Is it safe to say that the parties have officially flopped on big govt.?

[Cadence]

Republicans are now officially the big government party. Patriot act, congress intervening in personal matters, massive fiscal irresponsibility... etc.

Can it really be argued that support of social welfare programs consitutes a belief in big government?

[Roxy66]

1. Democrats were never the "Big Government "party....GOP talking point

[Cadence]

6. But that's how the parties have been defined for ages

before GOP talking points. The GOP has made it a talking point because it's not based in reality. They think if they say it enough, those that don't want to pay taxes will get brainwashed into thinking it's true.

What am I wondering is what initially gave the Democratic party that label... the support of social programs- clean air, water, safe food, social security?

[Vincardog]

2. The radical Right has just shown it's true colors

FASCIST corrupt crony capitalists. Rape the 99% to benefit the 1%
I am revolted by the racist bastards

[MindPilot]

3. yes.

As I starting saying somewhere around 1981, "Republicans want to get big government off your back...so they can shove it up your ass."

I told a con yesterday that the thing I really don't like about conservatives is that they want big government involved in the most intimate details of our personal lives while they rack up massive debt to do it.

He just looked at me.

I think they have basically handed us their asses on a silver platter.

[Beetwasher]

4. Only If One Buys The Propoganda

Repubs are most definitely all for big brother government. They want gov't involved in the most private aspects of everyone's life; what you do w/ your body, who you marry, how you die. They just want government out of the business of helping those less fortunate than them.

It's actually the governments job to be involved in social programs, that's why government was created really. At a basic level, gov't is there to PROTECT and represent the populace and provide for common defense. That's otherwise known as social welfare.

[Cadence]

7. Well put. n/t

[BlueEyedSon]

5. I think the Dems have been consistent on "big govt" but the

pubs have done a great big 180, from one side of the dems to the other.

2 observations.
1. Redistribution of wealth via the budget (one measure of the size of gov't is the relative size of the budget). The treasury - funded by our taxes and bond debt - is the largest, easiest pile of money to STEAL. And steal it they did via wars, corporate welfare and tax giveaways to the rich.

2. Breakdown of Church/State separation. Now that the republicans are the defacto "Fundamentalist Christian Party" and they want to legislate morality, government is going to stick itself in to every nook & cranny of our lives.

[Clark Bayh 2008]

8. Well put

The height of irony.

[bemildred]

9. Big Government is a red herring, a straw man.

The issue is democratic and responsive government.
If it works for the people, the people can decide how big
or small it should be. Right now we have no say.