Christians..

[undergroundpanther]

http://www.publiceye.org/magazine/v14n1/ReproPatriarch-12.html#P142_66372

The right advocates policies that discourage childbearing by depriving low-income women of the means to support a child. In the 1990s, using stereotypes such as the "welfare queen," the right successfully promoted the 1996 Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Reconciliation Act, the "welfare reform" bill. As part of that policy initiative, the right has sought to discourage women on welfare from becoming pregnant by punishing them when they bear children. This form of punishment known euphemistically as a "family cap," which is increasingly popular with state legislatures, denies any increase in payments to women who become pregnant or give birth to a child while on welfare. Another right-wing policy that discourages or prevents childbearing by low-income women mandates or encourages women to use Norplant, Depo-Provera, or the newest form of contraception, contraceptive vaccines such as quinacrine.

[aden_nak]

1. The premise.

So the premise, if I understand it correctly, is to punish the child for being born to a poor family? Yep, that's as American as baseball and apple pie, I say!

[undergroundpanther]

2. Here's another thing

Poverty has to exist if there are going to be obscenely rich people ya know.WE dare not cap a rich man's income influence or power even if he robs the poor to get more.Oh how America fears biting the hand that holds him in chains of debts that are for the most part a scam he believes is real.And America is all about getting rich by hook or crook,It's only the ones who think they'll make it if they work hard innovate and think positive that will get screwed by the wealthy every time and kept poor..


Where decent people fail to see how fundies get away with what they do.
They take it without context.

http://eserver.org/bs/30/bertsch-schalit.html

[hughee99]

3. A little confused...

"the right has sought to discourage women on welfare from becoming pregnant by punishing them when they bear children. This form of punishment known euphemistically as a "family cap," which is increasingly popular with state legislatures, denies any increase in payments to women who become pregnant or give birth to a child while on welfare."

So a family who can not afford the responsibilies they have should not be discouraged from taking on more responsibility?

I believe that the problem built into the welfare system is that the standard of care is set down without requiring any partnership from the side of the recipiant. Let's say a student has their parents pay for college. Is it not right that the parents have at least some say in the students progress? Not "take this class or take that class" but at least "you should go to class". For some students, just as some on welfare, this is an unspoken contract. The person, or student, wants to improve their situation, and the partnership works well. For others, controls must be put in place to prevent abuse. The big difference between the two analogies is that the parents who are actually paying the bill have the option (basically at any time) to stop the funding. In the case of welfare, those footing the bill have no real say in the funds dispersal. This causes some frustration to build up and feeds into the "welfare queen" stereotype. It only takes a few people abusing the system to severely damage what is conceptually a good idea.

[Az]

4. That would be that much heralded compassionate conservativism

Lets see if we got this right.

Take away welfare so those few that abuse the system are put in their place. Those that are in genuine need will of course lift themself up by their bootstraps. Oh and in case they decide that making another child is perhaps a bad choice at this venture make sure you cut off their access to birth control and more importantly abortion. Keep em barefoot and pregnant. That'll keepem outa trouble.

I think I am going to be sick. :puke:

[hughee99]

9. Didn't the original post say just the opposite

about birth control, though? "Another right-wing policy that discourages or prevents childbearing by low-income women mandates or encourages women to use Norplant, Depo-Provera, or the newest form of contraception, contraceptive vaccines such as quinacrine." I don't know if this is true of not, but it doesn't sound like the fundie's I know.

[truizm]

5. Remember...there is a Christian left

despite never being mentioned in the corporate press. I know you distinguished between the left and the right in your post, but when individuals on the left do say something such as 'Christians are oppressing the poor' then reactionary Christians, never looking in the mirror, claim the left is anti-Christian, when it clearly is not.

[Az]

6. Big Tent with many entrances

All are welcome that embrace tolerance and freedom. Thats our criteria. Christian, Jew, Muslem, Atheist, Hindu, Taoist, Buddhist, Pagan, Agnostic, Unitarian Universalist, it simply does not matter. The only thing that matters is that you not require others to be the same as you.

[truizm]

7. Exactly.

[mzmolly]

8. Why the title "Christians" Many right wingers are not Christian and many

Christians do not subscribe to these attitudes.

This is a bigoted post. It's like posting an article about terrorism entitled "Muslims".

Please change the title to reflect a more accurate portrayal of the subject matter.

[Must_B_Free]

10. Just a way to sterilize "unproductive" members of society

Look at the goals of MK Ultra from some documents uncovered in the 1977 congressional investigation - among other things, they were also looking for mind control techniques to make populations "lazy and unproductive". Ask yourself why would they want to seek this?

One has to wonder if AIDS was another smallpox blanket to give to their enemies - people of color and gays.

One also has to wonder about the ancillary goals of the CIA fostering the crack epidemic in black communities.

One also has to wonder about the more recent image of black people being marketed to them.

In my day and age (1970s) there was a spirit of progress that has now disappeared to be replaced by a new separatism. Granted - why should black culture be forced to be like "master", but on the other hand, bling bling, pimps and hos and such stuff is a far cry from the uplifting, uniting spirit of Motown Records, Marvin Gaye and Tammi Terrel, which leaves me asking WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED?

I personally don't recall in my youth the ghetto drawl that people speak now a days and that Cosby is pissed about.