Report: Gore Accuser Failed Lie Detector Test

[kskiska]

Source: Fox12 Oregon

PORTLAND, Ore. -- A masseuse who accused former Vice President Al Gore of groping and kissing her at a downtown hotel in 2006 failed a lie detector test and had a history of falsely accusing people of mistreating her, according to a report in this week's Portland Tribune newspaper.

Tribune editors said they found out about Molly Hagerty's sex abuse allegation against Gore 3 ½ years ago, but they didn't print an article because the newspaper's reporters thought her story lacked credibility.

The National Enquirer first reported the story last month and detailed Hagerty's accusations that Gore made unwanted sexual contact at Hotel Lucia in Portland.

Tribune editor Mark Garber said Hagerty's lawyer asked her to take a lie detector test and she failed, but that wasn't the reason they didn't print the story. He said the newspaper reporters' "personal interaction" with Hagerty raised red flags.

Read more: http://www.kptv.com/yourvote/24263736/detail.html

[texastoast]

1. Let's see that headline screaming on the liberal media grocery store newsstands

Nope. Damage done. Puke plan completed.

[godai]

25. or Drudge. There will not be a word of this. n/t

[JNelson6563]

36. Will this get same coverage as accusation

here on DU?? That is a more interesting question.

Julie

[xxqqqzme]

53. was thinking te same thing.

Forget the tabloids & drudge, there were numerous DUers ready to believe anything smearing Gore.

[jody]

2. Reminds me of the rush to judgment in the Duke lacrosse case. n/t

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

7. It's even worse. Since the target is a well known liberal Democrat, the bloodthirst is 1000x. -nt

[pnwmom]

18. Not worse on DU. Here, there was more willingness to keep an open mind

with regard to Al Gore -- as was proper.

Not so much with regard to the Duke case.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

19. I mean the media and the public at large. -nt

[mzmolly]

3. My, what a familiar

scenario.

[Ozymanithrax]

4. So when will the right wing radio pundis read this story...

never.

[Alcibiades]

9. The source here is a Fox News station

They know about it.

[Ozymanithrax]

10. Right wing radio hosts read the allegations on their shows.

I want to know when they will read this story exonerating Gore, or if they will just say that justice failed.

[Alcibiades]

38. They will say nothing

They will focus on other lies, such as the idea that cutting taxes on the rich fosters economic growth.

[HardWorkingDem]

5. Now, how does Gore get his good name back?

Anyone?

[kskiska]

6. Indeed

Gallup: Al Gore's approval rating plummets since 2000

(snip)

In 2007, just after he won the Nobel Peace Prize for his work in fighting climate change, 58% held a favorable view and 37%, an unfavorable one.

more…
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/greenhouse/post/2010/07/gallup-al-gores-approval-rating-falls-to-lowest-level-since-2000-recount/1

[sabrina 1]

8. Good for the editor of the Tribune for not publishing a questionable

story that couldn't be backed up with facts.

I hope Gore sues the Enquirer once this is over.

I KNOW we will not hear from the media about how a woman falsely accused a public figure of sexual assault and how dangerous it is to innocent people when baseless stories are published as if they were facts. That is a story in itself, but just as the media, so willing to spread the lies about ACORN around, have yet to give equal time to the total debunking of that story.

[Judi Lynn]

11. It would be a huge surprise if many sane people ever took any part of that yarn seriously.

Glad the news got out this soon.

Al Gore has been sinned against wildly by the U.S. corporate media for years. They DEEPLY owe him.

[GOPNotForMe]

12. Lie detectors are inadmissible in many courts for a reason.

They are unreliable, plain and simple. I love Al Gore and have been hoping that this story proves false and this is a good indication that it will be, but it's not proof that she was lying.

[AtheistCrusader]

15. Unfortunately true.

Worse, the timing of his divorce, which has the rethug 'where there's smoke there's fire' assholes all in a tizzy.

[No Elephants]

40. Tipper said she knew of the allegations years ago and they played no role in the divorce.

Not that facts matter with the Right, which seems extraordinarily resistant to facts.

[ck4829]

16. It wasn't just a fluke that she failed, it means something

Like with your average lie detector test, it's probably the result of small several tests. And it's not just a little gauge either, the person taking the test notes how long it takes the person to answer, if they give different answers to similar questions, and the ways they interact with the test giver.

Obviously, polygraphs aren't on par with fingerprints and DNA, and that is why courts don't use them. But the burden of proof is on the accuser, and this test has is just another statement saying that she's not being very truthful.

[Uncle Joe]

30. I agree in regards to the lie detector test, but there were too many other inconsistencies

in her story and behavior.

http://portlandtribune.com/news/story_2nd.php?story_id=127913967087475000

Budnick had told her he wanted to talk to friends and associates and lawyers she worked with. At first agreeing, she later seemed to backtrack and tried to limit his access to key people. During some curt conversations between Budnick and her, she accused him of “bullying” her. In other conversations, she accused him of “screaming” at her. Audiotapes of the conversation show he never raised his voice.

Budnick and Tribune editors worried about a pattern. In earlier conversations, Hagerty had accused a well-known Portland lawyer of mocking and bullying her and had said the polygrapher hired to administer the test to her had “screamed and screamed and screamed at me.”

In November, at a time when we hoped to be in the final stages of reporting the story, she began to again claim the Tribune had made commitments on the story’s content — commitments that the newspaper had explicitly avoided. All of this made us question her perceptions and her memory.

<snip>

She ended her 13-page statement by saying she had decided to come forward not to try to gain money — “I decided that I was not interested in making any money from this case. I did not want to be labeled a gold-digger like women in this situation are often labeled.” She wanted to come forward, she said, because she believed Gore likely had assaulted other women in the past. “I want this behavior stopped,” she said, “and I want people to know who he really is and what he’s done.”

<snip>

In its first story, published in its July 5 edition, the Enquirer wrote that a Portland lawyer retained by Hagerty had told the newspaper she was seeking “$1 million” for exclusive rights to her story. The Enquirer denied paying Hagerty anything for the first story. After the second story was published in its July 12 edition — with Hagerty’s name, her photo (holding her black pants, inside a zip-locked bag) and more details — the Enquirer again denied paying for the first story but pointedly did not deny paying for the second story.

[No Elephants]

42. Not 100% reliable, but correct much more often than not. And not the only evidence

in this case, either.

[Bitwit1234]

13. Will the National Enquirer report on this

they ran a spread on Sex crazy Gore on this goody nut's say so. How do you contact them, I'd like to ask them that question. Looks like they wasted a lot of money. Good....

[iamjoy]

14. Lie Detectors Are Not Reliable

that being said, I was never convinced of her accusations, although I found it plausible. After John Edwards, I find it hard to have confidence in any public figure's fidelity anymore. I knew Al and Tipper were getting divorced, so it didn't seem too outrageous that if the two had been growing apart...

On the other hand, the question that comes up in these cases is "why now?" What changed that made this woman bring forth such accusations now. I realize there is sometimes legitimate reason for waiting and that true victims should not be made to feel intimidated, but after watching the Republicans drag out Clinton's skeletons (some of the same critters who had vilified Anita Hill)...

Well, this changes little. People who want to think the worst of Al Gore will continue to do so and say that the lie detector is bull. People who want to think the best of Al Gore already did before the results of this test. Skeptics and cynics will continue to be...skeptical and cynical.

It is unfair that when a person is accused of a crime (or civil indiscretion), they are tried in the media and court of public opinion where it often seems one is guilty until proven innocent. If our justice system later drops the charges or the person is acquitted, that barely gets a mention.

But then, we all do that, don't we?

[MajorChode]

21. You could just as easily use a psychic in lieu of a polygraph

The reliability would be about the same. It's much more telling that a newspaper and the police rejected her claims.

[No Elephants]

43. Disagree.

[tabasco]

51. Nope. That's a lie.

Why are you a liar?

[MajorChode]

63. I'm simply overwhelmed by your powerful arguments

Not.

I'll offer a bit of advice. Simply calling someone a liar without even trying to offer any reason whatsoever is nothing more than internet jackassery. I could just as easily call you an asshole and my argument would be considerably stronger than yours, but I won't.

Cheers!

[texastoast]

28. No, we don't all do that

If we are fair and balanced.

[iamjoy]

35. OK, Not All

But probably most.

I mean, how many people were so sure OJ was guilty? Michael Jackson? Uh-huh. Of course, that could just be racism.

How many DUers were convinced Larry Craig, Mark Foley and Mark Sanford were hypocrites, perverts or creeps the day the scandal broke? How many DUers are still convinced something fishy happened in then-Congressman Joe Scarborough's office? Of course, maybe it's just frustration because that scandal didn't get nearly the same press as Gary Condit's. For that matter, how many DUers think Condit is an ass?

We like to think we are fair and balanced, but few of us really are.

[No Elephants]

44. I was sure OJ was guilty. Nothing after the trial has suggested otherwise, either.

Larry Craig pled guilty. Foley was after young interns. that is indisputabe. So is Sanford's hypocrisy. So is Condit's innocence--of murder.

Not sure about Jackson or Scarborough, but most of your examples don't really help your argument.

[iamjoy]

62. That Wasn't My Point

The moment the scandals hit, many DUers took a certain schadenfraude in the pending downfalls of Craig and Foley. that was before any pleas, etc. In Foley's case, he resigned and I don't even think criminal charges were filed.

Jackson was actually acquitted, but many people still believe he was guilty. I don't think Scarborough was ever even charged, but there are people convinced he did something wrong. Moderates and Conservatives remain unconvinced of Condit's innocence, and the scandal was enough to cost him re-election.

So, my point is that many people make assumptions about guilt or innocence that fits their preconceived notions of the accused. Those assumptions often have little to do with facts or evidence. These are all cases in my point. Unless you wish to deny that any DUers were calling Craig a hypocrite before any court conviction...

[No Elephants]

47. Polygraphs are probably a lot more reliable than untested allegations

against the rich and famous. We aren't in court here.

[onehandle]

17. Too late. You can't un-smear. nt

[catzies]

20. Accusation always get the headline, the retraction always gets buried n/t

[No Elephants]

45. An LBN thread the other day indicated that corrections only convince some more strongly

that the original story was correct. Go figure.

[Arkana]

22. Shock. Awe. Amazement.

Why would Al Gore proposition a massage therapist when he's already ridden the mighty Moonworm AND founded the Vice Presidential Action Rangers?

[Permanut]

23. The Oregonian, the daily rag here

Put the Gore "story" in huge headlines twice (Oregonian has always been right wing; endorsed W in 2000, etc.). Meanwhile, John Minnis, former head of Oregon Department of Public Safety Standards and Training, and husband of former State house speaker and noted Oregon right wing wacko Karen Minnis, lost a sexual harassment case and was assessed a fine (reference Willamette Week, July 2, 2010, reported by Nigel Jaquiss), and this story rated only a small font sidebar in the Oregonian. Oh, and apparently the state is going to pay for a big chunk of the $450,000 fine; how's that going down with the personal responsibility people?

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MrScorpio]

26. My, my, my... They don't say?

[Kingofalldems]

27. Original story was trumpeted right here on DU

Let's see, who was all over this fake story? -------> :shrug:

[No Elephants]

46. Some urged caution and many said "who cares, anyway?"

[slackmaster]

29. I have no confidence in "lie detector" tests

They're way too easy to fool, and even a well-trained, experienced operator can produce anomalous results.

There's a reason polygraph tests aren't admissible in criminal cases in most places.

Unrec for useless gossip topic.

:nuke:

[No Elephants]

48. Please see Reply ##s 47, 16 and 30.

[Wednesdays]

57. Unreccing the retraction...how nice

Were they around en masse to unrecc the original story on here? :mad:

[Emeritus]

31. Just as "Climategate" was debunked, the smears against Gore will be debunked to

In fact, the fact that this lady failed this lie detector test is the beginning of the end of the smear.

[Archae]

32. Polygraphs are NOT "lie detectors."

They are nervousness detectors, nothing more.

The woman could be lying.
But this test is no evidence that she is.

http://www.skepdic.com/polygrap.html

[Redbear]

33. Seems like the bigger story is the accuser's history of apparently false accusations.

http://portlandtribune.com/news/story_2nd.php?story_id=127913967087475000

[No Elephants]

49. Please see Reply ##'s 42, 16 and 30. She's the accuser. Burden is on her, not Gore.

No one has any obligation to prove her "untruthful." She has the obligation to prove Gore did something wrong to her. So far, she's batting zero.

Amazing how many "polygraphs are not {100%} reliable" posts are on this thread, compared with how few "allegations are not 100% reliable" posts there were on the thread a few weeks ago that broke the original story.

[tanyev]

34. Quelle surprise.

She called him a "crazed sex poodle" and tried to distract him, pointing out a box of Moonstruck chocolates on a nearby table. He went for the chocolates and then offered her some, cornering her, fondling her and shoving his tongue in her mouth to french kiss as he pressed against her.

She said he tried to pull her camisole strap down.

She said she told him to stop it. "I was distressed, shocked and terrified."

She said she was intimidated by his physical size, calling him "rotund," described his "violent temper, dictatorial, commanding attitude" -- what she termed a contrast from his "Mr. Smiley global-warming concern persona."

Later, she said, he tried to lure her into the bedroom to hear pop star Pink's "Dear Mr. President" on his iPod dock. She said Gore sat on one end of the bed and motioned for her to join him.

Suddenly, she said, he "flipped me on my back, threw his whole body face down over a top me, pinning me down."



I'm guessing she's a big fan of trashy novels.

[XemaSab]

39. Honestly, here?

"Oh, yeah, the guy cornered me and I was all freaked out and then 45 minutes later he tried to pull down my camisole strap and I was freaking terrified and then about 2 hours after that he told me to sit on the bed next to him and I totally did and he jumped my bones."

I don't think Al Gore did a single thing wrong here, but if a guy makes a pass at you that freaks you out... you LEAVE his hotel room. Hanging out for another few hours is just playing hard to get. :P

[alarimer]

37. So what. Lie Detectors are unscientific bullshit.

This proves nothing one way or another. Lie detectors are meaningless, unscientific woo and there is a very good reason why they are not admissible in court. Now, I do think her story is bullshit but not because of this.

[DirkGently]

41. Doesn't mean Gore isn't a "crazed sex poodle" though.

Arf.

:rofl:

[No Elephants]

50. May as well say it doesn't mean you're not a cannibalistic serial killer.

There are millions of things the results of this polygraph DON'T mean.

You know what though? So far, her allegations mean even less.

[DirkGently]

56. I'm intuiting that Al is a "crazed sex poodle." Just fits. 8)

Doesn't it?

[grahamhgreen]

52. She is 54 years old. nt

[Doctor_J]

54. I am surprised how many in this thread believe it more likely

that the polygraph failed than the accuser is a liar. What's up with that?

[Wednesdays]

58. They don't like Al Gore?

:shrug:

Just a hunch.

[AzNick]

55. Is Nancy Grace taking the day off?

Like she did when Mangum admitted to lying?

[EnemyCombatant]

59. The thing that tipped me off

was when I found out that she had accused her ex-boyfriend of abuse which was thrown out by a judge when she requested a restraining order.

I figured that only a person with some sort of mental problems would make up such an elaborate allegation.

Then it turns out that she accused the polygraph examiner and reporter of screaming at her also. So there is evidence of some sort of mental disturbance.

This aside from the fact that she stayed around for 3 hours, inconsistencies in her story, and the romance novel aspects ('come hiterto look' and karaoke) you have to wonder about her credibility. Even while leaving the hotel she took the time to write a bill that could have waited till later.

If she really was assaulted and truely wanted justice, the last place she would go to is the Enquirer. The police and reporters tried to follow up with her many times but to no avail.

Her motivations have to be in question also.

[louis-t]

60. Look for any repug who has contacted her and offered her money.

See also: Paula Jones, Kathleen Willey.

[gateley]

61. Oops. nt

[JI7]

64. even without this lie detector test there were problems with her story