is there really anything we can do

[gpandas]

about outsourcing? can our economy withstand no more outsourcing? ideas, please.

[Deja Q]

1. If the status quo isn't put on reins by the government, we have 4 options

1. Find a field that pays a lot that can't be outsourced. (and manage to get the degree and empirical experience before we lose our jobs, possessions, and livlihoods in the career we ended up in.)

2. Rebel against the corporate TRAITORS who want things both ways. Yes, they are traitors to this country (and to the world) and I would shout it from the highest mountaintop. So should we all.

3. Commit suicide and save ourselves the agony of #4:

4. Become homeless and rot away slowly, with a vain sense of hope that things will get better.


Outsourcing will eventually cause our economy to crash. As 2/3rds our GDP comes from consumers buying stuff (the middle class, you corporate dummies), combined with repukes shifting the tax burden from the wealthy to the middle and lower classes, and then getting rid of the middle class, they will eventually put themselves in the same fire they're chucking us into.

[gpandas]

2. how would reins of government work? n/t

[Deja Q]

4. Monetary incentives, for starters... (long)

Reform the tax system...

Eliminate corporate welfare. Entirely. Only the big wealthy companies get such money and they as hell don't need it.

Encourage corporations to hire people for reasonable wages via tax incentives and benefits or punishments.

Put taxes on imported goods and services.

REGULATE THE SYSTEM.

Reagan deregulated the system. Bush I did nothing to change things around. Rush Limbaugh came on saying how many more millionaires were created thanks to Reagan/Bush. (not saying how many more poor had been created in the process...) Clinton did little, it was the IT industry that built people up from the rubbish Reagan and Bush I made. And Al Gore did not invent the Internet. :eyes:

And we all know how Bush II has been behaving, he's as much a traitor as the rest of them, I will never forgive him for denouncing America's workrs. Ditto for Carly Fiorina or other execs who spit in our faces and then expect us to buy their products that break down after a year.

Globalization isn't about advancing the world either. It's about helping the corporate execs make a bigger profit for themselves. Have you seen the price of ANY outsourced good go down by even one penny? Nope. And don't forget, even Microsoft outsources these days. See Windows or Office drop in price? Nope.

And only the gas companies put up tv ads that call themselves "American companies". And that's a joke because they deal in a product, most of which comes from the other side of this planet! There's nothing "American" about it.

Personally, America is beyond the gutter thanks to the national debt, our new standing in the world, about 50 ways our economy could crash and burn (Saudi investments, a big attack, housing bubble, deflation, inflation, peak oil, shifting tax burdens on to economic classes that can't afford it while cutting their jobs/pay/benefits at the same time, the medical debacle industry, et cetera), and the animals in charge (corporate or political).

[gpandas]

9. would taxes be on all imported goods and services?eom

[nannah]

3. vote with our dollars

when ever possible buy locally or regionally made products. commit to buying less and paying more for goods and services produced in US.

Provide shopping options for people who want to vote with their dollars, ie. products bought and sold at outdoor bazaars; conscience based food coops expand concept to other heavily used products: office supplies, clothing, etc.

[Deja Q]

Reduce spending as much as possible.

I buy only clothes, food, computer, and DVD items.

I know I'm in bad trouble if I lose my job and that's likely to happen within 2 years, if not sooner - which is very likely.

Without a job, I can't even get the meds to treat my mental illness (ADD and anxiety, take a guess WHY for the anxiety...).

I am as good as dead.

So normally I'd spend away.

But this time, no. I am curtailing all my spending. It's all I can do. None of it will be useful to me when my time comes.

[gpandas]

10. do you feel all is lost for many more american workers?eom

on edit post is for unnumbered hypno toad reply

[gpandas]

6. a great idea if it worked...

but americans have consistently voted more imports with their dollars.

[Cats Against Frist]

18. Thank You

This is a huge thing that people can do to get our dollars back in the pockets of people who work and contribute to the United States. You can buy a lot of stuff secondhand, at cooperatives, farmers markets and seasonal festivals, if you plan ahead. In addition -- I know this sounds weird -- but if you need to buy something that is not made in the U.S., buy something OWNED by a foreign company (and better -- a foreign company with plants in the U.S., like Mitsubishi (which I've always heard burns down the rainforest, but you get my drift :)), not an outsourcing American one that does little to support our nation, and has moved jobs. They don't deserve our money.

Keep up on the list of oursourcing companies, which can be found here:

http://www.madeinamerica.us/

Learn how to make something. There are tons of things you can craft yourself: baskets, brooms, clothing, purses and other household items.

The main way to stop this is to keep your money -- and when you can't, pay small business, handicrafters, etc. There's almost always an alternative -- especially if people get over material hogging and buy fewer, made-in-America items.

I feel that someday we are going to have two, very scary classes -- the same corporations who built their fortunes off of our sweat and our dollars, are going to abandon us for the opening Eastern Markets, to get a foothold over Japan, and even Chinese and Indian companies. If they don't have to pay our taxes, and they don't have to pay our workers -- what are they giving back?

These are the entities that need to be told not to "let the door hit them on the way out."

Something similar to import-substitution industrialization will be the only answer to this, in the end -- YES the "bailout" technique for third world countries with no manufacturing and production, who are producing raw materials, but not durable goods.

You can start your own ISI program by buying locally, independently, and even developing and marketing a product of your own.

[gpandas]

19. buy american campaigns...

have never lasted beyond the flag-waving. maybe pogo was right, and the american people are their own enemy. greed rules.

[PragMantisT]

5. The tide is turning. Many outsourced jobs will be returning soon.

Why? Because management is here, and the jobs outsourced don't have adequate leadership. Also, many employees overseas lack a clear view of the big picture of American business and also lack the initiative that keeps American business viable. Cheap labor does not translate to a job well done. Companies are learning that now. Jobs are returning.

[gpandas]

7. so if "many" jobs do...

return, should we continue present policy of outsourcing?

[PragMantisT]

14. I don't expect anything will bring "all" those jobs back.

Changing the policy would bring more, but alas, like many industrial jobs, many outsourced jobs will never return to the U.S. One could tinker infinitely with the policy and there would still be disappointment. Let business learn for itself.

[gpandas]

15. learn what?

[PragMantisT]

21. That outsourcing many jobs is a mistake.

The first thing that needs to be learned is that outsourcing Treasury Department IT work is a mistake. No one in Bangalore needs the keys to the Federal Reserve, which is presently the case. This is the work Richard Clarke was investigating before his untimely departure from the NSA.

Business has to obey the bottom line. The government has no responsibility to it's stockholders concerning the bottom line.

Much like factory jobs left the states never to return, many IT jobs will never return. Both business and labor will have to adapt. Then the market will follow. Factory jobs left and a collapse has not ensued yet.

[gpandas]

23. collapse ensued for factory workers...

who now must do minimum wage burger flipping. so, are you saying that outsourcing should be curtailed only when national security is threatened?

[PragMantisT]

25. No, it's called an example.

Got any ideas? Or just criticism?

Are you saying companies should be forced to ignore all price structures? Are you saying that capitalism should be the slave to government regulation? Where will that end?

Do you wish to be regulated to the nth degree?

At this stage of the game, where corporations are afforded the stature of human beings, should they not be allowed to ensure their existence? That is the only responsibility of the corporation.

I await your RE-action. But would appreciate more than a byline and some knee jerk response with no new input. Your entries have not exhibited any alternatives, simply attacks upon other posts. Get in the game.

Are you up to it?

[gpandas]

26. re scathing post...

read my original post. i'm asking for ideas, because i don't see a solution to problems created by outsourcing. all but one of my replies are questions, asking responders to expand on their ideas. i also believe op should respond to all replies to their om. what attacks, what criticism, what knee jerk do you find in these questions? by all means point them out, or quote them to me. of course i offer no ideas because i'm asking for solutions to the problems created by outsourcing. read my original post. corporations exist to make a profit. by making this profit they have provided many, many americans the opportunity to live excellent lives. no profit, no corporation, no opportunities. nowhere did i suggest more corporate regulation as the answer to this problem. others have said more regulation or govt. intervention, and i asked them questions to give them a chance to explain these actions, the same as i did for you. maybe i was subconciously adapting socrates method of teaching. i do have one more question for you, why are you so angry?

[Deja Q]

8. The IT jobs coming back are of much lower pay and have higher requirements

A bachelor's degree is not uncommon to prep, install, move, or support a PC. The pay is also $12.00/hr. It is also stressful, despite the comparative simplicity to install software these days, there are still many details and nuances to follow. Especially when handling data is involved. A bachelor's degree for that?!

Programming jobs, databsae jobs, anything IT jobs, is much lower in pay these days. It's despicable.

And especially for the jobs where people are responsible for data (which is ALL OF THEM), they are getting a good deal by doing what they've done.

In 1974, TV shows stated that without a high school education, people were sunk. These days people need at least a 4 year degree and truckloads of experience. So why won't public school cover enough basics for a basic job? Minimum wage isn't even half of a LIVEABLE wage.

Our country is totally fucked up. What's left to say?

[gpandas]

11. totally fucked up?...

alas, this is true. totally fucked up by capitalism?

[Deja Q]

12. Fucked up by deregulation of capitalism

And corruption.

[mongo]

16. So why won't public school cover enough basics for a basic job?

Public school is now a joke. Yesterday, the girl at Wendy's couldn't even make change from $10.47 for an order that cost $5.47.

I've run into other people IN COLLEGE that couldn't do fractions.

I doubt if the average high school grad today would be able to work as a clerk in my store.

I'm so glad my wife homeschooled my daughter from 9th - 12th grade.

BTW - minimum wage goes a lot further out here. Hell, my wife and I survive with a mortgage and a car payment on $420/wk before taxes.

Anyone that still has a good job needs to start saving money now.

[gpandas]

17. how did public school become a joke? n/t

[mongo]

20. I don't know.

Here they spend most of the time preparing kids for the proficiency test.

I don't know how these kids graduate high school without basic math skills.

Grammar is another area where people are sadly lacking these days.

[gpandas]

22. do you think mandatory education is working...

it's gotta be hard to educate people who don't want to learn. i think they are being promoted to get rid of them.

[Ms. Clio]

24. Spelling is yet another area where people are sadly lacking these days

The word in your sig should be spelled "amendment," and probably should be capitalized, too.

Sorry, couldn't resist! :D

[CrispyQ]

13. Prepare yourselves financially to live on service level wages. eom