Should the State of Iraq survive?

[Sandpiper]

It is worth remembering that Iraq was not a nation that came together on its own. It was a creation of the British Empire, carved out from three provinces of the old Ottoman Empire after WWI.

It's boundaries were drawn with the idea of throwing three diverse and historically contentious groups within the same border. This was a calculated move to create a client State that would be weak, divided, and susceptible to outside interference from Western Imperial Power.

Throughout its history, Iraq has been held together by Western puppet governments like the Hashemites, strong-man military leaders like Hussein, or outright military occupation from West.


Knowing this, I pose the question: Should the State of Iraq survive? Should the U.S. try to ensure its survival? And if the Iraqi people were truly given self-determination, would they even want it to?

[Name removed]

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[David Briggs]

2. It will fly apart.

Like the former Yugoslavia. The best hope for the region is a royalty trust which can manage and disburse the oil revenues. Put Israel in charge of that.

[DrDebug]

3. If Kurdistan becomes a state then Turkey will invade

So seperation is not an option. We are talking about one of the largest armies in the world with sophisticated weapons and don't doubt that they will attack if there is a free Kurdistan and they are more powerful than all the troops in Iraq right now

[H2O Man]

6. That's an important point.

It seems to me that the USA might do better to consider encouraging a coalition approach within Iraq for it's long-term future. That might be better accomplished by having non-Halliburton or military forces attempting to influence the leaders of the separate groups in Iraq. There are other peoples in North America who could be called upon to serve in this area.

[DrDebug]

7. Turkey already said that it will not tolerate a free Kurdistan.

It took many billions in 'aid' to get them out of the Iraq war, because they wanted to be in as well and add the northern part of Iraq to Turkey. They have massive troops near the border and they are ready to attack, because a free Kurdistan can lead to a civil war in Turkey as well since it's an ethnicly diverse country.

To give you an idea of their strength: 635,000 active soldiers. Potentially 13,000,000 can be drafted. The 7th largest army in the world. The second largest within NATO. The most F16s after the US. And the moral is many times higher than the US troops. In short they can simple kick the US army out of Iraq if they want to.

[H2O Man]

9. The potential

for an explosive regional conflict to break out is clearly not limited to Syria and Iran. I think the situation with Turkey has made people familiar with the situation in norhern Iraq very nervous since the Bush invasion began. There were a number of reasons that Bush1 did not want to invade Iraq.

[stray cat]

4. It would be nice if the Iraqis could survive

I don't know about the nation - its the civilians caught in the middle of it that concern me and what people will do that get power in a new or stateless Iraq.

[Uben]

5. No, but......

.... we still have a little bit of money left here in the U. S., so we need to go ahead and spend it on Iraq so we can go ahead and file bankruptcy!

[enigma000]

8. Many nations are multi-ethnic

Many countries are multi-ethnic, in a sense of not just having immigrants from different parts of the world & different cultures. Belgium has two main ethnic groups. Switzerland has 3: Italian, French, German. Canada has Quebec. Spain has strong regional identities. Would China exist as one nation if it were a liberal democracy?

95% of the Iraqi population are Muslims and 80% are Arabs. They share a common history and common values. The Kurds seem to have accepted being part of a federal Iraq. The Shiites may be of the same religious branch as the Iranians but are not Persians. The Sunni Arabs don't want a separate, oil-less state, they just have issues with losing their previous level of power over Iraq - but this too seems to be changing as Sunni politicians are running in next month's elections.

Should Iraq survive? Not our decision. But I've seen few Iraqi political and religious leaders advocating separate states.

[Sandpiper]

10. But we've already decided

We've decided that it will survive, and with an illusory democracy.

Iraqis are now "free" to have a US approved federal republic.

True self determination (the kind which might have a result inimical to US interests) never was on the table and never will be so long as Dubya's running the show.

The "freedom" that Iraqis now enjoy is that of being "free" to choose within the boundaries that their foreign occupiers have set.

[enigma000]

11. No different than if Kerry was President

The US has invested far too much into this to let Iraq become a failed state(s) or fall under Iranian domination. Even if the Dems get into power in '08 the same reality will face them.