Sam's Club Destroys Plasma TVs

[Cattledog]

I just heard that Sam's Club (Walmart) will throw returned Plasma TVs into the compactor. Even if the item was returned for cosmetic reasons. Apparently this is their business practice. They will have workers do this watched by a manager, to prevent theft I guess. This is kinda sick destroying a $3,000-$5,000 item when these could easily be donated to charity. I mean Walmart is so pro Salvation Army and all. What's up with this? Is this common practice? seems nuts to me!

[jdj]

1. Sams throws everything in the compactor, the assholes.

most stores do.

it's sickening.

all that food, when I worked at sams that the threw away could've ended a famine.

[SoCalDem]

39. Here's why food MUST be destroyed

Let's say some store brand lunch meat is just tossed into a dumpster, and people retrieve it, eat it and then get sick. They CAN (and HAVE done so) sue the store by saying they bought it. No one would expect people to save their grocery receipts, since we all assume that the food we buy there will be eaten, so why bother to save the receipt.

Sometimes, organizations are allowed to collect nearly out of date and non perishable, but damaged containers for donation to the poor, but all of it must be documented and the stores are removed from any liability once it leaves the store.

Scavengers who are hungry WILL eat tainted food. Most of the time they will not become ill if they eat yogurt that's outdated or even lunchmeats, but they COULD, and the store would be held liable.

[durablend]

40. Plenty of "reduced price" groceries around here...

They get leftovers, damaged package, cast-offs, expired (or short dated) food merchandise for next to nothing (and sell it on the cheap).

I think the REAL issue here is that Smiley Mart doesn't want to dilute the value of the (new) product, so they'll destroy the used product instead of having to sell it for a required hefty discount.

[SoCalDem]

42. Large stores usually do not like to "re-sell" merchandise

because of warranty issues. Some things are repo, and if you knew you were going to "lose" an item you did not want to give back, you might "accidentally" damage it :)

It's too bad they don't donate it to a shelter or old folks home though :(

[sbj405]

66. I worked at a restaurant that should it's baked goods

We threw out tons of food. It was sickening. I was told that was the practice because if the employees were allowed to take expired goods, they were afraid we would hide them or place them in the back of the display so they would reach the expiration date.

[benburch]

2. WalMart is evil

Do you need any other reason?

[trumad]

3. edit

and a shout out to Walmart. LOL

[BlueEyedSon]

4. Or recycled via eBay like other retailers do (Sears for exmaple)

[The_Casual_Observer]

5. Seeing that they probably pay a few hundred dollars for these

in the first place (if that, it isn't worth it to them to deal with what would be involved in fixing them or anything else.

[Anakin Skywalker]

18. They Are Made Very Cheaply Overseas.

[Demonaut]

32. not that cheaply, mostly it's done because the units are too

expensive to repair, a plasma display with a few bad pixels cannot be repaired...these units are usually made by Daewoo or Sampo..shit units

[bloom]

43. The factory workers

in China get something like 20 - 25 cents an hour.

Live on site.

Seems like slave labor to me.

[Lisabtrucking]

6. Thats what they do. My mom works there . They use to let the workers

buy the stuff then people started destroying things, so they could buy them cheap, and before anyone starts dumping on my mom for working there , she is a 66 year old single female who has worked her entire life, and the money she get from soc security just keeps her above the poverty level with her job.

[trogdor]

37. Who's dumping on her?

Not me.

[WLKjr]

55. some people do though

I am willing to bet there is more than one DUer that works at one of these stores. I am one.

[On Par]

7. Do You Think The Words... "Price Reduced. Item as is!"

Ever crossed their minds?

Or, why wouldn't they return it to the manufacturer for a refund of their costs?

Upon further review, I don't see a company taking a hit like that. I ain't buying that story.

OP

[Nimrod]

11. Believe it

This is not unique. This is standard business practice, I've worked at several stores and gotten to take a hammer to a $500+ item.

[durablend]

41. They'd rather write the item off altogether

For the full value than sell it at a drastic reduction.

[elehhhhna]

25. Insurance, baby. You don't think their in-store stock's insured? HA!

[On Par]

36. Not Even Close To Being Convinced.

Defective items are returned to the manufacturer for a full refund. Why would Sam's use an insurance company and only get a partial refund? As an example, I was recently at a Black & Decker outlet featuring "reconditioned" items, as well as new. As one Rep was telling me, if Home Depot drops a skid full of B&D saws, they return the entire skid. We check them out, and sell them at our outlets with full warranty.

And if an item was defective, and the manufacturer refused it's return, there would be a reduced price on it. You see it every day.
Been to Lowe's or HD lately? Reduced return items are a fact.

OP

[fat free goodness]

44. No, Wal Mart does not return defectives for this reason:

Having sold things to Wal-Mart:
They do not return to manufacturer for refund. They get a refund (+ markup) on merchandise that does not sell or is returned as defective. They may not make as much on an item they throw in the dumpster, but they still make money.
Think of Wal-Mart as the worlds largest consignment store, who gets especially favorable terms. If the item does not sell, it took floor space from something that did, and Wal-Mart wants compensation.
I’ve seen a case where they did not put food out for sale. Admittedly, by mistake, it stayed in the back until it went bad and had to be thrown out. They demanded and received payment from the manufacturer, as the contract allowed.
You don’t like the terms, don’t sell to them. There is someone else who will agree.

Manufacturers with sufficiently in-demand, brand name products may be able to negotiate a better deal.

[On Par]

45. It's Not What They Do Here.....

Last fall I stopped at Walmart for an outdoor item. All they had was the display, and it had a slight tear. When I pointed out that defect, the manager told me he'd send it back to the manufacturer for a refund, rather than discount it.

While I'm not doubting you, I know what they told me.

OP

[fat free goodness]

46. but...

That may be easier to say than (pick one) "I won't give you a discount because that's a hassle / my computer system does not allow me to discount stuff / I don't have the authority / I think you will buy a different one at full price / I think someone else will buy this one at full price / Why sell this one at a discount when I can shred it and get full profit?

It's probably true that different manufacturers have different contracts. I can see Black & Decker or Sony, for instance, being able to negotiate a better deal than "NoName Fruitcakes, makers of your favorite marginally edible, super seasonal food!"

[On Par]

50. Foods are perishable...

..so I can understand that. And I'm sure there are FDA regs.

But regular items. Sorry. I see the practical side every day, and no one is tossing anything out the back door.

OP

[fat free goodness]

51. Fruitcake was only an example. Besides,

where did you get the idea that fruitcake is perishable? :)

No, each manufacturer gets a contract. Some contracts allow the return of faulty goods. Some allow Wal-Mart to destroy the goods and get credit as if it were returned.

We make software. I don't ever want any of it returned, just shred it.

If I made tape recorders, or small TVs, I'd feel the same way. It's not worth repairing them.

I'm not so sure about the big plasma jobs, but I bet the manufacturers know.

[On Par]

52. It Was A Good Discussion.

Guess we'll agree to disagree. However, I will concede the point that fruitcake is a non-perishable good!

OP

[fat free goodness]

61. I differ on the "good"

Fruitcake is non-perishable, but I am not sure about the "good".

[jmowreader]

49. We do attempt to not drop whole skids of things, though

I can think of a couple of reasons why Wal-Mart won't RTV (return to vendor) anything.

First and foremost is that the more RTVs you process with a vendor, the higher your price from that vendor is. If B&D gets a skid of $50 (wholesale price, not retail) saws back and sells them for $40 in their stores, they have to eat not only the $10 discount off the wholesale price, but the cost of receiving the saws, sending them through remanufacturing, all that. Let's say, using rectal analysis, that the loss is $20 per saw. Yes, they have a certain number of RTVs figured into their projections. If dealer A and dealer B both buy a million $50 saws a year, but dealer A RTVs one percent of them (costing B&D $200,000 per year from that one dealer) and dealer B doesn't RTV anything, B&D will be tempted (which in Wal-Martese means "we'll twist your arm until you do it") to reduce the price of these saws by the amount they save not processing RTVs--meaning Wal-Mart saves twenty cents per saw. Twenty cents doesn't mean much to either you or me, but to Wal-Mart it means they can set the price of the saw in question to twenty cents lower than Home Depot has it--which allows them not only to say "we have the lowest price in town on this" but keeps them from having to price-match.

Next, RTV can be a pain in the ass. Every vendor has a different process, and keeping up with it in my store is a full-time job for one associate--and we're only a medium-size store. By not doing RTV, Wal-Mart eliminates at least two full-timers from every one of their stores--remember that Wal-Mart has more products than Home Depot does.

So why not sell the things instead of just pitching them? They're scared of liability. Simple as that. If you were to buy a product from Wal-Mart, decide you didn't like it and returned it, they would have to inspect the item thoroughly to be sure you didn't bring it back because you spilled a beer in it or because you let your cat eat the power cord. They'd need an associate dedicated to doing this one thing. Once again, by not doing it you eliminate an associate position from your payroll. Throwing a $5000 television in the compactor is cheaper than paying someone a million dollars because their kid was electrocuted by a television they bought at Wal-Mart.

Some of us Evil DUers could clean up on this...we start a company that buys returns from Wal-Mart on the cheap (accepting liability for any damaged product), fixes them and sells them in a chain of Big Lots-style outlets across the country.

[tsuki]

58. Some manufacturers have a RTV policy that allows for a percentage

of the goods sold to be returned. That reduces the cost of inspections, freight etc.

Some years you eat a lot of returned goods, some years you make a profit on the return credit. The theory is that it all evens out.

But you cannot apply for a RTV credit on an item you discounted.

[jmowreader]

62. At least one manufacturer I know of handles RTV like this...

This is our door vendor. They use "RTV in house."

A certain percentage of the doors we receive are broken in transit. We log the broken doors, fax in the logsheet for credit, and "dispose of" the broken doors. They don't care how.

We then call the fire department. A bunch of fire departments in the area have banded together to build a big training facility. It's nice out there. They have a commuter plane, a C-130 and a house...and the house always needs doors because the doors all get kicked in and burned up while they're practicing putting out fires in there. So they are scrounging free doors constantly, and we are happy to help.

[tsuki]

63. Some manufacturers insist that you have proof of destruction

because the item is defective, like porcelain waterclosets. They don't want them out there because it will brand the product as inferior. Doors can be repaired and you can see the repair. A wc that will not flush because it was warped when taken out of the mold is not visible.

[jmowreader]

64. You're right. They're all different

Which explains why the RTV clerk is not only a full-time position, but one of the higher-paying ones in the store.

[Deja Q]

8. Link?

[NEOBuckeye]

9. How incredibly wasteful.

This makes no practical sense. It's just greed in the absolute extreme.

[LostInAnomie]

10. They allow the Salvation Army bell ringers because...

... it is a cosmetic facade that makes the public think that they care. It also doesn't cost them a thing.

Plasma TV's on the other hand would cost then maybe $50-$100 to repair. That's just not in the Walmart budget.

[Demonaut]

33. you repair TV's?

[BiggJawn]

47. $50?

I charge $43 just to plug it in and see if the remote batteries are dead.

Maybe it has to do with the manufacturer's policy. Hard to send 'em back to the factory when the factory doesn't want 'em...

[TheMightyFavog]

65. Not at the Marinette Evil Empire.

You see, the Boilermakers local likes to volunteer to be bellringers there.

[TwilightZone]

12. Don't believe everything you hear.

Considering the intensity of media exposure re: Wal-Mart, if this were true, we would have heard about it a million times already.

[SeveneightyWhoa]

15. Yeah, exactly.

Where or how did you hear about this?

[Cattledog]

26. Heard it here

Of course the deleted one of my posts as being "political"


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=515552

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

13. On the other hand,

ridding the world of televisions, even those only slightly damaged, can't be all bad. Unfortunately, they get replaced.......

[NewHampshireDem]

14. I have never seen this practice.

I did not work at Sam's Club, but I did work at Wal-Mart--same company, same policies. (And my brother was an assistant store manager for them for 2 years.) All returns are processed in bins in the back of the store and shipped back to the distribution center, where they are either returned to the vendors or shipped to outlet centers (I think they still operate "Bud's" stores out in the midwest, though I am not 100% certain).

If they are destroyed, it is because it is what the vendor wants, not what Wal-Mart wants. For example, books, which are handled by a separate vendor, are 'destroyed' by having their covers removed and returned to publishers and then simply thrown away, since there is no inherent value in the book.

I would be *very* surprised if this were true, since you can by refurbed plasma TV's through different outlets.

<on edit>BTW, yes, Wal-Mart is evil, but never, ever confuse evil with stupid.

[Lisabtrucking]

16. I think thats what the boss wants you to believe. I know for a fact

they do this in the one my mother works for, you can see the trailer with the grinder on it. In the back of some stores.

[NewHampshireDem]

19. Uh, okay.

:eyes:

I guess I must have been halucinating the whole thing ... loading the merch onto the trucks, etc. etc.

And, oh yeah ... the trailer with the grinder on it--must be to grind up plasma TV's, because that would be the most efficient way to do it, rather than just throwing them in the compactor. No, let's get a special "damaged goods grinder" that we run secretly ... :rubs hands together in a sinister fashion:

[ultraist]

29. Uh...maybe different stores have different policies

According to the State TAX codes. In some states, it is more profitable to throw something out and declare it a loss, than it is to get a deduction for a donation. Tax laws vary from state to state. FL for example, doesn't have State income tax as most states do.

[JNelson6563]

34. I saw same

When I was with the marketing division of Sam's returns that were defective went back to the vendor for credit. Just didn't like it items were returned to stock. Wal-mart never, ever wastes like what I see in original post. Hell they save freight boxes to ship back to the DCs to be re-used. Right on the boxes is says "Returning this box for re-use saves the Co. xxx dollars".

Julie

[B Calm]

17. Auto Zone does the same sort of practice. I watched stores

throw thousands of STP air and oil filters into dumpster pans when the company changed to Fram.. They were not allowed to give any away..

[gaia_gardener]

20. I have a hard time believing that

since I've been in lots of Sam's and they all have a section at the back of reduced items. You can tell that several of the items are returns, some are display models and some are packages that have been damaged.

I recently was dragged into a sam's by my mother and saw lawn equipment that was clearly returned - you could see the dried grass still stuck to it.

C

[WLKjr]

57. There are some stores that do though

Trust me, I have seen it happen.


Now on the other hand there are a few stores that have a "clearance section" like the store I work at. I was informed the other day I had to start checking out ALL computer equipment, not just the computers themselves so that they wouldn't have to send them back and get charged from our return facility. This includes printers, pc cards, wireless equipment, cables, etc.

I sold a hp computer that was 1198 (P4 with Hyperthreading Tech, 180GB HD, 512RDRAM, DualLayer DVD Burner/DVD Rom Drive) missing it's nice HP 17" LCD monitor for $700, which a customer still continued to argue with me to the point I just ignored him and said to him someone else would buy it for that much.

9 times out of ten it's just people bringing this shit back becuase they are too damn dumb to use them or hook them (this includes TV sets ) up so they say they don't work thinking they won't be allowed to return it just to return it. I hate that. It's 15 days for computers, 45 days for anything else having to do with a computer people with reciept. lol, damn don't lie about so I have to waste time (bad thing?) trying to find out if what you said was wrong with it was true! lol :)

[youngdem]

21. This is not how it works,

I used to work for a large manufacturing company, one of our contracts was walmart. When walmart had a return they would call our company and request a return authorization. Our company would weigh the costs of shipping back to us vs. having walmart "dispose" of the item. Most of the time we would tell walmart to do as they pleased with the product because the shipping was so high.(compared with what wal mart payed for the item, because of course they got the "lowest" price) It is always up to the manufacturer of the product, about what to do with returns.

Walmart is a horrible company, they almost forced the company I worked for out of business.

[Spacejet]

22. Errr

Let me tell you a little secret... You know that multi-thousand price tag? The thing took $100 tops to produce.

It's like when you buy a computer instead of assembling it your self from OEM components. You're paying hundreds more than it's actually worth.

[Dookus]

53. LOL

Sorry, that's just not true. You can't make a $5k television for $100. I worked for years in product development in consumer electronics companies, and the margins are actually pretty low.

Of course, it's not just the cost-of-goods involved. There's development, testing, manufacturing, shipping, return, repairs, support and service, and lots of other costs.

[Johonny]

23. Sounds true to me

My brother was manager at another big retial store for a while. And this was there company pratice as well. I wonder if there is a legal angle invovled.

[ultraist]

28. There probably is a legal angle: Taxes (loss vs. donations)

Deductions for losses are higher than deductions for contributions to charity. So, in effect, they make more by throwing it away, then by donating it.

It's all about the bottom line.

[Johonny]

30. True

But in the world of online reselling on places like ebay it would seem foolish to not resell these items. I mean when you see what people get on ebay for a refurbished Ipod, I would think a resold plasma TV would be worth more than the write off. My guess is there is a liability issue that scares these companies off.

You can't easily donate TVs. I've tried and most places will not take them.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lorien]

27. Costco resells returned items at a discount

and of course, Costco is BLUE!

[Johonny]

31. I noticed best buy

and Frys and Good guys does this. The upside is the items are cheaper. The downside is they often are sold as is.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SoCalDem]

38. Poor people getting "fancy" TVs.. Surely you jest !

:)

[porphyrian]

48. McDonalds business theory

They do the same thing at McDonalds with the food. After a certain amount of time, the unsold pre-prepared food is thrown out. They don't want anyone eating it after that point, and employees caught doing so are immediately fired. Why? Because rather than seeing the twenty-one minute old burgers as wasted food, they see each as an opportunity for someone to steal the price of buying a fresh one inside. Fuck the starving, eat their garbage and you're preventing them from taking in the $1.99 they'd make selling you the same thing one minute earlier. Everything's a profit loss or gain. Can anyone doubt these decisions are being made by accountants?

[WLKjr]

54. You should see the Books they throw out

it's okay though, :( they get vendor credit for books not sold......

[democracyindanger]

56. Not to mention the toxic materials dumped in the landfill

A lot of heavy metals in a high-tech appliance like a plasma TV. The least they could do is send the broken bits to a proper recycler.

[kamqute]

59. This shouldn't be an issue for progressives because..

..buying a plasma TV with full knowledge of what you are doing in most cases basically disqualifies you from being progressive. Those things eat electricity like nothing else.

[NuttyFluffers]

60. find it hard to believe, but if it's true :D

it sounds quite funny :D have waves of people buying expensive plasma tvs, then returning them because of a cosmetic (aka, smudge) defect.

ahh, if only it was true... then you could have a most amusing protest against wal*mart. 'i buy your stuff! if it's defective, i'll return it! even if it isn't defective, i'll return it! mwa ha ha ha!' *image of thousands of tvs being ground down by bulldozers*

and the funniest part is it'd probably increase your FICO score :D they mostly care about activity, not about returns. 'damn you wal*mart! i'm gonna force you to improve my credit and eat it!'

ha ha ha, well, one can dream, can't we?