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"I'm a Veteran -- and John Kerry Didn't Earn Any Purple Hearts"

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GiovanniC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:51 AM
Original message
"I'm a Veteran -- and John Kerry Didn't Earn Any Purple Hearts"
Is anyone watching C-SPAN this morning? I watch Washington Journal occasionally, but I'm not 100% familiar with their format. When they have open phones, is the host allowed to question callers, or point out errors? Or does he just sit there and let them say whatever they want, even if it isn't true? Case in point, at about 8:35 or so this morning...

Guy from West Virginia:

"I'm a veteran and I want to say something about John Kerry's three Purple Hearts. You don't EARN Purple Hearts, you get them automatically when you're wounded. John Kerry could have been running away from the enemy and got shot in the butt and still gotten a Purple Heart. A Purple Heart doesn't mean anything. A Purple Heart isn't anything to brag about. Now, if he had gotten a Silver Star or a Bronze Star or something, then maybe that would be something, but he didn't."

The host never called him on the lie that Kerry didn't earn a Silver Star or a Bronze Star.

As I was writing this, a woman called in and pointed out the errors in what this guy said. Good for her.

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teach1st Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:54 AM
Response to Original message
1. Bush most assuredly developed...
...liver damage during his alleged service. He should have earned the Purple Heart.
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:57 AM
Response to Original message
2. Glad that woman called in and corrected him
my brother won a Silver Star in Viet Nam. He didn't earn any Purple Hearts, and for that I am profoundly glad.

Wish I knew that fellows phone number. Wouldn't it be great if we could have the guy whose life Kerry saved call the bozo and explain just what Kerry did in Viet Nam?
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
3. Ted Sampley's stooges will be all over the airwaves
This is a foaming at the mouth GOP operative who dealt with his PTSD and survivor guilt by attacking other vets. John McCain had to get a restarining order against him. He's organized a bunch of like minded foamers against Kerry and they will be trotted out all over the whore media, so brace yourself.

To find out what a piece of work Sampley is, go to http://www.independentsforkerry.org/uploads/media/vvajk.html
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OneTwentyoNine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:05 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Sounds like just the idiot that FOX is looking for......
Those mindless dweebs that watch FOX for all their news will eat this up and never think twice about checking facts. Sounds like Sampley could make big bucks on FOX until November.

David
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rfkrocks Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
4. West Virginia is booming under Bush-NOT
This guy must have patroled in the "not too swift boats" -and shame on Host for not mentioning the silver and bronze star
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WI_DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
5. that's the calibar of the people we will have to deal with
someone with the IQ of a peanut calling in and spreading lies "he could have been running away...and got shot in the butt." As for your other question, from what I've seen the host on Washington Journal pretty much does just sit there and let people have their say, no matter how stupid it is, I know if I were hosting a show like that--I couldn't put up with that kind of stupidity and just sit mute.
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captain_change Donating Member (73 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
7. He is right about the PH
Edited on Sat Jul-31-04 08:13 AM by captain_change
We used to joke about the Purple Heart being the enemy's marksmanship award. But, it does prove a few things

1) You had to be in a combat zone to get it, not sitting out 4 deferments in Wyoming

2) You had to be injured by enemy projectile, not crashing a plane in Lubbock TX

Get my drift
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #7
27. Welcome, CPT change, to DU!
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #7
31. Ooooh, GREAT comebacks!
We should all be using these!

Welcome to DU!
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Columbia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #7
66. Correction on #2
You can be hit by friendly fire and still get a Purple Heart.
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greekspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
8. My observation about this dweeb
1) I think that if you are WOUNDED fighting for your country, you EARN every fucking award they give you. So Kerry EARNED those THREE purple stars.

2) As for the other lie, which is bald-faced, the host of the show should have corrected the caller. I am not saying he or she should be rude or condescending. But say something like "ladies and gentlemen, please note that Mr. Kerry did in fact earn a silver star." Since this clearly did not happen, the "unbiased" host is complicit in the lie the guy from WV told.
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koopie57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
9. every time I hear Kerry's service
being questioned it makes my heart sore. He volunteered to go there. That took a lot of thought on his part. He knew he might not come back. Then he went there. No matter what he did while he was there, he was there. But he was in one of the scariest places there was. At least to me. For some reason I get chills when I hear of the uhm Delta (I have no idea how to spell it).

Whenever someone says crap about his service, I'm going to say "so you volunteered to go over there? Tell me about what you experienced".

I don't know how people can be so ignorant. If someone doesn't want to vote for Kerry for one reason or another, I can deal with that, but to put down his service to us, Americans, I don't understand. The man got balls. If he wins this election or not, I know that I'll be stronger having seen his example.
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #9
30. So you turn to them and sweetly say - so how many purple hearts
and other combat medals did YOUR man win in Vietnam? Smile and bat your eyelashes while doing so.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:35 AM
Response to Original message
10. calleer on Friday: " bush* ASKED to go to Vietnam"!
but his commander turned him down. She also said Kerry never got wounded. No one corrected her. Brian Lamb is the worst for letting people go on and on with the lies.
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VLC98 Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #10
19. I heard that.
Was it the same lady that said... "I read in a magazine" blah..blah. Brian Lamb should have asked what magazine it was. He disgusts me.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #10
45. I heard that too. He "didn't have enough flight hours"
No wonder, when you don't show up!
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iamjoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
11. Oh, For Crying Out Loud
Edited on Sat Jul-31-04 08:50 AM by iamjoy
There is a group of Veterans against Kerry. I think they are mad at him because he came back & spoke out against the war. I think I read somewhere that for a while, John McCain was mad at Kerry about this too (which I sort of understand, McCain is in a tiny cage being tortured by those monsters in Hanoi and Kerry is back home protesting the war) but then when they met McCain saw it from Kerry's perspective.

These Veterans against Kerry stepped up their attack when "Tour of Duty" came out. They accuse him of lying about the acts that earned him the Silver Star and Bronze Star. And they believe Kerry left after 4 months because he just wanted to put in time to help a future political career.

Their understandable anger about Vietnam is drastically misfocused. Fanned on by the Repugnantcans, it has become almost insane. Kerry volunteered to go to Nam because he felt a commitment to serve. It is illogical to suggest he went and risked his life for a future political career. He left Vietnam after 4 months (not completing the year tour of duty) because he saw how the war was being fought and disagreed with it. His conscience would not allow him to stay.

Now, for those medals. I saw all those men from Kerry's swift boat up there. Are they all lying? Are men who claimed to witness a very different set of events lying? I would like to believe no one is lying. There are three sides to every story - my side, your side and the truth which is some where in the middle. But what evidence or account recorded immediately after these events would indicate he doesn't deserve his Silver or Bronze Star? Each of these men has something about those days they want to remember (most they'd like to forget) and as time goes by and we experience different events and emotions our memory of past events, our perspective, is altered. It's perfectly honest and understandable.

What is not honest and understandable is for Republicans and their supporters, people who did not serve, to criticize or question Kerry's war record, to only show the Veterans who oppose and criticize him. In my opinion, I think John McCain, himself a veteran, tortured by the Viet Cong, came to understand that each man had to deal with Nam in his own way, and it wasn't anybody else's place, even another veteran's, to pass judgements on it.

Oh, and lets not pass judgement on those in the National Guard either. My step-father joined to avoid going to Nam, but he unquestionably served his time. :)
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Neecy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. can I ask something?
Everyone talks about Kerry's 4 months in Vietnam, but wasn't that his second tour? I though he was there prior on a ship, then transferred stateside for training, then returned. Was he in country for a total of 4 months, or was there time prior to that?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #14
25. Gulf of Tonkin
The first tour, the ship was in the Gulf, like ships today that are in the waters off Iraq. And, there's "in country" and then there's swiftboat duty.

"The most intense action came during an extraordinary eight days of more than 10 firefights, remembered by Kerry's crew as the "days of hell."

http://www.boston.com/globe/nation/packages/kerry/061603.shtml

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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #14
41. Yes...his previous tour aboard his destroyer, the USS Gridley,....
...does indeed count as a tour of duty. All military personnel that served in that theater was eligible for the Vietnam Service Medal:

<http://www.history.navy.mil/medals/vsn.htm>

<http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/jkmilservice/Vietnam_Service_Medal.pdf>

Kerry volunteered for duty aboard the Swift Boats while he was serving aboard his destroyer.

<http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/service.html>

"John Kerry enlisted in the Navy in 1966. After completing Naval Officer Candidates School, he began his first tour of duty on the USS Gridley, a guided-missile frigate in the waters adjacent to Vietnam. In 1968, John Kerry began his second tour of duty, and volunteered to serve on a Swift Boat, one of the most dangerous assignments of the war."

In summary, Kerry actually qualifies as having served two tours of duty "in Vietnam and contiguous waters and airspace between 3 July 1965 and 28 March 1973".

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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #14
71. if you are wounded more than X numbers of times, you could come home
so I remember. Correct or no?

My uncle got a PH from getting shrapnel from a kamikaze. I am damned sure he was running at the time. He was no coward, nor was my uncle at Bougainville.
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #11
18. This does not sound right.

"He left Vietnam after 4 months (not completing the year tour of duty) because he saw how the war was being fought and disagreed with it. His conscience would not allow him to stay."

I never heard of anyone being allowed to leave under those circumstances. I knew a guy, an Army lt., who got to Nam and decided he was a conscientious objector but he had to file for CO status and then was embroiled in a court martial. I don't know how it ended up for him but the Army was not about to let him just say "Oh, I just had a revelation that I'm a CO" and go home.

We need to get our facts straight about Kerry's service. If he only spent four months in VietNam, WHY was he sent home early?
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Neecy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. I think...
If you're wounded 3 times, as Kerry was, you're eligible to leave the combat area early. At least that's the explanation I've heard for Kerry's early departure.
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iamjoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #20
26. Exactly
Kerry had an opportunity to leave after being wounded 3 times and he took it. It is my belief (with nothing to substantiate it other than my hunch) that the reason he left (others who were wounded stayed) is because he was disgusted with the way the war was being fought.

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MaineDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #26
42. Your hunch may not be correct
If the Navy policy was three incidents and I could go home I'd jump at the chance. This was Navy policy. WHy try to read more into it than is already there? He would have been an idiot to say "no, thank you, I want to stay".

Having lived through those years I know what I would have done.
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iamjoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #42
50. I Am Probably Wrong
But, some people act as if Kerry leaving Vietnam when he had the chance shows he didn't really have courage and only did those 4 months to "advance his political career" I am trying to debunk this idea on all counts. Supposedly, there were others wounded who did stay
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #20
33. I heard that too. Kerry campaign should be ramming this
down the media whores throats.
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #18
28. 3 Purple Hearts. Apparently not a written rule at that time, but a
convention that was honored if you were wounded 3 times during your tour you could request out and apparently it was usually granted.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #28
47. No, it was governed by an actual document...check my post #46.
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. Thanks, just downloaded this. I obviously have to spend more
time checking out JK's site.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #18
46. Kerry received his third wound and was asked what he....
...wanted to do, and Kerry chose a duty assignment back in the states. The appropriate reference on the document linked below is as follows:

"Thrice Wounded
BUPERSINST 1300.39"


<http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/jkmilservice/Thrice_Wounded_Reassignment.pdf>

BUPERSINST was an acronym back then that stood for "Bureau of Personnel Instruction". It may still be in use today.

There are no facts to get "straight about Kerry's service"...it's all on his website if you will take the time to look instead of giving the appearance of trying to create an issue where there is none.

<http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/military_records.html>
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #46
51. Yes, there *are* facts to get straight, because the RW is

circulating a lot of rumors (and lies) and a lot of us who are voting for Kerry haven't read his entire website. You can bet most of the people who are planning to vote for Kerry never will read his website, so we need straight answers -- facts -- when RW-inspired rumors are thrown around. That's the only "issue" I'm concerned with: having the facts to counteract misinformaton and disinformation.

If you go back and read the post I was responding to, that poster seemed to suggest that military personnel could leave an assigned duty post early because they were unhappy with how things were going. Having grown up in a military family, I knew that was incorrect. I'm not criticizing that poster for not knowing that, just saying we need a definitive short answer on this in order to defend Kerry against sleazy RW attacks. I actually went and found that answer (and remembered having heard it before) after I posted here. Not everyone would bother looking it up, so it's good that several people responded to my post with the answer I wanted.
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iamjoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #46
60. We Agree
but we need to be able to debunk right wingnuts who try to say differently.

They won't go to the website to look at the official documents.
I think it is interesting that all these "Vietnam Veterans for Truth" (read "Vietnam Veterans Against Kerry") now question his valor and whether he deserved those medals when he (Kerry) has been more than willing to share his military records, something Dubya has been extraordinarily reluctant to do.
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LastLiberal in PalmSprings Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #46
63. Maybe Kerry decided he didn't want his fourth Purple Heart
to be awarded posthumously. That would seem to be reason enough to agree to a stateside assignment.

BTW, didn't Kerry complete his military obligation, unlike a certain Dubya who shall go unnamed?
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jakefrep Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #11
61. I place far more stock...
..in the "band of brothers" that ACTUALLY SERVED ALONGSIDE KERRY than I do in the collection of miscellaneous asshats that the Bush's goon squad is trotting in front of the media.
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Catt03 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
12. Caller just explained the 87 M vote by Kerry
She explained the whole thing and why he voted against it....the bill was initially 66m and the Repbublicans tacked on 25M.

They cut her off.
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Paradise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 08:56 AM
Response to Original message
13. Kellyanne Conway on C-Span.
I hate to admit it but she really gets my goat! :mad: :puke:
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #13
48. Just another Ann Coulter...they serve the same purpose in life.
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Longhorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:02 AM
Response to Original message
15. About the Purple Heart:
"When contemplating an award of this decoration, the key issue that commanders must take into consideration is the degree to which the enemy caused the injury. The fact that the proposed recipient was participating in direct or indirect combat operations is a necessary prerequisite, but is not sole justification for award."

From http://www.americal.org/awards/ph.htm which has a copy of the actual Army regulation. It's pretty clear that if a soldier was injured running away, as the C-Span caller said, he or she would NOT receive a Purple Haart. Nor do they get them for injuries resulting from their own negligence.

Hard to believe someone would go on record claiming that a Purple Heart doesn't MEAN anything!
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Bandit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #15
29. I suspect that person had never been to Vietnam or if so had never been
in Combat there. I don't understand the running away suggestion. Where the fuck could you run away to? When the shit happened they were everywhere. You ran for cover and away from being shot but it was impossible to run away from a battle. We were in their country and they were everywhere. Even if a person was shot in the but it in no way was an indication of that person's bravery. Some people just don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.
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UTUSN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:16 AM
Response to Original message
16. He ********DID***** Earn Silver/Bronze Awards
Whatever they were (I don't keep up with other people's decorations). If Shrub's and JK's military records were reversed, these ignorant wingnuts would be yapping out of the other side of their ignorant mouths.
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GiovanniC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. He Earned Both
Silver and Bronze.

I was waiting for the host to correct the caller, but he just sat there and nodded and said, "Thanks Caller!"

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Toots Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #17
55. Not just a Bronze Star but a Bronze Star with 'V' Device
That is strictly for great heroism. Kerry is a Hero and Bush* is not.
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:54 AM
Response to Original message
21. The hosts rarely, if ever, correct people who state false information

on the air. They sometimes question someone as to why they are saying what they say.

C-SPAN is supposed to be neutral and the hosts are also supposed to be neutral. It often seems, though, that they'll allow our opponents to go on and on but cut us off mid-sentence.

I think each caller should have a set amount of time and only be cut off for foul language, screaming, frothing at the mouth, etc. (And for those offenses, they should be cut off immediately. I remember during the primaries a host allowed a woman to scream and rant for what seemed an eternity. The caller sounded psychotic -- and wouldn't you know she was supposedly a Democrat?! That host, a white man, is the least effective host, IMO.)

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Tomee450 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #21
40. I've seen
the hosts allow Republicans to ramble on and on but not allow the guest to respond. Brian Lamb did that yesterday. Kerry's critic got out what she wished to say but instead of allowing the guest(a former speech writer for Democrats)to respond, Brian asked another question. He also cut off several Kerry supporters before they finished their comments. I can't watch much of Washington Journal anymore because it has definitely shifted to the right.
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
22. The hosts rarely, if ever, correct people who state false information

on the air. They sometimes question someone as to why they are saying what they say.

C-SPAN is supposed to be neutral and the hosts are also supposed to be neutral. It often seems, though, that they'll allow our opponents to go on and on but cut us off mid-sentence.

I think each caller should have a set amount of time and only be cut off for foul language, screaming, frothing at the mouth, etc. (And for those offenses, they should be cut off immediately. I remember during the primaries a host allowed a woman to scream and rant for what seemed an eternity. The caller sounded psychotic -- and wouldn't you know she was supposedly a Democrat?! That host, a white man, is the least effective host, IMO.)

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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:03 AM
Response to Original message
23. Why are so many veterans violating their oathe to uphold the
Constitution. It is crystal clear that the invasion of Iraq violated our constitution and national law, yet many vets are supporting it? Why? Are the oathes they take just words to them?
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oneighty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. Also
many are not veterans, they say they are and people accept that at face value. The US of A is thick with wanna-be-vets and phony war heroes. Take all they say with a good dose of "Prove it".

180
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ItsMyParty Donating Member (835 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:13 AM
Response to Original message
32. A memo should be sent to our military in Iraq which reads:
"Dear serviceman/woman: Some day, we pray, you will come back home alive. Be prepared that 30 years later some republican prick who wouldn't think of breaking a sweat for his country in a godforsaken place like you are in, will call you liars, cowards, unpatriotic, unAmerican, losers, who do not deserve any of the medals you earn. Why are you fighting for them; better still, why are you voting for their morally corrupt party"??? Signed, John Kerry (winner of the sliver star, bronze star and 3 purple hearts)!!!!!!!!!!"
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many a good man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
34. The Lion and the Chicken
Another caller responded to the charge that Kerry was on the swift boat "for only four months" by telling the listeners about an old African saying: "Its better to be a lion for one day than a chicken for your entire life."

She went on to say: "As far as I'm concerned, this is what this race comes down to -- one is a LION and the other one is a chicken!"

:kick:

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Swede Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. What a great saying.
I hope it's ok if I start a post with it.
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cheezus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:48 PM
Response to Original message
36. well, I know how many purple hearts bush and I have
and that number is ZERO
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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
37. Beyond shameful
My father, a veteran and a Republican, sent me an e-mail criticizing Kerry and saying that his three Purple Hearts "didn't mean anything." I was amazed. I could not believe that he would take pot shots at another veteran like that. Say what you will about his politics but that man served his country, was wounded, was decorated for heroism and people have a whole lot of nerve to try to downplay that. Especially people who have never served.
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. Yes I've gotten antiKerry hate filled email from the dad of one of
my best friends. My friend is still in the Army (lucky enough to be in a situation extremely unlikely to go to Iraqnam) and his dad retired after a career in the Army. I guess he assumed since I am a former military guy that I must be some kind of wingnut. I had to order him to cease and desist with the emails.

Really sad because they (my friend's parents) have been nothing but nice to me so I've gotten the dad to agree we just won't talk politics.
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #37
56. Truly shameful.
The republicans are showing their true colors in their debased attacks on an honorable and valorous veteran. It is clear that service to Nation means nothing to them. The only thing they repsect is service to their fuhrer, and their demented neocon policies.
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clydefrand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
38. I am always appalled when the hosts of these shows
NEVER follow up or question what they have heard and must know is wrong. I sent out 15+ emails to all the reporters on CNN telling them they aren't doing their jobs because they let half-truths be told without questions. I'm so pissed that these people are let off so easily. I think some of it is ignorance and some is bias and some is time constraints. Only PBS Jim Leher seems to have follow-ups and demands thorough explanations from its guests.
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Tomee450 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #38
44. It bothers
me also when hosts do not correct lies. I know the hosts at C-span are to be neutral but they could at least correct statements they know are untrue. I cannot see why they would think that telling the truth is taking sides.
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
39. So Bush didn't really earn his Purple Hearts.
Oh right. He REALLLY didn't earn his Purple Hearts.
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Generator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
52. Does anyone ever point out the obvious on this?
It's petty,mean, sour grapes and besides all that if you question the validity of Kerry's purple hearts, then aren't you leaving it open to question, belittle and yes BASH anyone that got a purple heart.

Why don't we just say-we don't know what anybody really did in a war zone-they are all heros. Even though of course, they all can't be. But the converse is true, if you want to bash Kerry for it, let's just say all purple hearts aren't earned. How frigging tacky and insulting is that?

But-we certainly know Shrubya earned squat- he never reported for duty at all!

They are idiots with this line.

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Bozita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
53. "I'm a Veteran -- and GW Bush Didn't Earn Any "Honorable Discharge"
hmmmm
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DrWeird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
54. He's probably lying about being a veteran too.
Somebody should check out these "Vets Against Kerry." I'll bet a good portion of them never served. Apparently there's a lot of people out there that lie about their veteran status. I think there's also a lot of people who like to call their bluff. I think I heard about a website that lists a lot of people who claim to have been green berets but never were.
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vetwife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #54
57. Most did not see combat up close and personal for sure !
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Toots Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #54
58. It is almost obvious from what was said that he was not a Combat
Vet. At least a Vietnam Combat Vet. When he talked about running away from a battle it was obvious he had never been in a battle in Vietnam. There was no place to run.
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jdj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #54
67. this is unbelievable and outrageous:
I linked to this page from http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnkerry.com

"As for Islamic claims of outrage because Arab prisoners were sexually humiliated, every United States female soldier taken captive by the Iraqis, without exception, have admitted they were raped repeatedly while being held prisoners of war."
http://www.usvetdsp.com/atrocities_iraq.htm

This is the biggest load of crap. Jessica Lynch never stated she was raped, and Shoshanna Johnson never mentioned rape either. What a bunch of freaking liars. This page intersperses pictures from Abu Ghraib with pictures from 9/11 (jumpers, buildings falling, etc). It really gives you chills when you realize that in this case, these people WERE NOT misinformed, they JUST DON'T CARE that the Iraqis were not responsible for 9/11.


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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
59. This crap is insulting to ALL soldiers
Some idiot tried telling me that one of Kerry's Purple Heart awards was for a "shrapnel wound so minor it only needed a band aid". He said the doctor who treated Kerry supposedly said so but of course no source was cited...never is.

Could you imagine a shrapnel wound being "minor"? My father recieved one of his Purple Heart awards because of shrapnel and it sounds like a disgusting, painful thing to go through. Burning hot sharp metal shards piecering your skin. Yeah, real fun.

War is never easy and never pretty. These idiots who try to gloss over the hell Kerry volunteered for are banking on the idea that most Americans think of war as nothing more than a video game. It's easy to judge the hardships of others when you never have to walk in their shoes...or in this case, run in their combat boots.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #59
62. However!
If bush* assuming he was ever in a combat situation, :eyes: had received a "minor" shrapnel wound these same idiots would be saying what a brave guy he was. Cheneying hypocrites!
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #62
68. It is disgusting!!!
People that don't know a freakin' thing about real war talkin' crap about a real war hero.

"the RW is circulating a lot of rumors (and lies)."

That is their MO. We must counter them with truth.


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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:09 PM
Response to Original message
64. So? Kerry was THERE, DUMBASS!
The editor from the Army Times was on c-span and said he checked into Kerry's medals and he earned them and anyone who said otherwise is being "churlish"!
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:15 PM
Response to Original message
65. So much for Support Our Troops eh...
I guess they mean support the troops who are on their side. I caught the movie Platoon again on cable last week. It reminded me that the troops fighting the wars are just as politically divided as those of us at home trying to help them. You catch bits of it in F-9/11 as well. You'd think the fact that Kerry and McCaine were able to see through their differences and work together on the POW issue might make some of these assholes shut up, then again, they attacked McCaine's patriotism when he was beating the Shrub in the 2K primaries(not to mention Clelands in 2K2) so it shows that they have no respect whatsoever for people who did what they were afraid to do.
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playahata1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #65
70. Yes, I was about to say don't forget about Max Cleland
and what happened to him in 2002. All this "braver-than-thou," "who-went-through-the-most-hell-in-'Nam" shit is bullshit.
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Bake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
69. Somebody needs to say this every day of the campaign
"The Republicans are so desperate that they have stooped to lying about John Kerry's service record. LYING, PEOPLE, LYING. Lying to the American public."

That needs to be said every day until November 2, by somebody who can command media attention. We cannot let the Pukes do a "Gore job" on JFK wihtout challenging them.

Bake
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BenDavid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-04 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
72. I do not wish to go on a rant here,
but to receive a Silver Star one has to face the enemy and an opposing force. This means one must be in country, in battle and not in some dusty ass town in Texas or Alabama.Of the two men running for President, Kerry is the only one that was in country, in battle and faced the enemy that was an opposing force, and was recommended for the Silver Star. The other person named Bush was in one of those dusty ass towns in Texas or Alabama.

"For distinguished gallantry in action against an enemy of the United States or while serving with friendly forces against an opposing enemy force."

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