A guy I work with invited me to his church's "Hell House" this Halloween.

[Kid_A]

You've probably heard of these things. Super-conservative churches set up religious haunted houses where each room is a scene of a person who is "damned", like a girl getting an abortion, a homosexual who contracted AIDS, a drunk driver who killed someone, etc, etc.

I've been really curious about these places for a long time, and this guy I work with is apparently concerned for my soul (and I'm very honored by that), and he wants me to get "saved" at his church this Halloween. I'll skip the "saving", but I'm really curious to see one of these places in person.

Should I go?

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. Ugh! If you go, PLEASE wear a Jesus was a liberal Tee shirt

[tom_paine]

2. If this is real: Absolutely.

Just for the experience and to see it with your own eyes.

[Kid_A]

6. It's absolutely real.

And I'll post a full report here, believe me.

[Caution]

3. go for it

but be prepared to be disgusted. Just do yourself a favor and don't act like a freeper at F9/11 and start ranting. See what they have and go home. Then you can give an honest answer to your co-worker.

[apnu]

4. Hell houses make me ill...

... the very thought of them is sickening. The idea of using church issues to scare and disgust people into their thinking is revolting, and, I'd like to add, un-Christian.

Those people will burn in Hell for, "missing the point" that Christ made, IMO.

[Neecy]

5. well....

I don't know you, but I know that I'd have some kind of reaction to these lurid scenes of the 'damned' - whether it be laughter, indignation, or just disgust. I *know* that I'd let at least one comment fly, especially if I saw them indoctrinating children with their propaganda (and you know this is the main purpose of these 'Halloween' things), so I wouldn't go. I wouldn't want them in my face, so I choose to stay out of theirs.

[LittleApple81]

7. I remember that a kid was trying to recruit me into his church. I

said that I could never belong to a Church that thought everybody else (not-in-their-church) people would go to hell. He said "no, only the ones who have heard the voice of Jesus and not heeded its call." My reply: "Then please shut up. If you never mentioned your religious message then I can go to Heaven. Don't you feel guilty for all of those you have condemned to eternal damnation?" End of conversation.

[skypilot]

31. LOL!!!

Yeah, how can I heed the call if I never got it. We could all just coast right into Heaven if it weren't for the fundies blathering at us.

[lumberingbear]

32. LOL

I like that idea. Maybe we could all wear ear plugs and never
have to listen to these religious wingnuts and we''l sail into
heaven. ;-)

[cheezus]

8. about about the polition who was adulterous

or the one who bore false witness

or the one who ignored "thou shall not kill" (more than a few thousand times)

or the kids who dragged another kid behind their pickup truck because they hated him

or...

[JHB]

41. That's a GREAT Idea!

Get rid of the abortion/drugs/homosexuality skits, and go to "real life meets the Bible" skits:

Newt Gingrich saying "I like blowjobs because then you can truthfully say you've never slept with her", and having his ex-wife sign the final divorce papers from her hospital bed;

And eye of a needle, and the squirts have to try to pass a copy of the "Forbes 500" through it, much less a camel;

The First Stone, to be tossed by someone without sin (and under the stone is a note: "Ever hear of the sin of Pride? Put the rock down!")

Hyde & Seek: Lessons on "youthful indescretion" from Henry Hyde;

more?

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

9. First of all

I live in an area with TONS of those things (think Dallas area). And I would NEVER go to one. I am Christian, but I am beyond disgusted with those things. God is not about fear and intolerance, in my opinion.

Anywho, I wouldn't be able to stop myself from laughing and pointing.

[playahata1]

10. I would not give this guy a minute of my time.

He is obviously trying to establish his imagined "superiority" over you. Just skip it.

[Kid_A]

17. He's actualy a really nice guy

it's just that whenever the conversation turns to religion, his intolerance and change-a-phobia starts to become more apparent.

I've told him that I will never, ever share his beliefs, but this time my curiosity trumps by liberalism.

[LiberalFighter]

44. Well....

Go see it.
Then you can tell him that you think that it makes your own beliefs that much stronger knowing that it is better than what you saw.

Or better yet... Don't see it and tell him that you have researched it and those "Hell" Halloweens are the reason your beliefs are much stronger.

[frank frankly]

11. i couldn't do it. nope.

sounds like the worst thing ever.

:puke:

[ronnykmarshall]

12. Hell NO!

Don't validate this bullshit by showing up.

I'd have a hard time keeping my big trap shut.

[Bandit]

13. Their "God of Love" is damning some of his children to everlasting Hell

Especially an omnipotent and omniscient God who is nothing but Love. How absurd can they get?

[gauguin57]

18. tell your co-worker you saw it on TV, and beg off.

They show these things on TV, and play them on the radio (I think I heard one on "This American Life" or some other public-radio show)... and so you know what it involves and you're not interested.

Instead of spending your time going to Hell House on Halloween, go to your local Kerry headquarters and see what you can do to get the Hell-House-Enabler out of the White House on Nov. 2.

[mstrsplinter326]

14. I hope you have a stronger will than me

Cause I would be sickened to the point of trying to SAVE the church goers from their narrowminded, unreal view of the world.

I would probably start screaming

[mstrsplinter326]

15. dupe

[lukasahero]

16. If you do go, be prepared.

They will not let you out easily. You may be there a while...

If you want to piss them off though, make sure to mention that Jesus noted the Pharisees and Sadducees (the priests of the time) with their public prayers and piety were quite equally damned.

[prodigal_green]

19. I used to teach English as a Second Language and

a lot of my muslim students would try to enlighten me. My stock response, "thanks, but I already have a God." Seems to work for fundamentalists too.

[Az]

20. Perhaps someone should counter with a heaven house

Examples of rightous behaviour in the eyes of the lord. Like stoning to death someone working on the sabbath. Or perhaps stoning to death a rebellious child. Or then there is the popular stoning to death of am entire community because one man blasphemed the lord.

[TWiley]

24. How about wonderul peace on earth

after all the fundies got "raptured" into heaven.

[Iris]

26. or, more unlikely, the stoning of a business owner who forces

his employee to work on Sunday because he no longer has to pay the poor guy overtime and has little incentive to hire an extra person to do the work.

Of course, the employee would still be stoned, too.

[kayell]

37. Lot offering his daughters to the mob, Lot cheneying his daughters,

(and Lot's wife was they one who got in trouble with god :eyes: ). That nasty flood that killed almost everyone and everything (lots of presumably innocent newborns and fetuses), God torturing Abraham by making him (almost, haha) sacrifice his son........

[Warren DeMontague]

66. Heaven House will be the Earth after all these wackjobs

are teleported, "Star Trek" style, out of their minivans during the rapture. At which point, us sinners who are "left behind" can finally enjoy the planet, and our wanton wickedness, in peace.

[TWiley]

21. You might not be able to skip the "saving"

Aggressive fundies such as this might not want to let you out of the door without getting "saved" My boss tried to save me and when i would not respond, i became a "bad heathen" and therefore a "bad employee". I do not deserve training, and for a long time, i did not deserve overtime either. Lots of harassment still comes down the pike.

This white employee in a white town has learned a ton about what it feels like to be the victim of discrimination. Attendance, attitude, skill, work ethic, or willingness make no difference at all, there is nothing that i can do to change the situation except quit, or get "saved". Even then, I would have low seniority as a saved person.

I can only imagine with horror what life must be like for members of a minority living in the bible belt.

I would think twice before setting yourself up for a controversy at work. That is where you earn a living.

Maybe we should set up our own hell houses. Little booths with church people trying to save your ass, condemning you for how you look or how they think you live, trying to scare you into providing 10% of your income to them, wearing KKK outfits .... etc

[Neecy]

27. sounds to me like you have a legal case...

I'd speak to an employment attorney about your situation, especially if you can document the harassment. Keep a daily journal and log every single incident, including witnesses to the incident. This is clearly workplace harassment based on your religious preference and your employer could be in for a world of hurt.

[TWiley]

60. The HR man is a deacon in the church.

I tried working it out with him for years, but the harassment just got about 10 times worse each time after I talked to him. Normally, they (he and boss) either claim that it is some kind of personality flaw that I have, or that I have a perverted sense of reality. For a while, I was too stupid to learn, until I showed them a GPA - scholarship plaque that I earned, and which hangs in a university that I used to attend. I kind of documents that I do have the ability to learn. On the next review, they would claim that I actually receive the "difficult, more advanced tasks" even though anyone in my field would realize that the jobs others are being trained to do have a higher skill level associated with them. It is never ending.

The reality is that in this neck of the woods, church and the republi-KKK-lan way always wins out in the end. I have pretty much decided to tolerate as much as I can, and keep earning a check until the economy changes. Many seem to be pressured into spouting the limbaugh way and vote republican just to keep a job, and to avoid a similar fate.

It pretty much works like the Fox show "survivor" except the voting is done in secret, and nobody outside the circle can see the entire dialog. In my view, Fox is training conservatives how to discriminate and get away with it legally.

On the upside, I really do have a much better understanding of the dynamics of discrimination, and empathy for, homosexuals,women and those of a different race or religion that have suffered their whole life from discrimination.

Thanks for your reply

[Neecy]

61. try this...

Forget the HR guy. If he knows about the conduct and condones it, then the company you work for is even more liable.

Keep the job for as long as you need, but I'd still document EVERYTHING (including any health issues this is causing you) and at some point take your concerns to an employment attorney. If they're harassing you at work or making it a hostile work environment because of your religious beliefs, you have a case. Check out the EEOC site and do a google search on employment laws in your city and state. I know that in San Francisco, you could file a separate complaint with the city Human Rights Commission. There might be something similar where you live (although from what you say I doubt it).

You sound like a nice person and I really get outraged at stuff like this, especially pressure from religious fundamentalists.

[TWiley]

70. The city human rights commisioner

is the police chief. Now, you must be thinking "this cannot be true", but alas, it is. I will follow your advice and check out the EEOC web site. Thanks = : > )

[comsymp]

22. Sure you should- and since it's Halloween, tell him

that you want to go in costume- the two of you, as a married gay couple.

[NYCGirl]

23. Save yourself the grief and watch this documentary...

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000092T6A/qid=1089820235/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2/002-9721980-9241668?v=glance&s=dvd

Great documentary often shown on IFC. Rent this instead.

[TrogL]

36. features a score by Bubba

You can't make this shit up.

[GreenPartyVoter]

25. You might try printing this out and passing it out while there

Why live a good life if all will be saved? http://www.tentmaker.org/FAQ/WhyLiveAGoodLife.html

Would Jesus love a liberal? You bet!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/liberalchristians.htm

[hatrack]

28. Well, at least he didn't ask you to visit the Precious Moments Chapel . .

Or go shopping for Thomas Kinkade paintings. :evilgrin:

[hunter]

29. We have neighbors who set up an Anti-Halloween party every year...

...offering huge amounts of food, candy, drink, and games.

For a few years that was the first place the local "goth" kids would go. They'd load up on candy and those odd little religious tracts that explain why magic is unGodly, and they'd politely listen to lectures about modesty and chastity and other virtueous behavior, and then they'd go out behind the fence and do sinful acts.

I imagine the same sort of thing goes on at those "Hell Houses."

[madrchsod]

30. they have one of these in rockford il.

one year it put on a show so gross that they got so many complaints ,so had to shut it down and change many of the exhibits..good christians?,ya right..

[AndyTiedye]

33. What a Waste of a Perfectly Good Halloween!

Why would anyone want to spend Halloween looking at depressing fundie propaganda?

I want to have fun on Halloween.

[lumberingbear]

34. It's alright for them to do this "hell house" crap...

but it's wrong for you to send a little child dressed up as a princess, or Barney or a ghost and go trick-or-treating ???? Doesn't make sense does it? Trick-or-treating is paganism and occutish, but this "hell house" isn't???

(By the way, when you go in the homosexual room, give the guy who invited you a big sloppy kiss. That will get you out of there quick!!!)

[LiberalFighter]

47. To bad you couldn't take a dog in and...

make them think the dog was you when it kissed the guy.

[pocket]

35. go for it!

I've always wanted to go to one of those. Preferrable while drunk/stoned to the gills.

[Ducks In A Row]

38. Avoid it

It's painful to watch the poor teenagers roped into these performances. It's abuse, in my opinion.

Personally I'd rather go to a good cornfield maze. Fun and exercise in one.

[Cat Atomic]

39. Will they have a room with Cheney holding bloody dollar bills?

[Cat Atomic]

40. doublepost

[LiberalFighter]

42. I never heard of anything like this... that is sickening

[truthspeaker]

53. You've really never heard of anything like this?

You need to start paying attention, because these whackjobs are trying to take over our country.

[Selwynn]

43. Wear an "I've got a Heart on for Jesus!" t-shirt :D

[Neecy]

48. or wear this...

Surely it belongs in a 'hell house'...if not, what does?

[bleedingedge]

45. Why hide from it...

If your beliefs to the contrary are strong? Go ahead, go. Maybe your co-worker will get some Brownie points with the church constabulary. It can't hurt you and it can only serve to demonstrate that liberals are the ones who are truly willing to listen to the other side.

Who knows - it might be a hoot.

[Forkboy]

46. I'd LOVE to see that

Theater of the absurd at it's finest.

Hell,take some pictures for the rest of us :)

[DemBones DemBones]

49. Kid, you'll regret it if you go.

Your co-worker wants to "save" you and you'll only encourage him to step up his efforts if you set foot in his church for any reason.

Think about it -- it's MID-JULY and he's asking you to attend something at the END OF OCTOBER??? He's a zealot.

I live in the Bible Belt so I've had plenty of experience with zealots. You have to work with this guy so don't do anything that will cause problems at work.

There are good reasons to go to church and if you're interested in exploring religion, go for it. I found my faith after trying several denominations that didn't work for me (though they clearly work for others.) But I'd advise you to watch out for churches with gimmicks like "Hell House." Just attend regular services if you want to see if a church has something for you.

[Kid_A]

50. I don't think going to this thing will cause any problems at work...

This guy knows I disagree with him on stuff like this, but we still get along. I said before that he's a really nice guy, it just so happens that his religious beliefs offend me, and mine offend him. He invited me to the Hell House because he knew I was curious about them, not because he wants me to join his church. I've told him many times that I think his beliefs are abhorrent and totally un-Christian, but I respect the fact that he believes in them, just like he respects my beliefs even though he finds them abhorrent and un-Christian.

Even though I expect to be completely offended and horrified by what I see, I want to show this guy that us liberals are open to other beliefs, no matter how disgusting they are, and that we don't shut out anyone who disagrees with us.

[neuvocat]

51. That's entirely hypocritical.

If your friend is a Christian, ask him or her why he or she would have anything to do with All Hallows Eve.

[Az]

55. Hell Houses

Are a recent inovation on the part of fundimentalist evangelizing types. The idea is to counter the influence of All Hallows Eve by offering up a version of what defying god leads to. It is based on the same thinking behind the antiabortion videa "The Silent Scream". You scare people into compliance with your doctrine.

[neuvocat]

59. Agreed, but it still backfires though

by featuring gross and gory depictions of what supposedly happens in every day life. What's the difference between seeing that and a horror movie on Halloween?

I wonder if these people ever ask themselves "What Would Jesus Do?" because I'm sure if they did they would find out there is nothing in the Bible that supports any of that nonsense.

[KayLaw]

52. I don't think you should go

These people sound unstable and possibly dangerous.

[GiovanniC]

54. I Don't Know If I Would

I'd be curious to see what kind of crap they're doing. Religions usually fascinate me just because of sheer morbid curiosity.

But when it comes right down to it, I have trouble worshipping a God who finds it necessary to torture people for all eternity for ANY reason. Especially the religions that believe that God will torture people for all eternity simply for not believing in Him.

[lectrobyte]

56. I'd say no, if you are like me, seeing this "testimony" being drummed

into children will make you wonder about your friend's state of mind. Also, if they think you may be "saveable", they will pester the living fuck out of you until you have to do something ugly to get them to leave you alone. On the other hand, I'd probably be tempted to drop 50 mikes and check it out if I didn't have something cooler to do on Halloween. Rhetorically speaking, of course...

[merh]

57. Will this "hell" house include recreations of the prisons in Iraq,

complete with rummey & ashwipe & wolfie & f'u debating how to get around international law?

Will it include the bombed out homes of the iraqis complete with scenes of the dead civilians and our soldiers?

If not, it is not a hell house....

(imho - it should have a special room with a large conference table with all of the * admin's names posted on name cards at each seat.)

[dansolo]

58. Can you bring some of your own contributions?

I'm sure that there are plenty of places in hell for warmongers and greedy corporate criminals.

[EV1Ltimm]

62. i like the part where someone says the lord's name in vain

and is promptly squished by a piano which then in turn is flattened by a 16 ton safe.

spooky.

[Warren DeMontague]

64. Ooooh! Scaaaary!

(best count floyd voice)

Well, maybe it means they realize, on some sub-conscious level, that all that crap about fire and brimstone and pitchforks is as absurd as the idea of witches flying around on broomsticks.

Make a shirt that says "Hell doesn't scare me. I survived the George W. Bush Administration."

[West Coast Democrat]

63. I've never heard of such a thing before!

Kids actually go to these places?

[Warren DeMontague]

65. Tell him you'll go if he'll go with you to F911.. n/t

[knitter4democracy]

67. Having been an Evangelical Christian, be careful

Honestly, if you aren't interested in his faith, don't go. Even if there aren't problems at work afterwards, you're giving him hope that he will be able to "save" you in the end. (I know, semantics, blah, blah, blah) Having been trained on evangelizing and all, your attendance indicates that you do fear hell and are open to hearing the Good News.

I know there are many here who have been hurt by Christians, and I just want to apologize for that. I am still a Christian, Eastern Orthodox (which has its own problems, I admit, but comes as close to what I need as I can get), but when I hear of people being bullied or harrassed for not choosing Christ, it just hurts. Jesus would never do 99% of the crap his followers do, that's for sure.

[democrat_patriot]

68. Does 'pickle' play the drunk driver

that killed someone?

Please get her autograph.

Does * stand by the girl getting the abortion?

Is Crashcart's daughter in the "being gay is evil" skit?

Is Rumsfeld in the 'thou shalt not murder' bit?

Is the entire administration in the "If you lie, go to hell when you die" grand finale?

When you see these portrayed ask "is this about (insert name here)?"

[ParanoidPat]

69. Open your own BushCo* 'Hell House' this Halloween.......

.....Rent a space, set up exhibits of the numerous and various examples of living under the Bush* regime.

Advertise locally that all profits go to ____________. (Insert Democratic cause/organization of your choice.)

Run for the last 2 weeks of October. (Conveniently occurring just before the election!)

Have a ball and help out two worthy causes at the same time! :evilgrin:

Happy Halloween! :toast: