Tired of losing? Check in here - The Bag of Dirty Tricks thread.

[ReadTomPaine]

As we’ve heard again and again recently, if we are going to beat this bunch of rule breaking GOP misanthropes, we’re going to have to start fighting as dirty as they do. I started this thread for one reason, to get everyone’s ideas on a list of things we as Democrats can consider to stop the takeover of this country. This isn’t going to be a thread for the squeamish, or for the ideologically pure. Best to steer clear if that describes you.

Here are half a dozen ideas to get the ball rolling.

1) Get Republicans fired at your workplace, or fire them yourself if you can – In the belief that all activism starts with the grass roots, do us all a favor, and fire your Republican employees this week. There are legitimate reasons to fire virtually any employee, so avail yourself of them. Not only will it quit the gloating you’re hearing around the office, it’ll stop those donation checks they are getting ready to write. Might also teach them a bit of humility regarding the poor and the disadvantaged. They can be the “Pioneers” of “Unemployment Window A”

2) Pretend to be a Republican, and then cut down the next Republican that you have a conversation with. - The more public/crowed the place you do this, the better. Use whatever remarks you know are sure to make the intended impression. “You’re no better than the liberal scum you claim to hate… get back into the kitchen… Just wait till we win next year and toss peons like you into the field or the workhouse… People in your income bracket don’t have the right to be Republican or vote etc.” If you need talking points, just observe in a Yahoo political chat room for a few minutes and you have all the right wing bile that you can use and quite possibly all that you can stand.

3) Create, plant and disseminate widely “news stories” that discredit GOP policies – A good way to do this is to print out stories in the visual style of a major newspaper or magazine (don’t use the logo or other copywrited material, however) and theme them similarly to the ones that targeted John McCain’s platform last presidential election. Make sure not to slander individuals directly. Leave stacks of the printouts where people are certain to find them – i.e. supermarkets, coffee houses, bars, community centers etc. As in #2 make sure to write these from the right wing perspective, for maximum effect on the target audience. Avoid digital media, as it’s too easy to fact check, not that most GOP voters care to check these things anyway.

4) Contact the IRS and anonymously tip them off regarding prominent GOP contributors in your area. – Lets face it, they are likely tax evaders in any case (that’s why they are GOP), so might as well have them go thru an audit and feel a bit of what it’s like to have a hostile government prying into their affairs. The tax money you shake free will be a little payback to your community for the egregious tax cut they undoubtedly are enjoying.

5) Make sure that you’re the only ride on voting day for a group of hard right types who live out of the way, and then don’t show up. – This works best in low population density areas and poor right wing communities. Cultivate a group of right wing friends and make sure they depend on you for the ride on Election Day. Then don’t show up. Every vote they miss is an uncontested vote on the blue side of the aisle. The right needs a taste of Florida 2000.

6) Impersonate Linda Tripp. – Whisper into the ear of GOP associates to encourage and get dirty laundry regarding their improprieties, and then make sure that information gets into the wrong hands. It’s hard to brag about family values or think about politics when you’re in a divorce court.

Are you really serious about winning the culture war? Do you mean it when you say it’s time to fight fire with fire? Then channel that anger and let’s hear some ideas. Given the thin skin of most conservative ideologues, it won’t take much to have them running far away from such policies and tactics so we can all enjoy proper, principled political discourse in the country again. First, however, they need to be taught that fighting dirty burns them as much as it burns anyone.

BTW- if you want to take action beyond the intellectual consideration of these ideas, please do so on your own. This thread is meant for the mental exercise of these ideas. Don’t involve DU.

[Metatron]

1. LMAO

Thanks - I needed a new perspective!

[sybylla]

2. I like how you think, TomPaine

But I'm afraid I'd lose my soul to stoop to that kind of deception on a regular basis. I fear that is how repukes are born. A chicken and egg kind of question for me. If you spend your days shitting on people, even if it's for a good cause, eventually all you will be able to do is shit on people.

Takes a stronger person than me. If you can do it, more power to ya.

[rucky]

10. Something for the Sybyllas To Do:

I for one can't do dirty tricks...but I won't try to stop the folks who can. One thing I have done, though, with a clear conscience is sacrifice our standby partisan defenses - the GOPs favorite targets.

I do not defend attacks on Bill Clinton, and I even give them a pass on trashing "spineless Democrats". Instead, I take the perspective that Bush is as bad a Clinton, Republicans are as bad as Democrats - if not worse. My take: politicians should be held to a higher standard, more accountability, less corruption all around. It immediately takes the partisanship out of the debate, and gives your opponent a perspective that they're not prepared to attack.
You don't have to join in the attacks on Democrats - they'll do that for you. Just respond with: "Two wrongs don't make a right."

Soon you'll find them agreeing with you on your criticism of Bushco: Which should emphasize 1) Defecit - lack of fiscal responsibility 2) Huge fat contracts to cronies 3) Enron and other corporate criminals 4) No exit strategy for Iraq (don't go beyond this).

Other responses:
Why are you a Democrat? "I vote independent" - it's none of their fucking business, so don't feel obligated to give an honest answer. Then ask: "Why are you a Republican?"

Talking about the primaries? Just say you're undecided, but looking for a candidate that's not a typical politician. "I'm taking a good look at (insert candidate here). Compared to Bush, s/he's the lesser of two evils."

We're trying to get people to think critically. We can't do that from a standpoint that's seen as partisan from the get-go.

Need practice? Nobody to talk to? Yahoo Chat - Politics.

[Patriot_Spear]

3. Where can we find more such interesting reading?

Enquiring minds want to know...

[ReadTomPaine]

5. We have 32633 bright, freshly motivated people right here for ideas

… no need to go looking for more!

[sangh0]

4. Great ideas!!

I'm going to use at least one of them later today.

[T Wolf]

6. you just know you are going to get flamed for this

by the "we don't do that" crowd. But, you have to break a few eggs...

In a perfect (or even something a little further from hell) world, reasoned debates would produce informed decisions by the electorate. But we live in Amerika, where cash is god and reason be damned.

So, I heartily endorse the "by any means necessary" approach because it is the only way we have any chance against the repukes.

To paraphrase Barry Goldwater, street-fighting in defense of Democracy is not a crime.

[grasswire]

8. interesting

Recall back in Revolutionary America how the patriots began to treat the loyalists. Eventually they had to flee to Canada when the patriots got serious about throwing off King George.

So maybe it isn't "losing your soul" to fight for your liberty.

[ReadTomPaine]

9. I have a feeling that after Tuesday...

...people won't be quite so hostile to the idea.

[tom_paine]

15. What happens on Tueday?

Inquiring minds want to know.

[ReadTomPaine]

19. Not happens...happened!

:(

[tom_paine]

39. Ah. Gotcha.

[Shadoobie]

45. All great ideas, but...

..am I the only one who found it huorous that tom_paine misread ReadTomPaine? ;)

-Greg

[Book Lover]

40. Interesting that no one has flamed this thread yet...

I thought folks would really get angry at these suggestions, but when I started scrolling down, I didn't find that at all.

[lovedems]

7. I am particulary fond of #4.

Maybe we could land a few in prison! Let the frog walks begin.

[hang a left]

11. I like it alot!!

I'm tired of being honest and truthful. Get's you absolutely nowhere. Good guys do not always win, they hardly ever win. Truth does not always prevail, in fact in hardly ever does. Justice is never served! I'M MAD AS HELL!!!! I AM NOT GONNA TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!

[calimary]

13. Me too. Nice guys finish last. We can change the tone WHEN WE WIN!

But first, we have to WIN!

I've already done the "stealth" rethug approach in calling some repuke senators' office - describing myself as a concerned republican who is afraid that the leaking is going to make good republicans look bad, blah-blah-blah. At least they listen to you all the way through and behave nicely, as opposed to being in yer face or patronizing or hanging up.

Also, whenever I get one of those obnoxious "food for thought" emails that dump on Clinton, I reply (to the sender and EVERYONE on his or her referral list where the email came from) with a bush resume run-down (to which I add, at the TOP, a mention of the likely TREASON in the White House) and The National Catholic Register commentary from Sister Jean Chittister called "Is There Anything Left that Matters?"

When I've done that, I've not heard back from ANY of 'em.

[nannygoat]

12. Here's another one to add, RTP...

Are these GOP leaders aware of their dirty tricks?
http://www.thehill.com/marshall/021903.aspx

[calimary]

30. Those are good tactics if you're somehow involved in party machinery

so you can get phone numbers to use.

There's other street stuff, too. Wherever you see a pro-bush or one of those simpering "America Love Her or Leave Her" stickers, THAT'S the place to plaster a "STOP BUSH" or "Impeach Bush/Cheney" or "Bush Knew" or "Bush Cheated" or "Friends Don't Let Friends Vote Republican." (Although, that one's a little long. For the sake of all the drive-by traffic, shorter and sweeter is better.)

OR: For us females - and especially for those of you/us who do have access to phone numbers - if I knew a rethug with big bucks and power within the local party, I'd call his house and ask for him in my smokiest, sexiest voice. When the wife answered, I'd get a little evasive and then hang up. Yeah, I know. Icky.

I know some of this is shitty. But that's the way THEY want to play it. And that's the game as THEY have already defined it. All we're doing is leveling the playing field. The only way to beat a bully is to bully them back. Confront them. Give them a dose of their own medicine. That's all they understand. One poster here once lambasted me for lying and deceit when I did the "stealth rethug" game on Orrin Hatch's office. My response: you have to speak to them in a language they'll understand.

If they can embrace Machiavelli, so should we. It's about time that strategy was put to work on behalf of the GOOD GUYS for a change. Do we want to keep fighting pit bulls with guinea pigs?

[wyldwolf]

14. In book stores, switch dust covers on the conservative books...

..stick a "Treason" cover on an Al Franken book.

[ReadTomPaine]

16. HA!

Love it.

[Patriot_Spear]

20. Oooohhhh.. shouldn't have told me that one. Heh-heh...

Headin' to the bookstore tonight.

[Book Lover]

21. I love that idea!

I already turn the conservative books upside down at the POS displays - switching dust jackets never before occured to me...

Do it now, before the paperbacks come out!

On edit: One thing, though - the UPC code will read as a copy of the conservative book, so the sale will be recorded that way. FWIW...

[wyldwolf]

24. But the conservative will either read the book or get pissed off...

..both are acceptable!

[Bitchgoddes]

17. Just tand up to them....

and tell the truth. Never back down don't be a whimp and when they call you names just say is that what you call a debate. I hate drty tricks but fight back with the truth. That can be hard when all the Republicans just watch FOX or listen to Rush. I like Dean's way of never backing down. Well you can bring up that Bush lies just about everything, Bennett has a gambling problem and Rush is a drug addict with a race problem to boot. that is the neocons famliy values.

[calimary]

46. And let's not forget that poster boy for the Respect of Women Coalition:

Mr. Arnold Gropenegger. What a foul bunch.

[Catherine Vincent]

18. You're so silly!

I like the one about driving everyone to the polls. LOL!

:D

[MCVet]

22. The Republicans are Nazis....

In order to defeat them, we too must become Nazis.

[Book Lover]

25. I'd rather not become a Nazi, just use their tools

I'd rather think of it as holding my nose while doing something distasteful. Or think of it like a medical procedure: gross to the untrained eye, but necessary for the health of the whole.

Will there be a day when I don't wake up and feel sorry for what partisan politics have done to our government? Just pave the roads, deliver the mail, educate us all, keep the water, air, forests and byways clean, rehabilitate criminals, maintain a system of healthcare for all, defend us with reasonable might against our enemies, and keep the lights on!

What have I forgotten? Or is that another thread?

[calimary]

47. It's like eating liver. At least for me. I do it for the iron, NOT

the taste.

Just because we beat them at their own game doesn't mean we ARE Nazis. You can't yank back the agenda and change the tone and run it in a better way if you keep losing. The time to make nice-nice is AFTER the elections (that we've WON). NOT before. Beforehand, we fight like junkyard dogs!! We have to.

And yeah, I don't like the idea of stooping to their level, and the arguments of "that makes you no better than them" or "that just perpetuates the evil" or "you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas" or "you have to counteract evil with goodness" - frankly, we've tried that last one over and over and look how well (AHEM!) ited worked. Just like all the Dems who thought they ought to get along with bush and just support him and "do the right thing" and maybe he'd play ball. Well, he played alright. He played THEM - for fools.

You NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER capitulate to bullies. You NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER cave to the bad guys. You confront and FIGHT them. Always and forever!!!! Til my dying breath, I will never give in to any of them. And if it means I have to get my hands dirty, so be it. That's what washing up afterwards is for.

[ReadTomPaine]

27. Heh, I knew this thread would draw a few of 'em out.

Our lurking friends from the other side.

[Renew Deal]

23. I just fired half my staff.

Fuck it, I always hated those blood sucking freeper scumbags.

[MCVet]

26. I'm going make some....

..."Democrats Only" and "Republicans Only" signs, for the drinking fountains in my office.

[Renew Deal]

28. I hope you are kidding.

That will get you fired.

[MCVet]

29. I'm the boss.

.

[hang a left]

31. then it will get you sued......

but it is funny

on edit

just had a visual

Democrats get the bottled water

Repubs get the hose that has been brought in from the gardener, you know the green one with the rusty lip.

[ReadTomPaine]

32. Clears the air nicely, doesn't it.

The rest of your staff is certain to thank you for it.

[tedoll78]

33. Now, I'm ready to make Machiavelli look like a diaper-wearing amateur.

I used to be an "I-won't-do-that" person, but now I want to win and prevent the major harm that the GOP would do. In the end, having more liberal leaders in power will save the country and world from more heartache/chaos/destruction/etc; the change for the positive worldwide will more than pay-back for these tactics.

Like someone above said, let's break some eggs.

My starting proposals:
1) Hand-out faulty polling locations & directions in GOP-heavy voting districs. Let's see how they like it for a change.
2) Go door to door as a GOP volunteer with absentee ballots; the GOP loves to vote absentee, right? And then throw the filled-out ballots away. Either that, or give them a faulty ballot with a bad address on the envelope, and then they won't vote on election day since they'd think they've already voted.
3) Volunteer for a GOP phone bank operation and talk dirty to old people on the phone. Think of the most obscene, anus-licking things you can comprehend, and go for it! And be sure to identify yourself as a Bush supporter.
4) Wear an 'I love george w bush' t-shirt in public and act like a major ass. Moon people, fart loudly, call people offensive names. Here's a favorite: Go to football games where the Army is playing and accuse the other team's fans of being unpatriotic for rooting against the Army. In other words, be absurd!
5) When a polling organization calls, give answers such that they reflect very very very poorly on the nation's condition. Tell them you're unemployed, or tell them that you make <$8000 a year.
6) Panhandle in GOP/swing neighborhoods where it isn't illegal. Get as many people as you can to join you; create the image of crisis. Hold-up a sign saying that you were downsized, or that your job was sent overseas. If you're a veteran, empahsize your loss of benefits.
7) Drop-off a stack of fliers at veterans' halls, hospitals, etc detailing the betrayal of the Bush administration. And, if possible, ask them if they're enjoying their tax cuts.

I just thought of these seven off the top of my head. Surely we can come-up with some creative strategies for making the GOP's image as irrespectable as possible!

[ReadTomPaine]

34. 5, 6 & 7 on your list are the best IMO, Tedoll78!

Esp #7 since it's not really a dirty trick. It's education. Tho I love the 'Go Army' football schtick from #4- that belongs in a movie.

[ieoeja]

36. That would be the Borgia family.

Machiavelli wrote an expose on the Borgias hoping that bringing their evil to light would help erradicate it. Sadly, most people are unaware of this leading them to believe that Machiavelli is the evil manipulator rather than the one fighting such.

[tedoll78]

37. Ahh!

Thank you so much! (it's been about 8 years since I've taken political philosophy.. :P)

[RoonShark]

35. Fake Liberalism - a Democratic "Dirty Trick"

When Democrats fake being liberal, it's a dirty trick played on constituencies that rely on us. And we're starting to learn that we can't always get away with it. Gray Davis was defeated because he didn't have any friends left, he'd screwed them all.

Gray Davis - a liberal? What a joke. When he needed the votes of people he took for granted, those votes weren't there. The most naturally liberal state in the union now has a Republican governor.

[ReadTomPaine]

38. There's a pretty good DLC pro/con debate going in a recent thread...

If you're really interested in the moderate vs. wing debate, check it out

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=501966&mesg_id=501966

[JNelson6563]

41. Use one of their favorites, I did

You all know how they love to call C-Span or write to their local paper, claiming to be lifelong Democrats. It's always obvious when they are lying.........

Not so long ago I submitted a blurb on my local paper's website where they let folks submit up to three sentences and they may get printed in an occasional page of blurbs.

The one I said complimented two Republican legislators for speaking out on something or other the WH did. I chided my "fellow", local Republicans for shunning independent thinking. Added that it's almost embarrassing to admit to being a Republican anymore.

hahaha

Someone said to me "Wow! That's quite a statement!" I had 'em read it to me and smiled broadly as I recognized the words. :-)

Fun stuff.

Julie

[screaming_meme]

42. #7). FLAMING BAG OF DOG POOP ON THEIR PORCH!

The maliciousness of this thread kind of takes my breath away. Very ugly stuff.

[Book Lover]

43. I'll tell you what's ugly

A) Throwing away the lives of our soldiers for no good reason.

B) The unscheduled redistricting of Texas.

C) Buying the California recall.

D) Laura Bush's clothes (OK, that one is unfair. But the rest are not)

[screaming_meme]

57. And petty, mean-spirited revenge against co-workers stops it?

How, exactly?

[ReadTomPaine]

58. Sorry SM, it's fight to win or learn to lose right now. <eom>

[Imajika]

44. Fire Republicans?

"1) Get Republicans fired at your workplace, or fire them yourself if you can"

The fact that so few have criticized this statement is downright frightening.

This is a progressive web forum, and your suggesting firing people with different opinions and ideology? Let me get this straight, you think it would be fine and dandy to engineer or directly fire Republicans from their jobs and careers - for no other reason than they vote and support Republicans?

That is sickening. The very thought is repulsive.

I'd go one step further, If I ever found out one of my supervisors was firing anyone because of their personal politics - I'd fire that supervisor in a heartbeat.

Anyone who thinks this is a good idea better get an effing clue. The Republicans OWN most of the businesses, and therefore have the ability to fire and hire pretty much anyone they want. If your dopey idea actually became a tactic liberals used to hurt Repubicans, it would backfire in a BIG way.

Your sixth idea about airing dirty laundry is pretty crappy too. If I knew someone was intentionally doing that, whether they be of the right or left, I would immediately avoid them at all costs simply because I would consider them a dispicable human being.

Intentionally keeping people from the polls? Shouldn't we be encouraging EVERYONE to vote, not discouraging those we don't agree with? I suppose I could see hoping a certain bloc of voters doesn't cast ballots, but to actually attempt to prevent them from voting is disgusting.

The rest of your ideas sound like typical political operative stuff. Have fun wallowing in the mud if you want, but know that the ends don't always justify the means, so if you can live with yourself do whatever makes you happy.

Imajika

[kennedy_lib]

48. You People Make Me Sick

You false-liberals make me sick.

Ever been to the local soup kitchen?
Ever been up to the pediatric floor of your local hospital?
Adopted any kids who aren't in an "attractive" category?
Ever volunteered at a local charity?

Geez, there's so much you could be doing to help out locally and all you can do is sit around and dream up *illegal* *unethical* and *sociopathic* attacks on your neighbors who differ in their political thinking.

Get a clue. Liberalism is NOT thinking up ways to harm others. You want to know how we can win elections? Start by setting a good example. All this extreme demagoguery just emboldens the Cons.

Where're the moderators?

[ReadTomPaine]

49. Welcome to modern politics.

If this type of Democrat bothers you, blame the right. This atmosphere wasn't created by us and this culture war wasn't started by us. But it will be finished by us.

[Book Lover]

50. None of these suggestions

would have stopped the Arnie juggernaut. I am not interested in doing good under a fascist regime. I am interested in living free.

[John_H]

51. Apparently, liberalism isn't about having a sense of humor

at least in your case. See you down at the soup kitchen, where I will be buying votes with Marlboro Lights.

[hang a left]

54. Come on lighten up, It is hillarious.

[JNelson6563]

59. let's not get too presumptuous

Ever been to the local soup kitchen?
Ever been up to the pediatric floor of your local hospital?
Adopted any kids who aren't in an "attractive" category?
Ever volunteered at a local charity?

Ever hear of "venting"??

What makes you assume that some folks who are sick of getting screwed haven't done charitable work? "Adopted any kids...."?? Sure, we all have the resources to do that.

Strong dose of the self-righteous juice today?

Julie

[JasonBerry]

52. Maybe we should leave this to Donald Segretti

and busy ourselves with something a bit more...uh...constructive.

[ReadTomPaine]

53. Umm, He's a republican and they won that election.

Kinda proves the point.

[JasonBerry]

55. Ummm....It Proves MY point

They won the election and Nixon --- resigned.

My guess is Segretti was wishing HE would have been doing something more constructive. The whole incident bankrupted him after fighting so many civil suits. As for the criminality of his actions, Segretti finally settled with the prosecution for his "dirty tricks campaign" and spent 3 months in a county jail and another 5 months in a federal prison.

[ReadTomPaine]

56. You're right in one respect...

There is a double standard when it comes to judging the way Democrats and Republicans operate, politically. What Reed, for instance, pulled off the last few elections makes Segretti's actions look like a pie fight. You can bet a lot worse is in store for '04, and unlike the 70's the WP and the DOJ won't even flinch. Heck, they will probably be in on it.

[Renew Deal]

60. kick n/t

:kick: