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al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 12:20 PM
Original message
C-SPAN1: Ohio Vote in the 2004 Election
Edited on Wed Dec-08-04 12:27 PM by al bupp
Live broadcast of hearing about voting fraud/problems in Ohio!

On edit, discussion happening here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=127992&mesg_id=127992

Thanks to the alert mods here on DU!
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. truth at last
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al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Let's hope so...
:kick:
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Liberty Belle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. More from the C-Span hearing:

I couldn't get most of the names, which weren't printed onscreen. Here's a summary of the last portion:

An attorney said that Justice Sandra Day O'Connor has said privately that she almost changed her mind about voting to let all votes be counted in 2000. He urged her to look in the mirror and consider the stakes if cases from this election wind up in the Supreme Court.

Another speaker (didn't catch name) warned that the future of Democracy is at stake. Voters who want to vote out Republicans in power in the 2006 elections "Won't be able to do that if they won't count our votes and we won't be able to do that if they own the voting machines."

Aaron Rubin (sp?) of NY suggested state Constitutional amendments be implemented via ballot initiatives to protect voting rights; Conyers said a federal measure is needed.

Lyn Landis (sp?)a journalist, said "What's missing from this discussion is `No machines at all.' The U.S. is in the extreme minority worldwide in using machines...We have the right to have our votes counted." Audits of machines deny pollworkers the right to observe the process, she added.

Rep.. Jerrold Nadler objected to her idea, saying paper ballots are susceptible to fraud and that old clunky voting machines are better, based on his experience in NY.

Landis countered by sayin MIT studies showed that old fashioned, paper ballots counted by hand are the best.

Conyers thank her and said the issue of no machines hadn't been raised and was a good thing to think about.

***IMPORTANT: An African American man--get this--said that in 15 red states, there is NO LAW (only tradition) saying that all electors must vote for the candidate who won the popular vote. "Democrats could win this election now--simply by having Democratic electors vote for Kerry," he said.
Conyers said of the man's testimony: "THIS IS THE MOST AMAZING PROPOSITION EVER PUT FORWARD BY A NON-LAWYER" and said it's worth considering if true.

A woman said "You ask me to pay taxes. You ask me to send my children to war. Now tell me why...You want my sons to die for you and my daughters to wave flags..Now tell me what you'll do for me...My vote must be counted if we're going to shed our blood."

A man representing a youth group said "This election should NOT be certified by Congress."

A Navy Veteran who fought in the first Gulf War revealed that he filed a report with the FBI on November 9th alleging Voter Fraud in PArry County..."Did I do wrong in contacting the FBI?" he asked, then revealed, "I called the FBI on Friday and they told me that they turned my case over to the state ATtorney General's office." (Gasp from the crowd). Conyers had received a letter from the man and asked about his case in a letter to Blackwell, which Blackwell ignored. Conyers promised to have a committee lawyer meet with the man.

JASon Ross/Roth? of LaRouche Youth Movement called for federal prosecutions of voting suppression in all states, including those that went for Kerry, to avoid certifying Bush.

Ellen Broadsky? Verified Voting, criticized Broward County, FL officials for claiming election ran smoothly. She said none of the early voting machines were tested Oct 15th for accuracy.
ONE POLLING PLACE HAD TO BE SHUT DOWN IN BROWARD COUNTY becuase of problems with the machines "so we don't really know how many poeple voted early on these machines."

Conyers is assigning a congressman (WExler?) to work with her and said Florida's lack of due process would not be acceptable to anyone.

Software from the 2002 governor's primary resulted in loss of something like 102,000 ballots, Broadsky said; County & ES&S werew awawre the software wasn't fixed and did nothing. "We need citizens canvasing boards to count votes, people who are not married to the voting machine companies," she added.

**JEFF FISHER (Fischer?) announced he submitted proof of vote fraud in this election and a previous one (governor's race, I think--is Jeb in by fraud?)--including how it was done-- to the FBI and that the Chicago Tribune confirms the FBI is investigating. Conyers asked to see the material he'd submitted and said he'd guarantee a meeting between Fisher and committee staff.

Fisher shouted to the crowd after told his time was up "I want America to know more about this" and gave a website (I think it was www.walkingwithfisher.com (fischer?). Then he shouted at the committed "You all swore on a Bible to protect our rights" etc.

Rep. Bobby Scott asked that rights of the disabled be protected in any changes made to voting procedures.


-- end of hearing--
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Liberty Belle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
3. HEre's what's happened so far:
I tuned in 15 minutes into it.

Jesse Jackson called for a constitutional amendment to protect our right to vote.

ARnebeck, the lawyer filling the latest lawsuit in Ohio, says he will use statistical evidence by Freeman and two others to "point the finger" at fraud. He vowed to fix the fraud issues in THIS ELECTION and said he will use discovery powers in the next week to unearth the truth. "We intend to employ the best experts in the country" to identify precisely how the electronic manipulations were accomplished, he added.

Someone from a Citizens Alliance (didn't catch the name) stood up and said a lot of the problems were in the central tabulators in Ohio.

Someone else said certain precincts in Ohio showed 98.55% turnout wihtout the absentees. Impoundment of the voting machine(s) was called for.

Best question so far: Jesse Jackson Jr. asked if the Ohio problems remain unresolved, "Might this committee object to the seating of Ohio electors?" The chair replied, "We are now!"

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Liberty Belle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 01:41 PM
Response to Original message
5. More from the C-Span hearing
More from the C-Span hearing:



I couldn't get most of the names, which weren't printed onscreen. Here's a summary of the last portion:

An attorney said that Justice Sandra Day O'Connor has said privately that she almost changed her mind about voting to let all votes be counted in 2000. He urged her to look in the mirror and consider the stakes if cases from this election wind up in the Supreme Court.

Another speaker (didn't catch name) warned that the future of Democracy is at stake. Voters who want to vote out Republicans in power in the 2006 elections "Won't be able to do that if they won't count our votes and we won't be able to do that if they own the voting machines."

Aaron Rubin (sp?) of NY suggested state Constitutional amendments be implemented via ballot initiatives to protect voting rights; Conyers said a federal measure is needed.

Lyn Landis (sp?)a journalist, said "What's missing from this discussion is `No machines at all.' The U.S. is in the extreme minority worldwide in using machines...We have the right to have our votes counted." Audits of machines deny pollworkers the right to observe the process, she added.

Rep.. Jerrold Nadler objected to her idea, saying paper ballots are susceptible to fraud and that old clunky voting machines are better, based on his experience in NY.

Landis countered by sayin MIT studies showed that old fashioned, paper ballots counted by hand are the best.

Conyers thank her and said the issue of no machines hadn't been raised and was a good thing to think about.

***IMPORTANT: An African American man--get this--said that in 15 red states, there is NO LAW (only tradition) saying that all electors must vote for the candidate who won the popular vote. "Democrats could win this election now--simply by having Democratic electors vote for Kerry," he said.
Conyers said of the man's testimony: "THIS IS THE MOST AMAZING PROPOSITION EVER PUT FORWARD BY A NON-LAWYER" and said it's worth considering if true.

A woman said "You ask me to pay taxes. You ask me to send my children to war. Now tell me why...You want my sons to die for you and my daughters to wave flags..Now tell me what you'll do for me...My vote must be counted if we're going to shed our blood."

A man representing a youth group said "This election should NOT be certified by Congress."

A Navy Veteran who fought in the first Gulf War revealed that he filed a report with the FBI on November 9th alleging Voter Fraud in PArry County..."Did I do wrong in contacting the FBI?" he asked, then revealed, "I called the FBI on Friday and they told me that they turned my case over to the state ATtorney General's office." (Gasp from the crowd). Conyers had received a letter from the man and asked about his case in a letter to Blackwell, which Blackwell ignored. Conyers promised to have a committee lawyer meet with the man.

JASon Ross/Roth? of LaRouche Youth Movement called for federal prosecutions of voting suppression in all states, including those that went for Kerry, to avoid certifying Bush.

Ellen Broadsky? Verified Voting, criticized Broward County, FL officials for claiming election ran smoothly. She said none of the early voting machines were tested Oct 15th for accuracy.
ONE POLLING PLACE HAD TO BE SHUT DOWN IN BROWARD COUNTY becuase of problems with the machines "so we don't really know how many poeple voted early on these machines."

Conyers is assigning a congressman (WExler?) to work with her and said Florida's lack of due process would not be acceptable to anyone.

Software from the 2002 governor's primary resulted in loss of something like 102,000 ballots, Broadsky said; County & ES&S werew awawre the software wasn't fixed and did nothing. "We need citizens canvasing boards to count votes, people who are not married to the voting machine companies," she added.

**JEFF FISHER (Fischer?) announced he submitted proof of vote fraud in this election and a previous one (governor's race, I think--is Jeb in by fraud?)--including how it was done-- to the FBI and that the Chicago Tribune confirms the FBI is investigating. Conyers asked to see the material he'd submitted and said he'd guarantee a meeting between Fisher and committee staff.

Fisher shouted to the crowd after told his time was up "I want America to know more about this" and gave a website (I think it was www.walkingwithfisher.com (fischer?). Then he shouted at the committed "You all swore on a Bible to protect our rights" etc.

Rep. Bobby Scott asked that rights of the disabled be protected in any changes made to voting procedures.


-- end of hearing--




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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-04 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
6. I'm just crossposting to the 2 big threads for those interested
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