Is The U.S. Irredeemably Evil?

[cali]

Are we nothing but a nation built on an imperialistic and racist past? Or is this, perhaps, a little too simplistic a perspective? Forgive me for asking, but sometimes I get the impression that a significant number of DUers believe that this country is evil and it's history nothing but a litany of oppression.

[kclown]

1. Imperialism and racism are having a pretty good run these days

Humility is what is AWOL.  We all oppose the solipsism of
"freedom is on the march" while the dead rot in the
streets.  

History is the litany of oppression, and the stories of people
doing something to fix it. 

Vermont?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

2. Nicely said. Gandhi would agree.

“What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy.” - Gandhi

[tx_dem41]

4. When has imperialism and racism NOT had a good run? n/t

[billbuckhead]

5. Face it, we were founded by the people who gave natives smallpox blankets

and then said they were uncivilized. Americans will go down in history as equivalent to the dreaded Ferrenghi.

[cali]

10. Well said.

As a nation, we've never valued humility. Even Vietnam didn't really make an impression. How do we teach the value of humility over hubris and reflection over reaction? Beats the hell out of me.


Yes, Vermont. You too?

[toymachines]

3. well in many ways yes, we have done evil acts

but i think we were the first real attempt to inegrate and eventually elevate every race and gender (maybe someday sexual orientation). In doing so we have caused a lot of tension between the divided parties. It is safe to say that most of these groups have interests that conflict with many of the others. this is where isms of all forms arise. we evolved to live in small tribal gatherings and encounter a relatively small amount of people each day, within a given area, so they all were alike. now that we are in urban and suburban areas we encounter thousands of people everyday, live in artificiality, and because of the system of economics that we aer in, everyone is really out to skrew everyone else. in any case, there is internal strife. And as for agression against our opponents, we have always pushed the envelope in war, hiroshima/nagasaki, iraq, vietnam, we like to oppress people that go against our... our something. I dont know, thats my ramble.

[noiretextatique]

8. the first? hardly, why do you think black people went to europe

to escape jim crow?
the BIG LIE of the rw backlash has been that extending rights to some other means giving up your own rights...and that is a LIE. what it does mean it giving up PRIVILEGES...white, male, heterosexual, xtian, and so on, that are considered as inalienable, natural, and normal.
there are no conflicting interests between people of different races, genders or sexual preferences...there is only the insistence that one group is more supreme than another, and that one group gets to mete out rights as if they "own" them. and yes...it's an integral component of the american myth about its self, which is basically this:
"whatever we do is ok (no matter no evil it is) because we did it...and hey, we said we were sorry, so stop your bitching already."
my friend karenina says america never really did any soul-searching of the kind germany was forced to do after WWII for example.
that's my ramble :D

[wuushew]

6. For the most part its our actions not our intentions

Somewhat like the difference between a Nazi SS solider rolling into Russia vs. the lied and mislead American solider who accomplishing things remarkably similar. Many of the bad things that have happened because of American actions are a result of well meaning buffoonery and a relenting to you have to break some eggs to make an omelet mentality.

[Deja Q]

7. Jefferson was a hypocrite, but Franklin gave us a bunch of good one liners

No, we were never irredeemably evil.

And we taught the world how to end slavery and be kind to each other.

Pity it didn't rub off on us, because many other countries saw our hypocrisy, made changes on their end to make us look bad, realized we're all human, and then became friends with us after it took a lot of people killing each other.

And so the world revolves... :crazy:

[BillZBubb]

13. The US taught the world NOTHING on slavery!

The civilized world ended slavery long before 1862. England did it almost a century earlier.

Perhaps your post was sarcasm?

[noiretextatique]

14. and to be kind to each other?

unless 100 years of jim crow is considered "kindness"...this must be sarcasm.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

15. The Ancient Greeks Had Slaves...

I think any powerful person or people is tempted to use that power to exploit others....

[Goathead]

9. The United States is a country at odds with itself

We proclaim the greatness of our freedoms, we allow foreigners from all over the planet to join us in those freedoms by extending them citizenship but we, as a collective whole, believe that we are exempt from the great responsibility that those freedoms grant us, and then we chastise the immigrants who come to our shores for what we perceive as their contempt for our country.

We have this euphoric ideal of the greatness of America that really does not exists and like spoiled children we refuse to take responsibility for our actions, like the effects of globalization on foreign countries and the environment.
Greed rules in the U.S. and our politicians are as corrupt as any junta-come-lately third world banana republic.

Unfortunately, the country was founded on oppression and genocide and the two are intertwined, the early colonies had to import slaves from Africa because the indigenous peoples whom they were going to enslave were dying off from the diseases introduced by the white man.
The American Indian also occupied land that the colonizers wanted.

It is sad, sick legacy that we as Americans have all inherited.
This oppression is also written directly into our laws, The U.S. Constitution was written by slave holders for slave holders, every single one of our rights, that we hold so dear is dripping in with the blood of those whose humanity we have destroyed.

[Minstrel Boy]

11. No nation is irredeemably evil,

but the United States does need to redeem itself, or it will be judged for its evils. Which - I'm sorry - are many, and can be counted in part by the millions of lives it's taken.

Empires are another matter. They can be irredeemably evil. And fascist empires with a global reach certainly are.

[Redleg]

12. NO, nations are not evil- the leaders may be.

That's just like saying Ronnie Raygun's "evil empire" bullshit had validity.

[Sara Beverley]

16. No just the political leaders...on both sides!

The ones with the most power are the most evil.