End Soc. Sec & Medicare & employer provided benefits-GOP Cong. Ryan (R-WI)

[papau]

End Soc. Sec & Medicare & employer provided benefits-GOP Cong. Ryan (R-WI)

From Congressman Ryan's Speech (is quoted by BCG Insider newsletter volume 3 - edition 4 - July 2004):

This election is the most important in decades. It will determine if we ....return to the undesirable history of Social Security and Medicare and other defined benefits....

Social Security and Medicare are based on collectivism.

(Election will determine if we continue to move to) ... a society built on individual responsibility.

IRA and Health savings accounts should define the future

Employers should facilitate access, not provide benefits.


Any Questions?

[rfranklin]

1. They know it is easier to rip off individuals...

abd separate them from their retirement and their homes.

Republicans see every dollar as belonging to them. When government programs safeguard those dollars paid in, it is more difficult to transfer that money into their bank accounts.

[Eric J in MN]

2. What is his first name? nt

nt

[eyesroll]

5. Paul n/t

[ralps]

22. Who is his opponent?

ralps

[eyesroll]

23. Hi, Ralps

He has two opponents -- Chester Bell (nice guy, from a political family, a bit awkward), and Jeff Thomas, a perennial candidate who's never gotten anywhere.

Chet's nice, well-meaning, good ideas, but a bit late to the game-- his web site's not even live yet.

[LibDemAlways]

3. If these thugs ever do try to

actually end Medicare and Social Security, they'd have millions of elderly people and the children of those elderly people taking it to the streets. Imagine the average guy who hasn't been paying attention waking up to the news that his elderly parents are coming to live with him and he must provide for their needs - including their health care needs - because the government has washed its hands of them. Muliply this guy by many millions and you'd see some serious shit hitting the fan.

[Mika]

10. Americans will hit the streets in masses? LOL

Depends on what's on TV that night. :evilgrin:

[LibDemAlways]

17. My 81-year-old parents, as

with millions of other seniors, depend on their Social Security checks and Medicare benefits to stay alive. This really is a matter of life and death, so yes, I think they would take to the streets - and their children and grandchildren would join them.

[bvar22]

13. It is happening NOW!

Like the assault on abortion, the destruction of Social Security and Medicare is ALREADY under way. It is being destroyed a little at a time, and the DLC Dems are helping.

The Prescription Drug Bill was a Trojan Horse that opened the door to the privatization of Medicare.

The implementation of Voluntary Investment Plans combined with the looting of the SS funds will be the beginning of the end for Social Security.

[LibDemAlways]

15. I know it's happening.

But people aren't yet paying attention because this shit is being phased in slowly. I still maintain that when it hits ordinary people that benefits they've taken for granted that have allowed grandma and grandpa to be somewhat self-sufficient - disappear - and they are faced with the reality of taking care of elderly relatives - and footing the bills themselves - there will be a thunderous outcry.

[Kanary]

28. Good luck overturning it once it's done

Kinda like stopping a war when the bombing has started.

Kanary

[Union Thug]

4. These guys truly want to return to the Gilded Age...

They are self serving, greedy, murderous bastards. I hate these people.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

6. Screw the poor

Trouble with these Jay Gould wanna be's is that they haven't read history. The ripoffs of the working men is what gave rise to the labor movement and to Communism. No reason why neoconservativism couldn't give rise to neocommunism or something similar.

[Jose Diablo]

29. These guys want communism, because they think they will land on top n/t

[Monte Carlo]

7. ''individual responsibility'' is a code word for ANARCHY.

Which is what the GOP really wants. They idealize a world where we are each our own little nation. It's just that a little thing called human nature gets in the way.

It's all very selfish. They want anarchy because they believe they will personally profit the most from it.

[Monte Carlo]

8. Divide and conquer.

Split us up, and we are much easier to dominate.

[OHdem10]

9. A true Ayn Randian Neocon--

that Jack Ryan. Even though he is wrong wrong wrong, I give him credit for publicly esposing the goals of the Republican Party.
He did not try to blanket or disguise it in swaddling clothes of
Compassionate Conservatism. Until all Democrats realize the Randian Influence on the Republican Party from Grenspan on down, they will never put up a good fight. Have some of them joined forces with the Republicans.???

[berry]

11. NOW with Bill Moyers did a piece on this July 16 (yesterday)

It was about Alabama (or Mississippi? anyway, the state ex-RNC chair Haley Barbour is gov.). They have cut thousands off the Medicaid rolls and people ARE screaming.

The transcript isn't up yet, but it's well worth reading if you missed the program.

http://www.pbs.org/now/

[Yupster]

12. I'd like to see

programs like social security, medicare and health insurance financed from the government and not from jobs.

Especially health insurance. It is a permanent need every person has. There's no reason it should be tied to a temporary thing like employment. Your health care shouldn't depend on where you work. It should be run by the government for everyone regardless of where they work, or even if they do work.

I think it's stupid tying benefits like health insurance to employment, and I'm sure other bosses like myself would mostly agree. I don't have time to analyze and redo my healthcare packages. I'm trying to make a living and keep my business afloat.

This is something the government should handle.

[Sugarbleus]

34. I agree with you Yupster

it seems to me that if we alleviate the burden of healthcare costs from our employers and into/onto a different delivery system, perhaps employers can hire more, perhaps they can retain more employees...any number of benefits to employers and employees could result.

My sister and I have talked about these issues for years. Especially preventative healthcare; access to healthcare even if one is between jobs or not working et al. Why wait until a person is in a catastrophic state which would cost so much more.

Surely, please tell me, there are bright enough minds in this country who could come up with a program that would work for our society. Even a single payer thingy for those who have any money at all...to each as he is able to pay. Free for those who are down on their luck. Anything, SOMETHING. Just do it!

It seems criminal and extremely cruel to withhold meaningful healthcare from human beings in a country where we have some of the most innovative advances in medicine.......

[bvar22]

14. The Federal Government is the perfect vehicle...

...to administer to the health needs of our nation. The MASSIVE collective bargaining power would drive down the cost of pharmaceuticals, streamline services offered by regional and local hospitals, provide consistent quality control, and ensure equitable distribution of services.

DEREGULATION and PRIVATIZATION are SCAMS!!!!!

[Cleita]

16. Time for civil disobedience.

Letting old people die homeless and of starvation and lack of needed medical care is diabolical. Where do these people learn their ethics and morals?

[Sugarbleus]

35. Certainly not in kindergarten...........

Remember the ethic of "sharing", "Tolerance", "honesty"?

[drscm]

18. Great! Maybe they can all invest in Enron or the many other companies

who have robbed their employees and shareholders of millions. That way they can be assured of a stable future.

Asses...

[tlcandie]

21. That's just it.... you don't make money in the stock market unless

you invest in the crooked businesses! TRY to find just a few that have integrity and ethics and see what your returns will bring!

This again is all for them while we have to make a decision to eat or invest in cruelty, torture, and raping of our environment.

Some tough decisions lay ahead, no doubt! I'm not especially looking forward to it!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

19. The NeoCons have been attempting to do this for decades.

[chefgirl]

20. This is true

Actually, Paul Krugman was talking about this very thing more than a year ago, IIRC.
The Repubs have always promoted the concept of 'starving the beast', which signifies an end to ALL social programs.
This is the single biggest reason why I will never understand why ordinary, middle class people choose to vote R.
They will never have the system of private safety nets that TPTB keep in place for themselves (by standing on the necks of the working class) and will suffer just like the rest of us if they ever find themselves in need of one of those 'commie' social programs. They just like to believe THEY will never be in such a position.
Funny thing is, the more they vote Repub, the faster they'll be in that position.
MORANS !!

-chef-

[wettap]

24. The "devils advocate" says...

...if Social Security and Medicare could be improved by privatizing them, or letting the States administer them, should we be necessarily opposed to it?

[papau]

27. IF - but options outlined to date destroy only - with nothing improved

"devils advocate" in this case equals Devil - or if you like - the GOP.

[AG78]

25. Funny

I was flipping through channels this morning, and I went by Fox News. They had some show called, "The Cost of Freedom"; how can you not love the title? Anyway, they had a round table discussion on some stock market yapping, talking about how Kerry will be bad for Wall Street because he wants to raise taxes, capital gains, etc, etc, etc. Of course Bush will be good for Wall Street. They were all screaming at each other, and some younger guy, from capitalistpig.com or something like that, made a statement that some people actually think health is a right. Obviously those people are insane. Alan Colmes was the only semi-Democrat on the panel, but nobody called this guy on what he said. He was allowed to say that health/healthcare is not a right.

I know it's nothing new from Fox, but they're in power. This is what they're saying. This is what they're doing. And nobody is stopping them. They're getting away with it.

[Sugarbleus]

36. LOL--->'Capitalistpig.com

It's true, the other side has gone to the "dark side". When did this ugliness actually start I wonder??? Obviously, the ultra RW has been planning their "day in the sun" for years. They've been working under the radar for a long time. I just wonder what year it really started to take root in earnest....Reagan years maybe?

Human beings with one ounce of sense or sensitivity KNOW you can't just make statements like that, they know you can't treat other's like this. WHO,EXACTLY, ARE THESE PEOPLE in power, in the neofascist party? They certainly bare little resemblance to earthlings IMO.

How debased and vile can people get and still wear a suit????? At this rate, I expect them to start foaming at the mouth and growing hair in odd places along with fangs...geeeez

[uhhuh]

37. Was it this guy?

Johnathan Hoenig.

He has a website called

http://www.capitalistpig.com/

[patdem]

26. I have had a few 'slaps in the face' moments one is Econ 101

which says..whatever makes a profit..it will be produced...without any caveats as in ...death, disease, destruction...I was absolutely astounded...the other was..'to the victors goes the writting of history'..which tells me that the history I learned might not be the reality I have believed for so many years!

Who knows...the shadow (government) knows!!

[Junkdrawer]

30. What has euphemistically been called "The Trust Fund" is better...

called "A huge portion of the national debt". And if we're running 400 Billion+ deficits now, with 200 to 300 Billion of SS surplus helping to float the federal deficit, imagine what will happen when the boomers retire and want "The Trust Fund" repaid.

One way or another, the Repukes will kill SS before the bulk of the boomers retire. Mark my words.

[Disturbed]

32. Middle Clas Repubs

"The Repubs have always promoted the concept of 'starving the beast', which signifies an end to ALL social programs.

This is the single biggest reason why I will never understand why ordinary, middle class people choose to vote R.

They will never have the system of private safety nets that TPTB keep in place for themselves (by standing on the necks of the working class) and will suffer just like the rest of us if they ever find themselves in need of one of those 'commie' social programs. They just like to believe THEY will never be in such a position.
Funny thing is, the more they vote Repub, the faster they'll be in that position.
MORANS !!

* They are ignorant or just don't understand what we understnad.

The Right Wing

Abolish

Social Security
Medicare
Employer supplied health insurance
Unemployment Benefits
Welfare
Collective Bargaining
EPA
Public Education
Public Housing

[Junkdrawer]

33. But..but...Rush says that Liberals just want to keep people dependent...

and THAT'S why Liberals love social programs.

I just don't know which is sadder: the audacity of The Lie or the thought that there are millions that buy it.

[SharonAnn]

31. I'm OK with removing all of his "employer" provided benefits.

He can test this approach.

And, by the Way, his "employer" is us, the "taxpayer".