so what happens if the pope goes into a coma? Or dies temporarily

[Bombtrack]

Can there be 2 popes at once? Like what happened with the Slayers on Buffy.

Eliza Dushku should be the next pope.

[opihimoimoi]

1. they will prolly tube him for 16 years??

[Jamastiene]

2. I can only predict that

nothing will happen. They'll give it 'til the end and then pick a new one probably.

[MADem]

3. Only one pope allowed

If he goes into a coma, he is still the pope. If he lingers for years, he is still the pope. There is a household of factotums who do the day to day work, so everything will continue to run on autopilot for the time being.

There could be a letter, a "living will" as it were, that the pope MAY--I say again MAY--have written and given to one of his senior staff, providing advanced directives if he remains ill for a prolonged period. It could say anything from 'leave me hooked up--I want the title to the end' to 'I resign if if am sick for more than (fill in timeframe).' There is no requirement for such a letter, but there is speculation if one exists.

If, say, he decided to resign, they'd toss him up to the Summer Residence for the rest of his days. If he wants to hang onto the title no matter what, well, the church will just chug along, and likely one of the household senior staff will emerge as a face that we see often. There WILL be jockeying for power. Navarro Valls, the Vatican spokesman, will probably have to work a bit harder too.

[ClintonTyree]

5. Thanks for the insight...........

Catholic stuff confuses the heck out of me. They're chained by history so it's hard to tell who the "playas" are from time to time.

[ClintonTyree]

4. But who decides.............

if the Pope is in a vegetative state for years being kept alive by any means necessary (which, so I've heard, is the plan), who makes the decisions?
Until that little puff of smoke comes out of the chimney, he's still the Pope. :shrug: Any Vatican specialists here? What happens?

[Dogmudgeon]

6. The time between Popes is called the "Interregnum"

The word actually means "between kings".

Here's what I know about it ...

If the Pope dies, there is no Pope. Period. Yes, there are provisions for the senior Cardinals to act with provisional Papal authority.

The newly-elected Pope is officially installed during the elevation Mass. Of course, there's always somebody minding the Vatican office. But all authority in the Church is considered provisional, anyway, as an organizational substitute for the authority of Jesus and the Apostles.

It works much the same way within Bon (Tibetan) Buddhism. When the Dalai Lama dies in body, they consider him to be "away" until they can determine who he reincarnated as. The child is not expected to resume his duties until adulthood. There are several other orders of Lamas who can assume authority; in fact, the Dalai Lama line (believed to be the same personage by the faithful) isn't the only one that has been in authority in the history of Tibet.

Also, as far as I remember it, any Priest is able to substitute for Papal authority in extremis. So if you're a Roman Catholic, and you're stranded on a desert island with a priest, you're OK. A layperson can also observe the Mass, even if s/he can't officiate. It's the thought that counts. The Sacrament is the gift of God to Man; where no physical Sacrament is available, the effort made to follow its intent is considered to be more than sufficient.

Overall, the Roman Catholic Church isn't the soul-strangling dictatorship it's often made out to be; obedience is spiritual, not secular. Mind you, it wasn't always like that, much to the shame of modern Catholics.

--p!

[Ferry Fey]

13. Bon question

Just a technical question here --I know of Bon as being the indigenous shamanic tradition in Tibet. While it may have adapted to the rise of Buddhism in Tibet, does the Dalai Lama actually consider his lineage to be rooted in Bon rather than in Buddhism itself?

[Dogmudgeon]

14. Similar relationship to Christianity + Druidism in Europe

As Buddhism spread throughout Europe, it took on local characteristics. In India, it retained a Hindu "flavor"; in Indochina, the local spiritual traditions were also absorbed. Zen in Japan (or Chan in Chinese) became a major school of thought. It could be argued, fairly, that a large chunk of the American "New Age" movement will eventually develop a truly American Buddhism (in spite of the New Age's foibles). In Tibet, the religion emerged in the 8th century, with the Bardo Thodol appearing soon after; Buddhist monks probably brought literacy to the Himalayan peoples, and their alphabets are based on those used in India.

Tibetan Buddhism is considered, by most Tibetans, to be like Judaism -- it's a religion as well as an ethnic culture. I know next to nothing about the Tibetan language, but the word "Bon" is probably a word describing national identity, like "Hebrew". So the Dalai Lama would probably consider his lineage to be both ethnic and religious. Like Judaism, while it has not traditionally actively proselytized, it accepts converts.

The current Dalai Lama (Tenzing Gyatso) has revolutionized the faith, making it more of a "cosmopolitan" religion, accessible to a much larger number of people. Chogyam Trungpa, the Shamballah Publishing house, and Robert Thurman have all had tremendous influence in bringing the religion to a wide audience, and Timothy Leary's enthusiasm for the Bardo Thodol in the 1960s dovetailed well with the peak years of the Tibetan diaspora.

I'm expecting that someone will try to synthesize pop Celtic Druidism and Buddhism any day now ... :)

--p!

[mrbill]

7. check your local video store for "shoes of the fisherman".....

A 1968 film with Anthony Quinn in the process of becoming Pope and David Jassen as a reporter with a troubled homelife. Lots of political intrigue going on. The nuclear option is being discussed.

Against the background of this plot is an excellent summary of how Popes are selected. The cardinals are locked in the Sistine Chapel and have real nice chairs. Black smoke no, white smoke yes.

Invest 160 minutes in this movie and you will fully understand the process and be mildly entertained.

[Bronco69]

10. Here's an interesting site that tells about the Papal election

process. http://www.catholic-pages.com/pope/election.asp

[MADem]

8. The same bunch who have been making them all along

The pope has a mess of senior advisors, they have been doing most of the heavy lifting for quite a few years. When the pope gets a bee in his bonnet about something, he will focus his attention on it, and everyone else of course falls into line, but the day to day management of the church is far away from his unsteady hand.

Basically, it will be sorta like the Iraqi provisional authority, the cash gets doled out, the cash comes in, if someone down the food chain dies, they as a group make interim appointments (not permanent ones, though) and they keep the whole business clicking. They don't have the authority to take the church in a different direction, though. They will be very conservative in their actions, of that you can be sure.

This has happened before to previous popes. The mechanism is well in place to work around him. But we do not know if he left an advanced directive with his secretary, which would 'retire' him if he is ill for a long period. And we won't know, unless that happens.

[RebelOne]

9. What do you mean "dies temporarily"?

If I am correct, death is permanent.

[mrfrapp]

11. Don't know if this true of not,

According to the BBC, he has a living will that will be opened if he falls into a coma. It is understood that this will contains his resignation. He can't be stripped of his position by anyone other than himself.

[radfringe]

12. if/when he dies

it will "god's will"

if he rises again it will be a miracle...

speaking of which -- just heard on CBS news that Pope is out of his coma but in "severe" condition