vol/Dec 908/2.74 bln/1751 NYSE Adv/Vol/Dec 1715/1.64 bln/1475

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

116. We need more thrust in the helicopter engine.

eom

[TheWatcher]

117. It appears this whole week is about seducing everyone with Synthetic Bullshit

And calming everyone down.

This latest venture into the world of magical fancy should fall apart within the next three days.

If they can turn into a bigger party I would expect the ceiling to be around 10500.