The Strange Unexplored overlap between Homosexuality & Fascism

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

....from a UK blog:

http://www.johannhari.com/archive/article.php?id=407

"he twisted truth is that gay men have been at the heart of every major fascist movement that ever was – including the gay-gassing, homo-cidal Third Reich. With the exception of Jean-Marie Le Pen, all the most high-profile fascists in Europe in the past thirty years have been gay. It’s time to admit something. Fascism isn’t something that happens out there, a nasty habit acquired by the straight boys. It is - in part, at least - a gay thing, and it’s time for non-fascist gay people to wake up and face the marching music."

yeah, I know...just go ahead and read the article. The guy has a point.

[donco6]

1. Great, now we're all pedophiles AND fascists!

Thanks for making my day.

[arcos]

3. Read the article, that's not what the author is saying... n/t

[donco6]

4. I did, and here's what I read:

"The twisted truth is that gay men have been at the heart of every major fascist movement that ever was – including the gay-gassing, homocidal Third Reich."

So tell me how I'm interpreting that incorrectly?

Or how about this one:

"It’s time to admit something. Fascism isn’t something that happens out there, a nasty habit acquired by the straight boys. It is - in part, at least - a gay thing, . . . "

Or this:

"Gay pornographer and film-maker Bruce LaBruce has one explanation. He claims that “all gay porn today is implictly fascist. Fascism is in our bones, because it’s all about glorifying white male supremacy and fetishizing domination, cruelty, power and monstrous authority figures.”

Pfft. I stress the use of the words "all" and "every", and stand by my original post.

[Name removed]

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[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

6. expected...

DU can be, at times, the home of the knee-jerk PC comment.

I notice no-one has picked up that the author is gay and writes for a UK gay publication.

[cprise]

2. How many women fanned the flames of the Inquisition and the Witch Trials?

It's nice that the author is concerned, but there is an overlap between gays and almost everything. We come from all walks of life.

He could just as easily link Jews with Hitler.

[fedsron2us]

5. So what

Rohm was gay

Goebbels was straight.

Hitler was a vegetarian.

Goering supported animal rights.

Himmler believed in New Age religion.

They were still all Nazis

[donco6]

9. So here's his point:

"Yet we can’t allow these madmen <referring to authors such as Scott Lively> to prevent a period of serious self-reflection from the gay movement. If Bruce LaBruce is right, many of the mainstream elements of gay culture – body worship, the lauding of the strong, a fetish for authority figures and cruelty – provide a swamp in which the fascist virus can thrive. It’s time all gay people realised that fascists will not bring on a Fabulous Solution for gay people. They will bring a Final Solution for us all."

And that's agreeable, sure. But I think the guy needs to get out more. I'm not into body worship; never have been. I've always preferred the lived-in look to the buffed and waxed crowd. And the authority figure fetish? Bleh. Not part of my world. Hence my objection to the "all"s and "every"s.

I guess my main gripe about it is that it's obviously trying to appeal to the 22-year old audience (the age group that made up Hitler's original brownshirts), and it tars everyone who's well out of that superficial mindset. I just don't appreciate it, that's all.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

11. I find the whole thing ironic

,,,,considering how the gays usually are the targets of the fascist or thuggish elment on the right.

I do agree that he "needs to get out more". One of the problems with gay writing is that is sort of ghettoized. And he's using Bruce La Bruce alot, whos always been sort of this contrarian/provocateur.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

14. Scott Lively??!!

He and Lon Mabon were the masterminds of Oregon's anti-gay initiatives.

The sardonic John Callahan did a cartoon during one of those campaigns in which he subtly implied that Lively and Mabon had a sexual relationship going. Most of the gay and lesbian people I knew were convinced that Mabon, at least, was closeted gay.

Anyway, both Mabon and Lively are ignorant and bigoted fundamentalists, not historians.

[donco6]

15. I knew I recognized that name from somewhere.

In fairness, the writer wasn't quoting him positively (he did call him a "madman" after all.)

Mabon definitely sets off my "gaydar". Much to my dismay (oh my eyes, my eyes!)

[librechik]

10. I'm thinking it's a small segment of gays that overlap with fascisti

HSSMs--and not that all HSSMs are fascist, of course, just that the authority stuff, and the cruelty of fascism come more naturally perhaps to those types than gays in general.

Also explains that S&M Hetero types are also found among the fascist army.

jumping off before your flames get on me, Waverly--you are either a brave or a foolish fellow to start this thread!

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

12. hmm...HSSMs?..then theres the uniform fetishists.

HSSM....new acronym.

Then there is that "uniform" subculture, where folks dress up in military or police uniforms. Im not sure whether this is "fetish", or "drag".

Personally, I do like uniforms too, but its more an esthetic thing than a sexual thing.... And yes, the Nazis (and Germans, historically) had some great uniforms.

[sofa king]

13. Wait a minute, I thought Ernst Rohm was set up.

The historians quoted in that article seem to be a lot more certain about Rohm's sexual preferences than the ones I've read. Several suggest that Rohm was framed as a homosexual by Hitler and Goebbels exactly because the primarily homophobic Nazi party would accept Rohm's execution on grounds of homosexuality alone.

Anyway, who cares? Gay people can be assholes, too. Surprise!

[JSJ]

16. what does this say about 'the troops'?

Don't ask- don't tell.