What do you think of abstinence only sex education?

[bluestateguy]

I just watched a special on teenage virginity pledges (no sex until marriage) and abstinence only education. It was on the Trio TV channel, about a program in Lubbock, Texas. The local school district teaches sex ed this way, and Lubbock is a red state Bible thumping community. The narrator pointed out that Lubbock still has very high rates of teen pregnancy.

Don't get me wrong, it's one thing to talk about abstinence in front of high school kids--as long as it's not to the exclusion of discussion about contraception--but is that really reasonable for single adults?

Some people are not lucky enough to find a spouse until they are 30 or 40 years old. Is it really realistic to expect someone to be celibate for that long?

[neebob]

1. My ex is fully educated in abstinence

That's why I divorced him.

[Warren DeMontague]

2. I think, when you're dealing with your ex, it's wise to abstain.

:o

[CornField]

3. I think abstinence only is a disservice to our young people

Knowledge is power.

I don't think we are providing a service to our young people when we don't give them all the information. It is just as useless to teach a condoms-only sex ed course as it is to teach an abstinence-only sex ed course.

[FreedomAngel82]

11. Especially when they are giving out false information

and scaring them claiming you can get cancer by having an abortion or some nonsense like that. They do need the truth about sex. If a teenager choses to be abstient that's fine, but there are kids out there who don't want to wait and want to have sex. They should know how to protect themselves and their partner(s) and know about diseases and getting checked and all that.

[deadparrot]

4. It doesn't work.

All that results from such a policy is an increase in uneducated pregnant teenagers.

I'm for comprehensive sex education, covering all the options and giving them equal time.

[firefox]

5. No, it is totally unrealistic

It is about like teaching people how to pan for gold in the new economy. It would solve a lot of problems if everyone would support themselves with some honest labor. Abstinence has a serious and glaring flaw right on the surface. But the politicians go on, thinking that blunder is success and should continue.

Abstinence is another example of policy by mythology.

[Wapsie B]

6. I think it's a panacea for the conservative fundies.

They want simplistic solutions to complex problems. They see teen pregnancies and just say no is supposed to be enough to suppress a very basic human need. Well that and plenty of carefully selected scripture passages as well.

No it's not realistic. It totally ignores the realities of life. But would they every admit failure? Never.

[KitchenWitch]

7. And they only teach abstinence from actual intercourse

I do not have the statistics handy, but there is a high percentage of high school students participating in oral sex, and not in a safe way. Many are misinformed, in that, they do not believe oral sex is sex.

[CoffeeCat]

8. My view...

....children in school should be taught the basics; anatomy, how a baby is made, the process, etc.

I don't think ANYTHING should be taught as far as behavior goes.

They shouldn't be told to abstain. They shouldn't be taught to have sex. They shouldn't be advised of birth-control methods.

Get this stuff out of the public school system.

It's the parents job to teach their children about behaviors and sexual decisions.

It's not the place of public education to be advising our children about sexual behavior.

[FreedomAngel82]

12. Not every teen learns about sex from their parents

I didn't. I learned through a health class. I think that's where it should be taught.

[niyad]

9. unbelievably stupid and short-sighted. many years ago, I heard

beverly lehay (wife of idiot tim lehay of the dreadful "left behind" series) on some afternoon talk show (merv or phil, that's how long ago) and she said, and I quote, "if we don't teach our teenagers about sex, they won't do it." the host's jaw dropped, the audience roared with laughter. the host looked at her and said, "you don't really mean that, do you?" and she insisted she did.

if anybody has a link to this, I would really appreciate it. it was one of the few times I actually caught a program like that.

[FreedomAngel82]

10. I think you should teach both

I think it's nice in a world of pop-culture and sex to show young people they don't have to give in to the popularity of the world and all the emotional and physical happenings that could negativley happen on their life. I also think you should be realistic and realize young people will still have sex and that you should teach sex education. At least have the information out there available. I remember after the last election on Laura Flanders show she had a girl on her show who grew up in Texas and in high school when Bush was governor and started the program there. According to her kids in her school from all grades went to her for information on condoms and diseases and stuff cause they knew she knew and they still had sex. You can't close your eyes and ignore they still have sex. I think a professional should teach sex and parents should also have a good relationship with their kids in case they want to talk about sex issues and if something happens they won't be afraid and make a mistake without seeking advice (or at least have an adult friend they can trust or counsler).

[Dogmudgeon]

13. I'm 47. Never been married.

I would like to be / to have been married, but sometimes it really IS the luck of the draw that calls the shots.

If the assembled clerisy of Christianity wants to halt my sinful lifestyle, they can dedicate themselves to dramatically improving my dating life. I'll send a brief outline of my criteria upon request.

Otherwise, I'll fuck whom I please, when it pleases the both of us.

--p!

[PowerToThePeople]

14. Bunch of crap... n/t

[shenmue]

15. Put simply...

It's idiotic.

[garybeck]

16. it sucks

pun partially intended.

[TimeChaser]

17. I had an abstinence only education.

It was horrible. Some lady had this little thermometer at the board. She talked about a hypothetical couple who held hands *thermometer moves up* kissed *moves up* on and on until *gasp* sex! I swear, they weren't just trying to scare us away from sex, they were trying to frighten us away from normal teenage relationships. The word "condom" was never mentioned.

By the way, I personally knew people in my grade who'd been having sex far before "sex ed."

[don954]

18. teenage guys are abstinent until the 1st opportunity of tail

comes their way, and then it goes out the window...

I know it was true with me, my friends, their friends, and so on...

In short, make sure the teenagers have some freeking rubbers and know how to use them.

[TimeChaser]

19. Hah!

Although it's the same for some girls as well.

I must admit, the best sex ed I got was from websites set up for that purpose by universities. I came accross them when researching for a debate on Abstinence Only Education. If I find them again, I'll post them. They're wonderful reasources for teenagers who had no good sex ed at school.

[tavalon]

22. Well, it's nice to see that teenagers these days

are no different from teenagers a few decades ago. I'm always amazed at the collective amnesia that occurs to parents. When we were teenagers, we fucked. When our children become teenagers, somehow, we rationalize that it will be different for them. Of course, it isn't.

Yep, teach birth control and protection against infection.

[Lexingtonian]

20. All I really know

is that in my middle class white suburb at 13-14 in health class sex and pregnancy was still semitheoretical stuff despite older siblings' behavior and one girl in our junior high class of 220 being pregnant by her 17 year old boyfriend.

At 15-16 in biology class, sex was something no one I knew who had any smarts whatsoever wanted to pronounce anything about on record. The kids with moonbat Christian Right parents put on quite the show about "immorality", the little morons. But all kinds of stuff was beginning to happen- at summer camp, at beach houses, on vacations, at church groups, at music groups, to drunken kids at parties.

All I remember is everybody sitting around and the attitude being perfectly obvious- It's going to happen (or, It has already happened), I want it on my terms or the best terms I can get. When the teacher gave back the exams on human sexuality, all the girls did a lot better- they got most of the questions on contraceptives right, the guys just bullshitted their way through all of it.

I'm perfectly sure that most of the kids in Lubbock consider the abstinence only stuff essentially bullshit, though they might respect some of their peers who think it's not that bad an idea. The story there in the big public abstinence pledging probably isn't the "education"- it's the parental pressure of the I Will Kill You variety at some remove and probably some rampant sexual abusiveness or gross social pressuring in the school.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

21. Research shows it makes the problem worse, not better:

Many Teens Who Take 'Virginity Pledges' Substitute Other High-Risk Behavior for Intercourse, Study Says

-snip-

Although teenagers who take "virginity pledges" begin engaging in vaginal intercourse later than teens who have not committed to remain abstinent until marriage, they also are more likely to engage in oral or anal sex than nonpledging virgin teens and less likely to use condoms once they become sexually active, according to a study published in the April issue of the... Journal of Adolescent Health, the Washington Post reports. The findings could explain why pledgers have similar rates of sexually transmitted diseases as nonpledging teens (Connolly, Washington Post, 3/19). Study co-authors Peter Bearman, sociology department chair at Columbia University, and Hannah Bruckner of Yale University used data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health, which is funded by the National Institute of Child Health and Human Development and CDC, the AP/Long Island Newsday reports. The national study surveyed students nationwide in grades seven through 12 and followed up with interviews one, two and six years later. The Yale and Columbia report looked at data from 12,000 teenagers (Apuzzo, AP/Long Island Newsday, 3/18)

More:
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=21606

[neweurope]

23. Crazy, doesnt' work, and the school should teach facts, not morals.

Families and churches etc. are there for the moral part. The school should teach the biological side of the matter, which includes dangers like sickness and pregnancy - and how to avoid them Everthing else should not be the school's business.

Moreover I don't think that abstinence until marriage is a goal worth supporting. The generation of my parents didn't have sex before marriage. It was such a stuck up generation it's unbelievable nowadays. If young people aren't supposed to have sex they'll marry earlier which is not necessarily good, they'll divorce more often, the chances of educating themselves further and finding a good place in life are smaller for the young women, and I'm sure there are more reasons I just can't think of right now.

Moreover: Sex is not a problem.

Sex is fun.

--------------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!

[Oeditpus Rex]

24. '60 Minutes' did a segment on a program like this

a few months ago. They cited statistics showing something like 80 percent of the kids in the program ended up having sex, usually unprotected because they hadn't been educated, or had been poorly educated, in preventing pregnancy and STDs. So the incidence of those was like in the study SWMBO quotes above.

The scariest part of the '60 Minutes' segment was the guy who was the leader of this particular program said something like he wouldn't instruct kids in how to use condoms, even if they asked.
Sometimes I think we're stuck in 1956. :scared:

[fujiyama]

25. It's nonsense

and it's a symptom of backwards puritanical thinking.

It's denying reality. But of course that is standards operating procedure for the right.

Abstinence only education is another failed program to teach children morality rather than reality. DARE is another good example of a similar failed program.

[Oeditpus Rex]

26. You heard what kids call DARE?

Drugs. Are. Real. Expensive.

:rofl:

[fujiyama]

28. Another good one:

Drugs Are Really Excellent!

:smoke:

[TreasonousBastard]

27. I think sex ed should be a lab class...

with full participation required.

Why not teach not only the biology, but how to do it right? Without the guilt and bullshit.

We have shop and driver's ed classes. And gym classes. Why not sex classes?

For years there has been the dirty little secret of fathers hiring high-line hookers to teach their sons the arts of love. Why should this be the privilege of only the rich and amoral? And why of only men-- why not teach the women, too?

(Well, it was a thought...)

[Lydia Leftcoast]

29. Well, I'm 55 years old, and I had classmates who got pregnant at 13

and in those days, it was not unheard of for teenagers who had had "no sex before marriage" drummed into them to run away to South Dakota (no waiting period, low age requirements) to get married over the weekend, just so they could have sex.

[etherealtruth]

30. At what point did our country decide that ignorance was a better ...

... tool than knowledge?

[Stuckinthebush]

31. I will be giving my daughters condoms

and birth control

and have been educating them about their bodies and their rights with their bodies for a while now.

Abstinence only is not useful.

Some will choose it and that is fine, but most will not. My daughters probably will not marry until their late 20s based on trend data. I seriously hope that they don't wait until marriage ot have sex, because sex is part of life. Sex is part of relationships. Sex is being human. Sex is wonderful.

Teach them respect for themselves, respect for others, a knowledge of their bodies, and a knowledge of birth control and STD prevention.

They will make their choices...some good, some bad. Your job as a parent is to give them all of the information they need to protect themselves from violence, STDs, and unwanted pregnancies. They will be fine.

We are so fucked up in this society about sex. Pun intended.

[Mr_Spock]

32. Randi Rhodes has a piece that runs on AAR that talks about this

It's a little promotional piece that's run throughout the day on AAR. Says basically that rates of risky sexual behavior were HIGHER amongst those taught abstinence only. Reason being that they will tend to fall off the wagon without much planning AND they will have oral sex or do other risky behaviors that "skirt" the actual intercourse issue. I believe the studies based on my personal experience growing up with "abstinence" trained Irish Catholics :rofl:

[Straight Shooter]

33. The teachers of these courses usually have a sex life, do they not?

I think these courses should be taught by virgins in their late 20's. Let's see how convincing they are :P

Libido is not something that someone can be "taught" to control. "God" gave us a libido for a reason. We are still living with bodies that physiologically were designed to reproduce after puberty. That means hormones on the rampage.

Teach safe sex. Those who think sex is icky can stay away from it if they want, but those who think sex is enticing can therefore avoid health problems that arise from unfortunate ignorance. Personally, I think teen-age sex is a major distraction from focusing on life's goals, but libido rules at that age for most teen-agers.

[Monkey see Monkey Do]

34. The 'Silver Ring Thing'

are an pro-abstinence group which have been getting federal funding thanks to Dubya. The BBC have featured them in a couple of documentaries over the past few years.

Anyway, they are run by a fundamentalist evangelical christian who - in one of the BBC docs - admitted that the organisation was just a front to convert teenages before the imminent second coming of Christ. This is frankly very dangerous and underhanded.

Religious motivations aside, I'm against abstinence only education. I think it's unrealistic, puts too much of an emphasis on marriage and ignores or marginalizes contraception.