A profoundly disturbing story

[benburch]

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/243434_youthpastor05.html

<SNIP>

"The era in which we live is one of the most critical turning points in American history," Smith told an audience of college students last month. President Bush's Supreme Court nominations, he said, would be essential to determining "whether or not we will continue to murder innocent lives in the womb of our women."

"Wow," breathed a girl in the audience.

<SNIP>
Raised in an era when their peers made headlines for random school shootings and their president's sexual exploits became a national joke, Smith's target audience, the so-called Millennial Generation, have grown up to embrace a new traditionalism. Some observers say they are the most rule-friendly, group-oriented generation in recent history.

"They are joiners," said William Strauss, co-author of the book "Millennials Rising."

"They are prepared to listen to leaders -- whether from the pulpit or the White House -- in ways that their parents, the boomers, did not, and that is a very new phenomenon. They believe in security rather than radicalism, political order rather than social emancipation, collective responsibility rather than personal expression."

<SNIP>

-------------

These criminals have got to be stopped.

[bryant69]

1. I'm all for stopping criminals

but which criminals are you talking about?

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[benburch]

6. The ones brainwashing young people in the name of religion.

I think we need more than freedom OF religion. We need freedom FROM religion.

[bryant69]

7. Ah

Seems unlikely, but then as a religious person myself, I'm unlikely to go along with you on this one anyway.

But it is intersting to see the free expression of religion described as a criminal activity. Something to consider.

[benburch]

9. It becomes criminal when it is used as a political tool for controlling...

...others who are not part of the religion in question.

[bryant69]

10. That doesn't make any sense

Should every preacher across the land start every sermon by saying "Would anybody who doesn't already agree with me please leave this area. Otherwise I might be accused of brainwashing you and subject to criminal prosecution."

[benburch]

12. They want to impose their morality on us through the courts.

That is what I am talking about, if it was not clear.

[bryant69]

13. Ah

No it wasn't clear. OK I guess we would be on the same page with that one, since I would also oppose President Bush's nominees to the Supreme Court.

I'm not sure where the criminality comes in, but let it go.

[benburch]

14. I meant criminal in the pejoratve sense, not the legal one. nt

[bryant69]

16. Oh I see

In other words, something that should be a crime. Not something that is actually a crime. Something that in Ben Burch's perfect world would be a crime. In that sense?

[benburch]

18. No....

As in definition four; Shameful, Disgusting, Wasteful.

[bryant69]

20. Ah ok.

Thanks for clearing that up.

[benburch]

22. I think I use too many uncommon words and minority definitions.

If I were to restrict my vocabulary a bit I might make myself better understood.

[FreedomAngel82]

70. And also when

it takes away someone else's Constiutional rights for their own freedom with religion or lack thereof.

[RaleighNCDUer]

24. How about the 26 yr old kid who was able to buy a half-million

dollar house three years ago - when he was 23, obviously. This god business is very good to him.

He left his bible school to go to a (gasp!) public school where he preached. C'mon. This isn't Cross and the Switchblade stuff. He's a con man who is building a cult following by preying on the unsettled teens - know any teens who are not unsettled? - and making himself rich by it.

[flamin lib]

2. Recommended.

The move to fundamentalism, be it religious or otherwise, is world wide and scares hell out of me.

[MuseRider]

3. WTF?

I have to say something here. I have not read the entire article yet but I have two boys in that age group, both in college and this does not define them or really any of the kids I have known as they grew up. Rule followers? That really makes me laugh.

OK, perhaps I should not have said anything until I read the entire article but from what you posted here I think maybe someone wants us to believe that.

Edit OK, I read it and I still do not know one single young adult that I know through my kids, and I know a bunch of them since my house was often the hang out, that falls anywhere near this discription. I am not saying it is not true but I do have a difficult time believing this, especially since I live in Fundie Land.

[annabanana]

8. I'm not too worried about this crowd of kids...

I'm worried about their parents. (proximity, acorn/tree stuff)

It's been my experience that the harder you try to indoctrinate a kid to the right, the harder the left turn they make.

No one is more ferociously anti-cleric than a lapsed Catholic..

[MuseRider]

11. That is what I was

thinking too. The story was disturbing but these kids have not had to face a world without Roe v Wade or many of the other things that will not be available to them if this group gets its way. Nothing will change the mind of a teen or young adult faster than "the man" telling them how they can socialize.

In my experience the kids of the very strict fundies are often the ones in the most trouble....see above.

I don't know what to make of this, it has not been my experience that kids are the way the article says they are but then this is a small pond here speaking. Maybe it is different elsewhere. :shrug:

[ultraist]

59. I think you're right.

There are more Dem college aged voters, than Repubs.

[FreedomAngel82]

71. I think so too

At my college now I still see way more Kerry bumper stickers then W one's. I've seen at least four/five Kerry/Edwards stickers still on the car and during the election I saw a lot more then that. I did see a handful or so of W stickers but not as many.

[mirandapriestly]

90. Yeah, who writes these things? nt

[ComerPerro]

4. Maybe some of these "joiners" will join the military in Iraq

Fat chance.

[Toots]

5. Question Authority

If the youth of America do nothing else they must at least Question Authority. Never take it for granted the truth is being told. Question always question. I know that concept is totally foreign to Bush* but for the youth of America it is vital.

[MuseRider]

17. That is the best point

I have seen in a while. It is an essential part of growing and becoming your own person. I would worry myself sick if the kids did not question. It is the adults who do not question now that scare me the most. Some religions do a lot of that. They are training people to be accepting of things they do not understand and not to even try. Thy will be done.

[FreedomAngel82]

72. Yes

I go on at least two/three religious boards and some teenagers there have admitted they questioned their faith and asked if it was wrong. I said no cause it means you're still human and a free thinking independent person. There's nothing wrong with questioning. It doesn't mean you're wrong it just means you're still thinking for yourself. And for those who do believe in the Bible even King Solomon in the book of Proverbs incourages independent thinking and not to blindly follow someone. How do you know they really are like you? They could be fooling you for all you know.

[MuseRider]

88. That is great advice

to those who question and have been led to believe that questioning is wrong.

If we were not meant to think would we have these wonderful, teachable brains?

I do know some who would say that was wrong but not many.

[knitter4democracy]

53. Most don't.

They don't even think to question the television or their textbooks or their teachers. Some do, and those are the ones who make me hopeful.

[RaleighNCDUer]

15. FFA

Future Fascists of America.

[KurtNYC]

19. From a review of the Strauss book...

"Millennials Rising" is a 400-page gumbo of facts and quotations. Authors Howe and Strauss never met a sentence about today's kids that they didn't find worth treasuring and including in this book or in their previous books, which won a lot of reviewers' ink, such as "13th Gen," "Generations" and "The Fourth Turning." This latest book, like the others, mixes statistics from responsible data-collectors such as the Institute for Social Research with results from scientifically unrepresentative surveys of 200 high schoolers in Virginia and from postings on their websites...

Using this hodgepodge of material, the authors springboard to some wacky conclusions about the most overfed, overbundled and overprotected generation in American history. They say Millennials will soon remake America into a new country, a country that sounds an awful lot like East Germany, given how much time these youth spend playing organized sports, listening to the theme-park-style positivity of boy bands and dressing alike by wearing uniforms mandated by schools or peer pressure.

http://flakmag.com/books/mill.html

[MuseRider]

25. And there it is.

Typical. Still dangerous but typical.

[madmom]

21. I've done my part both my kids...

are staunch dems, both of voting age and both active in politics!!!!:woohoo: :patriot:

[Mandate My Ass]

23. he sounds like a Koresh type

"This is really the most critical time of your life," he said, striding across the stage, which was strewn with electric guitars, and wearing a T-shirt printed with the word "Obey" in gothic script.

<snip>

The Smiths preach about the reality of miracles. They speak in tongues. They believe the Bible is fact, not allegory, and that living radically as a Christian does not necessarily mean taking a vow of poverty -- "We've got multimillionaires in this church. I've got no problem with prosperity," said Smith, who bought a $410,000 home on the Eastside with his wife in 2002.

A little selective isn't he about the bible being literal? IIRC, it says a lot about poverty and spreading the word.

A few weeks earlier he had urged them to attend his three-day Bible camp, even if they didn't have the necessary $200....

And now for the absolute highlight of the article by far...

"Camp totally changed my life," said Imani Lawson, 20. "Before it, I was like, 'Why am I going to camp? I'm a pre-med and Spanish major and my grades suck.' But I asked God about it and God totally spoke to me about my grades. He said, 'Just keep going to church, I'll take care of that.' " And he has, Lawson said. "School became so easy, I'm like, 'Wow, God.' "

[NorthernSpy]

36. I agree with you!

This does NOT sound like normal evangelicalism. I wouldn't trust that Judah Smith person any further than I could throw him.

[FreedomAngel82]

76. I agree

It sounds more like brainwashing. With my church we've been getting a bit more involved in evangelicalism and it's basically just reaching out more to people and spreading the message of Jesus around. I wonder what goes on at this camp they have. And it surprises me this preacher or whatever has a house that much. My preacher just has a normal house and same with the youth minister. :shrug:

[PatriotMom]

40. I work in a PAC/Psychiatric Acute Care unit and I can tell you this

3 quarters of our clients talk like this. Hyper religious. They talk to God and he talks back, and sometimes it gets quite violent..yikes
Usually they are schizophrenic, very tortured souls most of them.

[ultraist]

60. Creepy! He's a cult leader. n/t

[FreedomAngel82]

75. Okay...

Sounds strange. I do think God can touch (as in your "intuition") you and answer your prayers but I don't know about actually talking to you. That sounds a bit schzio. :\ $200 for camp?! There's this youth thing a lot of the kids at my church go to but it's not $200. It's a weekend type thing and you only pay $45 or so and it's mostly for boarding since you stay on a campus of a Christian college. I guess they missed all those parables and lessons of helping the poor. :eyes: The first century churches gave and gave to each other. I wonder why they had to pay $200. :shrug:

[Cats Against Frist]

26. More Propaganda

First it was the "Gen Xers" that were more conservative, then the blacks leaving the Democratic Party in droves (droves, I tells ya), and now the Millenial Generation are the new GOP frontier. They're trying for a "bandwagon effect." Float it, make it true. Textbook. These people fucking suck. If anyone EVER called me a "joiner," I'd plant my knuckles right up in their schnozz. I will teach my son the same.

[NorthernSpy]

30. exactly -- they've been spewing variations on this theme for decades

On the whole, the Xers didn't turn out to be Reaganauts, and blacks didn't leave the Democratic Party. It's just the usual wishful thinking.

:eyes:

[RaleighNCDUer]

44. That was all just cover, to explain the weird vote counting.

"The republicans won because (x) voted for them in unexpected numbers."

Each time it's proven otherwise, they choose a different target group.

[Nay]

50. Exactly. I see lots of kids who definitely don't fit this mold. It's

pure propaganda.

[FreedomAngel82]

77. Probably

My younger cousin's are getting older and they're pretty independent. They're Christians and they love "Harry Potter" and Eminem's music and one of the cousin's likes Justin Timberlake and everything. Most of the Christians at my church are far from this as well as far as I know them.
:shrug:

[Mr_Spock]

57. Exactly - complete BS

My kids will tear the head off of one on these pansy "joiner" twits. I don't blame people for wanting things to be just so - it's just human nature. They are, however, completely delusional.

[Cats Against Frist]

27. Sorry, I have more commentary

There is NOTHING that I cannot stand more than people who attempt to co-opt "coolness" to sell "the philosophies of religion and order," -- in fact, the damn article almost spells it out: that these kids, supposedly "rapt," by Smith are looking for "order."

The problem is, that it's disingenous, because they're cloaking the same old patriarchal, rigid, constructed, sexist, bigoted dogma in the clothes and "memes" of decades of counter-culture. Was that guy SERIOUSLY wearing a t-shirt that said "obey?" Isn't that one of the slogans on the billboards in "They Live?"

The truth is, these people truly ARE aliens, disconected from their bodies, from the strata of human creativity and possibility, ready to fit everything into a nicely constructed, comfortable package. And for what? So they kids are better human capital? Notice how, like all Jesus revisionists that personal wealth is not poo-pooed upon. Is there anything more individual than hoarding resources? How the hell can the idiot who wrote the article talk about "collectivism?" WTF? She needs a LTTE, stat.

[Cats Against Frist]

28. Not to mention that

the "counter-culture," itself, has been co-opted by consumerism -- which is about the furthest thing you can get from spirituality and true existential self-exploration.

Why are they feeding kids this bullshit? :grr:

[KurtNYC]

29. Visual reference...

[FVZA_Colonel]

39. Creepy.

I think I might rent it if I ever find a video store near my dorm.

[MountainLaurel]

42. What movie is that from?

I know I've seen it, but can't remember.

[gulfcoastliberal]

43. I think it's "They Live"

Had to wear special sunglasses to see the bastards.

[porphyrian]

31. Easy enough to deal with.

Weren't the pre-hippies the same way? Didn't Watergate shake thousands of minds loose? It's not hard to shatter the illusion, we just have to do it.

[FreedomAngel82]

78. I agree

Once you learn how the people really are then you'll wake up. In the beginning in 2000 I was upset that Gore didn't "win" and I was slowly starting to like Bush (eek!) but then last year I was getting more into politics since I was able to vote (I would have Gore in 2000 since I adored him and Clinton) I started doing a lot of my own research on Bush and everything going on since 2000 and my eyes were really woken up to the truth and I'm glad I did.

[porphyrian]

89. Well then, you're a living example.

It's not like kids are stupid or can't change their minds, especially in the face of enough evidence. If anything, I'd be more worried about the adults who act the same. They are the ones who are less likely to change.

Glad you're awake.

[Ariana Celeste]

32. Lol. Not where I went to school.

Nor where my SO went to school. (I'm 20.)

Many of my peers appeared that way. But no way in hell is my generation a bunch of little soldiers. Maybe the good Christian kids. But everyone I knew, besides the good Christian kids, were doing drugs, having sex, breaking curfew, etc. Usual behavior. I think this is all just wishful thinking.


On edit: I should mention, since this article is in a seattle paper, that I went to school in Kent, Snoqualmie, and Tacoma for highschool. All WA schools. My SO went to school here in Indiana, and says his was a very diverse crowd.

[FreedomAngel82]

79. How many people were at this thing in the article?

I think also a lot of times the Christian teens are just as normal as the others. You just have to really get to know them. They're not so brainwashed as they would like to think. Religious yes, brainwashed no.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

33. All This Religion Industry Trash

reminds me of the still-relevant lines by the great labor agitator Joe Hill:

Long-haired preachers come out every night,
Try to tell you what's wrong and what's right;
But when asked how 'bout something to eat
They will answer with voices so sweet:
You will eat, bye and bye
In that glorious land above the sky;
Work and pray,
Live on hay,
You'll get pie in the sky when you die.

Meanwhile, Franklin Graham, charlatan son of charlatan Billy Graham, says he wants FEMA to give churches the trailers in Louisiana that OUR taxpayer dollars bought so the Religion Industry can decide which poor people get somewhere to live.

Screw 'em. Screw 'em all! The whole sick, twisted, perverted, kiddie-diddling, money-grubbing Religion Industry. Screw 'em to death!

:grr:

[ultraist]

61. "Religion Industry"

Those "churches" should not be allowed to maintain their tax exempt status. They are big money making corps. What a sham.

This kid sounds like Jim Baker, jr.

[NorthernSpy]

34. actually, this sounds more like a cult than the religious right we know...

Consider this bit:

A few weeks earlier he had urged them to attend his three-day Bible camp, even if they didn't have the necessary $200, even it meant quitting jobs they'd worked all four years of college to attain. Rise from your seats, he urged the young people, and walk down to the stage to say you will go to camp.

"If you go to camp and your life is not changed I will pay, personally, your way," he said, staring up at the diminishing crowd, more and more of whom were now standing with him and looking back at their friends.

"Camp totally changed my life," said Imani Lawson, 20. "Before it, I was like, 'Why am I going to camp? I'm a pre-med and Spanish major and my grades suck.' But I asked God about it and God totally spoke to me about my grades. He said, 'Just keep going to church, I'll take care of that.' " And he has, Lawson said. "School became so easy, I'm like, 'Wow, God.' "

Lawson's parents have expressed concern about the intensity of her involvement with Smith's ministry, she said, but this has not dampened her enthusiasm. Nor has it worried Smith, who urges his followers to go home to families and roommates and spread the word.

Ooooh -- welcome to the Farm, sister...

:scared:


That bit about the throwing away your career to attend this guy's "Bible camp" should have the alarm bells ringing loudly for anyone who reads this. Churches tithe, and they do make certain demands on their members. But even far-right fundy churches don't encourage paritioners to give up their normal lives, or to put their jobs and schooling in jeopardy. Someone needs to get it across to the reporter that the behavior of this church "leader" is a sign that something has gone wrong with this organization.


:think:

[RaleighNCDUer]

45. That's how the Moonies used to recruit, if anyone remembers.

Hot soup and peanut butter sandwiches for the runaway street kids, then an invitation to the camp or farm or whatever.

[FreedomAngel82]

82. Did anybody ever investigate those camps?

What happened there? :\

[FreedomAngel82]

81. You're very right

My church usually only has events on the weekend or in the summer and mostly for the youth. The college class I attend doesn't really do any camps or anything like that. We do stuff together but it's just like you would your non-Christian friends. I remember a year or two ago watching on MSNBC about this girl who was apart of a Christian cult. I was really surprised. Apparently she was knew at this college and her room-mate was apart of this group or someone she new at the college. They claimed to be Christians and to believe the same things as she did, but as time went on she found out more about this group. They told her she could only eat at certain times and certain foods and she couldn't talk to any family members or any of her other friends unless they were also in this group. It was really scary. Luckily she still had connection to people outside of the group and was able to help her get out. I tried to find a transcript or something but couldn't find one. This doesn't sound like going to anything Christian. I've seen Christian concerts and events online before and it wasn't like this at all. And what if you do go to this camp and do have a changing event? Do you still have to pay the $200? And what if you can't? What will happen to that person?

[progressivebydesign]

35. I tell ya how it is from near Seattle. Insider's knowledge.

My daughter goes to a fairly affluent high school outside of Seattle. The thing here is 1) Young Life 2) A mega million dollar church that overshadows everything around it. They are both exactly in the vein of what that faux-cool guy preaches (or brainwashes). I can speak from our experiences in recruiting the teens and in how the teens involved in those groups really act. It's a fantasy that the fellow in the article is wishing was true. Let's just say they aren't pouring out the vodka forever.

The preps involved in the Young Life groups here are just as sexually active as the kids who are not. They are also just as likely to get drunk. My daughter's first experience with the kids like that was a YL event at which all the girls and one of the adult female leaders went skinny dipping together at the event. The kids who are involved in both the mega church and YL find that 50 cent and Tupac are their musical heroes... NOT Christian bands. Hardly the lyrics that the youth pastor would endorse. The kids have pages on My Space (in violation of the rules, as they are under 16), and the videos they post on their as their faves are every bit as sexual, drug promoting, and skanky, as the so-called "non-believers" at school. It's common knowledge that the kids who are involved in the Christian youth groups and the heavy duty churches are wild and are there SIMPLY because it's what you're supposed to do to be one of the populars or the preps. Their heroes? Jesus, my parents, and 50 Cent.

Best thing ever? An acquaintance at the school who was WAAAY into the YL and Church thing BIG TIME joined a school club that my daughter belongs to... the YOUNG DEMOCRATS! Seems that the popularity of being in the Christian Youth is fading, it was a fad, and it didn't create adult believers.. rather it's a SOCIAL group. Free pizza, great trips, lots of parties!! All you have to do is say that you have accepted Jesus. But, like all great parties, it has to end. The kids realize that there's a bigger world out there, and things they'd like to do that the church and groups don't want them to. The Young Democrats Club at this affluent and pretty conservative school is growing so fast this year that they run out of chairs every meeting because of new members. It also features the ASB pres and treasurer as members!

[FreedomAngel82]

84. Wow, that gives me hope!

Thanks for that uplifting insider edition. :) I'm surprised really. I also think it's wishful thinking. And someone else on a Christian board I go on for music mentioned also how it's probably a fad. In a way it's sort of sad that they have to put up a fake belief in something to belong somewhere instead of really believing in something. I'm a believer because I truly believe in God and Christ and Christ's messages. I'm not surprised though and I think it's going to be like big hair in the 80's or whatever. All you have to do is look at the polls recently from Miers on whether or not her religion makes a difference in her being on the bench. I've just always believed that the "religious right" really was a small minority who just had loud mouths. They have way too much power in the republican party and I bet now a lot of republican politicians are wishing not. Anytime anyone wants to run they have to mention they are "pro-life" and "pro-family" even if they really aren't. I'm glad to hear that many of them are in the Young Democrats group. I was really surprised at that. I think we can really reach a lot of evangelical Christians with what Howard Dean is doing with the grassroots efforts. Talk a lot about corruption and helping the poor. He mentioned once on the "Daily Show" (his first appearance) that in the Bible it mentions the word "poor" 3,000 times. Compare that to how many times it mentions something about homosexuality and/or abortions. I do have hope for this country even though sometimes it appears there is none. Something always proves me other wise when I lose hope.

[MamaBear]

37. Tent Revival, 21st Century Style

This sounds like the sort of message preached for years at revival meetings, with the same sort of urgency, small minded bigotry and fear-mongering. Smith says:

...homosexuality is a sin, the same as murder, rape or living with your girlfriend...

This actually is a fairly sophisticated statement, conflating homosexuality (not even homosexual behavior) with murder and rape, and then conflating cohabitation with all of the above.

The bad news is that this stuff enters deep and sharp and is effective in frightening people half to death. The better news is that camp revival conversions tend to fade fairly quickly when camp is broken.

This is pretty hideous talk, though.

[FreedomAngel82]

85. I'm glad it fades though

It's sad what they're doing. Instead of preaching about peace, love, kindness, helping the poor etc. (the messages of Jesus) it sounds like they're preaching from the Old Testament to me and that wouldn't make them Christians. You're a Christian because you follow Christ and his message(s). At my church my preacher has never talked about abortion or homosexuality. He talks about lesson's that can be applied to our individual lives such as personal responsibility etc. He's only mentioned politics twice. Once was a fourth of July sermon where he talked about how we're lucky in this country with our amendments and thanking the soliders and those veterans in our church who served and then another time he just breifly mentioned why we have to be left vs. right and instead be a better country for God and he's mentioned a lot about helping the poor. I don't know what my preacher is politically but I wouldn't be surprised if he's more an independent. My now mayor is a Christian (a real one) and he's an indie (he reminds me a lot of a Jimmy Carter type).

[raccoon]

38. So many times, journalists, pundits, writers, make generalizations

like these:

"They are prepared to listen to leaders -- whether from the pulpit or the White House -- in ways that their parents, the boomers, did not, and that is a very new phenomenon. They believe in security rather than radicalism, political order rather than social emancipation, collective responsibility rather than personal expression."

So, let's see. The "Greatest Generation" (Tom Brokaw named them that, so of course his word is holy gospel) were hardworking, thrifty, patriotic, and dutiful.

The "baby boomers" were rebellious, materialistic, yadda, yadda.

"Generation X" are slackers, now the "Millennial Generation" are as described in the above quoted paragraph.

I don't know about you, but I'm tired of these generational stereotypes. In any generation, there are some people who fit some of these characteristics.

[Orangepeel]

55. of course, but there is some logic to it

you are absolutely right that these descriptions are stereotypes and not everyone fits the description. In fact, probably no one fits the descriptions exactly.

But, there are things that happen in society and the environment that affect how many children are raised and can have an impact on generations.

Among middle class families, children in the "millennial generation" are much less likely to have just played outside for recreation than older people. They were much more likely to have had structured activities with lots of rules. They were much more likely to have had an educational experience where they spent a significant amount of time drilling for standardized tests.

By the way, the same type of research also indicates that the "millennial generation" tends to be very tolerant, diverse and accepting of other's lifestyles. I hope that part is true.

[MountainLaurel]

41. Pardon me, while I

:puke:

[Walt Starr]

46. It's the helicopter syndrome

Parents oif this generation overwhelmingly structured every bit or their lives. they hover over the kids like helicopters. Teh result are a bunch of sheeple willing to do whatever those in positions of authority say.

Same thing happened to the generation that came of age in the 20's in Germany.

[Bridget Burke]

47. Claudia Rowe wrote the story....

Is she the same Claudia Rowe who teaches Preaching at Fuller NW Theological Seminary?

www.fuller.edu/cll/fnw/ecds/032/PR511_Rowe032.html

Perhaps this "movement" is not as important as she claims.

Boy, that young preacher is really "cool"!

[Sequoia]

48. All in all, they're just another brick in the WALL.

[FlaGranny]

49. That describes absolutely NONE

of the kids I know. Must be the kids of the fundamentalists.

[Chovexani]

51. "Joiners"?!

Sounds more like the goddamn Borg.

[knitter4democracy]

52. That sounds about right.

I taught that generation for three years. They were often quite passive in the face of authority and very uncomfortable with questioning anyone who had any kind of power. I was told over and over again that I had to be right because I was the teacher--and I taught AP English! I was shocked on a daily basis. These kids were smart, but they were tame already.

I did know some who weren't, and they made my day. :D

[LSK]

54. these @#$@##$ would love the middle ages

:grr:

[Mr_Spock]

56. Fascinating - and delusional

These people must be grasping at straws to same something so entirely stupid. Forced to be conservative children might act that way, not my kids :D

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

58. Sound perfect for military service...RECRUIT THEM. nt

[Lethe]

62. na, this is over-generalizing an entire generation

you can't put a stigma on an entire generation

but, instead of calling them "joiners", just call them lazy, fat, and too stupid to think so they go along with whatever is in style....which is certainly not a generation thing, its a human thing

[WildEyedLiberal]

63. "Rule-friendly, group oriented"

"They believe in security rather than radicalism, political order rather than social emancipation, collective responsibility rather than personal expression."

This is about as picture perfect a description of fascism as you can get. I disagree that this accurately described my generation, however. We went for Kerry by a significant margin.

[usregimechange]

64. That shit we have to stop!

[Mythsaje]

65. This has been engineered

and has been coming for a long time. If you think of the way the schools have been pushing conformity in many different areas from so many different angles...from forced drug testing for any and all extra-curricular activites to enforcement of hundreds of arbitrary policies that restrict freedom of expression in so many ways.

Simply put, it's the end result of nearly twenty years of forcing kids to bow to an overabundance of rules and regulations.

When I was in High School we could get away with wearing a beer tee-shirt, or other tees that weren't exactly "correct." Now? LOL...not a chance.

From the beginning I've been concerned about this and it's awful to see that my concerns may well have turned out to be correct.

[FreedomAngel82]

86. Yep

When I was in nineth grade my principal was pretty cool about clothing. I remember when I was in nineth grade I had band as the last class of the day and we had practice outside and people wore short shorts and everything. :crazy: But when I got higher up in the school by the time I was in twelveth grade they started having a bit more rules with your clothes and you couldn't wear anything over your knee's and nothing offensive on tshirts.

[lostnfound]

66. collective responsibility could work for us

Doesn't society have a collective responsibility towards children?
the handicapped? the elderly?

What is our collective responsibility as citizens towards controlling our own government? Our collective responsibility toward Iraqi or Iranian children?

Our collective responsibility as stewards of the earth, toward the next generation?

[suneel112]

67. Yes, there are kids like that...

...but only the rich kids ;). As a member of the "millenial generation", "the group-oriented generation", or "the generation that will have a lower income, life expectancy, and standard of living than their parents generation", there are deep divisions, as there are with every generation. However, this time the division is like the Berlin Wall, if you start on one side of it (right or left), you will not go to the other. If one started on the left (like me), they will hate the right because they know it is full of lies, deceptions, and evil. Likewise, those who grew up on the right will hate the left, as they have been brainwashed since they were small children: being forced to go to right-wing churches, watching Fox News, and having their parents rant on and on about taxes and such.
In reality it is the parents' faults for destroying their childrens' minds. The very same thing happened in Berlin, about 70 years ago. Mass brainwashing of every member of society into submission. It didn't work with everybody, since there were a group of people who really, REALLY hated Hitler, but enough people were weak and brainwashed to maintain a majority. The minds were distorted to commit heinous acts of barbarism. This can be seen by looking at those who support the Iraq war or those loonies who think that Katrina was a good thing.
There is one solution to this problem. As soon as a democratic majority is obtained in the House and Senate, push through an education bill that will "deprogram" students from the misinformation they learned from their parents or from their "religion". Start a "Christian Left" movement, and finally, file billions (or trillions) of dollars in lawsuits against all defense/oil companies that caused the problem.

[EC]

68. Mao's Little Red Book and Red Guards

were all brainwashed children..."The Killing Fields"

Mao's return to power in 1966 put an end to "creeping capitalism." To purify the revolution Mao appealed to young people, who nearly destroyed Chinese society by pitting one faction against another, even children against their parents. Hundreds of thousands of Chinese were executed, sent to jail, or exiled to re-education camps. Yet, surprisingly, by the early 1970s the political tide began to turn in favor of capitalistic America.

As Mao toppled Deng Xiaoping and others from power, his great "Cultural Revolution" proceeded to devastate Chinese society. His call to young people caused 11 million "Red Guards" to quit school and flock to Beijing to attack Mao's rivals. Children turned in their parents. Teachers were humiliated, beaten, even killed. Artists and writers were tortured. Books, artwork, and records were destroyed.

When faced with imminent anarchy, the Peoples Liberation Army restored order and sent the Red Guards back to communes all over China. This mass communal effort was coined "The Green University," but with minimal education beyond Mao's "little red book" of quotations, these youth were later to be called "The Lost Generation."

http://hoover.archives.gov/exhibits/China/Political%20Evolution/1949-71/revolution.html

[FreedomAngel82]

69. Most definitely

They're purely brainwashing these kids. Wait until they get into the real world though. They'll learn the hard way.

[Ellen Forradalom]

73. "Wow," breathed a girl in the audience.

That happened 40 years ago too when Tim Leary, Ram Dass, Alan Ginsberg, Alan Watts, or any other happenin' luminary addressed a crowd.

Things don't change that much.

[Behind the Aegis]

74. Millennials Rising

The author of this story was smart to use Strauss' information about Millennials. Although they are generalizations, they are useful in understanding groups of people. The one "positive" is that while most favor their parents' political beliefs, they are also less likely to get involved in politics or even be aware of them. This means once they leave college and start to become more independent, they often will have their politics challenged, and since they have not been involved in politics in the past, they are more of an "open slate."

[booley]

80. So i.e., we now have every tyrant's wet dream

a whole generation that will do as the leader says without much if any question, who will go along with anythign as it's a "rule" and will conform to the group.

Yes, that is disturbing. I am suddenly thinking the apocalypse may not be such a bad idea.

[nadinbrzezinski]

83. They grfwe up safe and coddled

i say bring back some pain and suffering...

Sorry, but that is the only thing that will wake them up

[FreedomAngel82]

87. Probably

Sometimes people don't "wake up" until something effects them personally.