The Fundie Right has successfully Hijacked Christianity

[DearAbby]

Those that are sane Christians, that truly follow the teachings of Jesus and the New Testament. I understand you feel that there are those that mock and insult your beliefs.

There are a few here that have crossed that line. Yet, you have to take into account that the very vocal radical right has hijacked the term Christians. They are in the process of dismantling this country. legislating laws that would turn our form of government into a Theocracy.

Very simular to the term Liberal, it has been defaced. Maybe if you would consider the term, Followers of Christ. Or retake the name, and your faith. I hear very little out there of those who truly follow Christ's teachings standing up against these people.

Granted the Media will be no help in this area, but it must start locally. What can you do, to reclaim your faith as true followers of Christ. What are some ideas that can help in this area?

[BuyingThyme]

1. It was an easy task.

All they had to do was cross the line between religion and government.

Being that they were the only ones trying to do this, they won by default.

[seabeyond]

2. i mean we have the catholics in michigan promoting

not giving medical care to gays, or birth control to women.

all catholics are responsible if they walk into the church every week. just how i feel. you are honoring the religion by continuing in it. it is you responsibility to bring this to your preists, it is your job to say, jesus healed the only homosexual we know of in jesus's interaction, he did not reject, he did not walk away

this is my point on not being a sensitive christian. if our religion is doing it, then we have to stand up to our religion. it does no good for athiests to do it. only we can. and we cannot blame those that are angry at us

just like the repugs that dont agree with all bush does, they get my contempt as long as they dont speak up. is their party, it is their job to do

[Tux]

5. Collection plate

Each $ you give supports wackos. That simple. Don't give any money. At all. If your priest or minister complains, tell him you won't support a church that promotes hatred and supports inequality that Jesus fought against. If they threaten to remove communion for you or kick you out, let them and alert a newspaper. Did Jesus kick anyone out of his sermons? Did he demand they give money or agree with his politics? Remind them that Christians go by the New Testament and not the Torah (Old Testament). If they want the Torah, they should be Jews.

If a sermon is about hating gays, right wing politics, etc, get up and leave. If they say you're going to hell, remind them that Jesus allowed people to come and go as they pleased.

[seabeyond]

15. i personally feel most all preist will embrace the

christian that comes to them and states this is occuring in michigan in the name of catholics, and as a catholic just cannot honor this and have a discussion with priest. they listen. i jsut feel we can do it in love, not battle. i dont think it has to be ugly, i think the point is better made done in love

[YellowRubberDuckie]

9. Oh Please.

That's like saying all Muslims are responsible for Bin Laden or all Germans are responsible for Hitler. Give me a break. :eyeroll:
Duckie

[seabeyond]

17. roll your eyes, but ya.............all that didnt stand up

i also believe in all men responsible for their gender and women theirs. i feel a responsibility for my fellow woman to be a voice of reason, as i hope a male sittin in a locker room, listening to some guy talk about getting a chick drunk adn then fuckin her, i expect that man to say, hey that isnt cool dude. they wont listen to a woman, but they will listen to their brother. the fundies will listen to fellow fundies. the germans, absolutely they have a part if they allowed. and the muslims, long ago should have addressed their sect that said suicide will bring 72 virgins. yes

i do believe this

now i dont believe that a person has to take on a guilt for what an individual does. i am not saying that. all people get to own what they do

i believe whites as a whole should feel a responsibility adn stand up to fellow whites that discriminate towards blacks. i dont take responsibility for slavery, nor racial views, but i know my race has caused a lot of pain to the black community and i take responsibility for that

[DearAbby]

20. Well said and I agree

:)

[FreedomAngel82]

24. You think it's easy?

You think all someone has to do is speak out? Please. It's not that easy. Look at the fundies on the right for example. If something doesn't go their way they send out death threats and kick people out of the church. Sure the guy could've stud up and said "no" but each person is different. I can only speak for myself. I can't make someone else do something. By my actions I can only show what it's like to be a Christian. I can respect all life (as Jesus did) and help those who need it. I can show people not everybody are like those on the right and speak up when I have the opportunity. You try dealing with the fundies who call you an idiot, clouded, anti-American. I've tried dealing with some on the Terri Schavio case on another board but it's just impossible to deal with people who are brainwashed.

[DearAbby]

27. What would Jesus do? Back off because it wasn't easy?

Says alot about your faith. If you have the faith of a mustard seed, you can move a mountain...The majority of the people in this country are not this extreme right. These are the people that can be reasoned with. Some dont realize until now just how far these people have gone.

Isn't this worth saving? Those that are infiltrating our government are just a small percentage of the population. Yet they are on the verge of destroying this country.

[seabeyond]

31. what would jesus do................exactly, kid in preschool

at this fundie school and they were doing some stuff i didnt agree with. an opportunity came with another child. didnt have what my child had. i asked son, what would jesus do..............teacher children all stopped to see. and my son perfectly did this. it was a gentle reminder for those in this space. wasnt hard, hurt no one, and a moment of lite and love

[seabeyond]

30. i was in a fundie school for 6 years, i didnt follow any of their rules

and i always spoke out, i always kept my integrity and i always followed the path i interpreted of jesus's words. i always did it with respect and love. and i never had a fight. i came in for 6 years with brightness and a smile and embracing and love of all the people. my children gave the same to that school. adn we didnt belong, yet we were embraced, and when we left, i was called in and asked why, what went wrong, what did the school not give me. i told them, listed it, adn we talked about how they could fix some things.

fundies are not innately evil. they too have been directed away from lite in a horrible way. i do not see it as a lost cause for fundies to even take back their religion. i have a handful of women i continue to stay in contact with, to share their responsibility in the hate their religion is creating.

to let them see they can be better, they certainly want to be better. no. i have not given up on fundies either. i know too many that are beautiful, full of lite and love, no way i would turn my back on this

and who said things had to be easy

[LittleClarkie]

13. Each church is different

even within denominations. Some are more progressive and some more conservative. All Catholics should not be damned by what SOME Catholics do. I was shocked, for instance, to find a Baptist church that makes a point of welcoming everyone as they are. Shocked I tell you. I thought all Baptists were fundamentalists.

I'm not conceding the word Christian to these people, and I don't think it's right that the RW has tried to take Liberal away from us. I don't feel like giving them that power. That said, some did opt for "People of Faith" during the election. We had buttons for them and everything. As well as Catholics for Kerry and Christians for Kerry.

Are all Muslims responsible for the actions of some? Should they renounce Islam, then? Or refer to themselves as people of faith instead, or risk being just as guilty as those who use their religion for terrorism?

It is not "our religion" that is doing much of this, I think. It is a faction within the religion.

Sadly the more reasonable folk have forums and discussions and write letters about what is happening in their faith and how they feel about it. But not being the drama queens that their more fundamental counterparts are, they don't make good copy apparently. The meek shall not get on the telly, it seems.

[DearAbby]

16. The Muslims in this country... was/Is very vocal about the separation

of their true faith and those fundamentalists that preach violence and hate.

Christians need to do the same, starting locally in their own church if need be.


But one point, the Fundamentalist Muslim is not trying to take over our country. "Christians" are.


edit: spelling ack

[LittleClarkie]

21. And yet I've heard Freepers claim that none ever did

I swear some of those people are half blind. They don't see what doesn't fit into their hate-filled model.

How does one stand up where one will be noticed, I wonder. I suppose the more reasonable among us don't know how to play hardball.

I was proud of my button though. It made the point that I, as a Christian, was not down with the Bush agenda. Some folks still think God is a Republican. In fact, friends of mine who know I go to church don't understand why I'm NOT Republican. Esh.

[FreedomAngel82]

25. I'm with you

All the college age kids in my church were pro-Bush except my brother and I who were very much anti-Bush (but that's not the only reason why I voted Kerry, I really respect and admire him). I even had on my car a "Kerry/Edwards" bumper sticker and a pin on my purse. ;) I wasn't going to let people think I too was a Bush supporter. Ew. No way. But I'm starting to speak out more and not be so shy about my feelings. It's a small step but I'm willing to take it and get used to speaking out.

[seabeyond]

18. they should stand up and speak out, condemning the action

absolutely. if it is broguht up in a catholic church that doesnt believe this or behave in this manner, may become more sensitive and understanding to why people are reacting to them as they are, and with valid reason. it might open dialogue. it might make things better

better than pretending that all is fine, not speaking of it or saying no to it

[Pithlet]

41. Thank you for this

this is my point on not being a sensitive christian. if our religion is doing it, then we have to stand up to our religion. it does no good for athiests to do it. only we can. and we cannot blame those that are angry at us

You don't know how badly I need to hear this right now. Thank you for understanding.

[seabeyond]

42. the more people that can take this from battle

to protect their personal beliefs, the quicker we heal

[bamademo]

3. They did themselves in.

It's not often I listen to conservative radio but today I heard a woman call in and say she was a Pentecostal minister and she was ashamed of the way "these so called Christians" are behaving.

Even conservative Christians want to distance themselves from these loons. I think it's a good thing they got so much exposure.

[LittleClarkie]

14. As someone said yesterday, Americans just don't like protesters

They don't care what the issue is, they don't like protesters.

[FreedomAngel82]

26. Me too

Maybe it's a blessing in desguise how they're acting. I think it's bad that it had to happen this way but maybe some people are waking up with how some of the fundies are. I was surprised to hear 2/3's of those who consider themselves evangelicals were against what was going on.

[pelagius]

4. Please educate yourself with a cursory Google search

...and see what Christians are doing before you start issuing challenges. Try, for example, "Christian social justice" and see what comes up.

[FreedomAngel82]

28. There was also

a website that was Christians 4 Kerry and it had information and things like that on there. I'm not sure if it's still up though. I tried it once a while back and it didn't work.

[Az]

6. Not quite

The religious right has hijacked the public perception of Christianity. I would suggest that many if not most Christians are far more open minded than the fanatics on the right would suggest.

But that doesn't change that the dominant voice for Christianity in our society is currently the religious right. In the short term this is merely a political issue. But in the long term the dominant voice becomes the dominant position. Particularly as more and more believers are introduced to it via this strong voice in the public arena.

Thus it becomes a question of what are the defenders of the more progressive sects going to do? They have to place their voice in the public square to refute the claims of the right. They have to use their infrastructures to counter the rights machinations.

[DearAbby]

8. Just saying...What is it worth to you? Are you willing to fight for your

Faith, dont blame those that mock and denounce Christianity, if this is what they see as a reference. You have to take back your faith, you are the only ones that can do it.

[Ron Green]

7. There's a fundamental problem (no pun intended)....

I hear very little out there of those who truly follow Christ's teachings standing up against these people.

People who truly follow Christ's teachings don't tend to "stand up" against others, but to love them and forgive them. That's the irony of the whole Christian issue: A real Christian, as I understand it, forgives seventy times seven, even as he sees the bullshit and hypocrisy around him.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

10. Short and sweet. You said it better than I ever could.

Thanks,
Duckie

[Tux]

11. 68, 69, 70

Time to kick ass!

[FreedomAngel82]

29. Yes

The verse in Matthew 25 says it all. If people really loved Christ and was a real Christian would be following him and not their "leaders."

[LoganW]

36. Oh please

"People who truly follow Christ's teachings don't tend to "stand up" against others, but to love them and forgive them"

Biggest copout ever.

[seabeyond]

37. actually seems to be a consistancy when talking to my religious

i say something about bush, or dobson focus on the family, i immediately get we are all sinners

i told a couple friends recently, i would like for them to be able to go beyond the easy, we are all sinners. a sinner also has to repent, work at not doing it again, own it. to just allow and then say, oh well we are all sinners is wrong.

[Red State Rebel]

38. Judge not, lest you be judged

is the scripture that effects me the most. I did some stupid things when I was young and I needed forgiveness. I learned very quickly that being judged sucks and thus, I refuse to judge others.

It is not my place to judge what every other Christian does, it is Gods - period.

I'm sorry if you don't understand that, but it is the way I believe.

[Ron Green]

39. So, in your view, those who follow Christ's teachings fight others?

Hmmm.... I guess you could come up with that somehow, but I don't buy it. To me, the Christ is about forgiveness. Forgive myself, forgive the world. It's one and the same.

Why don't you 'splain to me about the copout part?

[smitty]

12. Christians

The problem is that "fundies" also believe that they are truly following the words of Christ and the New Testament. So if you're a "sane" Christian does that mean that those with different viewpoints are an "insane" Christians---not much chance for dialog there. Fundamentalism is not just a Christian problem as there is Muslim, Hindu and Jewish fundamentalism out there too, it's a world-wide phenomenon. I think it's a reaction against modernism, democracy, feminism and science. It's not new, but it's become more widespread in the past 30 years.

We can't abolish fundamentalism, but can contain it and keep it from gaining political power. Moderate and liberal Christians (and non-Christians) have to take the concepts of fundamentalism seriously before we can deal with it successfully.

[seabeyond]

19. what would happen if the moderate and liberal christians

would all go to ministers, preachers and priest and tell them your concern of what is happening to the christian faith. do you think there might be a collective awareness that we are better than this, and we need to start promoting the better of who we are not the worse

[DearAbby]

22. Very good point, church to church, person to person.

[seabeyond]

23. this is my point. if there is a groundswell

from the religious folks, talking to their ministers and priests, and they do it in christ conscious, in spirit in love, then they will see, they will take it to their gatherings adn they will start saying, you know..........the people, our people want us to be better. we can be better

[pelagius]

44. My personal response to the hijacking of the Christian name...

...by radical clerics was to return to my nominal church -- the Episcopal Church -- after a twenty-year absence and get involved. I am non-dogmatic and cross my fingers during certain parts of the Nicene Creed we recite during our liturgy. I'm an agnostic at least three days a week and a believer at least three, leaving one day as a toss-up. I fit in just fine.

On the Sunday that V. Gene Robinson was consecrated Bishop of New Hampshire my wife and I strolled into our local Episcopal church and let anyone who talked to us know we were there because we supported the full inclusion of GLBT people in the life and ministry of the church. We said we heard people would leave the Episcopal Church in droves as a result of this move and we were here to replace them. :-)

We were welcomed with open arms and continued to be welcomed and valued as we began to contribute our time, money, and skills to our parish community. Along the way, we met many friends who shared our commitment to social justice. We also met Christian brothers and sisters who disagreed strongly with us, but loved us just the same, as we love them.

My wife, a professional educator, helped shaped the Sunday school curriculum in concert with others so that a new generation would be taught not about the utter depravity of humankind and God's unyielding wrath, but that we are all created in God's image and our baptismal vow is to "seek and serve Christ in others" and "work for justice and peace among all people."

At the minister's urging, I began to lead a Bible study focused on the Hebrew prophets and there message of repentance and return to the ways of God. Chief among the sins they decried were oppression of the poor and weak by the rich and powerful. The Bible study started with 2 people and myself and grew to around 30 before it ended nine months later.

Two years after our arrival,I was elected to the board of the church (the Vestry) that handles all the business affairs of the congregation. It just so happened that my reluctant arrival tipped the Vestry into having a progressive majority.

We've done some purely symbolic things like see that "fair trade" coffee is served at parish functions -- "s/he who controls the coffee pot controls the church!" -- and run ads in alternative newspapers announcing ourselves as open to all. But we also have created and funded a "social justice commission" and joined an interfaith alliance working on social justice issues in our community.

As many of you know, the US Episcopal Church (ECUSA) is an the verge of being kicked out of the worldwide Anglican communion because of its commitment to including GLBT persons fully in the life and worship of the church. Some US Episcopal churches have broken or announced they will break with the ECUSA if it continues down this path to full inclusivity. The Vestry of any particular congregation is who gets to vote on this issue, if it comes up. I'm please to say our church vestry, in a straw poll was unanimous against leaving the ECUSA now or in the future over this issue and that we full supported our gay brothers and sisters in Christ.

This is very long post and I hesitate to continue with more because, it smacks embarrassingly of self-aggrandizement if read in a certain way. I can assure that none of this has happened because I'm so smart and special. In fact, I am deeply flawed and limited in my faith. Many Christians would call me a heretic or apostate.

But I firmly believe that the way churches or any other institution changes is bit by bit through the steady involvement of folks who are committed to the radical call of the Gospel and who do not see "American values" and "Christian values" as synonymous.

So, in long-winded answer to the question posed in this thread, right-wing radical clerics have spent several decades building up their institutions and networks. We liberal and moderates are far behind, but were are plowing the ground in which, God willing, new seeds of progressive faith will sprout.

I end with a personal challenge to all lapsed Christians: if you still believe that the Gospel calls us to radical love and social justice, please forgive the institutional church that failed you, and find a place where you can make your stand, with all your doubts and failings and misgivings, to take back the Christian name.

May God shine his light on your path! Welcome home.

[LevelB]

32. Maybe we have lost

But I am not giving up.

The Republicans have hijacked two branches of Federal Government and are working like beavers to get the third. Should we concede?

Like hell.

B.

[jonnyblitz]

33. they are the face of christianity I am sorry to say

whether people like it or not. :shrug:

[Frumious B]

34. Christians are a third of the world's population.

The "Religious Right" represents maybe about a third of Christians in America which actually makes them a miniscule portion of the total Christian population of the planet. To say that they have "hijacked Christianity" gives them far more credit than they deserve. The faith is quite a bit larger than America or its politics.

Personally, I'm far more worried about the neocons and unbridled global corporate imperialism than I am about the Religious Right. At least the Religious Right have some moral dimension to them, warped though it might be. The same can't be said for those other cats. In a way, I think that the Religious Right are being set up to take the fall for the neocons. At any rate, it is a near certainty that the Religious Right will overreach themselves as they always do, get bitch slapped by Joe Public and end up slinking back into their little niche of playing Led Zeppelin records backwards in search of hidden messages from Satan.

[DearAbby]

35. They are the face and voice of Christianity in this country

and in our neck of the woods, they have successfully hijacked it. They have hold of two branches of our government, strangling the third.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bryn]

43. Austrailans consider U.S. 's Foreign Policy a Big Threat just as

Islamic Fundamentalism. I saw it on TV news this morning but didn't catch it all. U.S. better wake up and stop mixing policy with religion and also Bush and most of his crones are going too far.