I'm sorry, this disaster is every bit as big as 9/11, maybe more...

[Dawgs]

Imagine the same happening to New York City or Las Angeles.

Why is our leader sucking his thumb at a birthday party for John McCain?

[rodeodance]

1. phones NOT working, people not able to talk with families. We did NOT

learn much it seems.

[rodeodance]

5. the anger will not be there. This was a natural disaster--

[Henny Penny]

15. There may be a lot of anger....

if it is shown that cut backs in emergency budgets or stationing of the NG in Iraq, or an inability to organise adequate transport to get people out, led to serious loss of life.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

16. There was a great deal of anger toward Poppy Bush when he failed to....

...visit the Andrew disaster area until he was embarrassed into going. Some feel that was the reason he lost the 1992 election to Clinton.

[Henny Penny]

17. lets hope Poppy set a precedent there! n/t

[wli]

18. the webpages showing that are getting scrubbed n/t

[magellan]

14. The phone lines and cellphone masts are down

There's very little that can be done about that within a day. I expect ham radio operators will be moving into the area to get messages in and out. They did this last year during our canes in FL.

I nearly went crazy worrying about my parents in Stuart after Frances hit them dead on last September; we were stuck in a hotel room in the Orlando area (as secondary victims) and had no way to get in touch with them. No one was being allowed into the Stuart area for a couple of days except rescue workers. On the third day their phone was back. It'll be longer than that in this case.

[Horse with no Name]

2. I totally agree

and not to diminish the people that were affected by 911, the terrorist named Katrina has inflicted as much damage as OBL and we need equal troops to defend from her.
Difference is...we were glad to see her get away.

[bj2110]

3. Because they can't use it as an excuse to take control of an oil-producing

region...

[raccoon]

4. Maybe Republicans don't consider NO as important as

those other cities?

[Botany]

6. Just the same as 9/11 he was AWOL

Arizona and So. Cal as category 5 hurricane hits the Gulf Coast.

Any doubt that he is just a figurehead she be gone by now.
Expect major photo ops from him ASAP.

[Jacobin]

7. Since its in the south

The only thing the media cares about is showing its weather talking heads blowing around in a safe place and then on to the next missing blonde.

We'll have to deal with it without the national guard.

Oh, and a special shout out to the Monkey Man in the WH for cutting funding for New Orleans levee system by 70 fricking percent last year.

[driver8]

8. Because he is a big, do-nothing, non-caring piece of shit.

If it doesn't affect him or Jeb, it doesn't matter.

He has got to be the most sorry excuse for a "president" this country has ever seen. He is about as useful as tits on a bull.

Why don't they just tuck him away on his ranch where he can play cowboy and let Cheney run things. At least he wouldn't have to pretend anymore.

[CanOfWhoopAss]

9. He is not up for re-Selection. Why bother? (nt)

[Stephanie]

10. 9/11 was sudden & shocking, an unimaginable event

but I fear the devastation from this may be far worse

[msongs]

11. katrina = bigger impact over wider area than 9/11 but not as

dramatic or "made for television". probably easier for the average american to forget about in a week or so.

Msongs

[The Stranger]

12. Shhhhh. Let him suck. Else he may declare a "War on Weather"

or, worse, a "War on Water."

[Media_Lies_Daily]

20. Those "wars" would be just as effective as his "War on Terror".

[ContraBass Black]

21. With the loosening of arsenic standards,

The War on Water is already underway.

[liberal N proud]

13. Oh I think this disaster effected far more than 9/11

but it is hard for bu$h to politicize Katrina, there is no gain for him here.
- His base was all able to get out ahead of the storm
- They all had insurance to cover the damages they may have suffered
- bu$h and the republicans see the poor and middle class who are suffering as a burden to the rich
- This is a win - wind situation for the bu$h cartel and the oil companies he supports.
The price of oil goes up = more profits for the oil companies

[MostlyLurks]

19. How do you mean?

Do you mean in terms of human toll and financial ruin? In that case, you're probably right.

But I'd hate to think you're equating it with 9/11 in any other way, such as saying it's every bit as big in terms of the shock to the psyche of the country.

People are used to acts of random misery from nature: it is to be expected. So while we might sympathize and empathize with people in LA, MS and AL, we are not shaken by it in a transformative way. 9/11, on the other hand, was perpetrated and motivated by anger and agression, and that sort of incident is transformative. Most victims of violent crime report that they're never quite the same, and that's how this is drastically different from 9/11 - not even in the same ballpark.

I'm sure you realize that already. I'm sure you meant the former and not the latter. But, it's this sort of loosy-goosy attitude toward words and meaning that pounds us in the ass at election time. Think about how, were your statement made by an elected official, it could be twisted by the likes of Limbaugh, Hannity, et al. "Why, those Liberals don't even understand the difference between a natural disaster and Osama bin Laden". And then they'd start some asinine "9/11 was not an act of nature. This was not Hurricane Osama that came ashore and then dissipated into rain over the Ohio Valley. This was an attack on our way of life blah blah fricking blah". And which meme do you think would stick with the people?

As liberals/progressives/Democrats, we HAVE to be more careful about how we speak and the language we use. Look at the conservataive movement: language and linguistics are the very foundation of its success. That's Lakoff's whole point.

Peace.

Mostly

[wli]

22. also, Bushler & Cheney ordered 9/11, they didn't order Katrina. n/t

[Media_Lies_Daily]

23. Skip the lectures. We get enough of that from the Freepers & NeoCons.

[Dawgs]

25. Whatever...

Do you live in New Orleans, Mississippi, Alabama? Have you seen the pictures or video of this disaster?

Are you telling me that people won't be affected by this tragedy, just because it's a natural disaster?

I could care less what Limbaugh or Hannity think. They will lie and twist our words anyways.

Instead of attacking "my words", maybe you should answer my question and tell me why Bush isn't doing anything but taking photo-ops with McCain.

[MostlyLurks]

27. No, I don't live in NO, MI or AL

But if you think this will have the staggering NATIONAL impact on worldview that 9/11 did? You're wrong. Andrew didn't, and it was pretty damned devastating. I had relatives in Andrew and while I worried like hell about them, it did not change my worldview because you can't lash out at the perpetrator of a hurricane. If you genuinely think a hurricane is the same as 9/11, the left is well and truly fuct.

Mostly

On Edit: OK, as to why Bush isn't doing anything. Hmmm, how about because he can't. NOLA is under water, MI and AL are in a state of emergency. What good would it do to shuttle him into one of those areas - and in the process occupy local authorities with security protocol - just so he could glad hand a couple of now-homeless people? How exactly would that help? I've seen people, in other threads this morning, saying that Presidential visits did nothing but complicate matters during natural disasters they personally lived through. I'm inclined to believe that - Presidential visits cause horrendous problems when skies are blue and the sun is shining. I can only imagine how that's amplified during a catastrophic crisis.

Since we're posing questions, let me ask you this: so many people today are saying Bush has refused to visit because there's no political gain to be made in the gesture. But are we making that point because we really believe his visit will have any positive affect, or because we ourselves are trying to politicize Katrina?

And by the way, seeing as how I don't live in an affected area, could you please provide me with some affected-area approved talking points that I could fall back on?

[Dawgs]

28. I never said it would have a "staggering NATIONAL impact" , and

I never said that I think a hurricane is the same as 9/11. Gosh, you must be a freeper if you take what I said and turn it into that.

But, if you don't think the devastation is much worse, and that are President shouldn't put all of his efforts into dealing with this, then you are truly FUCKED.

[MostlyLurks]

30. You read my first post selectively.

You said it was every bit as "big". And I asked how you meant that: in terms of human toll and monetary loss or in terms of a psychological event. And I very specifically agreed that the former was true, that this is probably going to have a similar body count and financial impact. Go back and read my post - it's in the first 'graph or two.

The problem is that you just laid that concept out with vague language and, to top it off, you added a reference to what would happen if the hurricane had happened in LA or NYC. That, to me, is a muddled message that can easily be misconstrued to mean that a hurricane = 9/11.

Look, if you don't care about this sort of argument, that's fine. As somebody else wrote, the other side will twist your words regardless of what you say. Fair enough. But I, for one, am in the camp that thinks you don't give the enemy ammunition through carelessness, something I see a lot of from elected Dems, practicing liberals and progressives. Language is 80% of the battle and if you forfeit that part, it makes little difference whether you're right or not. It's what makes "them" better than us right now: they use language better than we do. That's incontrovertible. And I believe their hegemony will continue until such time as we pay attention to that part of the game.

And as for me being a Freep, you can think whatever you like. Any time I post anything even remotely contrarian, I get labelled with that and frankly, I'm too secure in who I am to really care.

Mostly

[mknmehappy]

29. Very well put !

[cbear70]

24. this should be grounds for impeachment

Where the hell is he. I watch the news and the devastation with tears in my eyes, wondering where our "leader" is. He should be doing something, showing he cares. The fact that he "goes on with his life" no matter what the situation is , it is completely deplorable. I have never been so disgusted with him. Where are the democrats , showing their sympathy. Where the hell is anyone. How did America change this badly...

Never mind.. I know. Just sad.

[esvhicl]

26. Donate Red Cross

http://www.redcross.org/donate/donate.html

[Lydia Leftcoast]

31. It's a different kind of disaster, but it's impacting more people

:-(

and it has destroyed more people's livelihoods.

On another thread, someone wondered if we'd have to have refugee camps for Americans. Yes, I think we will. :-(