US Jan. auto sales rise; safety fears trip Toyota

[TomCADem]

Source: Associated Press

DETROIT (AP) -- The U.S. auto industry rebounded from last January's sales collapse with one big exception: Toyota, which lost an estimated 20,000 sales after it stopped selling eight models because of defective gas pedals.

Last month, U.S. sales of cars and light trucks rose 6 percent from a year earlier, thanks to increases in fleet sales and strong demand for newly redesigned vehicles such as the Hyundai Tucson SUV and Buick LaCrosse sedan. Big winners included General Motors Co., Ford Motor Co., Nissan Motor Co. and Hyundai Motor Co., which all posted double-digit sales increases.

But Toyota's sales slipped 16 percent, and they could fall further as its sales stoppage drags into February. It was the first time since February 1998 that Toyota's monthly U.S. sales fell below 100,000 vehicles, according to Ward's AutoInfoBank.

Toyota's troubles helped to knock the Camry off its traditional perch as the top-selling car in the U.S. Last month the Camry ranked fifth in car sales, passed by Honda's Accord, Nissan's Altima, Toyota's Corolla and the Chevrolet Malibu. The Camry has been the top-selling car in the U.S. for the last eight years.


Read more: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/US-Jan-auto-sales-rise-safety-apf-2062899392.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=3&asset=&ccode=

[Yurovsky]

1. Buy American ...

GM, Ford, or Chrysler/Jeep.

Let's put Americans back to work.

[LeftyMom]

4. They quit making cars that I want.

I had a Saturn SW1 wagon, really liked it too. But Saturn quit making them in '04, and the other domestic wagons are either unreliable, underfeatured (and the Saturn wasn't exactly a luxury car- the windows had cranks- so I'm not terribly picky,) inefficient, entirely too small for my needs or simply inferior to the competition.

So I drive a Subaru. And I really, really like it. More than the Saturn, even, and I have nothing bad to say about it.

But when Detroit turns out a safe car the size I want, that does what I want it to and will do it for 200,000 miles or more, we'll talk.

[blue_onyx]

7. Detroit does make great, efficient, and safe vehicles

If you can't get past your anti-Detroit bias to see that, then that's your problem.

[joeglow3]

8. EXACTLY

Do some research on the "quality gap." We sold out Blazer with 120,000 miles last year and it had NO mechanical problems (wife wanted a minivan with the birth of our 3rd son). My Sunfire has crossed 100,000 this year and I have had ZERO problems with it.

[LeftyMom]

11. What they don't make is a reliable, high quality wagon.

I needed a wagon. The current domestics were all crap. :shrug:

I don't have a problem with American cars, the wagon I was replacing (I wrecked it with 187,000 highly reliable miles on it) was a Saturn, and my family business has more Lincolns than you can shake a stick at. But I need a wagon, and none of theirs were any good.

[joeglow3]

14. Fair enough.

At least you did the research. Too many people are to lazy to do even that and it is costing our country jobs and money.

[LeftyMom]

9. I don't need a generic "vehicle" I need a wagon.

They used to make a great one, the Saturn SW series/LW series. It's discontinued. Ford discontinued both of their wagons as well.

Current wagons from domestic makes include: the Chevy HHR, which is unacceptable because the interior is seriously spartan (my Mom drove a Yugo once and the interior reminds me of that, ffs) and it has really, really terrible blind spots, the Dodge Caliber (too small for my purposes, I can't really go smaller than the Saturn I had, and I'm very leery of Chrysler reliability) and Magnum (terrible mpg, Chrysler reliability.) I looked at all of them, didn't get any because none will meet my needs. By contrast, Japanese and European brands had multiple cars that did what I wanted and I got to take my pick. edit: I forgot the PT Cruiser. Chrysler reliability again. Plus it's a Neon under the hood, and my roomie has a Neon and it's quite possibly the worst car I've ever had the misfortune to drive, and I refuse to take it anywhere anymore because it bounces all over the road in the most frighteningly unsafe way.

That's not anti-Detroit bias. My family runs a car-based business, I help to buy cars for that all day long and we have a small fleet of vehicles for it which are ALL DOMESTIC. I had a domestic car for years and I ABSOLUTELY ADORED IT. If I could have got an updated version of that car it would be in my driveway right now (actually, it would be someplace else, because two UAW built Lincolns are currently in my driveway, due to the aforementioned family business, but I digress) but I could not because that model was discontinued. I didn't run out and decide to get a Japanese car because I like ridiculous California markup on them, or because I really wanted a non-union vehicle, I got it because no current domestic cars met my needs. Maybe I'm supposed to "take one for the team" and buy something that doesn't do what I need it to do, but I rent so my vehicle is the most expensive thing that I own, and I'm not in a logistical or financial position to do that.

Detroit needs to stop abandoning market niches (or filling them with shit products) and SELL A GOOD CAR IN EVERY SEGMENT. That's how you do business, you don't tell people they can't have what they want and that they're un-American for asking, you give them everything they want and then a little extra.

[blue_onyx]

12. The wagon isn't a popular vehicle

but I could see them making a come back once gas prices rise again. I've read rumors that GM may soon offer a wagon version of the Buick Regal. I think it would be good for the US automakers to start offering wagons since there aren't many options for people that want that type of vehicle.


"By contrast, Japanese and European brands had multiple cars that did what I wanted and I got to take my pick "

Which vehicles did you like? I can't think of any wagons produced by foreign brands other than VW.

[LeftyMom]

15. Off the top of my head Volvo, VW/Audi, Mercedes, BMW, Subaru, Mazda, Hyundai/Kia, Honda and Toyota

all make at least one wagon for the US market. The latter two have one each, and both were two small.

The Hyundai/Kia models were excluded due to being crap. Neither their safety nor reliability were acceptable.

The Mazda I liked most (the 5) was hard to find, or I'd have probably got one. In fewer years than I care to think I'll kick this car down to my kid, and it's quite possible I'll grab one of these then unless I'm ready to move to something smaller. I looked at the 3, which came highly recommended but it had a very cramped backseat. I did not look closely at the 6 because for the price I'd rather have the 5, but from what I saw it seems to be a perfectly good car.

BMW and Mercedes both make wagons ranging from small and sporty on up to big luxury estates (that's dirty furriner for station wagon) and $100,000 high-end models. Perfectly lovely, and entirely out of my price range for both initial purchase and upkeep. Plus I'd feel like some snobby family's nanny driving one.

Volvo makes a bunch of great wagons, I just didn't a Volvo. No good reason, really.

VW/Audi makes several wagons that would have been perfect except that I had very serious quality concerns, so I opted not to get one after serious consideration.

Eventually I went with a Subaru. Their quality and reliability were very good, I was able to get a car the right size that got great MPG and had every feature I wanted and then some, and the addition of AWD was a huge plus since my town has a serious problem with street flooding.

I'm very happy with my car, but I could have chosen any one of several imports I'd have liked as much or nearly so.

[blue_onyx]

17. I looked at several of those brands' websites

and I don't see any wagons offer by Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Toyota, and Mazda. Maybe you consider a hatchback to be the same as a station wagon?

[LeftyMom]

19. I'll grant you a few of them are debatable.

But a proper hatchback should have a roof no longer than the sedan version and a sloping glass hatch. A wagon has a longer roof and greater cargo area or increased seating capacity in the additional space.

Honda: Fit (a fantastic car but a bit too small, a wagon whether they call it one or no)
Toyota: Yaris (debatably a hatch, too small in any case, fairly uninspiring)
Kia: Rio Cinco (ditto)
Hyundai: Elantra wagon (about the right size, seriously shitty crash test ratings) (might be discontinued, didn't want one so didn't pay much attention)
Mazda: 3 wagon, 5 (only comes as a wagon), 6 wagon

[blue_onyx]

22. It seems that...

it's more of an issue with you having a preference for the foreign companies, not the US companies not having anything to meet your needs.

None of those vehicles are really wagons...they're hatchbacks. The Saturn Astra and Pontiac Vibe (which is really a Toyota) would have meet your needs (based on the vehicles you listed) but they are no longer made since those brands were discontinued. Chevy Aveo5 and HHR could have also been options.

The Ford Flex is probably closer to being an actual wagon than those vehicles you mentioned.

[Yurovsky]

23. The Flex is a cool car BUT...

it's pretty expensive. I saw one on a local Ford lot when I picked up my Hybrid Escape and it was around $40k. Ouch!

[WriteDown]

16. Just beware of the 60K transmission failure on that subaru....

A well documented issue on any car discussion board.

[LeftyMom]

18. I bought it used. It already has over 60K miles, and the transmission works perfectly.

Here in the real world, Subarus are NOTORIOUS for... lasting over 200,000 miles with minimal repairs. :rofl: I know plenty of people who have them, and they all rave about their reliability.

[WriteDown]

21. Here's just one of the many threads discussing the COMMON problem....

http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f0ffade

But yours is "special." :rofl:

Oh, and not to mention the notorious head gasket issues.

http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=b6d697c1b20809e4ecd12be432c9de09&forumid=66

[TomCADem]

20. Personally, I am looking at the Ford Fusion To Replace My Old Camry

My Camry predates the current recall issues, but I am looking for a nice modest family sedan to replace my old modest family sedan.

Yup, that's just how I roll.

[Yurovsky]

24. The Fusion/Milan is a nice car...

really quiet yet with plenty of acceleration for highway passing. I think the hybrid version was Motor Trend Car of the Year.

[blue_onyx]

2. Great news

I'm glad to see things improving for GM and Ford.

[fujiyama]

3. They both have some great cars

and now's a good time for them to steal some customers their way.

There isn't a chance in hell I'd ever buy a Chrysler though (well OK maybe an old Viper, but the day I'd be able to afford that...well as I said).

[LeftyMom]

5. Second that.

I like my mechanic, but I don't want to visit him that often.

[madokie]

13. I'll put our two fords up against any of the foreign brands

both are '98 models and both still like they were when new, No upholstery holes no worn out or replaced anything. The 98 f150 still has the original brakes on it and for the first six years or so I was pulling a trailer with a bobcat skid loader on it pretty regularly. If you can't find something that ford or gm has to offer that suits you then I say you'd just rather buy foreign brands. Thats a shame too as I see it.

[Historic NY]

6. Wait until this comes out...its coming.

http://videos.komando.com/2008/02/17/

[JCMach1]

10. Preferably buy American, but how about just BUY UNION

and only Union built cars and trucks.