For many Iraqis, abuse settles opinion of U.S.

[NNN0LHI]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/chitribts/20040508/ts_chicagotrib/formanyiraqisabusesettlesopinionofus&cid=2027&ncid=1480

The crowd outside the prison walls seethes, demanding to visit the thousands inside.


Sunni and Shiite Muslims, engineers and farmers, mothers, uncles and militants are gathered on this scorching Friday. Each frantically waves the name and prisoner number of a brother, a father or a son, scribbled on a shred of paper, a scrap of a cigarette box, or typed on a crumpled bit of stationery.


"They will only let 30 people inside today," the Iraqi official from Abu Ghraib prison shouts as the angry cluster of roughly 100 visitors erupts in jeers. "Whoever is here without an appointment must come back next week."


More than a week into the fallout of abuse disclosures at Abu Ghraib prison, Iraqi outrage has swelled far beyond just photos of cruelty and torture and has seized on a much broader target: the entire U.S. system of raids, captures and detention. The human toll from a year of mounting confinements has emerged as an essential factor darkening Iraqi perceptions of the occupation and the United States.


Abu Ghraib, in short, has become the symbol of a deep sense of humiliation and frustration that crosses sectarian and class lines--a feeling that many argue is fueling the very insurgency the prisons are intended to contain.

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[MichaelUK]

1. Well, at least it got them united

to a common cause.

(shakes head)...pull em out boys, pull em out.

[saigon68]

2. NO THE BUSH KILLING MACHINE NEEDS TO KICK ASS

Honor to him means he can't wimp out like his daddy did. The man is a Twisted Fuck.

Plus the NeoCon Corporations are in the process of making a profit killing beyond anyones wildest dreams.

[2cents]

3. "...abuse settles opinion of U.S." ??

These folks are a hard sell - one would think "shock and awe" would have settled it.

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[saigon68]

6. ADIOS

)))))))))PING((((((((((((((

your words --"I hope they understand this major upgrade to their freedom."

My words----

When the POW had a PLASTIC FLASHLIGHT RAMMED UP HIS RECTUM ???

When a GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG BITES HIM IN THE TESTICLES ???

When the POW had a 220 Volt wire attached to the TIP OF HIS PENIS ???

When Lynndie England was encouraged to help the POWs obtain erections so they could perform
ORAL SEX ACTS ON EACH OTHER and the PERKY PRINCESS OF ABU GHRAIB
PRISON COULD SHOUT "HE'S GETTING HARD"???

When Lynndie England the PERKY PRINCESS OF ABU GHRAIB DRAGGED a naked POW
around with a Dog Leash

When SPC Sabrina Harman, 372nd MP Company, stated in her sworn statement regarding the
incident where a detainee was placed on a box with electric wires attached to his fingers, toes, and
penis, ““““that her job was to keep detainees awake.”””” It is interesting to speculate that SASSY
SABRINA UNDOUBTEDLY ACCOMPLISHED HER MISSION BY TURNING ON THE
JUICE..

When POW’’S were FORCED to wear Dirty Women’’s Underwear on their Heads

When a POW was beaten to death, HIS BODY PACKED IN ICE and TAKEN OUT IN THE
DESERT AND DUMPED ???

When a Civilian Interrogator ANALLY RAPED A 16 YEAR OLD BOY IN FRONT OF GI
WITNESSES and is going to get a free pass because he was under NO ONES JURISDICTION ???

[leftchick]

7. Ahhh, the aWol* chimp's famous "saddam's rape rooms" (with a smirk)!

Have now become the aWol* chimp's fucking rape and torture rooms. Aren't you just so fucking proud to be an amuriKan? I know I am... :eyes:

[Stockholm]

8. Oh my.... "understand this major upgrade to their freedom"

I am sure the Iraqis are absolutely thrilled over their upgrade of freedom - you should go to Baghdad and let the Iraqi people thank you in person.

[saigon68]

10. Welome to DU Stockholm

As a visitor to Malmo I appreciate the dry humor that exists in your country-- a bit of which I still have when I see my cousins there :-)

[Magleetis]

12. You forgot

the <sarcasm off> switch.

[snippy]

13. After all, it was only some republican torture pranks going on in the

Bush rape rooms and torture chambers.

FIRE THE LIAR

[Minstrel Boy]

15. headlines: "worse than Saddam"

"US abuse worse than Saddam, say inmates"

"The savagery the Americans have practised against the Iraqis, well, now we have seen it, touched it and felt it," he said. "These types of actions will grow more hostile forces against the coalition, and this is the reason for the resistance."
www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/05/03/1083436542947.html

"US worse than Saddam, Arabs say"

"The liberators are worse than the dictators.

"They have not just lost the hearts and minds of Iraqis but all the Third World and the Arab countries," he said.
http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/05/01/1083224628877.html

[Bonhomme Richard]

5. We've created our own Bastille and the result...............

is going to be the same. This nation has dug a hole that will take decades to get out of and I lay the blame directly at the feet of the republicans.
The democratic leadership should share some culpability for not having a spine you couldn't pass your hand through.

[54anickel]

9. I don't think it settles only Iraqis opinion. n/t

[ze_dscherman]

11. When will this crowd start to demand access?

What will happen when many many more protesters start to flock to the prison? What will happen if they REALLY demand access?

What will happen if one of the religious/political leaders in Baghdad picks up the opportunity of the next friday prayer and gets the masses marching towards Abu Ghraib?

Will the prison guards be able to hold them back? Will the U.S. use force against them, while the whole world is watching?

[teryang]

14. Sleep deprivation, nakedness,

...stress positions, beatings, interference with bodily functions, humiliation, cold, deprivation of food and water and other forms of low-impact bodily torture aren't as bad as rape, electrocution, and murder, but they are just as certainly Geneva Convention violations. They have been used with restraint in training by American Armed Forces for decades to prepare various combatants for possible capture by Geneva Convention violators. Now we are using them offensively. This is because there is the mistaken notion that they are legal.

These techniques have been perfected in a way to avoid public exposure of the Conventions violator. These illegal techniques will be retained by Miller. This administration and the intel types deliberately confuse lack of bruises, breaks, and lacerations with lack of injury and legality and will allow such practices to continue. They are dead wrong.

[saigon68]

16. yes teryang these are War Crimes

And the pervasive institutionalized use of these methods puts the whole chain of command in the dock at the Hague. Problem is unless there is a major civil war or catastrophe no one above E-5 will be punished,

[alfredo]

18. The higher ups get reprimends. It ends their military career, but

I am sure there are plenty 'contractors' who will hire them.

[saigon68]

19. Good observation alfredo

Yes the "MILITARY CONTRACTORS" are hiring. Especially if you can beat the crap out of someone with no remorse.

[alfredo]

24. I had a chance to go with a 'contractor' in Saudi Arabia back in

the late 60's but turned it down. Too sleazy. It would have been industrial espionage for a US oil company. The guys doing the hiring were slime.

You don't have to be an officer to get offers from the mercenaries.

[reprobate]

17. I just read Thomas Friedman, ususally an apopogist for bush

"We are in danger of losing something much more important than just the war in iraq. We are in danger of losing America as an instrument of moral authority and inspiration in the world. I have never known a time in my life when america and its president were more hated around the world than today....It's no wonder that so many americans were obsessed with the finale of the sitcom Friend right now. They're the only friends we have and even they're leaving."

More and more, people in the news are coming out and saying that this fiasco of a war is lost and the only alternative is to get out. And many of these are repugs or their supporters. Kind of gives you a warm feeling, huh?

Some of us have been saying for a couple of years that this maladministration will destroy itself by its own arrogence. We were right.

[saigon68]

20. Hopefully it will happen soon

[teryang]

21. Tom Friedman literally screaming to Arab world after 911:

"We hate you tooo!"

[Minstrel Boy]

22. "We are in danger of losing America

as an instrument of moral authority and inspiration in the world"

:crazy: :crazy: DANGER! DANGER! :crazy: :crazy:



:crazy: :crazy: DANGER! DANGER! :crazy: :crazy:

[0007]

23. Too late for apologies

"But to many Iraqis, the apologies and declarations are too late to bridge a widening gap in the U.S.-Iraqi relationship. Despite U.S. officials' insistence that abusive practices are not widespread, many on the streets of Baghdad see the photos of men being forced into humiliating sexual positions as another illustration of the U.S. attitude toward Iraq."

I hope criminal charges are being prepared!!