John Kerry: The next Senate Minority Leader to lead the fight?

[Pachamama]

For the last 48 hours I've been angry and confused about his concession....I have come to the conclusion that it was a very smart and shrewd political move... While Kerry's conceding seemed "gentlemanly" I believe its not because they didn't win, but because they wouldn't be able to "prove" it and leading a war of lawyers would only give fuel to the right wing....I think it was the only way he could save some political clout for the fight on another day...I think that Kerry will become the new Senate Minority Leader fighting the good fight for Jeffersonian democracy and demonstrate to the American people and world what kind of leader he is and wait now till 2008 for the next election and this was his political move...

Meanwhile John Edwards, GOOD CHRISTIAN, a principled son of a mill worker from the working class, loving father & husband, fighter for the "little guy" against corporations will lead the fight as the next head of the Democratic Nat'l Committee....

Thoughts DUers?

:kick:

[cheezus]

1. let's pick someone who actually wants to fight

[Pachamama]

3. I believe that Kerry is still fighting for us...sometimes, and you can ask

any General, its smarter to wait and attack at the right time...I believe in John Kerry and haven't given up on him...just wait and see....

:kick:

[The Backlash Cometh]

6. Scrappy, blue-collar origins.

Someone who can bluff his way through a poker game with low cards. That's who we need.

[truthseeker1]

2. The next DNC chair is supposedly a woman....

the clue was in The Note yesterday.

Hillary?

[Pachamama]

5. No, I don't believe that...

Maybe they will appoint Co-Chairs... My vote would be John Edwards and Donna Brazil...then when 2008 comes along, Edwards could leave his post to join Kerry in the run fopr the White House...or....he would contine to lead the DNC and Kerry would choose as his running mate Hillary or....Barrack Obama....

:bounce:

[mazzarro]

9. Kerry's time have come and gone by.

He chose not to fight on. We are better with someone with the stomach to fight even when had pressed to give up.

[Pachamama]

10. How do you know what he is doing right now? How do you know he isn't

doing something behind the scenes right now? How much (or little)faith did you have in him to begin with? Was he an "Anybody but Bush" candidate for you? Not me...I gave him my trust and he still hs it...I'm more loyal and patient than that...you haven't heard the last from John Kerry...he's been fighting for us all his life...he still is...just watch...

:kick:

[Zhade]

20. Unless he fights against the BBV fraud and ensures every vote counts...

...he is worse than useless to us now.

If - IF! - he really is working on something to take the presidency that I think we all know is currently being stolen from him, then I will be first in line to grovel for forgiveness for doubting him.

Until I see him fight for us, I can conclude nothing but that he is a quitter who didn't really mean it when he said he'd get our back.

And to answer the question you asked another DUer, I was always ABB where Kerry was concerned. His foreign policy is terrible. But I never, EVER thought he didn't want to be president. I NEVER thought he'd fold faster than Superman on laundry day (to crib from The Simpsons). At this point, it looks like he did.

I'd be OVERJOYED! to be proven wrong. I want Kerry to prove me wrong. Will he?

[LittleClarkie]

14. Why do we always do this to our candidates

We use them and discard them like so much garbage. Throw them out there and then kick them to the side.

Well, I may be the Red Sox fan of politics, but I'm sticking by my candidate. That's part of showing some backbone in this party. I'm not going to keep rushing from one candidate to the next because I think they can win. I have made my choice.

Kerry for Minority Leader in 04
Kerry for President in 08

Which reminds me. I need to go back to Senate.gov and finish emailing all the Dem senators on Kerry's behalf.

[Pachamama]

19. Thank you LilClarkie! If I was a SwiftBoat Capt, I'd want you on my boat!

I'm with you....I don't discard them like garbage as it seems so many do...Kerry is still fighting with us and we need to back him up...I'd rather have him as Minority Leader in the Senate, leading the way for freedom and democracy than to hang it up and be a lame-duck Senator who gets trashed by the media, the fellow Senators on the Right, the Right Wing and ofcourse the "once supportive" backers of him....

Kerry for Minority Leader of the Senate '04
Kerry for President '08

I'm going to start emailing too...

:kick:

[Zhade]

21. Uh, NO. Donna Brazile is good friends with KARL ROVE.

FUCK that.

[Pachamama]

24. Friends? I'm not sure its Friends...more like friendly rivals -who better

...than someone who knows him very well to take him on and take him down?

:eyes:

[Zhade]

27. No, Pachamama - I mean FRIENDS.

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:mHF_VhLF2AIJ:www.democrats.com/preview.cfm%3Fterm%3DKarl%2520Rove+Donna+brazile%2Bkarl+rove&hl=en

Karl Rove's Network includes Key Democrats
10-Mar-03
Karl Rove
PentaPost reports, "Few would suspect that Rove regularly trades tips with Donna Brazile, Al Gore's 2000 campaign manager; she tells Rove how Bush's proposals are faring among Democrats, while Rove makes sure her clients are included in White House events... Brian Lunde, former executive director of the Democratic National Committee and one of the few Democrats on the list, helped the Bush 2000 campaign round up Democratic supporters. After Bush took office, Lunde has recommended Democrats for White House appointments, especially in cases requiring selections from both parties. During consideration of trade proposals and protective measures for the steel industry, Lunde could suggest to Rove potential Democratic supporters, which, in turn, advanced the interests of such Lunde clients as the Business Roundtable and Nucor Steel, which backed the administration initiatives."



http://members.cox.net/fweil/NYT030221.htm

New York Times
February 21, 2003
Frustrated Democrat Makes Friends in G.O.P.
By KATHARINE Q. SEELYE

WASHINGTON — Two years ago, Donna Brazile, then Al Gore's campaign manager, was engaged in daily combat with Karl Rove, then George W. Bush's top campaign strategist.

Today, they chirpily exchange e-mail, chat on the phone and write letters, indulging in their shared zeal for the inner workings of politics.

"I like her a lot," said Mr. Rove, now ensconced in the West Wing as President Bush's chief political adviser.

Ms. Brazile, a committed Democrat who was the first black woman to manage a presidential campaign, has built similar relationships with other Republicans, like Grover Norquist, an influential conservative strategist. And her coziness with them comes as she is deeply frustrated with her own party for what she calls years of taking African-Americans for granted and for failing to organize for elections in a coherent way.


Like I said - FUCK THAT. We don't need anyone who is friends with a guy like Rove anywhere near a leadership position.

[Pachamama]

31. I've read her books, seen her interviewed and met her personally...

...trust me - they aren't friends - friendly rivals...there is a very big difference....Sometimes, Zhade, its better to keep your enemy close to you in order to know how to defeat them....

:eyes:

[Zhade]

32. Sorry. I disagree. Vehemently.

You simply do not cozy up to people like Rove and expect me to trust you. It won't happen.

[The Backlash Cometh]

7. I really want to give Hillary a full endorsement, but...

she is an incredibly political saavy lady and I really need to feel she'll put our kids' interests before those of the pro-Israel lobbist. Remember, Big Dawg once said that he would die for Israel.

Kind of scared me a wee bit.

[Zhade]

22. Not too thrilled with her stock holdings, either.

Kinda hard to believe she gives a fuck about workers' rights when she has financial interests in Wal-Mart, one of the most egregious abusers of workers on the planet.

[Pachamama]

26. Well, not so fast - I own stock in BP oil & I'm a staunch environmentalist

...this is because I found that aside from contributing sums of money to the Sierra Club, Rainforest Action Network and other environmental groups, I found I can "influence change" by owning enough stock as a shareholder that I can participate in referendums for change at shareholder meetings. I am sure most American Democrats who are investors would be shocked to learn just how much of their stock portfolio and 401K investments etc are in companies that are egregious and awful, whether it be workers rights, environmental abuses etc. Short of someone taking the time to invest with groups like the Socially Responsible Investment Group via Piper Jaffray or following Amy Domini and the Domini index, most people wouldn't have a clue about where their investment money is really going....Don't knock Hillary so fast...while she has her imperfections, she does care about human rights, healthcare, fair trade, civil liberties, gay rights, woman's right to choice etc....

[Zhade]

29. Unless you own millions of shares, good luck - you'll have zero impact.

I would personally find it distasteful to invest money with such companies, thus enabling them. That's just me, though.

[Pachamama]

33. Well, that's your opinion...and I and other shareholders have managed

to have some impact....already in the last two years, I have been a part of 3 shareholder driven inititatives to hold them accountable for environmental impact and moving BP in the direction of alternative energies. We have actually had great success and while no, I personally don't own more than 3000 shares, together with the other shareholders, we do own millions of shares and we have together had an impact....baby steps, but atleast moving them forward....we all do what we can...I donate money to organizations that I think will make a difference, try to live a life around being a more ecologically aware consumer and sustainability and respect for our planet and I try to influence the ignorant who are damaging it....I do not see that as "enabling" but rather as "influencing"...big difference....

[the Princess]

4. Right now I am still so angry that he quit on us

I don't want anything from him.

I have a sneaking suspicion John Edwards would not have given up. He seems more like a fighter to me.

John Dean and John Edwards that's the next ticket I want to see.

[Pachamama]

8. I was angry too...but when I calmed down and thought about it, I realized

that a man who as a soldier in Vietnam never fled a fight but rather fought smart, would be making a decision using his brain not the raw emotion of the moment...let me ask you and all the people who supported him and trusted him to lead this country: How deep did that trust and faith run? For me, I trusted the lives and future of my children in his hands...why would I and anyone else give up on him so easily? I'm not...As someone in the crowd said to Kerry in his concession speech - "We've got your back John" and you know what? He's got ours...and he needs our support....

Also - keep something in mind folks...concession speeches aren't legally binding and don't mean squat...what if I told you that a lot can happen between now and Dec. 13th? The Electoral College hasn't met and declared the next President...the votes are still being counted in New Mexico, Ohio, Iowa, Florida etc...What if people were demanding investigations into the computer voting mishaps and dicepancies? What if private citizens file lawsuits and make enough noise? A lot can happen....Don't count John Kerry out and don't lose faith...otherwise, "they" have won....

[Zhade]

23. You know, Kerry himself yanked the rug out from under us.

I understand you want to believe he's still fighting for us, but the fact is he gave a concession speech where none was needed. Yes, it's not legally binding. Yes, he will take the presidency if he gets the votes once the rest are counted. No, the public will not see it as legit if he does.

He should have waited the 11 days, and not caved on us so unexpectedly. It knocked the wind out of the sails of those of us ready to march, file lawsuits, demand the votes be counted whatever it takes.

It's hard to fight for a leader when he won't even give you the perceived time to do so.

[Pachamama]

28. I know more than most what its like to have had that rug pulled from under

me....I have spent the greater part of the last year not just personally giving what would be a life savings for most people to both the DNC, almost every 527 you can name, first Howard Dean, Wesley Clark, John Edwards and then eventually John Kerry, but I personally wrote over 500 letters by hand to women in swing states and sent them out via Priority Mail, I hosted MoveOn.org Bake Sales, I knocked on doors, I organized and participated in huge fundraisers raising money for the dems and in particular the GELAC fund recently for the Kerry/Edwards campaign, contributing almost $10K personally to the "legion" of lawyers for Kerry....I traveled on my own dime to three swing states along with my two kids, knocking on doors and working at Phonebanks. On Election day, I was a poll monitor in Ohio, standing in the pouring rain and working over 14 hours that day (while in between nursing my 10 month old) who was in the mini-van I rented sleeping nearby along with my friend who drove it around knocking on doors seeing if people needed rides to the polls. In fact, I didn't get the word that Kerry had conceded until I was standing in the baggage claim of San Francisco Airport having just traveled for over 10 hours from Cleveland, Ohio. When I got on the plane from Cleveland, nothing had been decided...when I arrived in Atlanta to connect planes, nothing had been decided....to then arrive in SFO, full of hope, full of energy for the fight, believe me, hearing the news, I was in full denial...it was as if I had someone kick me in the stomach....I was angry and felt betrayed....but after a good nights sleep and several calls with people involved with the campaign, I came to the realization of what had happened and why he did what he did....like I said, it was the right thing to do....and I know he's still fighting for us....you trusted him before....trust him again....

All of us who still support him - send emails and let them know your thoughts...if your angry, that's okay, but tell them what you want him to be doing!

[Zhade]

30. Sorry to break it to you, but I never trusted Kerry.

So if anything, you should be even more infuriated at his decision than I am!

[Pachamama]

34. But I'm not....and I still trust Kerry and support him....

I say that with the knowledge that he is fighting for us....its not some blind loyalty...very different than the sheeple christian fundies following their savior W.....

Perhaps you will someday see and understand....

Namaste to you Zhade...

[Zhade]

37. Boy, talk about condescending.

You know, I like your posts normally, but this series has been unpleasant.

"Perhaps you will someday see and understand...."

Ironic that you would mention fundies, when these words are a routine phrase they (and even some Christians here on DU) use toward atheists like myself. Perhaps I already understand, and you're the one optimistic about something that will not happen. If, on the other hand, you know something, please share it with the rest of us currently upset by Kerry folding.

I'll be very happy to be proven wrong, if it happens.

Peace.

[Pachamama]

13. He didn't quit on us...and neither did John Edwards....

Don't quit on either of them...not yet....

:kick:

[Old and In the Way]

11. Kerry is fighting, no doubt.

I'd absolutely be 100% behind a Kerry leadership position....he is safe in Massachusetts and he has the motivation to go after them.

[Pachamama]

12. I really believe that we have not heard the last word on this issue...

...stay tuned... he has always been a fighter for us all...that doesn't change suddenely....if the news is true about him having refused to take Big Dawg's advice and to support the anti-gay marriage amendments, then I can say from the bottom of my soul that this man is never going to turn his backs on us....he is still fighting....but the SMART fight....stay tuned...

:kick:

[Lenape85]

15. NO, NO, NO, AND NO

He would never make a good minority leader

[dand]

16. Kerry folded like a cheap suit.

He allowed the Fascist bastards to walk right over him.

WE NEED A LEADER WITH A SPINE! I don't see any one out there, (sigh).

[tjdee]

17. A minority leader?? As a consolation prize?

I think it would anger me more to see John Kerry playing second fiddle to Bill "I killed cats" Frist than to see him be a regular Senator.

[Dob Bole]

18. I want Byrd.

I'm not going to get what I want, it's true....but I still want Byrd to be the minority leader. He's populist enough, and he stood up against the war.

[JackRiddler]

25. Wow.

The power of self-deception is AWESOME!

[Pachamama]

35. What self-deception is that?

Do tell...I'm all ears....

:eyes:

[JackRiddler]

39. About Kerry

That he's going to lead the charge from the Senate floor, that he's preparing a secret campaign to sweep himself back in, that he's anything other than bought and paid for (morally if not literally) since around 1992 or so when he made his last move of any significance against the Bush mob (BCCI exposure) ... all attractive propositions that have me sort of hoping too ... and all likely bunk.

On Edit: And I want Byrd too. Ain't happening.

[redherring]

36. Kerry told Bush that we need to do something about

cultural divide in this country when he talked to Bush in order to concede his defeat. At this point in time, we need as much division between democrats and republicans as possible. With this type of rhetoric, Kerry is not the right choice. We need a hardcore liberal senator from up North.

[AllyCat]

38. Fight? Is that what that was called?