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911 Question about the hijackers......How did we know thier names?

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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:40 PM
Original message
911 Question about the hijackers......How did we know thier names?
I have always been puzzled by the press coming forward with pictures of these "men"...who:

* were not on the passenger lists

* we were told they used fake names

SO how in the hell do we know who they are?

Please help me with this one....
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Rick Myers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. Pay stubs and W-2's on file
with Carlyle Group. (pause) It could happen...
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:43 PM
Response to Original message
2. What an anti-American question. Tinfoil hat conspiracy theory

3000 innocent Americans were murdered by evildoers who hate freedom - Saddam Hussein's Al Qaeda and the former Foreign Minister of Niger! Why do you hate Israel and America so much?
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Pocho Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. COULD I INTEREST YOU IN A MEMBERSHIP?
Cowed member of the Paper Bag Society, DU Chapter
"They're crazy, not me. All's nice. I want it to be"

Certainly no conspiracies here. All reasonably explained

JFK, Jack Ruby, Hale Boggs, Warren Commission, CIA, Martin King, Malcom X, Bobby Kennedy, Abby Hoffman, FBI, John Lennon, Fred Hampton, Che, Contras, Iran, Echelon, John Jr., Osama, Touch screen voting, Nov.2000, 18,181, Skull & Bones, 9/11, Anthrax, Wellstone, NSA, Nov.2002, DLC, Saddam, WMD, Dr Kelly, Arnold.
(Earn PBS Blindy Points by adding others which tin hatters see as conspiracies but which we know are just a normal coincidental part of life.)
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Noon_Blue_Apples Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. They had to write a purchase order to somebody
?
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
5. I've been asking myself the same thing
since it happened . If they knew their names why in the heck
didn't the CIA/FBI know what they were up to and stop them ?
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ewagner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:55 PM
Response to Original message
6. The wierd part
...is that some of the names on the list are supposed to be alive and well in the ME. Can anyone enlighten me on that?
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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. this is such an easy area in which the press should at least say...hmmmm
but ...we lost our investigative press eons ago.

This simple question really bugs me about 911....becuase you ask somebody and you get "the look"....the don't make me think look.
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Must_B_Free Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:56 PM
Response to Original message
7. They all ordered from Sky Mall on the plane
as a last reward
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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 07:58 PM
Response to Original message
8. Some info for you
Edited on Thu Aug-21-03 08:02 PM by paulthompson
We actually have no idea who the people who got on those planes are. If the FBI knows, they certainly haven't released information that would convince a reasonable person on this. My favorite case is Saeed Alhazmi, where it is clear beyond a doubt that the FBI is using the wrong picture, birthdate and other info, and certainly must know this, yet they have never corrected the incorrect info. They even apologized to the guy, but still have his photo up on the FBI website as one of the hijackers!

The key fact is that the video footage of hijackers walking on the hijacked planes has never been released. Why not? (A few photos of two hijackers walking onto a different connecting flight earlier that morning has been released, which begs even more why release that and not the other footage?)

Here's my 9/11 Timeline entry most relevant to this:


September 16-23, 2001: Reports appear in many newspapers suggesting that some of the people the US says were 9/11 hijackers are actually still alive:
1) Ahmed Alnami is still alive and working as an administrative supervisor with Saudi Arabian Airlines, in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01) He had never lost his passport and found it "very worrying" that his identity appeared to have been stolen. (Telegraph, 9/23/01) However, there is another Ahmed Alnami who is ten years younger, and appears to be dead, according to his father. (ABC News, 3/15/02)
2) Saeed Alghamdi is alive and flying airplanes in Tunisia. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01, Telegraph, 9/23/01, BBC, 9/23/01) He says he studied flight training in a Florida flight schools for parts of the years, 1998, 1999, 2000, and 2001. (Arab News, 9/18/01)
3) Salem Alhazmi is alive and working at a petrochemical plant in Yanbou, Saudi Arabia. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01, Telegraph, 9/23/01) He says his passport was stolen by a pickpocket in Cairo three years ago and that pictures and details such as date of birth are of him. (Guardian, 9/21/01, Washington Post, 9/20/01, Saudi Gazette, 9/29/02)
4 and 5) The brothers Waleed M. Alshehri and Wail Alshehri are alive. A Saudi spokesman said, "This is a respectable family. I know his sons, and they're both alive." The father is a diplomat who has been stationed in the US and Bombay, India. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01, Arab News, 9/19/01) There is a second pair of Saudi brothers named Wail and Waleed M. who may have been the real hijackers. Their father says they've been missing since December 2000. (ABC News, 3/15/02, Arab News, 9/17/01) The still living Waleed M. Alshehri is a pilot with Saudi Airlines, studying in Morocco. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01, AP, 9/22/01) He acknowledges that he attended flight training school at Dayton Beach in the United States. (BBC, 9/23/01, Daily Trust, 9/24/01) He was interviewed by US officials in Morocco, and cleared of all charges against him (though apparently the FBI photos are still of him!). (Embry Riddle Aeronautical University press release, 9/21/01) The still living Wail Alshehri is also apparently a pilot. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01) What are the odds that two Saudi terrorist brothers would find two other Saudi brothers with the same names who were pilots with one even training in Florida?
6) Abdulaziz Alomari is alive and working as a pilot for Saudi Arabian Airlines. (New York Times, 9/16/01, Independent, 9/17/01, BBC, 9/23/01) He claims that his passport was stolen in 1995 while he was living in Denver, Colorado. (Los Angeles Times, 9/21/01) "They gave my name and my date of birth, but I am not a suicide bomber. I am here. I am alive." (Telegraph, 9/23/01, London Times, 9/20/01)
7) On September 19, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. distributes a "special alert" to its member banks asking for information about the attackers. The list includes "Al-Midhar, Khalid. Alive." The Justice Department later calls this a "typo." (AP, 9/20/01, Cox News, 10/21/01) The BBC says: "There are suggestions that another suspect, Khalid Almihdhar, may also be alive." (BBC, 9/23/01) The Guardian says Almihdhar is believed to be alive, but investigators are looking into three possibilities. Either his name was stolen for a hijacker alias, or he allowed his name to be used so that US officials would think he died, or he died in the crash. (Guardian, 9/21/01) Almihdhar is wanted for other terrorist acts (see January 15, 2000), so it's not surprising he's still hard to find. There are three official pictures of Almihdhar - one of them doesn't look at all like the other two.
8) Marwan Alshehhi may be alive in Morocco. (Saudi Gazette, 9/18/01, Khaleej Times, 9/20/01) Family and neighbors don't believe he took part in the attacks. (Reuters, 9/18/01)
9) Atta's father says he spoke to his son on the phone on September 12, 2001 (see September 19, 2001 (C)).
10) No one claims that Hamza Alghamdi is still alive, but his family says the FBI photo "has no resemblance to him at all" (on the other hand, Ahmed Alnami's family says his FBI picture is correct). (Washington Post, 9/25/01)
11) Majed Moqed was last seen by a friend in Saudi Arabia in 2000. This friend claims the FBI picture doesn't look like Moqed. (Arab News, 9/22/01) There are three official pictures of Majed Moqed - one of them doesn't look at all like the other two (see photos on below right).
12) The Saudi government has claimed Mohand Alshehri is alive and was not in the US on 9/11, but no more details are known. (AP, 9/29/01)

The Saudi government insists that five of the Saudis mentioned are still alive. (New York Times, 9/21/01) On September 20, FBI Director Mueller says: "We have several others that are still in question. The investigation is ongoing, and I am not certain as to several of the others." (Newsday, 9/21/01) On September 27, after all of these revelations, FBI Director Mueller states, "We are fairly certain of a number of them." (Sun Sentinel, 9/28/01) Could it be that the bodies (and sometimes faces) in question are correct, but the names were stolen? For instance, the Telegraph notes, "The FBI had published (Saeed Alghamdi's) personal details but with a photograph of somebody else, presumably a hijacker who had 'stolen' his identity. CNN, however, showed a picture of the real Mr. Alghamdi." (Telegraph, 9/23/01) Police have even determined who sold at least two of the hijackers their fake ID's. (BBC, 8/1/02) On September 20, The London Times reported, "Five of the hijackers were using stolen identities, and investigators are studying the possibility that the entire suicide squad consisted of impostors." (London Times, 9/20/01) Briefly, the press took this story to heart. For instance, a story in the Observer on September 23 put the names of hijackers like Saeed Alghamdi in quotation marks. (Observer, 9/23/01) But the story died down after the initial reports, and it was hardly noticed when Mueller stated on November 2, 2001: "We at this point definitely know the 19 hijackers who were responsible," and claimed that they were sticking with the names and photos released in late September. (AP, 11/03/02) Yet many of the names and photos are known to be wrong.

If you go to this page:

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/main/timelineafter911.html

and scroll down to the right date, you can see some photos of innocent people mistakenly identified as hijackers.
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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. so if they are alive...why don't they come forward...?
they can appear on a local tv or something.
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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. They have!
There were lots of interviews and such in the days and weeks just after 9/11. But most of them were in Europe or the Middle East, many not even in English. The US press is completely uninterested in a story that would so fundamentally challenge the official one.

Here's one interview by the way (scoll down). I can dig up more:

http://www.ncmonline.com/content/ncm/2001/oct/1005identities.html

Also, I think this story is of fundamental importance in understanding the 9/11 mystery:

Seymour Hersh, a New Yorker reporter, later writes, "many of the investigators believe that some of the initial clues that were uncovered about the terrorists' identities and preparations, such as flight manuals, were meant to be found. A former high-level intelligence official told me, 'Whatever trail was left was left deliberately—for the FBI to chase.'" (New Yorker, 10/1/01)

----

I think this includes the hijacker's identities, and the FBI bought the story hook, line and sinker, cos it's just easier to sweep the whole embarrassing thing under the rug. Incredible lengths were taken to hide the true identities of the hijackers, because they are so shocking (connections to gvmt intelligence agencies. Take your pick: CIA, Pakistani ISI, Saudi, or Mossad are most likely).
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ewagner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
25. Thank you
I thought I had heard (or read) very similar information but now I have a source.

I'm not a tinfoil hat type but there is definatly something wrong here.
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TomNickell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
11. It's not that hard....
They had to present -some- kind of ID to buy tickets and get on the plane--they had to give a name. They had to have -some- kind of visa to get into the country and stay. There were probably surveillance videos.

The names may have been faked, of course.

You really can't trust those suicide terrorists.
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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. with all due respect...are you being serious with your answer?
you have to present ID that matches your ticket to board...and this means you are on the passenger list
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. before 911 i never had to show any kind of ID.to fly anywhere!
Edited on Thu Aug-21-03 08:18 PM by ElsewheresDaughter
or to purchase an airline ticket...so your arguement is moot tom nickel
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Sterling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
27. TomNickel is moot
as usually he is stalking anyone who dares to question PNACs version of the truth. I wish I could afford to donate to DU just so I could do a search. I wager Tom has yet to contribute any thoughts not related to bashing skeptics with personal attacks.
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Pastiche423 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
12. Forget their names
How do we know that there were "terrorists" on the planes? How do we know their were 19 "terrorists" on the planes?

There are no photos of "terrorists" boarding the planes.

There are no photos of "terroists" aboard the planes.

What evidence is there to prove there were "terrorists"?
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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. It's a logical question to ask the 'sheep' about 911...it wakes them up
I'm open to being wrong on information....but how in the hell is this not asked about for the past 2 years?
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
15. also i would like to know how mohamad atta's passport was found in
pristin condition at the WTC after all that fire and debris? when not even a piece of a phone pad bigger than a sqaure inch was ever found...nothing recognizable was found of anything except atta's passport....explain that to me?
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Randi_Listener Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. God reached down from heaven....
....and stopped those bullets.
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Gordon25 Donating Member (246 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
19. We looked in the files
Five of the "terrorists" trained at U.S. Military bases. Three had Pensacola Naval Air Station as their home address on their drivers licences. :wtf:
http://www.madcowprod.com/index6.html

The deeper you look the weirder it gets.

Gordon25
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Kellanved Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
20. ANd: check this:
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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
21. so the takeaway from all this is.....THERE IS NO GOOD REASON....
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
22. And don't forget the lady from Tennessee (was it TN?)
who was supposed to have created IDs for some of these guys, but who died in a strange auto event within a short time after 9-11.
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
23. And have you realized that the Bush CABAL
who once ranted with fierce and piercing voices against the Immigration Dept during the Clinton years have barely raised their voices about the Dept since 9-11? They can't rant and rave because it will draw attention to the goofs, regoofs, absurd goofs, intentional goofs and possibly diabolical goofs.
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pretzel4gore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
24. disinformation...
they intend it...to clutter up the record....fake names of fake hijackers, phony ph. calls that couldn't possibly have been made, and the of course pristine passport! the car left with the arab language flight manual, found after some dink reported 'suspicious' characters near the car etc(!) james woods saying he reported buncha eskimoes scheming on plane week prior to 911 and so on...
The were no hijackers. 911 was planned in detail, carried out with relative ease (the planes were fitted for remote flying) and the mediawhores all greased up for their big perfomance. The brazen disreagard for even basic rules of evidence simply communicated to the bushnazis supporters the total utter contempt for the USA and the majority of people they gleefully have....so what if the story is foolish, in fact its very foolishness is why bushwaco going to get away with it....
911 was part of a ongoing coup.....not even biggest or most difficul part. That was/is the media conjob we are seeing....that is pure evil genius!
the only cowards bigger then bushinc are....amer. males between 10 and 90 who afraid to confront them. Following the July 44 plot to kill hitler, the grovelling terror/helplessness of the plotters, which included some incredibly brave men like Rommel, is astonishing. Tough guys like Ollie north who courageously attack liberals and Clinton, would turn into lil sissys when facing bushwaco (people attribute their own cruelty to those they know to be gutless punks, like hitler or bushwaco) they don't fear the courage of honourable men
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-21-03 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. 9-11 was Paula and Aaron's first day of the new CNN format, I believe

Just another one of those wacky coincidences, huh?
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