CAFTA will be voted soon, the vote will be very close and DU doesn't care

[arcos]

Ok, the subject is far tougher than the content of this message. I don't think DU doesn't care, but I'm amazed by the lack of discussion about this topic. Free trade was a somewhat important issue in the 2004 US elections, and it is a recurrent topic in most political discussions in Latin America. Why is it ignored in DU?

Just a few examples in the last 2 weeks...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=1775112
May 10 - no replies
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1443160
May 3 - 5 replies
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1458215
May 9 - no replies
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1444880
May 4 - 5 replies
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=3590515
May 3 - 2 replies


People... CAFTA has been approved in Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador... it will soon be approved in Nicaragua and the Dominican Republic, and Costa Rica will probably follow. It MUST be stopped in the US, and right now numbers are looking good. Bush now has promised to do all the arm-twisting necessary to approve it, but it is not looking good for them. It is possible to defeat Bush's trade policy, but definitely this topic needs to be discussed more, and hopefully more online activism like what has been done for other issues.

Central America is the second most important market for US goods and lots of outsourcing is heading this way. You can imagine the kind of negative impact it would probably have on both American and Central American citizens... This is in fact a referendum on NAFTA and US trade policy that has been exported to other countries.

http://us.news3.yimg.com/img.news.yahoo.com/util/anysize/380,http%3A%2F%2Fus.news1.yimg.com%2Fus.yimg.com%2Fp%2Frids%2F20050514%2Fi%2Fr4082169365.jpg

Just last week all the Central American Presidents met with the chimp in the White House, for example. The topic was CAFTA.
Come on... let's try to give this issue the discussion it deserves in the next few weeks!

[burrowowl]

1. Re Central America

The people are against it. Bu$h did some serious manhandling to get some leaders elected, but some are getting some serious oposition.

[arcos]

4. Sure, but it is not that serious...

There may be some social unrest, but it is unlikely things will change much. In my country Costa Rica we will have elections in February 2006... the leading candidate is a former President (Nobel Peace Prize winner) who is to the far right on economic issues. He is the main supporter of CAFTA because he considers it the basis of what he likes to call "economic development".

We might as well elect someone else, but if elections were held today, he Oscar Arias would win... There is very little possibility of change in the other countries too.

[anitar1]

2. I have I have been following this since the beginning and it stinks.

From everything I have been reading, I think CAFTA will not fly. NAFTA is a disaster and many of our countrymen know it. I have signed many petitions and contacted my Senators and Congressman. Also forward information to people I know, hoping they will protest this POS. If you have any more suggestions, please let me know. The WTO and Nafta should be shot down, but that will not happen. The destruction of our country has been going on for many years.If I am not mistaken, Bill Clinton signed Nafta into law. Will someone please explain that to me? There has been tons of info for awhile about Cafta, none of it good. I just pray that people are taking note of it.

[arcos]

6. Sometimes it seems people are not taking notes...

Both Americans and Central Americans keep electing people who have screwed them up time and again...

[GreenPartyVoter]

58. Stop CAFTA email petition

http://www.unionvoice.org/campaign/StopCAFTA/

[SoCalDem]

3. Probably because whether "we" support or do NOT support

an issue,means right about ZERO, when it comes to voting on the floor of congress or the senate. The "deals" are already inked, accounts set up, and the money will flow...whether we approve or not..

The sad facts that lots here have not faced yet are these:

Most senators and congresspeople are on the take
Most senators and congresspeople say whatever is expedient
Most senators and congresspeople care about families (their OWN)
Most senators and congresspeople care about voters (when they need donations or votes)

I know it's cynical, but I have observed this "game" since the 60's and see little change over the years...

[arcos]

5. I understand your point...

But this may come down to VERY few votes, and there are undecided congresspeople on both sides of the isle. Even if one pays a little attention to constituents and decides to vote one way or the other, it may affect the outcome.

And even if this is not the case (I have to admit I'm wishful thinking) it is important to discuss this issue... it will affect millions of people in this continent.

[0007]

13. Are you telling the truth?

SouthernDem2004 (1000+ posts) Sun May-15-05 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #8
Sorry if I am not old. :) I am only in my thirties. /eom

[SoCalDem]

14. SouthernDem2004 is not me.. I would love to be in my 30's again

Those were the BEST years :)Enjoy them :):)

[0007]

21. Please forgive me and my stupid error.

[arcos]

7. kick! nt

[Toucano]

8. My only talking point.

Can
Americans
Fuck
Themselves
Again?

[sadiesworld]

9. kick

[countryjake]

10. I've asked the same questions here...

and I'm also feeling the same impending doom that went down back when NAFTA was accepted. You are right that the vote is too close for comfort. I've written letters galore and sparked some interest around this farming county I live in, but the non-interest of certain types is truly confounding. Seems that those so distraught with "massive" immigration across our borders and outsourcing, or environmental-agri-business-devastation and rainforest destruction, sweat-shops and workers' rights, poverty and hunger, might be a bit concerned...hard to explain the dim response.

[arcos]

15. I agree... free trade agreements are a cause of all those problems...

It baffles me... We may discuss social security privatization, the Venezuela situation, foreign policy, the environment, but CAFTA is ignored. x(

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

32. free trade agreements are a cause of all those problems.

Don't you think that's a very, very slight overstatement?

[arcos]

33. Nope...

I'm not saying it is the only cause... but it is certainly one of them, especially in developing countries.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

11. A free-trade association among the countries of Central America

could be a good thing, if done right, sort of like ASEAN or the EU.

If you have a free trade association among countries of similar economic levels, then they can each concentrate on their strengths and support one another.

However, if you throw in a country or too with a vastly wealthier economy:

1) Manufacturing jobs gush out of the wealthier country and into sweatshops in the poorer countries

2) The poorer countries are flooded with subsidized imports from the wealthier country, especially in agriculture, making life even more difficult for subsistence farmers and forcing them into the sweatshops to survive.

[arcos]

16. There are already free trade agreements among Central American countries

And I don't think a US-Central America free trade agreement is necessarily bad... I think this was a missed opportunity and something good could have come out. But it didn't... maybe with left leaning governments in most Central American countries and a Democratic President in the US things could have been much better.

But the current deal is a lose-lose situation for the people everywhere... just more money for big corporations.

[yurbud]

12. CONTACT INFO for senators & congressmen

Congressman
(type your zip in left hand box in light blue bar near top)
http://www.house.gov/


Senators
(type state in box at top)
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

Bush
(make his flunkies waste their time deleting your messages)
http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/

You might mention that trade agreements are fine IF they include strong protections for labor and local sovereignty.

[Zhade]

17. Hell, a lot of the DLCers here SUPPORT IT.

Shameful.

[Swamp Rat]

18. ¡Chinga CAFTA y los lagartos extranjeros también!

:mad:

[Toucano]

19. Has CAFTA been introduced in Congress yet? n/t

[arcos]

27. I don't think so...

They have been doing preliminary hearings though. The actual treaty will probably be voted next month.

[ulysses]

20. globalization has never been a huge starter on DU

frustratingly enough.

[countryjake]

22. Much more info on CAFTA...What does your representative say?

The Real Record on Workers’ Rights in Central America
AFL-CIO April 2005

(This is a large pdf. file from the AFL-CIO, with tons of good information.) Can be downloaded from this page:

http://www.aflcio.org/issuespolitics/globaleconomy/

~ snip of the Introduction~

The Central America Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA) would, if implemented, lower tariffs and other trade barriers between the United States and the six CAFTA countries — Costa Rica, the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras and Nicaragua. CAFTA is significant not only because it would increase the volume of trade between the signatory nations, but also because it would establish a whole new set of rules to govern trade and investment in the region. The debate over CAFTA is a debate over these rules. It is not about whether or not to trade with Central America; rather, it is a debate about how to trade.

This flawed model of free trade without protections for workers’ rights is perhaps best exemplified by the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA). NAFTA created broad new rights for multinational corporations trading and investing in the United States, Mexico and Canada. But the agreement failed to include similarly strong protections for workers’ rights. As a result, 11 years after the agreement was implemented in 1994, trade and investment among the NAFTA countries has increased, but workers have not benefited. In the United States, nearly a million jobs have been lost to the booming trade deficit with Canada and Mexico. In Mexico, basic workers’ rights continue to be denied, real wages have fallen and poverty is on the rise.

In order to access the benefits of trade, workers must be able to exercise their fundamental rights on the job. The most basic of these rights are the core labor standards, which are defined by the 1998 International Labor Organization (ILO) Declaration on Fundamental Principles and Rights at Work to include:
• Freedom of association and the right to organize and bargain collectively;
• The right to be free from forced and compulsory labor;
• The abolition of child labor; and
• The right to work free from discrimination.
Every country in the ILO is bound, by virtue of its membership, to respect, promote and realize the core labor standards identified in the declaration. The core labor rights are universal human rights principles: every worker, whether she or he lives in a rich or poor country, is entitled to these rights, and countries are bound to respect these rights regardless of their level of development.

Unfortunately, like NAFTA, CAFTA fails to fully protect these fundamental rights. Workers’ rights to form and join unions of their own choosing and to bargain collectively with their employers are routinely violated in Central America. Central American labor laws fail to protect these rights, and Central American governments refuse to adequately enforce those protections that do exist. Employers in the region take advantage of weak laws and lax enforcement to intimidate, harass, threaten and fire workers who dare to demand a voice at work. CAFTA allows these violations to persist. In fact, CAFTA’s rules on labor rights are so weak that they even backtrack from existing U.S. laws that require Central American governments and employers to respect workers’ rights in exchange for unilateral trade preferences... read much more


STATEMENT OF CONGRESSMAN STEPHEN F. LYNCH ON THE CENTRAL AMERICAN FREE TRADE AGREEMENT representing the People of the 9th District of Massachusetts
http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/ma09_lynch/CAFTA.html

~snips~

"Simply said: CAFTA will make the rich richer and the poor poorer."

"Free trade should not mean free labor. Likewise, free trade does not, as evidenced in CAFTA, mean fair trade."

"Now we’re working to do another American job export bill."

"We need a trade policy that supports domestic manufacturers, while promoting labor standards overseas."


U.S. is the Loser in New Trade Deal
by U.S. Representative Peter DeFazio, Fourth District, Oregon
http://defazio.house.gov/pf_050405TROp-Ed.shtml

~snip~

Proponents of so-called “free” trade agreements like the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), which I opposed, have long promised endless riches for U.S. workers, farmers, businesses and economy. They’ve been wrong on all counts.

Failed U.S. trade policies have led to the export of millions of high-paying American jobs; decline in U.S. living standards; soaring trade deficits; and a significant erosion of U.S. sovereignty to international trade bureaucrats.

Despite this unbroken record of failure, Congress will soon consider an agreement the Bush administration negotiated to expand NAFTA to Central America via the Central American Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA). It will take significant grassroots opposition in order to convince enough of my colleagues to block the free trade hucksters. Here’s why CAFTA must be defeated. ...more


U.S., Dominican, and Central American Workers Unite for
“CAFTA - We Don’t Hafta” Tour
http://www.unitehere.org/presscenter/release.asp?ID=845


Workers Tell Congress: ‘Yes’ to Good Jobs, ‘No’ to CAFTA
http://www.aflcio.org/issuespolitics/globaleconomy/ns05092005.cfm


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


On Apr. 21, a hearing was held by the House Ways and Means committee regarding the implementation of DR-CAFTA. Supposedly, the full committee considered the proceedings a success and tho it's hard to find info on the bill's status, it is expected to continue onto the House floor.

Below is a link for a search of the House of Representatives, which will give you more than 200 results regarding CAFTA, including statements and positions of many state Representatives. If you're interested in what yours has to say, conduct this search to see if they've taken a stand. Simply type CAFTA into the search bar and Go.
We should know where our reps stand, if they care, and what they intend to do about defeating this bill!

http://www.house.gov/



Edited to shorten my snips!

[arcos]

31. Thank you, excellent info!

And thanks for the kicks too :)

[countryjake]

23. kick for decent jobs for all!

[Just Me]

24. Sometimes, it feels like the walls are moving in on humanity,...

,...and they are just not stopping. *sigh*

We care. We just have our hands so freakin' full.

[warrens]

25. As of now, they don't have the votes

It was supposed to come up last week. It's not likely to come up in the real near future, and the lobbyists I know who are behind it are pretty depressed. CAFTA itself isn't really a big deal except in textiles and a couple of small industries that have some protections. But what lies behind it is the FTAA agreement, which includes Brazil and Argentina and a lot of other large economies that could pummel our agricultural industries, as well as a lot of high tech. Brazil is the fastest growing economy in the world, faster than China, and it has been a really TOUGH negotiator. It could flood the U.S. with cheap sugar, fruit, beef, and a lot of other products.

The people opposed to CAFTA-DR know this and that is why they're being so hardcore. You can tell it's in trouble when its proponents keep crying about a total economy the size of New Haven and one lousy teaspoon of sugar a day per American. Whenever they wheel out soundbites like that, they're in trouble.

[sadiesworld]

26. kick...

the shit out of these SCFTAs (so called free trade agreements)

:kick:

[lonestarnot]

28. CAFTA = Catacalysmic About Fucking True Americans

More slave labor...and I mean a WHOLE BUNCH MORE!

[AnotherMother4Peace]

29. This is a train wreck - Who are the beneficiaries? Corporations

[countryjake]

30. One more kick!

[AnotherMother4Peace]

34. Another scary proposition

[yourout]

35. CAFTA + NAFTA=huge jobs losses.

Will also mean further Union losses, more pressure to drive down wages, and further erode the middle class. If any Dem votes for this they should be strung up by there undies.

[arcos]

40. Only 3 Democratic representatives support it...

I believe there are more in the Senate though... there won't be a vote if Frist decides to go nuclear though ;)

[Freddie Stubbs]

57. How will Democrats stop a vote on it?

A few years Congress gave the President 'fast-track' authority which enabled the President to submit trade agreements that Congress could only vote up or down (no amendments) and and no filibustering.

[arcos]

62. Well, they promise to bring all Senate activity to a halt...

I hope they are able to do that through rules maneuvering.

[Freddie Stubbs]

64. There are some things they will not be able to stop

Budget resolutions are another type of bill which are not subject to the filibuster.

[librechik]

36. when you're buried under a mountain of manure

who can care about ONE turd?

Tell me what I can do about it--besides what I'm already doing at my laptop? Discussion is good, but few can come up with details--is info even available?

Obviously it's important. But partner, they got us surrounded!

Tell you what I might do: Move to Costa Rica. It has a better climate than the banana republic we live in now.

[lonestarnot]

38. Hurricane season could be bad this year ... be careful and be sure to

"be careful about what you say" before you go. LOL

[librechik]

39. hah!

yeah, not really serious about Costa Rica--I mentioned it to a friend, and he said "There's no privacy there at all. It's such a small country they know it when you blow your nose!"

We're heading for that here, too--there's just more places to hide, perhaps...

[arcos]

42. Costa Rica is mostly hurricane-free...

Sometimes we get an indirect hit, but very hurricanes have affected us directly.

[arcos]

41. Well, you are more than welcome here...

But if you want to move here to Costa Rica you better hope CAFTA is not approved. ;)

[lonestarnot]

37. Looks like they may actually have to read the bill! LOL Then what

will the excuse be? Argentina is going to look like a paradise compared to what we are going to look like if this is passed. All of our sovernty is being put up as collateral on a debt that is looking more and more like we'll even have to put up the cats.

[Just Me]

43. Listen, look,...until we unite to defeat the US corporacrat regime,,...

,...we are just breathing our last breath.

[AnotherMother4Peace]

44. CRAPTA - the flushing sound of U.S. jobs

[Al-CIAda]

45. kick!

[arcos]

46. kick nt

[Swamp Rat]

47. ¿Estás despierto já?

:hola:

[arcos]

48. Si, aunque no debería...

Maldito insomnio, estoy harto de ser tan nocturno x(

:hi:

[Swamp Rat]

49. Yo también

Creo que soy vampiro.

[arcos]

51. Debería probar Ambien...

Colin Powell la usa, así es que posiblemente sea bueno

;)

[countryjake]

50. ¡Usted y mí, ambos!

¿Ha visto usted esta organización?

http://www.maketradefair.com/en/index.htm

[arcos]

52. No conocía el sitio web...

Pero sí había oído hablar de Oxfam... De hecho, ellos están trabajando mucho en conjunto con el candidato presidencial de mi partido aquí en Costa Rica, Ottón Solís de Acción Ciudadana, para oponerse al CAFTA e intentar al menos que sea renegociado.

:hi:

[countryjake]

53. Even more...

Road Show of Central American Presidents Can't Prevent Growing Opposition to DR-CAFTA
http://www.oxfamamerica.org/newsandpublications/press_releases/press_release.2005-05-12.6984123309


Friends of the Earth
Taking a Stand Against CAFTA
http://www.foe.org/new/releases/0505cafta.html


AMTAC Reaffirms Opposition to CAFTA
Agreement a Job Killer
http://www.amtacdc.org/media/2005/050509.asp


Bipartisan Coalition Opposes CAFTA
http://www.amtacdc.org/media/2005/050420.asp


(Not quite sure of the tone with this group, never heard of it!
Questionable reasoning, here.)
Majority of Americans Oppose CAFTA
http://www.americansforfairtrade.org/

[whatelseisnew]

54. Another: FL Fair Trade Coalition

http://www.flfairtrade.org/


 Breaking International News on CAFTA from the other countries affected  (read here)
...
Jim Davis wants to run for Governor of Fl.  He claims to be the friend of workers, agriculture, and environmentalists – yet he says he will vote YES to CAFTA.  Rep. Davis may very well be one of the deciding votes on CAFTA.  Help him hear the diverse voices of Floridians who are opposed to CAFTA. (Please click here) and copy and paste the letter and fax to him  at 202-225-5652 AND fax a copy to our office  [phone] for our records.
...
Press Release from the Institute for Agriculture and Trade Policy -
DR-CAFTA Threatens U.S. Sugar Program, New Report
 End of Program Would Hurt U.S.
...

[AnotherMother4Peace]

55. "Lots of outsourcing is headed this way"

[Freddie Stubbs]

56. Keep in mind that this cannot be filibustered

A few years Congress gave the President 'fast-track' authority which enabled the President to submit trade agreements that Congress could only vote up or down (no amendments) and and no filibustering.

[UdoKier]

60. I thought Fast Track had been in place for about 25 years now.

Nice pic of the guy who gave us the nightmare of NAFTA, BTW.

[Al-CIAda]

59. .

[countryjake]

61. Patee para el comercio justo!

Translation: Kick for fair trade!

[arcos]

63. otro kick!

[countryjake]

65. Drug czars destroying healthcare for our neighbors with CAFTA!

Defeating this bill should concern activists in many issues! The drug monopolies have already succeeded in almost tripling drug costs for HIV/AIDs patients in Guatemala, all in the name of CAFTA! This is a step backwards for healthcare there, as last year they had finally won the right to access to generic drugs...now the government in Guatemala has bowed to threats from our drug lobbyists and recalled that hard-won act, ALL IN THE NAME OF CAFTA!


CAFTA Perks for Drug Companies Would Deny Access to Generic Drugs

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1796770&mesg_id=1796770