When do my Rights over my Body end?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

Just a question. No need to flame. Really quite an innocent question.

[Bombtrack]

1. When you walk into the California governor's mansion

[Blue-Jay]

5. /rimshot!

:D

[La Lioness Priyanka]

7. lol!

[JayS]

2. 10:30 Eastern, 9:30 Central? :)

[Nederland]

3. When you harm another person...

Does that help?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

6. no it doesnt

so you are saying its ok for me to be tortured assuming i killed a soldier in war?

[Nederland]

30. No

The example I was referring to was vaccination. The court has ruled that a person can be compelled to be vaccinated because failure to do so can result in harm to other individuals. See the Jacobson v. Massachusetts, 197 U.S. 11 (1905) ruling. Since then, I believe that the court has modified this stance to say that parents may refuse to have their children vaccinated, but then the state may deny those children access to public schooling as a result.

In any case, I suspect that you really want to talk abortion, but don't want to come right out and say it :)

[La Lioness Priyanka]

41. no actually i want to pretend

that something inflammatory is really quite innocent

[Nederland]

44. How's this for inflammatory?

The Abortion debate isn't about a women's right to do what she wants with her body.

The abortion debate is rather simple. If you believe that a pregnant women consists of a single person you are going to believe that abortion should be legal. If you believe that a pregnant women consists of a two seperate persons you are going to believe that abortion should be illegal.

Contrary to what many on the pro-choice side will tell you, Roe vs. Wade lays the issue out in exactly this manner.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

45. a lot of pro-choice academics believe

that though Roe v. wade was a good decision it was badly based in law.

[Nederland]

46. Yes

But not the part that I referenced above. The parts of Roe versus Wade that pro-choice people take issue with are the parts that use viability as a measure of personhood. The problem being that viability is a moving target subject to technological improvements.

[Trillo]

4. You think you still have Rights over your own Body?

Perhaps I'm cynical instead of skeptical, but since governments took away individuals' ownership of their DNA, it seems silly to think there's any such thing as self-ownership of body rights.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

i'd like to think

that i in theory own my body....regardless of what the government says

[La Lioness Priyanka]

9. i'd like to think

that i in theory own my body....regardless of what the government says

[ScreamingMeemie]

8. When this ridiculousness is allowed to continue, and you find yourself

pregnant, so the government farms you off to a medical facility to ensure that you do nothing to harm the little person inside of you...by forcing you to take daily pregnancy tests, until which time the heartbeat is heard. Upon the heartbeat being heard, you will be subjected to daily Doppler ultrasounds to further ensure the health and safety of aforementioned little human being, up to and including the time of its birth. If, by chance, something should happen resulting in the death, intentionally or not of said human being, you will be remanded to the nearest federal penitentiary, you murderous being you.

Of course, with the government we have, nothing as ludicrous as this could ever happen...

[La Lioness Priyanka]

11. mrs. grump was that a reprimand?

cos it made me laugh :silly:

[ScreamingMeemie]

13. I don't know....are you pregnant??

:silly:

I wrote a whole essay on this for the fun of it...one time. :hi:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

19. course i am not pregnant

and if i were i would abort it.

[ScreamingMeemie]

23. And I'll continue to help you fight to keep that right.

:hi:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

27. thanks, though doubtful that i will ever personally need it

[ScreamingMeemie]

31. You never know...

There are those stories of alien abductions and all. ;)

[Debi]

34. That's all anal probing....

just ask Cheney

[Debi]

25. However, upon the sucessful birth of the being

The government will thrust you and your offspring aside (and since you've been locked up for 9 months you no longer have a job or 'impregnator' to help you) and demand that you get your lazy, welfare, unmarried behind to work and quit bringing children into this world without an adequate household in which to raise them in....

[kiahzero]

10. Simple answer

When they interfere with someone else's rights.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

17. well define whose else's rights should prioritize mine

[kiahzero]

24. What?

It's not a matter of priority. When your actions infringe on the rights of others, that's where your absolute rights over your body cease.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

12. Well, Priyanka...

You can feed yourself, give yourself drink, make sure you're clean, use the bathroom, and have sex, but since you're a lesbian, they don't want you to do that either. So, I guess, intake, output, and showering?
(removes tongue from cheek)
Duckie

[La Lioness Priyanka]

ohh dear duckie

you are so funny :P

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

14. Anytime you join the military.

You become an officially designated target and expendable.

[tom_paine]

15. In Imperial Amerika? None. Just wait for it to finish transforming

into Orwellian Tyranny.

You HAVE no rights, except to spend, buy, obey, talk on the phone (though every word will be analyzed by computers) and believe Der Fuhrer* unconditionally.

Sorry. Don't blame the messenger.

Maybe we can still stop this Monstrous Birth of Amerikan Tyranny before it reaches term...

[La Lioness Priyanka]

16. i dont blame the messenger

[TexasSissy]

18. I've always heard that in America, one's rights end where another's begins

For example, freedom of speech. I have the right to say anything I want....up to the point where it interferes with another's rights (incitement to violence, slander, etc.).

Are you speaking of denying medical treatment for yourself, or abortion, or the right to die?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

21. abortion. drugs. right to die

[noiretextatique]

20. when religionists, moralists, politicians, internet posters

and others who have absolutely nothing to do with your life tell you.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

26. good point

and they can collectively go to hell!

[noiretextatique]

29. i'm with you

:thumbsup:

[Mandate My Ass]

33. I thought hell was reserved for us atheist,

liberal, promiscuous baby killers....:evilgrin:

I'll be happy wherever *they* are not.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

37. me too

[La Lioness Priyanka]

38. me too

[Cleita]

22. When you are lying on the autopsy table, not before.

eom

[eyesroll]

28. In my own personal opinion, your rights end where someone else's

body begins.

I think you, as a human being, have a right to do whatever you want to your own body. Whether it's body modifications, mood-altering substances, sexual practices, and, yes, deciding whether to carry a pregnancy to term. Except in the case of a pregnancy (since it's a biological impossiblity), you have the right for other consenting adults to join you, and in all cases, you have the right to request other consenting adults assist you or advise you, or not.

Your rights end where someone else's body begins. You don't have the right to stab, shoot or kill people, unless you're defending yourself. You don't have the right to impose yourself on others sexually. You don't have the right to force someone else to carry their pregancy, or to terminate it. You don't have the right to drug someone without their consent, unless they're incapacitated, you legally have that decision-making power (guardian, power of attorney, ER doc, etc.) and it's for a legitimate medical purpose.

A standard counterargument usually turns to abortion: "Well, doesn't your right to abortion end where the baby's body begins?" and we can argue all day as to whether the fetus is a person entitled to rights or not, my response is along the lines of "until we figure out a way to make pregnancy not a major imposition on the woman's body for nine months, and birth not painful, and recovery instantaneous, the rights of the body that is trump the rights of the body that may be. Sorry."

[taxidriver]

32. well, you dont have the right to put illegal drugs in them, or suicide.

no need to flame, an innocent response.

[Debi]

35. I think that's the BIG debate..

When does a fetus become a human...is it when the fetus can be viable outside the womb? even then that brings the partial birth debate into play...

[taxidriver]

36. that is the big debate. and i think i'll duck and just read other threads

lol.

[Debi]

42. Agreed

eom

[La Lioness Priyanka]

39. why not?

my body

[noiretextatique]

43. just legal drugs like tobacco and alcohol

which is a kind of legal suicide.

[Bandit]

40. When your body contacts mine.

And vice versa.