Florida Judge Allows Graduation Ceremonies At Church This Year, But

[rodeodance]

missed this earlier. Whow.



http://www.au.org/site/News2?JServSessionIdr003=nd6l4oz9y2.app1b&abbr=pr&page=NewsArticle&id=7383&security=1002&news_iv_ctrl=1241


Florida Judge Allows Graduation Ceremonies At Church This Year, But Lawsuit Will Proceed
Wednesday, May 18, 2005

Americans United's Lynn Says Legal Battle Over Constitutional Issue Is Not Over

A federal judge's decision to allow several Florida public high schools to conduct commencement ceremonies in a church will not end the legal battle over the constitutionality of such events, says Americans United for Separation of Church and State.

This afternoon, Judge Gregory A. Presnell of the U.S. District Court for the Middle District of Florida turned away Americans United's request to order Brevard County school officials to move this year's high school graduation ceremonies from the Calvary Chapel in Melbourne to a neutral site. Presnell said there was too little time to find alternative venues.

But the judge did indicate that he agreed with Americans United's assertion that Brevard County officials should have scheduled commencements at a neutral location. The judge also ruled that the case, Musgrove v. School Board of Brevard County, would proceed to determine whether the future public high school commencements would be allowed in religious settings.

[rodeodance]

1. bet the repugs love this activist judge

[Roland99]

2. Oh now that's just getting ridiculous

Are they engaging in prayer? Are they being preached to?

[Eric J in MN]

3. Doesn't matter. Locations used by public schools should be secular,

not churches.

Same with voting. People shouldn't vote for federal/state offices in churches.

[Roland99]

6. Why? There's nothing in the Constitution about that.

There's nothing saying a voting booth in a church requires one to be a member of that church to vote.

Is the government supposed to build voting facilities in every precinct in the country? Churches are a convenient space to host various types of events.

[Eric J in MN]

18. There are public schools in every county which can be used for voting.

There is no need to have people vote in churches.

[TaleWgnDg]

8. "oh, now that's just getting ridiculous" ????? . . . wha? huh?

.
"oh, now that's just getting ridiculous" ????? . . . wha? huh?

Uummmm, I suggest without you reading the plaintiff's complaint as filed in the federal district court then you haven't got a clue, period.

What's with the kneejerk stuff? Particularly with that graphic that you display as to "GET YOUR RELIGION OUT OF MY GOVERNMENT" in your DU post response to OP????

The only clues to the written complaint from this Americans United for Separation of Church and State url is that (1) a public high school graduation ceremony is being held in a church, and (2) there is "a church sanctuary beneath a huge cross" . . . if that is factual, then that alone may be enough without more to uphold a finding for the plaintiff, legally speaking. However, I won't speculate since I've not seen the plaintiff's complaint.

BTW, the federal trial court's judge bio may be viewed at: http://www.flmd.uscourts.gov/judicialInfo/Orlando/JgPresnell.htm



.

[Roland99]

9. How is a cross on a church establishing or respecting a religion?

Pick your battles, people.

This is akin to Michael Newdow.


Settle down, people.

[TaleWgnDg]

11. When you get your law degree and pass a bar exam or two . . .

.
When you get your law degree and pass a bar exam or two . . . then we can "talk" . . . until then, see post #8.



.

[Roland99]

12. Want a cookie or something?

[dchill]

14. Michael Newdow has a HUGE argument.

And the right to make it.

Pick YOUR arguments.

[Roland99]

16. His argument was weak and he came off looking like a nutcase.

That doesn't do our cause any good.

[dchill]

13. Am I ridiculous...

because I would resent it if it happened to me or one of my kids?

Constitutionally, not.

[Roland99]

15. How is having a graduation in a church unconstitutional?

If so, then our entire voting process is unconstitutional since many precints use churches or facilities at churches.


Crap like this makes us all look like a bunch of lunatics.


Now, can someone point me to the part of the article where it says that the students are being preached to or forced to pray?

[Toots]

4. If it is constitutional for the Church to use the school afterhours then

should be Constitutional for the reverse to be true. Doesn't make it right though.

[TimeChaser]

5. That would piss me off

What? Do they need a priest's blessings?

[Roland99]

7. Where do you come up with that?

Is there anything in the article that says a priest is blessing the graduates or requiring them to engage in prayer?

[TaleWgnDg]

10. hey, TimeChaser, welcome to DU . . .

.
hey, Time Chaser, welcome to DU . . . and see my post #8 in this DU thread, eh, :hi:



.

[DemBones DemBones]

17. Our daughter's high school graduation was held at a church and it was

no problem. It was at a Southern Baptist church, which has a sanctuary like an auditorium, with an area up front like a stage (not like an altar.) Many Protestant churches are like that. My husband and I remember no religious symbols in the church, nothing that offended us (and we ARE easily offended by religion inserted into secular occasions despite being faithful Catholics ourselves. We would have been particularly annoyed by any Southern Baptist theological references.)

In many areas, there are a limited number of venues large enough to host a graduation ceremony and most local high schools long ago exceeded the capacity of their auditorium or gymnasium to hold these ceremonies (though the auditoriums and gyms are still large enough to have assemblies of the student body. Not every school can book a "neutral" location when all the graduation ceremonies are scheduled within probably a two-week period. Churches are probably cheaper than public venues, too, though I assume churches always charge for the janitorial staff having to prepare for the graduation and clean up afterwards. They don't make a profit; they just avoid taking a loss when allowing a high school to use their facilities. Most churches allow non-church groups to use their conference rooms, etc., for meetings, too, and that's at no charge. That's been commonly done everywhere I've lived.

I think this case is silly if it's just about using a church building to hold a school function.