Proposed Miss. License Plate To Honor KKK Leader

[IDemo]

Source: NPR

JACKSON, Miss. February 10, 2011, 05:38 am ET

A fight is brewing in Mississippi over a proposal to issue specialty license plates honoring Confederate Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest, who was an early leader of the Ku Klux Klan.

The Mississippi Division of Sons of Confederate Veterans says it wants to sponsor a series of state-issued license plates to mark the 150th anniversary of what it calls the "War Between the States." The group proposes a different design each year between now and 2015, with Forrest slated for 2014.

"Seriously?" state NAACP president Derrick Johnson said when he was told about the Forrest plate. "Wow."

Forrest, a Tennessee native, is revered by some as a military genius and reviled by others for leading the 1864 massacre of black Union troops at Fort Pillow, Tenn. Forrest was a Klan grand wizard in Tennessee after the war.

Read more: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=133645270

[Le Taz Hot]

1. Please, Mississippians, tell me there's more to this story.

Isn't there a thread on DU asking how we win over the South? How indeed?

[Hubert Flottz]

2. Before the war he and his brother bought and sold slaves.

Here's one of his handbills:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Bedford_Forrest

[Ex Lurker]

9. nevermind

edited because there's just no way this will turn out well.

[happyslug]

19. That is a fluff piece

"Innovative" Commander who used mobile tactics???? Forest was the classic Guerrilla, did not hold any ground, supported the regular troops when called to do so, sought protection behind such regular troops when he needed to regroup etc. That is any Guerrilla fighting group.

Forrest returned to Tennessee after the war broke out, enlisted as a private in the Confederate States Army (CSA) and trained at Fort Wright in Randolph, Tennessee.<8> On July 14, 1861, he joined Captain J. S. White's Company "E", Tennessee Mounted Rifles. Upon seeing how badly equipped the CSA was, Forrest offered to buy horses and equipment for a regiment of Tennessee volunteer soldiers with his own money.

What a crock, this was STANDARD policy of the South and the North in the first year of the war, make yourself a Colonel by raising troops and arming those troops. Both the North and the South adopted the draft when there were no one else left who wanted to be a Colonel who was NOT already one (and the Northern Draft's emphasis on permitting people to pay for substitutes was an effort to get people to pay the bonus the would be Colonels did in the first year of the War).

The writer mentioned Forest used of African Americans in his unit, but fails to point out HOW he was able to convince most of them to join and stay with his unit. Forrest when he formed up his regiment went to his slaves who were his teamsters and made them an offer, if they joined up with him and stayed with him, at the end of the war, they AND their families would go free. Forest knew what the African American Slaves wanted, and it was Freedom first and last. This is shown by an incident when a Southern Politician was giving a Speech in Forrest's presence on how the Civil War was being fought for everything except Slavery, and Forest responded (Para phased) "If we NOT fighting for Slavery, why are we fighting?". Forest knew WHY he was fighting, and that was to maintain Slavery. Forest also knew HOW to get the Southern African Americans to Fight, to offer them Freedom.

The writer even down play Fort Pillow, giving the Southern Explanation for it but mentioning the Northern Opinion on it. All the while ignoring the real two causes of that massacre. First was the bad position of Ft Pillow. Fort Pillow had been built by Confederate Forces to overlook the Mississippi River. To do so it was low laying compared to the surrounding area. This was fine if you controlled that surrounding area (as the Confederates did when the Fort was Built), but it made the fort an easy target once the enemy controlled that same area. In simple terms Ft Pillow was like Yorktown (and the Alamo) you need more men to hold it then to take it. Once the North took Fort Pillow and manned it with freed barely trained African Americans (and even then undermanned it) Fort Pillow was a disaster waiting to happen. Forest in that sense was the disaster, he attacked Fort Pillow with enough men to take it.

The Second problem with Fort Pillow Massacre is the Nature of the Southern Soldier at that time. Southern Whites had been taught from little on that the biggest thing to fear was a Slave revolt and that they had to do anything to prevent such a revolt and suppress such a revolt, including even murdering an African American every so often (and that was PRE-Civil War days). At Fort Pillow these same Southerns were facing their worse nightmare, Armed African Americans organized to fight as a unit. Southern Troops were known to kill captured African Americans while leaving white Union Prisoners alive. This was while know by 1861, by the time of the Fort Pillow Massacre is was to well known and it is clear even Forest knew if any fighting occurred his troops would kill every African American they came across. Forest did nothing to prevent the Massacre, and did nothing to stop it once it started. Under the Laws of War then and now that failure to even try to stop the Massacre is a War Crime.

[Hubert Flottz]

20. I saw all that crap...

I tried to post just the handbill thing as you scroll down on the right hand side, but it posted the main link.

[marmar]

3. Good grief.

Next, a proposal to have Mississippi judges wear white robes with pointy hats to the courtroom.

[LuvNewcastle]

4. I know I shouldn't be surprised by this,

but I often wonder why so many Mississippians will not let that Civil War shit go. There were far more battles in Virginia than MS and I don't see them putting Robert E. Lee on their license plates. MS might as well put a flaming cross on our plates.

[wilt the stilt]

8. don't give Virginia any ideas

with Gov. wackadoo this might be something he picks up

[Recursion]

15. Do they still call MLK day "Lee/Jackson/King day"?

I always thought that was a kind of pointless "FU" to MLK...

[mikeytherat]

22. Yes. And the L/J portion of it is a State holiday.

The Confederate States of America: Silver Medal Winner in the U.S. Civil War

mikey_the_rat

[Recursion]

14. No, but US Route 1 is "Jefferson Davis Highway" through Alexandria

Sigh

[Ter]

23. Well, Virgina celebrates Robert E. Lee Day on MLK's birthday

They are no Saint state either.

[Yavin4]

25. Tribalism

Go to any other nation that has had ethnic, racial, and/or religious tribal wars, and they do the same exact thing.

[liberal N proud]

5. So now they want to advertise their bigotry

At least when you see a plate like that you will know up front what kind of asshole you will be dealing with.

[Recursion]

6. Dupe

This dupe stuff again...

[Recursion]

7. Battle of Fort Pillow

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Fort_Pillow

The garrison was massacred in cold blood by Forrest's men.

I'm not in principle against a license plate honoring Confederate soldiers (though I'm not eager to do it, either), but no way this guy should get it.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

10. From a purely military view

Forest was superbly capable, and he repeatedly outsmarted and outfought Union troops, often beating armies much larger than his.

Even Rommel studied his attacks and how he disrupted supply lines of his enemy, with speed and surprise.

As a human, well, every coin has two sides, and Forrest's darker side was very dark indeed. Murder, wanton destruction, and the deliberate slaughter of an opposition that tried to surrender to his troops - that is the character of the man the south wants to honor. Somehow, the current tea baggers seem to be the perfect fans for Forrest.

[Recursion]

16. Oh I don't know; he was in the west mostly

The fact that the west fell first probably says something. If I were going to commend a Confederate officer for military genius (other than Lee) it would have to be Jackson. The Confederate cavalry gets a lot of praise but notably failed to accomplish its primary goal: to give the commanding general a good appraisal of the enemy's location and disposition. As flashy as both Forrest and Stuart were, I have to ultimately judge both of them failures on that ground.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

24. Jackson & Lee clearly made the South viable

far longer than their supplies, arms, ammo, and troop numbers would have suggested. Lincoln often lamented that while he had all the forces (and assets) to win, the South had all the military leaders.

Ever spend time in the Lincoln Museum in Springfield, Illinois? One of the better "modern" museums, attached to a perfectly perfect library. (What a gem that library is!) Whatever else it does (which i think it does well), it really drives home the horror of "The War Between The States" with all its blood, gore, death and disease.

If you've not been there, I strongly recommend going. Do the tour, especially the first visit. I've been there several times, I have yet to leave with a dry eye.

[queenjane]

11. The Cult of the Ol' Confederacy, I fear, will never die

I see it passed down in my family, like political beliefs (Teabaggery) and religion (fundamentalist So Baptist). Most of the kids in my family (teens, early 20s) NEVER question these beliefs. They absorb and spew them, are proud of them, teach them to their own children.

I'm afraid it's terribly naive to think that, once the old codgers die off, this country will finally be progressive and intelligent.

[Hoyt]

12. Most who would get one -- and there are many -- have a confederate flag somewhere on vehicle.

Wonder if ole Haley Barbour will get one in preparation for a presidential run. It will attract certain votes.

[Recursion]

18. Negative. They have a 1920's mashup of the CSA navy jack and Lee's battle colors

The "confederate flag" that appears everywhere has essentially no historical accuracy, and the flags it was based on were never flown over the state of Mississippi. And yet it appears in the canton of the Mississippi flag. Go figure.

[nalnn]

13. Oh boy.

This makes about as much sense as putting Neville Chaimberlain on a Mississippi tag. Forrest wasn't even from MS, he was from TN!

As far as who will get them? Yeah quite a few to those with rebel flags in public places and alot of rich white guys.

[Recursion]

17. He ran a business in Hernando, apparently

Though even back then Baja Memphis wasn't "really" part of the state...

[KamaAina]

21. "An early leader" of the KKK? He was its first Grand Wizard!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Bedford_Forrest

Nathan Bedford Forrest (July 13, 1821 – October 29, 1877) was a lieutenant general in the Confederate Army during the American Civil War. He is remembered both as a self-educated, innovative cavalry leader during the war and as a leading southern advocate in the postwar years. He served as the first Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan, a secret vigilante organization which launched a reign of terrorism against blacks and Republicans during Reconstruction in the South.

(Yes, Republicans were the good guys then. :shrug: )

Anyone stupid enough to display such a plate deserves to have his pickup KKKeyed!! :P