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WillyT (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:18 AM Original message |
Just... Wow... 'How the Left Lost Its Heart' |
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Robbien (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:24 AM Response to Original message |
1. That is the exact same message Franks wrote about |
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ibegurpard (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 11:01 AM Response to Reply #1 |
17. Right. |
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iamtechus (868 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:24 AM Response to Original message |
2. Looks like that came from a book I just read |
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WillyT (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:26 AM Response to Reply #2 |
3. It Did !!! |
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onecitizen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:48 AM Response to Reply #2 |
5. I cannot wait to read this........ |
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Massacure (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:28 AM Response to Original message |
4. A class war? So that means that |
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mhr (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:49 AM Response to Original message |
6. Let's Break This Argument Down And Make It Much Simpler |
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dumpster_baby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:54 AM Response to Reply #6 |
7. The Problem is that there IS no Left at the top levels of Democratic party |
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mhr (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 09:14 AM Response to Reply #7 |
11. The Only Answer I Can Offer Is Shamming The Leadership Into Action |
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sangh0 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 10:45 AM Response to Reply #11 |
14. Shame the shameless? |
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Jackpine Radical (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 05:21 PM Response to Reply #6 |
39. It's only class warfare if |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:28 PM Response to Reply #39 |
54. Exactly. It's "class warfare" if we object to our reaming. |
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CWebster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:00 AM Response to Original message |
8. guys with confederate flags on their pickup trucks... |
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Warren DeMontague (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:05 AM Response to Original message |
9. I've said it before- Economics is THE "values" issue. |
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BurtWorm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 10:44 AM Response to Reply #9 |
13. I don't see this article saying Democrats are vulnerable on choice. |
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Warren DeMontague (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 03:36 PM Response to Reply #13 |
22. Yeah, it's gotta be one of the greatest PR coups of all time.. |
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NewJeffCT (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:41 AM Response to Original message |
10. I've been saying this for a while... |
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dumpster_baby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 09:50 AM Response to Reply #10 |
12. they actually started at the top with media and message |
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BurtWorm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 01:26 PM Response to Reply #12 |
19. But Frank is saying something else (I think) |
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dumpster_baby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 03:57 PM Response to Reply #19 |
24. You've picked up on only part of Frank's thesis |
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BurtWorm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:22 PM Response to Reply #24 |
28. I see what you're saying, and I agree with your assessment. |
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dumpster_baby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:56 PM Response to Reply #28 |
37. But outside of Michael Moore, Nader is all the Left has right now |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:17 PM Response to Reply #37 |
42. Actually, I'd like one or two of those "economic leftist" links |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:38 PM Response to Reply #37 |
56. Yes, Dean is a fiscal moderate. But when the other side's strategy |
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dumpster_baby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 10:13 PM Response to Reply #56 |
62. but didn't Dean advocate harsh cuts in SS and Medicare? |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 11:00 PM Response to Reply #62 |
63. Yes, 9 years ago -- when it looked like there was no way to sustain these |
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BurtWorm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 09:25 AM Response to Reply #37 |
75. I agree that Dean is not as left as the media makes him out to be |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:32 PM Response to Reply #10 |
55. You mean like |
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madfloridian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 10:50 AM Response to Original message |
15. This quote in E. J. Dionne's article today shows this. |
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Norquist Nemesis (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 11:14 AM Response to Reply #15 |
18. Once again |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 03:53 PM Response to Reply #18 |
23. Dean wasn't talking about class issues at all.... |
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madfloridian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:11 PM Response to Reply #23 |
27. If I posted a link with all his statements and speeches, would you read it |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:25 PM Response to Reply #27 |
29. gotta love the dupes... |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:26 PM Response to Reply #27 |
31. I read his website, read his record as gov, talked with supporters at |
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madfloridian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 05:26 PM Response to Reply #31 |
40. What in the world did I say to make you so mad? |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:07 PM Response to Reply #40 |
41. I told you. |
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madfloridian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:33 PM Response to Reply #41 |
44. I did not do that, though. |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:25 PM Response to Reply #44 |
46. Yes, now you're facing it from the other side, and it doesn't feel good |
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madfloridian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:52 PM Response to Reply #46 |
59. I have one from you thanking me for all my work on the Medicare Bill. |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 11:02 PM Response to Reply #59 |
64. Thank you for the offer, and no, I don't have it mixed up. |
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Beam Me Up (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 02:18 AM Response to Reply #64 |
65. Kanary, I've read the last series of posts between you and madfloridian |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 04:05 AM Response to Reply #65 |
69. Thanks for hearing.... means more than you know |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 09:19 PM Response to Reply #46 |
60. 1) Kucinich made a deal with Edwards for ZERO delegates in order to |
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BurtWorm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:25 PM Response to Reply #23 |
30. Dean made the point that the Republican party betrayed |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:30 PM Response to Reply #30 |
33. Dems betrayed, also, and THAT is the point...... |
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BurtWorm (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:32 PM Response to Reply #33 |
34. Of course! But Dean was making an effort to redress the Dems' lacks |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:40 PM Response to Reply #34 |
35. Could be. Or...... just that his comments about smashing the media corps |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:43 PM Response to Reply #35 |
58. Yep. That, too. The media is the message is the elite is the problem. |
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( posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:28 PM Response to Reply #23 |
32. not true |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:41 PM Response to Reply #23 |
57. He didn't claim to be. He was and is a fiscal moderate and pragmatist. |
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The Flaming Red Head (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 10:59 AM Response to Original message |
16. Being nice to the undereducated and underfunded people |
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tom_paine (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 01:31 PM Response to Reply #16 |
20. Just WHO are you referring to? |
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The Flaming Red Head (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 06:31 PM Response to Reply #20 |
43. Since you're being mean, YOU |
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kodi (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:47 PM Response to Reply #16 |
49. using "democrats" and "so-called liberals" synonymously is pretty bogus |
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The Flaming Red Head (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 09:19 AM Response to Reply #49 |
74. you're beating up on a yellow dog dem |
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RedEarth (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 01:44 PM Response to Original message |
21. I saw Frank on Bill Moyers show a few weeks ago and he discussed his |
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Emillereid (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:00 PM Response to Original message |
25. Amen to this! I couldn't agree more. |
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Jose Diablo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 07:38 AM Response to Reply #25 |
73. Yep, here is the real issue |
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Emillereid (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 03:38 PM Response to Reply #73 |
76. Have you read the new book |
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Lydia Leftcoast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:03 PM Response to Original message |
26. I heard Jim Hightower speak in the Twin Cities last night, and |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 05:10 PM Response to Reply #26 |
38. I'm glad Hightower is able to say that w/o being tarred and feathered |
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unfrigginreal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:11 PM Response to Reply #38 |
45. "We've allowed OURSELVES to be splintered, and it's showing." |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:29 PM Response to Reply #45 |
47. Oh yeah, I'm the one doing the splintering.... |
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unfrigginreal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:44 PM Response to Reply #47 |
48. Of course you're the ONLY one who cares about class issues. |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 07:59 PM Response to Reply #48 |
50. Your sarcasm is doing a lot to heal wounds, right? |
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unfrigginreal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:16 PM Response to Reply #50 |
51. About as much as yours, right? |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:23 PM Response to Reply #51 |
52. Your screen name says it all |
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unfrigginreal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 08:27 PM Response to Reply #52 |
53. It sure does. |
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Mike Niendorff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 04:44 PM Response to Original message |
36. Outstanding piece. |
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WillyT (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-20-04 09:46 PM Response to Original message |
61. I'm So Glad We Can All Come Together In Peace And Unity Here... |
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Beam Me Up (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 03:07 AM Response to Reply #61 |
66. LOL |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 03:15 AM Response to Reply #66 |
67. You're so right..... I know *I* didn't see it.... too young and idealistic |
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Kanary (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 03:17 AM Response to Reply #61 |
68. Or bury it all with candles, holding hands, and singing Kumbaya |
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Disturbed (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 06:13 AM Response to Reply #68 |
70. Pain, anger and frustration. |
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WillyT (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 08:07 PM Response to Reply #68 |
77. Gotta Come Up With Another Song, LOL !!! |
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Bread and Circus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 06:49 AM Response to Original message |
71. Yeah, I agree w/ the article but if you start gettting.... |
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stickdog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Jul-21-04 07:09 AM Response to Reply #71 |
72. I'm a hardcore Marxist on this one issue. The so-called "culture war" is |
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