ladies and gentlemen, I give you . . . "Prussian Blue" . . .

[OneBlueSky]

Is there anything cuter than two identical twin twelve-year-old girls who have a band together? How about if they dress in matching plaid skirts—that ups the cuteness quotient, right? And what if they perform folky versions of classic racist songs by bands like Skrewdriver and Rahowa? Whoa! Now we are heading into the cute danger zone.

http://www.viceland.com/se/v1n3/htdocs/hello.php

from their interview . . .

What do you think is the most important social issue facing the white race right now? Do you have any songs that address this issue?
Not having enough white babies born to replace ourselves and generally not having good-quality white people being born. It seems like smart white girls who have good eugenics are more interested in making money in a career or partying than getting married and having a family. And yes, we are working on some new songs about this issue.

Please tell me the significance of the name Prussian Blue.
Part of our heritage is Prussian German. Also our eyes are blue, and Prussian Blue is just a really pretty color. There is also the discussion of the lack of "Prussian Blue" coloring (Zyklon B residue) in the so-called gas chambers in the concentration camps. We think it might make people question some of the inaccuracies of the "Holocaust" myth.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Reporter: "Mr. Gandhi, what do you think of Western civilization?"
Gandhi: "I think it would be a good idea."

[tjdee]

1. Poison doesn't always kill people!

Poison can look like Victor Yuschenko's face, or these girls' minds, courtesy of their parents.

I don't get the constant denial of the Holocaust--where do they reckon those six MILLION people went to? The Bahamas?

:eyes:

[shrike]

117. I never figured that out, either

Six million people (and that's just the Jews) vanished off the face of the earth, and there was no holocaust ...

[NightTrain]

2. I didn't need to know this.

:cry:

[IStriker]

24. And I wish I had not checked to see what it is.

[BrklynLiberal]

3. self delete

[BrklynLiberal]

4. Bet their parents are real good Christians, hate gays, support the war,

and voted for the idiot.
If you actually go to the site you will read some posts that agree that these kids' minds have been poisoned, and how assinine the whole concept is.

[InvisibleBallots]

5. I bet they are Pagans, hate gays, and are against the war

because the war is "for the Jews". It seems the trend among White Supremacists is Paganism and recontructed European "blood and soil" ideology. They think Christianity is a "Jewish attack" on Western/White culture.

[InvisibleBallots]

6. Yep, Pagan White Supremacists - from their website

There is a road and it leads to Valhalla
Where only the Chosen are allowed.
There is a boy with a dream of Valhalla,
A place in the land of the Gods.
But in the heart, where the fire burns forever,
Where life goes on for those who fell in battle,
The Gods are waiting for the moment he falls in the fight,
And he will rise when the sun goes down.

He raised high his sword, as he cried out “Valhalla!”
His dream had become reality.
Tonight he will dine, on the road to Valhalla,
Chosen to feast with the Gods.
But in the heart, where the fire burns forever,
Where life goes on for the might young Viking,
The journey has finally come to and end, for the boy.
And he has risen as the bravest of them all.


...

Some day in Valhalla,
When he’s young once more.
He will hold the hand…
Of the image he adores


http://prussianblue.net/index.html

DAMNED PAGANS!!!

[InvisibleBallots]

7. yep, even more Pagan White Supremacist songs

Lo, there do I see my father
Lo, there do I see my mother and my sisters and my brothers
Lo, there do I see the line of my people back to the beginning.
Lo, they do call to me,
They bid me take my place amongst them,
In the halls of Valhalla, where the brave,
They live forever!

[rman]

20. “Valhalla" - ancient German reference to heaven

Hitler used to proclaim that dying in the battle for the 3rd Reich would guarantee a place in Valhalla.

White Supremists, Neo-Nazies, Neo-Conservatives - same difference.

[InvisibleBallots]

21. yes, a popular term among Neo-Pagan White Supremacists

of which there is a growing movement, of which these kids are a perfect example.

"Christian" white supremacists don't sing neo-Pagan songs about Valhalla and Viking mythology - but hey, facts can't get in the way of expressing anti-Christian bigotry!

[knight_of_the_star]

59. Just to let you know

Neo-Pagan White Supremacists are a VERY small minority.

[InvisibleBallots]

103. do you think CI is a majority of Christians?

Just so you know, they are not - they are a tiny minority.

[TWiley]

126. Evidently, facts don't get in the way of

pro-Christianity white-washing of issues either.

http://www.hearnow.org/id.html
http://www.carm.org/list/christian_identity.htm

There is a very small faction of the Christian Identity movement philosophy that has found similar meanings in Pagan history.

The history and bulk of religiously supported racism in America is not Pagan. Its roots are from radical Christian sects.

[jdj]

128. so which comes first, the tendency

to be an asshole, or the religious fundamentalism. From this I'd gather it's the asshole-ness.

Actually it has it's root in family dynamics, the more overbearing (to abusive) and dominant the father and weaker the mother, the more likely to produce authoritarian zenophobes. Then they go out lookin' for a logo and a creed to quiet their torturous angst.

[knight_of_the_star]

60. I hope you're not serious

"DAMNED PAGANS!!!"

There are QUITE a few of us on here, thank you. I suggest you watch your mouth and your tone sir, and keep in mind that we are probably as a group in more danger than you because so many of Pat Robertson's cronies would like to see us used as firewood. You want to do a broadbrush of ALL pagans because of what those two are saying in their songs, then you are demonstrating your intelligence is not much higher than that of your average FReeper.

[InvisibleBallots]

70. no, I was being sarcastic

Sorry, I forgot the :eyes:

"I suggest you watch your mouth and your tone sir, and keep in mind that we are probably as a group in more danger than you because so many of Pat Robertson's cronies would like to see us used as firewood. You want to do a broadbrush of ALL pagans because of what those two are saying in their songs, then you are demonstrating your intelligence is not much higher than that of your average FReeper."

Are you threatening me? And please - spare me your pretend victimization - Pat Robertson, odious as he is, is no threat to you. American Neo-Pagans are nearly 100% middle class White people - it's not like you're Muslim.

:eyes:

I wonder if you "watch your mouth" when it comes to other people's religion or lack thereof? If I had said "DAMNED CHRISTIANS" no one would have batted an eyelash.

[Khephra]

28. I understand that you're trying to make a point

But Pagan was used by Christians to refer to anyone who wasn't a Christian. Using the term in the sense you are is grouping Buddhists, Jews, Hindu, Wiccans, Taoists, etc...all in with the sub-sub-sub group of racist Nordic Pagans.

You may be trying to make a point about how people scapegoat Christians together as one group here, but next time try to do it without insulting every other religion than Christianity the next time you do it, ok?

[InvisibleBallots]

31. no, you are wrong, I am using it in a very specific sense

The White Supremacists Neo-Pagans are NOT Buddhists, nor are they Jews, nor are they Hindus, nor are they Taoists - they are Neo-Pagans - White Supremacist Neo-Pagans, who use their Neo-Pagan religion to justify discrimination against non-white people.

"You may be trying to make a point about how people scapegoat Christians together as one group here, but next time try to do it without insulting every other religion than Christianity the next time you do it, ok?"

I didn't insult every other religion other than Christianity - at the most, I insulted Neo-Paganism. I don't even think I did that - just made a few points of fact, and a few sarcastic comments.

[NightTrain]

8. Check out this brilliant posting from their message board!

Subject: This is beautiful!!!
Date: Dec 20 2004 12:16:10 PM
Author: devil dog

It just goes to show what 2 beautiful white girls can do! And they don't have any jews behind them to push them into drugs, sex, etc...
And anyone who thinks that whites aren't superior, can kiss my white arse! WE made the world comfortable for the rest of you turd world scum!

[ornotna]

26. This guy doesn't know what he's talking about

"WE made the world comfortable for the rest of you turd world scum!"

It was an African American that invented the TV remote as we know it today. }(

http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blremotecontrols.htm#adler

[Hippo_Tron]

51. DAMN STRAIGHT!

We lazy fucks would have to get off our asses every time we wanted to change the channel if it weren't for black people.

[NightTrain]

67. Not to mention the invaluable contribution of black people to music!

Ragtime
Boogie-Woogie
Blues
Jazz
Gospel
R&B
Rock 'n' Roll
Doo-Wop
Soul
Funk
Rap/Hip-Hop

The list goes on and on!

[prodigal_green]

91. Comfortable for "turd world scum"

Yeah, living under dictatorships, sometimes in virtual or actual slavery, watching your children die due to starvation or pollution caused by American corporations, etc. etc. is really comfy. As comfy as a razor-wire duvet.

[Calvinist Basset]

9. Bleagh . . .

:puke:

[MisterP]

10. Paris Green is more like it

[bvar22]

11. I prefer Acapulco Gold,

:hippie:

[MisterP]

13. Paris Green is arsenic paint

it's a nonsense poem I misremember:
"Darius Bean / drank Paris Green"

[Cronus Protagonist]

12. NOw you know the real reason for the Klan's opposition to abortion

The like it when n***rs abort, they just want white women to be barefoot and pregnant.

[Sara Beverley]

74. NOW pointed out this same reason back in the late 80's

It was all about white women having too many abortions which was thought to be caused by women getting too many civil rights and having too much interest in "careers." Homeschooling is also another way to keep women at home enabling them to have more babies. I have former classmater who lives in Utah who homeschools her children...all eight of them.

[regnaD kciN]

14. Is this serious???

This sounds like a hoax to me, particularly the interview responses. Color me skeptical, but I doubt many 12-year-olds, no matter how indoctrinated by their families, are going to launch into discources on "good eugenics" or the color of the residue of Zyklon B. The whole concept sounds like it comes straight from The Onion.

:shrug:

[Hippo_Tron]

52. I thought that at first, but they have their own website...

And if you google them they show up in quite a few places.

[kip_russell]

15. i hope this is a fake

as this has *really* turned my stomach and i would like to go to sleep tonight believing that it is a hoax.

[Tinoire]

44. Sadly no... Welcome to DU

you'll learn about more of these... They're growing every day...

:toast:

[T Town Jake]

16. Really turns my stomach, from top to bottom...

... :puke:

[TWiley]

17. Religious Vouchers probably use Tax Money to teach this shit.

You can bet the school they attend teaches "creationism" and has the 10 commandments in every classroom.

Check out the "Christian Identity Movement" The beliefs of this fundamentalist organization have become widespread.

[InvisibleBallots]

18. They aren't Christians, they are Pagans

See above. Where are these supposedly "liberal" Pagan, how come they remain silent??? :eyes:

[Khephra]

30. Ummm...are you expecting the ""liberal" Pagans" here

to be able to know that you're posting slurs at the whole Pagan super-group of world religions just by the thread title?

Yah, that must be what you mean.

As you say, see my above post.

[InvisibleBallots]

32. what slur? Please post the slur?

You can't can you? So - what do you call someone you accuses someone of something which they did not do?

[TWiley]

80. Here is the slur you posted

From dictionary.com:

pa·gan ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pgn)
n.
One who is not a Christian, Muslim, or Jew, especially a worshiper of a polytheistic religion.
One who has no religion.
A non-Christian.
A hedonist.
A Neo-Pagan.

adj.
Not Christian, Muslim, or Jewish.
Professing no religion; heathen.
Neo-Pagan.


So, anyone who is not a Christian (and probably not a "born again" one to boot) falls into that big ugly cavern of guilt created by the Religious folks labeled "Pagan". Some may consider your remarks a slur.

So, explain to me, if you will, why are the Christian population is so obsessed with a group of people who believe differently?

[InvisibleBallots]

104. well I certainly can't speak for Christians

Regardless of what the dictionary says about the historical meaning of "Pagan" - the only groups calling themselves "Pagan" are NOT Hindu or Buddhist or anything else other than Neo-Pagan, reconstructionists, and the like. Let's not pretend that when people use the term "Pagan" they are referring to anything else.

and where was the slur? You posted a definition to Pagan, not a slur?

:shrug:

[TWiley]

113. Well, a Christian calling someone a "Pagan" is similar

to a racist calling a black man a N****r.

The dictionary defination points out that those who issue this slur "pagan" are directing it at "non-Christians" Now why would a non-Christian direct a religious slur at other non-Christians?

"Regardless of what the dictionary says?" First you want to re-write history, and now you plan to re-write the dictionary as well?

[InvisibleBallots]

121. oh, please

give me a break :eyes:

[TWiley]

122. Then a Christian calling someone a Pagan is a compliment?

I never thought of it that way I guess

I do not pretend to understand the reasonings of a fundamentalist, but my first instinct would be that it would be used as a derogatory comment

[InvisibleBallots]

131. here

"Wicca is a peaceful, tolerant religion... compared to, say, Christianity." Soon you figure out that you can insult your religious supressors (who are all secretly out to get you) and feel holier-than-thou at the same time! You can blame them for everything from the Inquisition to teenage pregnancy. Impress a group of Wiccans and suddenly you're lifelong friends who all have something in common... Christian-bashing. And now when the kids at school make fun of you, it's not because you're fat, ugly, shy, wear braces/glasses, or are part of the wrong clique... it's because they're religiously intolerant, those unenlightened fools.

http://www.whywiccanssuck.com/index2.html (Written by a Wiccan)

[TWiley]

132. Funny, I thought it was the Christian fundamentalists

who nearly always cast the first stone of judgment. The pagans lead the anti-homosexual movement? <scratches head>

If there was someone, or some group to blame for the Inquisition ..... Christians torturing and killing thousands for heresy, whom would you suppose that would be? The victims of those crimes?

You brought up the liability of the Inquisition, so what do you suppose the answer is?

[InvisibleBallots]

33. btw, the only Pagans that exist now are "Neo-Pagans"

So I tend to think that calling them "Pagan" is justified - they do themselves. Also, no other religions call themselves "Pagan" - and what Christians called all other religions 2000 years ago is irrelevant - even though you're wrong if you say that Christians called all other religions "Pagan" - they did not.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[not systems]

37. umm... so you hate all "neo-pagans" ...

because of some neo-nazi Odinists...

That make sense...Not!

[InvisibleBallots]

38. When did I say I hate all Neo-Pagans?

I didn't - you post is false. Happy Holidays.

[not systems]

39. I gathered it from your tone...

I guess you were just grinding the persecuted
Christian ax and it just looked like hate.

You don't think all Christians should be judged
by the worst amongst them.

Have the decency to grant your wish to others or
others will have no reason to do the same.

[InvisibleBallots]

40. ah, yes, my "tone" - you can read minds

Just for the record - I don't think Christians are persecuted in the US, and they aren't persecuted on DU. Did you hear me? Christians are not persecuted on DU.

Many people on DU are anti-Chritian bigots, and post rude, insulting, and defamatory stereotypes and lies about Christians - but that's not really persecution.

"You don't think all Christians should be judged
by the worst amongst them. Have the decency to grant your wish to others or others will have no reason to do the same."

I do - I never claimed or even hinted that all Pagans are White Supremacists. I can understand why my sarcastic comments - obviously directed at anti-Christian bigots, not really Pagans - gets such a reaction. Same things happens when Christians have their own bigotries ridiculed.

[not systems]

42. Your "sarcastic comments" read as...

hate of "neo-pagans" and smearing of all as racist.

You can believe that your comments were "obviously directed at anti-Christian bigots"
but it was only obvious to you trust me.

I think whatever point you were trying to make was overshadowed
by your bizarre delivery.

I do think you "hinted that all Pagans are White Supremacists"
but I guess that was just your way of stamping out
"rude, insulting, and defamatory stereotypes and lies".

Good job.

[InvisibleBallots]

43. yeah, sarcasm can be subtle, easy to miss

I tried to make it easier with the little icon for sarcasm - :eyes:

Next time I'll try to be more obvious - how about this?

:eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:

[InvisibleBallots]

45. notice also, the two posters who assumed they were Christians

and went all to post nasty stereotypes of Christians - when confronted with the fact they were wrong - just didn't respond. So far, it seems no one got angry with their prejudiced reactions - my obvious sarcastic comment gets all the heat. I'm not surprised.

GOP keeps winning the culture war - thanks to so-called "liberal" anti-Christian bigots. They could have never done it without them.

[not systems]

49. I didn't...

they could be Odinist or Identity Cristian and
fit the neo-nazi profile.

They come in all flavors, Cristian is one of them.

[InvisibleBallots]

53. yes

There are Christian white supremacists, there are neo-pagan white supremacists - and these look like the Neo-Pagan type.

[JohnOneillsMemory]

55. Often when we see 'Master Race'-types, they are also 'Chosen Few'-types

and that, I think, is why so many DU-ers are flinchy about deists.

Even many fans of Jesus go all authoritarian and hierarchical instead of egalitarian and inclusively compassionate.

Many of us understand that we are suffering the rise of a fascist theocracy that intentionally fuels the fear/hatred dividing the human species into tribal camps resembling gang territories or 'Terror-tories.'

Allow condemnation of hypocrisy without assuming condemnation of the entire group, is what I'm trying to suggest to those who automatically feel insulted by comments directed at 'Christians.'

My favorite quote about Christians:
"Too many Christians are busy sucking the finger instead of going where it is pointing."

As in, Christ said 'go help people' not 'worship me.'

What a charming topic for Christmas Day on DU!

Peace and good will to all of you.

[TWiley]

82. Please show me an example of a

popular "neo-pagan white supremacist group" The only ones I have ever seen are Christian and Conservative.

[InvisibleBallots]

94. no white supremacist groups are popular

neither Christian nor Pagan nor otherwise

[TWiley]

99. Their philosophies are popular.

Membership is difficult to measure. Mainstream White Power organizations are united with the Christian Identity movement, and their Sister Congregations.

[TWiley]

81. I would bet you that they consider themselves Christians.

Most, if not all, White Power groups consider themselves "Christian" Whither or not they are "Christian" is not my decision to make. As far as I am concerned, they are if they say so.

Check out these links. Notice the similar philosophies? 12 year old girls do not make this shit up. They are taught by Christian organizations, like these posted below, to see the world in this way.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/cr_ident.htm
http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/nrms/identity.html
http://www.carm.org/list/christian_identity.htm
http://www.carm.org/list/christian_identity.htm

Now, post your apology to all the "heathens" who do have some sense of genuine morality.

[InvisibleBallots]

93. sounds like neo-pagans to me

the Christian White Supremacists don't sing songs to Pagan gods, sorry.

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=435

When this generation met the Odinists, they found all of that, but in a racialized and militant form. Odinism offered them a new grand narrative. They could belong to something more important than themselves.

They looked with distaste at American society with its consumerism and materialism and its stupid TV programs. Medieval knights and Vikings and all that looked attractive.

IR: Racist Odinists tend to be more independent than members of traditional hate groups. Do you think the rise of Odinism is changing the shape of the movement?

GARDELL: Definitely. Most of the traditional groups could hold their national meetings in a telephone booth, and very few of them last more than a few years — although it's also true that for each organizations that dies, another is born.

Today, the number of white racist activists, Aryan revolutionaries, is far greater than you would know by simply looking at traditional organizations.

Revolutionaries today do not become members of an organization. They won't participate in a demonstration or a rally or give out their identity to a group that keeps their name on file, because they know that all these organizations are heavily monitored. Since the late 1990s, there has been a general shift away from these groups on the far right.

This has also helped Odinism thrive. Odinists took the leaderless resistance concept of Louis Beam and worked on it, fleshed it out.

They found a strategic position between the upper level of known leaders and propagandists, and an underground of activists who do not affiliate as members, but engage instead in decentralized networking and small cells. They do not shave their heads like traditional Skinheads or openly display swastikas.

This comes close to what the FBI said in Meggido Report . They contended that the overwhelming majority of domestic terrorists today do not belong to any traditional organization.

So you need to shift your analytical focus from organizations to a counterculture. It is a counterculture that defines itself in opposition to what is perceived as the errant direction of where American society is going — multiculturalism, big government, all of that.

http://odinist.com
http://www.publiceye.org/racism/white-supremacy.html#Thule

[TWiley]

101. again you deceive

Show me where the Prussian Blue Girls were singing to Pagan Gods.

Also, the article you refer to discusses the RISE of neo-paganism in the Traditionally Christian White Supremacy groups. Again, this is a very small movement within a much larger Christian organization.

[InvisibleBallots]

106. did you read their lyrics?

Did you read the bands they are covering? Why are you pretending the Neo-Pagan White Supremacist movement doesn't exist? They are everywhere, they have quite the following in the skinhead culture.

Again - the Christian White Supremacists don't sing songs about Valhalla and cover these bands.

[TWiley]

115. No, where are their lyrics posted?

Here is a quote from your SPLC link:

<snip>

GARDELL: When I came to the United States in 1996, I expected to write about Identity preachers, Klan leaders, militia leaders and all of that. I didn't expect to meet all these pagans and to see a new generation of racial activists so involved in pagan activities.

I realized that this was really big, that paganism was coming up strong and Christian Identity was turning into an old man's religion. It looks like a home for retired people.

<snip>

Evidently, citing proof from your own link, Christian Identity preachers who for decades have been active in the traditionally well known American racist bible-based organizations,are being replaced? He did not expect to meet "Pagans" in such hard core Christian outfits?.

The Christian movement inspired its offspring to rebel and re-package the same old song in a new binder. Am I to be shocked?

[InvisibleBallots]

118. Neo-Paganism is nearly 100% from Christianity

The neo-pagan movement in the US is nearly 100% White people who grew up in Christian families. So you could say that even the non-racist Neo-Pagans are basically the result of the "Christian movement inspiring its offspring to rebel and re-package the same old song in a new binder"

So the excerpt you just posted shows that as Christianity fell out of favor with young White kids in America, the White Supremacists "rediscovered thier Pagan heritage" and starting promoting their racial ideologies with songs and tales of old European deities and mythologies. I don't see why this is a surprise to anyone.

There are Christian White Supremacists, and their are Pagan White Supremacists - do you have a hard time admitting this? Did you think your own traditions were immune?

[TWiley]

119. I would understand it more like

the natural process of children rebelling against the parents beliefs.

You have concluded that this Neo-pagan movement is a sizeable portion of the Chrisian Identity movement. It is not. The bulk of the believers are of the origional "Christian" ilk.

I would like to believe that most "mainstream" Christian folks would be appalled at the "Christian" label being used by these groups. More often, they only attack the messenger much like you have, and bury their heads in the sand.

I agree that the problems of race are not confined to any one religion. It just happens to be the case thaqt in our nation, the main aggressors happen to consider themselves Christian.

You point to a new, small, and nascent movement as being the example of racial abuse in this country since the 1500's. Christians were busy burning pagans for non-conformity to their beliefs at that time.

And, how about the "Manifest Destiny", or slavery in the bible belt?
Were the pagans at fault there as well?

[robbedvoter]

90. The kulture war, is that so? Dang, I thought your handle meant

you are onto the stolen election, not "God votes with us"
I have news for ya: there isn't a culture war. It's all smoke and mirrors for rubes to not notice the hijacking of the constitution, treasury, the wars and the pestilence. So, you defend poor Christians while the "war" is way elsewhere.

[InvisibleBallots]

114. robbedvoter

My handle is obviously a reference to the fraudulent voting machines.

"God votes with us"

What the hell are you talking about? My first reaction is to assume that you mean anyone who objects to anti-Christian bigotry posing as Liberalism and helping the GOP slander Democrats must really be a fundie?

"I have news for ya: there isn't a culture war. It's all smoke and mirrors for rubes to not notice the hijacking of the constitution, treasury, the wars and the pestilence."

Well, there is a culture war - meant to distract everyone while they steal Social Security, so we agree on this it seems. The GOP's best tactic is to paint Democrats and liberals as anti-Christian - the religion and culture of 80% of Americans, including especially some of our most loyal voting blocks.

"So, you defend poor Christians while the "war" is way elsewhere."

Those poor Christians are as often as not Democrats, and some of them quite liberal. Why don't you speak up when they are slandered by bigots? Failure to do so is complicity in the GOP culture war.

[knight_of_the_star]

63. Because of HOW you said it

It looked to me to be more of a sign of disrespect and disbelief than sarcasm. As I said in another post, watch your mouth.

[InvisibleBallots]

76. I can't watch my mouth

My nose is in the way! :)

[Name removed]

62. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[InvisibleBallots]

71. Calling me a Freeper is against the rules, knight_of_the_star

Do it again and I may alert you.

[robbedvoter]

89. Cuz if they were Christians, they'd be persecuted for it like you all

I bet if this family was not Christian, we'd all be cheering this creative disclipline. Since he's a Christian, we must hate him. GOP Culture War is working quite well - with the badly needed aid of so called "liberal" anti-Christian bigots.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1098057&mesg_id=1098182&page=

I know dear, pagans are under your bed and in your closet - but thir thread was about something else. Remember, wear your cross at all times and they won't be able to turn you into a toad!

Maybe...

[InvisibleBallots]

102. this thread is a perfect example

Not of "persecution" of Christians - there isn't any in the USA, obviously, but instead, of a bigoted anti-Christian attitude that certain people who seem to claim to be liberals exhibit here. Half the time I wonder if Freepers haven't invaded DU, posing as the "anti-Christian Liberals" they so desperately need to fight their Culture War.

It was immediately assumed these people are Christians - and here, after I've posted numerous pagan references in their songs, and numerous links to the Neo-Pagan White Supremacists movements that they are influenced by STILL - people try to shift the attention to Christianity. Why?

I never claimed that there are no Christian White Supremacists - there obviously are. Will Pagans pretend there are no Pagan White Supremacists?

"Remember, wear your cross at all times and they won't be able to turn you into a toad!"

:)

"She turned me into a newt!"

"She did?

"Well, I got better!"

[mdmc]

19. what cute racists!

ten bucks says the'll end up snoops bitches in 6 years.

[SmokingJacket]

22. This is so....CONFUSING!

Is it satire?

Is it ironic?

Is it just totally and completely f***ed up beyond imagining?

I can't tell!!!

HELP!

[InvisibleBallots]

23. Why do Pagans hate Black people so much, and are so anti-semitic?

How come these supposed non-racist Pagans remain silent? :eyes:

[robbedvoter]

41. Nothing like heaping crap over crap - one hatred is as stinky as another

Whatever color you dress your little girls in, I don't want to hear them!
Careful what you wish:

[Hippo_Tron]

50. Pagan = all non muslim, christian, jew

Too broad of a term to characterize all of them as one thing.

[InvisibleBallots]

72. no, you are wrong

Pagan has NEVER meant Muslim or Jew - not back in the Roman empire days, and not now.

[Hippo_Tron]

75. I mean all OTHER religions that are not muslim, christian, or jew

NOT all other religions besides christianity.

[InvisibleBallots]

79. sorry, my mistake

I see what you mean now.

[robbedvoter]

88. It's always good to know whom to hate. Now, you're all set.

And, remember, they're after you and all the other of your poor, martyred, victimized brethrens. Hate, baby, hate!


P.S. You seem to imagine yourself in the Colosseum, in Rome, facing the lions. BS brought to ya by Faux&friends

[InvisibleBallots]

95. you have quite the imagination

Should I say, you seem to imagine yourself at the Witch trial, bravely fighting off the Inquisitors, they are after you, you poor, martyred, victimized Pagan!?

Here is a group of Neo-Pagans, singing White Supremacist Pagan songs - and still, there has to be SOME way to blame Christians! BS brought to you by the over-sensitive? :eyes:

[robbedvoter]

133. I am not fighting "liberal bigots" attacking my majority religion

It's you doing it, thread after thread - and if I need Faux talking points about poor victimized Christians I'd watch teevee instead of coming on DU.

Here's Frank Rich (a liberal bigot out to get you):
How can those in this country's overwhelming religious majority maintain that they are victims in a fiery battle with forces of darkness? It is certainly not about actual victimization. Christmas is as pervasive as it has ever been in America, where it wasn't even declared a federal holiday until after the Civil War. What's really going on here is yet another example of a post-Election-Day winner-takes-all power grab by the "moral values" brigade. As Mr. Gibson shrewdly contrived his own crucifixion all the way to the bank, trumping up nonexistent threats to his movie to hype it, so the creation of imagined enemies and exaggerated threats to Christianity by "moral values" mongers of the right has its own secular purpose. The idea is to intimidate and marginalize anyone who objects to their efforts to impose the most conservative of Christian dogma on public policy. If you're against their views, you don't have a differing opinion — you're anti-Christian (even if you are a Christian).

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/19/arts/19rich.html?adxnnl=1&8hpib=&oref=login&adxnnlx=1103475054-K5z/PXE0llw/+5d6yKuJEA

[knight_of_the_star]

64. You have no sense

Or manners. You want to heap that bs on us, go for it. Don't be shocked if you get tombstoned.

[InvisibleBallots]

73. The sarcasm was noted by the little rolling eyes

:eyes: - see? It should be obvious to everyone that my comments were directed not really at Neo-Pagans, but at the two groups of people who often says things like "where are the moderates, why won't they say anything" - two groups - One, Freepers when talking about Muslims, and Two, anti-Christian bigots who claim to be liberals.

[TWiley]

83. Proof of your position please.

Here is a small portion of proof supporting the idea that these 12 year old girls are likely associated with a Christian White Supremacy group. 112,399,041 more I can post according to google.


http://www.religioustolerance.org/cr_ident.htm
http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/nrms/identit...
http://www.carm.org/list/christian_identity.htm
http://www.carm.org/list/christian_identity.htm

[InvisibleBallots]

96. I just linked their songs, and to the SPLC regarding these

neo-pagan White Supremacist groups - are you seriously pretending they don't exist? Come now.

[TWiley]

98. The Neo-pagan groups are primarily in Europe

and extremely small as well as rare. How about the half million members of the christian identity movement in the USA?

[InvisibleBallots]

107. half a million members?

Lol! I'm sure some may claim that but I doubt it. In either case - Pagans are a tiny, tiny minority anyway - nearly 100% of them from Christian families. So I guess that means that the White Supremacist Paganism is the fault of Christians too! :eyes:

[TWiley]

130. Now that we have established that

the Christian Identity movement enjoys the largest following among virtualy all American racist groups, consider this:

http://www.tolerance.org/maps/hate/index.html

Go ahead, click on your state. Also, take a good look at the "bible belt".

[jmowreader]

25. I like this article

"I Hate The Right"

http://viceland.com/se/v1n3/htdocs/i_hate_the_right.php

This guy comes right out and says all the things we've been thinking.

[not systems]

35. That article is attributed to JANEANE GAROFALO...

so it is probable not as much of a coincidence as you thought.

[TWiley]

84. I liked the article also.

Thank you for posting it. It made my morning.

[madison2000]

27. Geez, that is really scary n/t

[despairing optimist]

29. What a waste of electrons

Sometimes the Internet seems ripe for burning, if only . . .

The messages on the supremacist website prove that there are issues that bear no negotiation and lie beyond the power of reason to resolve. My only hope is that most people still listen to reason and choose to abandon ideas that will destroy humanity.

But then, I leave unanswered the question of whether humanity is worth preserving--a weighty thought to ponder this Christmas Day.

"And we call ourselves the human race."--JFK, on hearing that "only" 600 million people would die in a nuclear exchange with the USSR

[JVS]

46. They need to get a few years older and get implants

then they'll be a real band

[Tinoire]

47. apathy in your eyes... watching as the white flame dies

"I see you all around me, I see the apathy in your eyes, Knowing not what it means to be free, watching as the white flame dies, It means nothing to you, pride is an unknown thing…"

Prussian Blue
I Will Bleed for You



Q: A lot of people think that listening to pro-White music, collecting CDs and attending shows is all they need to do for their race. However, you girls are literally out in the streets protesting as activists and working for change as part of the National Alliance's efforts. What do you say to people who only listen to the music and don't put the lessons into practice in real life?

A: Well they need to realize that this is not a game and that it is serious business even though it can also be fun to be around other racially aware people. A lot of young people like to dress in a way that gets them attention because they don’t know any other way to feel proud of themselves and special. Sometimes the way they dress doesn’t make them look as attractive or handsome as they could be. We think that they should work to look as good as possible by working out and dressing nice to show that people who are White Nationalists are not scary, but good people. The way that you look and act is activism in a way because you represent your family your beliefs and your race. You are a walking talking advertisement and our young people are the best advertisement so they need to realize this.

http://www.nationalvanguard.org/story.php?id=3652

====

They appear at cute little White Supremacist concerts & "Family Days"


At a spacious site perched in these fabled Ponderosa forests thousands of feet up in California's High Sierras, racialists will gather for FOLK THE SYSTEM 2004. The event will open on Friday, September 10th and conclude on Sunday, September 12th. The festival will be packed with cutting-edge music, family fun and folkish fellowship in a defined and private outdoor camping environment.

FOLK THE SYSTEM 2004 is a festival you don't want to miss, packed with activities and events you'll remember for a lifetime. We will be displaying a line-up of high-energy, leading pro-White musical talent in a range of genres.

Traditional Celtic games--with prizes--will be open to all adult entrants.
A vending area will be open throughout FOLK THE SYSTEM, with food, jewelry, t-shirts, information and music vendors.

Children's activities such as European-themed games, crafts, stories, and other events will take place.

FOLK THE SYSTEM is not a concert. FOLK THE SYSTEM is a Pro-White FESTIVAL with a wide variety of folk-building and cameraderie-enhancing activities for young and old alike. Come and experience an atmosphere far beyond a gig or a meeting...

http://www.folkthesystem.com

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[Tinoire]

48. Catchy little tunes at that (mp3s to hear) & Their web-site

I listened to "I Will Bleed For You". URGHHHHHH!!!!! If I didn't pay attention to the damned words, I would probably like, really like, this song.

And I'm Black.

How so sad.

Little Spawns of Satan.



Prussian Blue

Here's a few songs from a new band called Prussian Blue. Their first CD will be released soon on Resistance Records. The song "Skinhead Boy" will not be on the CD and will only be available on the internet. The song "I Will Bleed For You" will be on the CD so I clipped the ending off. Enjoy!

Skinhead Boy http://www.counterculturemusic.net/images/Skinhead_Boy.mp3

I Will Bleed For You http://www.counterculturemusic.net/images/I_Will_Bleed_For_You.MP3

http://www.counterculturemusic.net/pages/6/index.htm


The album's being well received and these little spawns are already being asked to sign autographs for the masses...

Oy Oy Skinhead boy, your my heart's beau... eyes so blue... little patriot... (or some crap like that)

Prussian Blue: The Most Disturbing Pop Act of 2004



Meet Lamb and Lynx Gaede, ballad-singing 12-year-old Californian twins who play guitar (Lamb) and violin (Lynx). They like listening to the music of Avril Lavigne, Evanescence, Green Day, AC/DC and Barney the Dinosaur… But their biggest musical influence is white supremacist skinhead band Skrewdriver. They do folky covers of many that odious outfit’s songs, and also perform originals filled with gushing references to Aryan warriors in Valhalla, and lines about freedom existing only for “those with darker skin”…
Unlike many child acts of their tender years, they are surprisingly articulate in interview and demonstrate an engagement with contemporary issues - such as eugenics. Specifically, they lament the fact that “smart white girls who have good eugenics are more interested in making money in a career or partying” than getting married and having “good-quality” white offspring…
As I said in the title of this post, they truly are the most disturbing pop act to emerge this year.

(snip)

(Many thanks to xxx for this link. When he originally posted them on his website, he was flooded with comments that called them a “refreshing change” from “normal pop rap garbage/ bling bling urban (c)rap/left-wing fruitcake propaganda” and proof that “Nazis aren't as bad as everyone thinks”... And, no, I don't think that last comment was ironic…)

(snip)


http://www.filmcement.org/rummage/archives/000151.html
============================

Here's their web-site. You can read the lyrics yourselves...

Chorus:
Aryan man awake,
How much more will you take,
Turn that fear to hate,
Aryan man awake.

Can your see how they lie to warp your daughter’s minds?
Can you let you sons be trodden down or held behind?
Can you apologize for things you did not do
And leave this battle that we fight to the proud and the few?

What will it take for you to waken to the truth?
What will it take for you to remember your own youth?
What will your give up to help this worthy cause
And strike with force and fury, without a single pause?

(snip)

Before it’s too late! Before it’s too late!

http://prussianblue.net/index.html

[Must_B_Free]

77. I will Bleed For You

Now, most people would say this insane, but

Aside from the racist content, I rather like this song, unfortunately. I like the slight contrast of the two similar voices. Cool instrumentation.

I kind of like them, musically. If they would drop the racism shit they could be very good.

[Heimdallr]

54. Smart white girls with ' good eugenics'? Bwahahahahaha....

Obviously grammar and proper English isn't the strong suit back in East Goat Rope, AR.

[regnaD kciN]

56. Huh???

It seems like smart white girls who have good eugenics are more interested in making money in a career or partying than getting married and having a family.

So...once they hit puberty, they're going to ditch the singing "career" and start turning out little Aryan babies?

Somehow, I get the feeling that we'll see that happening real soon now...and that 2006 will find them pushing little Siegfried and Brunnhilde Gaede in their strollers through the Himmler Trailer Park...

:puke:

[leftofthedial]

57. you go to holocaust with the poison you have

not the poison you want

(to quote another notable fascist racist POS

[Princess Turandot]

58. I wonder if they realize..

that they themselves prove one of their statement:

"generally not having good-quality white people being born"

[Tinoire]

61. LMAO!!

Good one! :thumbsup:

[American Tragedy]

65. They're referring to the not-so-very-scientific Leuchter report

Sorry, girls, try again.


According to Eugene Holman,

Leuchter's technique was faulty:

a. theoretically, because he was testing for Prussian B, a compound only formed in conjunction with exposure to cyanide under specific conditions, rather than for residual cyanide ions, something always present when something has been exposed to cyanide log enough for cyanates to form;

b. methodologically, because he took random-sized bulk samples rather than scrapings, did not inform the lab that only one surface of the sample had been exposed to cyanide, and allowed the exposed surface to be pulverized with the rest of the sample, with the entire sample rather than the exposed surface being tested for mg of Prussian Blue (molecular weight 859.3) per kilogram of sample;

c. analytically, because he did not take into consideration the role in Prussian Blue formation and retention played by different intitial conditions, different structural materials, or the different subsequent histories of the two environments.

(Holman, Eugene. UseNet "alt.revisionism," Message-ID [e-mail], March 20, 2002)

The walls of the extermination gas chambers were in contact with HCN for a much shorter time then those of the delousing chambers, and for the last 45 years were exposed to surroundings which dissolve the compounds, while the delousing rooms were not. Therefore it is obvious that less traces of compounds would remain in them. This debunks the major "amazing discovery" in Leuchter's report, which, in retrospect, wasn't 'amazing' at all.

The fact that all, or most, of the compounds would vanish during 45 years of exposure - is quite clearly stated in the report written by experts at the Cracow Institute of Forensic Research:

INSTITUTE OF FORENSIC RESEARCH
In the name of Prof. Dr. Jan Sehn, Krakow
Division of Forensic Toxicology

Hydrocyanic acid is a very weak acid, and accordingly its salts dissolve easily in stronger acids. Even carbonic acid, which is formed as a reaction of carbon dioxide with water, will dissolve ferro-cyanide.

Stronger acids, such as sulfuric acids, easily dissolve the cyanides. The compounds of cyanide ions with heavy metals are longer lasting. This includes the already mentioned Prussian blue, although this will also slowly dissolve in an acidic environment.

Therefore, one can hardly assume that traces of cyanic compounds could still be detected in construction materials (plaster, brick) after 45 years, after being subjected to the weather and the elements (rain, acid oxides, especially sulfuric and nitrogen oxides). More reliable would be the analysis of wall plaster from closed rooms which were not subject to weather and the elements (including acid rain).

The discovery of hydrocyanic acid compounds in samples of material which had been subject to the elements can only be accidental.

Information courtesy of The Nizkor Project http://www.nizkor.org/faqs

[NightTrain]

68. Ever see the documentary film about Fred Leuchter?

If memory serves, it's called DR. DEATH. Well worth a viewing! :thumbsup:

[sonicx]

66. How much you wanna bet non-white people manufactured their clothes...

sound system, or instruments?

[Tinoire]

69. Shhh... That part's ok by them

For a Lady I Know

By: Countee Cullen.

She even thinks that up in heaven
Her class lies late and snores,
While poor black cherubs rise at seven
To do celestial chores.

http://www.nku.edu/~diesmanj/cullen.html

It's ok as long as the darkies are all in their place... picking cotton, sewing by candlelight and all...

[Clark2008]

78. Also from this site

Lula is a seven-year-old Manhattanite. She recently took time off from school and hanging out with her little brother to address the pertinent issues of her day with Vice.

SNIP

What politicians do you hate?
George W. Bush. That's probably the person I would most hate. Wait, no, the other guy whose name I can never remember. Men Laden, or whatever—Osadem Men Laden. But number one is George W. Bush, because he causes wars and all he wants is money and oil and he's not a nice person.And the other one whose name I can't remember does even worse stuff. He sent that plane to crash into the Twin Towers and he's the boss of people who want to kill theirselves.

What the hell kinda site is this?

[TWiley]

85. Well, the good sense of a 12 year old is coming

out through all the brain-washing.

There will be many many years of therapy in their future.

[InvisibleBallots]

97. nonsense - these people hate Bush

because they think he is "under the spell of the Jews" and "started a war for Israel". Is the enemy of our enemy our friend?

[Tinoire]

109. Very true. Found this out a few years ago

White supremacists hate Bush for his alliance with Sharon, jobs, the war, destroying America.

Their battle cry was, gasp, ABB also.

From David Duke's site:


Anybody But Bush

Bush and Kerry
A Plague on Both Your Houses

Hello, this is David Duke.

The election is right around the corner and guess what, the American people once again have no real choice for President of the United States of America. No candidate is really worth the vote of one American but I can say without the least hesitation that no candidate deserves defeat more than George Bush, who is the clearest example of a traitor to the American people since the time of Benedict Arnold. The only President who I would say had out-treasoned George Bush was Franklin D. Roosevelt who, completely controlled by his Jewish supremacist advisors and financers, worked so intently to foment the Second World War, the most disastrous and terrible blood-letting in the history of European mankind in o, and the seminal event that has directly led to the rise of Israel, Zionism and Jewish supremacy over our government, media and culture in the postwar years.

(snip)

The blood of every American military man and woman in Iraq is on Bush’s hands. There is no more solemn thing a President can do than to commit our young men and women to war. He must be sure that before he commits people sworn to obey – that the war is just and absolutely necessary for our country. It is an atrocious crime for a President to send Americans to kill thousands of people in a foreign country, including thousands of innocent civilians, cause thousands of Americans to be maimed or die in a war that actually harms America rather than defends her. Such a crime is a betrayal of the ultimate sacrifice of our soldiers. And that is precisely what Bush has done.

I have watched the debates so far, and as you have noticed, there is no real debate. Kerry has made no real challenge against Bush’s Neocon war. It called it a colossal mistake. It wasn’t a mistake, it was a premeditated act against the most basic interests of the United States.

Because most Americans are opposed to the war, Kerry got a boost in the polls when he pointed out that the war is not going well and that Bush has been deceiving the American people. But Kerry never challenged any of the fundamental issues of the war. He simply announces that he wants to fight a “smarter” war and launch offensives that will end up killing even more civilians and make America even more hated around the world. Just like Bush in the debates, Kerry and Edwards also always took pains to emphasize that the security of Israel should be America’s highest concern.

(snip)

George Bush must be defeated in this election. Don’t tell me that Kerry will be worse. He may be. Whoever wins will be bad for America. We have no choice in this election. Don’t tell me about the lesser of two evils, evil is evil. But George Bush must become an object lesson for all those who would betray America. Bush must become an object lesson for all those who would betray his own base of support among European Americans. Bush has supported amnesty for illegal aliens, has intentionally left our borders wide open to invading Third Worlders, has betrayed us on affirmative action, has driven the deficit up by trillions of dollars for your grandchildren to repay, has supported outsourcing of American jobs and careers to Third World countries, has destroyed our American industries with support of GATT and NAFTA, and has done more to destroy American liberty and constitutional rights (with the misnamed Patriot Act) than any U.S. President before him.

(snip)

Remember, spread the word: Anybody but Bush!

For our people’s heritage and freedom, this has been David Duke

http://www.davidduke.com/index.php?p=151

[InvisibleBallots]

110. David Duke - long time ABBer

That should tell us something ... :shrug:

[TWiley]

127. Now, there you go again.

"These people" hate bush. What is it with you? Is there no room for individuality within a group?

I was refering to the good sense of "hating bush". Nothing more.

[TWiley]

86. Attn: InvisableBallots

Here, read this with your wheaties this morning.

http://www.hearnow.org/id.html

[InvisibleBallots]

100. okay, how about you read this then re Pagan White Supremacist Terrorists

http://www.publiceye.org/racism/white-supremacy.html#Thule
http://www.publiceye.org/racism/white-supremacy.html#Thule
http://www.adl.org/learn/felton/thule.asp
Odinism, when practiced by white supremacists, focuses on the rejection of what they see as Jewish-influenced Christianity; the embrace of an "indigenous faith" rooted in pre-Christian Anglo-Saxon warrior cultures; and the oneness of the Aryan race with nature.

National Socialism and other racist and anti-Semitic ideologies have tremendous appeal to white supremacist Odinists, who point out that many prominent Nazis practiced a form of Odinism in Nazi Germany. Many white supremacists in prisons practice the racist version of Odinism.

Primary activists in WOT and its publications included tattoo artist Nathan Pett (aka Nathan Zorn) and Peter Georgacarakos, a convicted cocaine dealer and prison inmate. While Pett lived on Whidbey Island, Washington, he used WOT to glorify the activities of The Order, a white supremacist terrorist group active in the 1980s whose leader, Robert Mathews, died in a shootout with police on Whidbey Island in 1985.

[TWiley]

105. Odd, the Order is a faction of the

"Christian Identity Movement" It is disturbing how you continuously ignore reams of proof and concentrate on a few stray individuals.

The "rejection of what they see as Jewish-influenced Christianity" primarily becomes a Protestant Christian Fundamentalist order. They champion causes like the Pro-life movement, anti-homosexual marriage, and the Creationist theories proponents which oppose evolution. Those are "Neo-Christian" causes, not Neo-Pagan. Did you sleep during the past election?

[TWiley]

108. Uh, did you notice the word "Christian" at the top

of the chart titled "where do these movements get their ideas? It is your link, have you even read it?

The group that you point to are tremendously rare and small. Especially here in the United States. The most common religion is Christianity, and it is the fundamentalist Christian factions that primarily populate these groups. Especially the factions which include "Constitutional law" in their sermons.

[TWiley]

111. Hmm, and how does this quote from your link

support your ideas? "Christians" as defined by your link about factions of the right wing, sound rather .... uhhh ....

Christian Right
Christian Nationalists—Biblically–defined immorality and sin breed chaos and anarchy. America’s greatness as God’s chosen land has been undermined by liberal secular humanists, feminists, and homosexuals. Purists want litmus tests for issues of abortion, tolerance of gays and lesbians, and prayer in schools. Includes some non–Christian cultural conservatives. Overlaps somewhat with Christian theocracy.

The Hard Right
Christian Theocrats—Christian men are ordained by God to run society. Eurocentric version of Christianity based on early Calvinism. Intrinsically Christian ethnocentric, treating non-Christians as second-class citizens. Implicitly antisemitic. Includes soft dominionists and hardline Reconstructionists.

[TWiley]

112. I guess I do not understand this either.

This is from the on-going discussion of the religious right. Any clarifications?

<snip>

White Nationalists (White Racial Nationalist)—Alien cultures make democracy impossible. Cultural Supremacists argue different races can adopt the dominant (White) culture; Biological Racists argue the immutable integrity of culture, race, and nation. Segregationists want distinct enclaves, Separatists want distinct nations. Americanist. Tribalist emphasis is similar to the race-is-nation wing of the European New Right.

Ultra Right (Extreme Right, Far Right)—Militant forms of revolutionary right ideology and separatist ethnocentric nationalism. Reject pluralist democracy for an organic oligarchy that unites the homogeneic nation. Conspiracist views of power that are overwhelmingly antisemitic. Home to overt fascists, neonazis, Christian Identity, Creativity (Church of the Creator), National Alliance.

[InvisibleBallots]

116. heh, thanks for reading it TWiley - and your 4 posts

You pointed out every connection to Christianity you could find in the article, and downplayed every connection to Paganism. Your biases are clear. Were you reading and posting one paragraph at a time, moving from one window to another each time you came across a reference to Christianity? ;)

There are Christian White Supremacists, there are Pagan White Supremacists, and these little girls are covering songs and bands with obvious and overt Pagan influence - why deny it? Why instead try to pretend its all the Christians fault? Come now. Some posters here just saw "racist" and assumed they were "Christian" - bigotry. The reality is never so simple is it?

"Each thing evokes its opposite"

[TWiley]

120. I did not point out every connection

to "Christianity" that I could find in "the" article. I posted some from each link that YOU provided as proof of your argument.

Time and again, you point to an obscure group called "the cult of Thule" and attempt to frame the entire "White Power Movement" in those terms.

You are simply and absolutely wrong.

I agree that the problems of race are not confined to any one religion, but if the topic is Religion which supports Racism in America, then the Christian Identity movement is the largest. This fact is not your fault, it is merely the way it is.

Pagans burned Christians? Pagans authored the "Manifest destiny?" Pagans owned slaves in the bible belt and devised sermons to support the practice? Of course not. Stop deluding yourself.

I do wish that more Christians would scrutinize themselves and their factions with the same intensity as they so freely dish out on the rest of us.

Jesus advised that it was good to remove the log in one's own eye before getting all nerved up about the speck in another's.

So, go forth and cleanse your own religion young man. There is much work to do there.

[InvisibleBallots]

124. no, the topic was these little girls

who sing Pagan White Supremacist songs - and the bigotry of those who automatically assumed that they were Christians - and perhaps those who even after its abundantly clear what they are still try to blame it on Christians.

If you want to have a discussion about the White Supremacist movement and their various religious ideologies, start a thread. We've both probably said all we need too. Feel free to have the last word:

:)

[TWiley]

129. I am still waiting for proof of their association with Paganism.

At this late stage, you still have provided......none.

Your reluctance to admit the role of Christianity as a justifying doctrine of racism in America is disturbing. You prefer to point to a virtually non-existent group of people and blame it all on them.

For the record. I am not "Pagan". I do not consider myself to be "religious" either. It is your bias which is obvious.

[RadicalMom]

87. Aren't those the twins that were in "The Shining?" n/t

[AliciaKeyedUp]

92. Holocaust Myth?

Who the fuck is indoctrinating these kids?

[SmokingJacket]

123. So... white supremacism meets pedophilia.

Now I get it.

Always knew there was an overlap. Little blond heads in nazi youth braids and tyrolean garb...



:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[OneBlueSky]

125. yoicks! . . . sure didn't expect this little item to expand into . . . .

a mega-thread . . . I'm continually amazed at how some posts that I consider interesting or important receive virtually no responses, while others that I think are just marginally interesting elicit tons of posts . . . just shows to go ya . . .