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I sometimes have the good fortune to travel to countries in Europe.

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KlatooBNikto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:38 PM
Original message
I sometimes have the good fortune to travel to countries in Europe.
Over the years, I have come to notice, how free of paranoia those countries are, how liberal and freethinking those people ( especially
Scandinavians) are and how the common good is preferred in those countries over self glorification. By and large, the civilized and adult behavior of people in Sweden sharply contrasts with the overgrown adolescence of ours.Every issue appears to be treated calmly and in a mature way without the frenzied madness that is all too common here.

Is it something we eat?
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DebJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. just old American cockiness, smugness...and ignorance
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latteromden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:47 PM
Response to Original message
2. Ah, jeg elsker Skandinavia. We've got a lot to learn from them.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
3. You just gave me a hankering for smorgasbord. I guess
it's time to eat dinner.
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patdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
4. There is speculation about flouride in the drinking water
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Celeborn Skywalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
5. Various things make the US different from Europe
Many who came to this country were more religious than their countrymen in Europe and that is part of the reason why we've got so many fundy nut-jobs that keep our society more socially regressive than Europe. Another factor is our shitty corporate media that keeps the population largely ignorant. If we can take back the media in this country we might start moving to a civilization similar to that of Western Europe.
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KlatooBNikto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. When I said liberalism, I meant liberal in a social and cultural context.
Not the politically charged term that has become the common usage over here. The Swedes are liberal in matters sexual, about religious beliefs ( you do what you want, it is your business),abortion,and a myriad things that make our religious nuts go bonkers.

The fact that Sweden has not been involved in any wars in centuries goes to show how a society that allows true personal freedom will not be war like. This is why as an American I found the peaceful and decent behavior of our Swedish fellow human beings so refreshing and invigorating.

Yes Virginia, there indeed is a better way.
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Lenape85 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
16. agreed
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alcuno Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 09:58 PM
Response to Original message
6. Something like 5% of all Americans ever leave the country.
We don't get out much and have been encouraged to develop a warped sense of nationalism.
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Florida_Geek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
8. you will see 13 yo kids with backpacks traveling on trains
over the summer without a worry in the world. But not in gun toting good old US of A.

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KlatooBNikto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. That reminds me of the time when I was in India on business when I
ran into a group of girls from Linz, Austria, all of them between the ages 13-15 backpacking and traveling by trains and buses throughout India. I was absolutely amazed.
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:04 PM
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9. My 5 years in Central Europe changed me forever.
I met all kinds of people from Scandanavia to Spain. Frankly the self aware, and yes satisfied, attitudes of the Norwegeans always impressed me. I guess living is a semi-Socialist state can work wonders on the "masses". Even the pharmacy techs that I met from Oslo were well read, could converse about Wittenstein in English, and polish off a beer faster that Jimmy Buffett.

Our "Succeed, Inherit or Fuck Off!" mentality sucks.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
11. It's in BFC
Something we eat? Well, it's something we're FED. Bowling for Columbine does a good job of exploring this. It's because we are constantly bombarded with fearful images, stories, etc. You have seen how much political mileage * has gotten by keeping everyone afraid.
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lectrobyte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
12. Haven't been to Scandanavia, but I do get to France and Belgium

a bit, and it is amazing the difference in attitudes. Makes America seem just tacky and crass. And don't even get me started on mass transit.
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KlatooBNikto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Agree absolutely.There is something about the openly aggressive
and smug attitudes many of us display even on trivial matters that creates the feelings of 'crassness' that you correctly point out.Civilized behavior is a pleasure to watch and absorb.

When I see all the sycophants Bush has to employ in addition to an army of bodyguards for his simplest travels, it comes as a shock to realize that the King and Queen of Sweden can pedal their bikes through Stockholm with not a bodyguard in sight. Amazing!
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. How does European culture relate to Canada?
I don't speak any foreign languages fluently. I know some Spanish, but not enough to live there.
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Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
15. My personal theory is that it has to do with cities and population density
and culture, of course.

Look at our own red/blue divide. Our urban centers, even in the red states, are decidedly blue. Europe packs more of their population into urban settings. Even their smaller towns are more dense than ours. Houses are smaller. They use more (crowded) mass transit. Their "personal space" is closer/smaller than ours.

I think all that closeness (here and there) fosters more of a go along to get along attitude. More caring about your neighbor because he is right there. He is not a news story, he's tangible.

Europeans **use** their cities, they live in them, right out on the streets. Most European restaurants, for example, even in colder climes like, say Amsterdam, open right up onto the sidewalks. People walk from place to place. People shop more frequently for necessities. They interact.

Interaction breeds familiarity with, and then acceptance of, others.

As to religiosity being our "undoing", I think not. The Europeans are at least as religious as we are. They just don't make it the issue our radical religious right does.

And they get out and about - to other countries - more than we do. Also, given the relatively small sizes of the European nations, none of them, alone, has much influence. They know this and thus they cooperate more than we do. I see that spirit of cooperation as being part of the reason they have a more worldly - and more world accepting - view than we do.

The above is based on my own first hand observations during my visits to Europe, not on any study or science. It is just one man's view.
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