No Closer To Cracking The Kennedy Case

[DemonFighterLives]

Article from The Washington Post
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/20/AR2005112000830.html

One of the presentations at the three-day session revived doubts about the famous "single bullet theory" that the House Select Committee on Assassinations thought it had resolved in the late 1970s. Another demolished persistent claims that the Zapruder film -- the "clock" of the Kennedy assassination -- had somehow been altered or contradicted by other photographic evidence. Still another speaker demonstrated how the sounds on Dallas police tapes showed that four and perhaps five shots had been fired -- meaning that at least one other person besides alleged assassin Lee Harvey Oswald had squeezed a trigger.

None of that solved the whodunit, although the conferees could still count themselves and like-minded historians and researchers winners in a way. Three out of every four Americans think President John F. Kennedy's assassination on Nov. 22, 1963, was the result of a conspiracy. Almost as many think there was a coverup.

But the proposition that drew about 135 people to a Bethesda hotel this past weekend -- that it is not too late "to solve the greatest mystery of the 20th century" -- has less traction with the public. According to the most recent poll, conducted in 2003 for the 40th anniversary of the JFK assassination, 75 percent of the public does not want another government investigation.

Washington lawyer Jim Lesar, president of the nonprofit Assassination Archives and Research Center, the main sponsor of the conference, was undeterred. "The lone assassin theory" -- the Warren Commission's conclusion in 1964 that Oswald was solely responsible for the killing -- "is more discredited than it has previously been," he said in opening remarks.

[wtmusic]

1. And as details disappear into the haze of time

the "lone assassin" theory will be more and more discredited. Next, on History Channel...

[Zen Democrat]

25. It's only been discredited by the same MSM/CIA people.

The CIA connected journalists have propped up the bogus Warren Report for 40 years. Aided and abetted by people like George H.W. Bush.

When these people are gone, the truth will emerge. There's nothing to investigate anymore, the truth is known. It was a neo-Nazi (a/k/a Neo-Con) coup and we've been living it from Vietnam to Iraq.

[Beam Me Up]

58. Yep. Same fingerprints as 9/11, the mother of all Iraq lies.

[Selatius]

2. Bill Hicks said it best:

I love talking about the Kennedy assassination. The reason I do is because I'm fascinated by it. I'm fascinated that our government could lie to us so blatantly, so obviously for so long, and we do absolutely nothing about it. I think that's interesting in what is ostensibly a democracy. Sarcasm - come on in. People say "Bill, quit talking about Kennedy man. It was a long time ago, just let it go, alright? It's a long time ago, just forget it." I'm like, alright, then don't bring up Jesus to me. As long as we're talking shelf life here...

[DemonFighterLives]

3. Since we're starting to dig into the corruption now in our country

this should be a good time to get to the bottom of it. While Poppy is still alive to testify.

[pretzel4gore]

10. yep, he was RIGHT there!

besides, there's a big fukking hole in US history, filled with silluputty (the lone gunman, magic bullet conspiracy theory)

[King_Crimson]

45. NO...WRONG...

Poppy says he can't recall where he was that day! I'll bet he could remember if he had some electrodes attatched to his nuts! :headbang:

[DemonFighterLives]

48. Mein Gott!

:rofl:

[upi402]

62. ooch! ouch! eech!

:yoiks:

[goclark]

75. Poppy and the Right Wing Nuts have been in the Middle

for a long time and why people let him off the hook with his son is beyond me.

Why did Poppy have a PRIVATE meeting in the WH with Cheney the evening before of 911?

Someone please answer that question for me.


I have YET to receive any form of an answer.

[FreedomAngel82]

19. Hear hear!

Someone should come out and ask him where he was. See if he still doesn't "remember".

[Jackpine Radical]

57. Guess what other President couldn't remember where he was.

Richard Nixon. I remember an article from the early '70's in the old TRUE Magazine. They dug up a taxi driver who remembered giving Nixon a ride from the DC airport downtown & they heard it on the radio. Interestingly, Nixon had just flown in from Dallas a few hours before the Kennedy assassination but a few months later couldn't remember that little fact.

[FreedomAngel82]

18. Exactly!!

I feel the same way. I've been obsessed with the Kennedy assisination for a few years now. My government killed my president. :cry: And not too many people give a damn! I wonder if he was a republican if people would care more. :cry:

[sojourner]

4. Thom Hartmann just had a show about this...and his new book

which he claims solves it. Archives of show (aired yesterday) are available at whiterosesociety.org -- worth taking a look IMO.

[DemonFighterLives]

5. Thank you!

This wasn't the greatest report on the meeting. They always seem to play up the detractors to the conspiracy, which in real life, look like idiots.

[acmejack]

6. That is Fridays show, which re-airs on Sunday.

It is a great discussion, led me to order the book.
edit,spelling

[DemonFighterLives]

9. The thing is archived and I'm not a subscriber

It might play, but I don't have time right now.
Could someone give me the gist of his theory?

[sojourner]

13. Quickly...

the book (I haven't read it) claims that JFK had a super top secret plan to assassinate Castro. That the plan was infiltrated by mob, and in retaliation against Bobby (aggressive pursuing mob) they offed JFK (apparently had made unsuccessful attempts prior to Dallas).

To prevent scenario of Castro retaliating against US (WW III) Bobby buried the truth...

Whole theory a bit richer and well elaborated, with supporting documents apparently.

[DemonFighterLives]

14. Thanks Sojourner

I suppose anything is possible, but from what I've read is Kennedy put a stop to the invasion of Cuba. Maybe I have just gilded him, but if it was the mafia, why couldn't the truth come out? Are they still that strong?

[sojourner]

16. according to hartmann and coauthor,

it was RFK and military who shut down the story. Fear of reprisal against US by Castro (eye for an eye). Fear of what that whole scenario would lead to -- WW III.

While I'm interested in the whole topic, and JFK's presidency in particular, I am not so well versed in the era that I can say much either way. Check out the book or access the archives at whiterosesociety.com (free) for a better analysis. Peace...

[Zen Democrat]

28. Joan Mellen's new book "A Farewell to Justice" has a better account

of this. RFK apparently was successful in shutting down assassination investigations, but not because they were planning to invade Cuba. It was apparently because RFK -- and JFK -- had prior knowledge from intelligence sources that there was an assassination plot afoot within the anti-Castro community (the ones working for the CIA). RFK had information about Oswald, knew that Oswald worked for American intelligence, and believed that Oswald was also working to uncover the plot. When Oswald was picked up for the murder, RFK was afraid of exposing his prior knowledge of Oswald -- and he was eaten up with guilt for the rest of his short life. From evidence revealed in the last ten years with the Assassination Review Board, it looks like that's exactly what Oswald was doing ... infiltrating an assassination plot and being set up as the patsy.

Mellen's book is incredibly good.

[sojourner]

65. I didn't say anything about an invasion attempt...

what you describe cuts close to what Hartmann says. Since I haven't read the book and am going only by my recall of what was said on his show, I don't feel comfortable having a discussion about it... just that from what I heard it sounded like a pretty cogent theory.

[FreedomAngel82]

22. Yes

There was a plan called Operation Northwoods that was made during the Eisenhower administration (I'm not sure if he was involved but people involved with him were) to cause a fake terrorist attack and blame it on Cuba so they could go in and do it. They presented the plan(s) to Kennedy but he rejected them.

[DemonFighterLives]

39. That's what I thought

I think "they" wanted to takeover Cuba much as "they" would like to today.

[Arkham House]

8. Hartmann's Book is Called "Ultimate Sacrifice"--

--I'm about halfway thru it right now. I've been reading books on this case since 1967...and believe it or not, I think this time, it really *has* been cracked--at least, as much as any historical event can be explained. They've founf new evidence and new witnesses...and while the answer they give isn't particularly generous to JFK or Bobby regarding their role, it does seem to make a dark kind of sense. And I'm still naive enough to think "the truth shall set you free"...

[DemonFighterLives]

11. Thanks for the details

Any more?
Welcome to DU!
:hi:

[nicknameless]

77. Well, what I can remember of the interview:

1) There was a Kennedy plan to overthrow Castro.

2) Robert Kennedy had been going after the mob like no one else ever had, so they (the mob) wanted to stop him.
The reasoning for going after John instead of Robert was that, if they killed Robert, John would go after them.
But if they killed John, Robert would have been stopped from retaliating by LBJ.

3) The plan to overthrow Castro (CIA-lead) was infiltrated by some mob members. They were the ones planning to assassinate John.

There were 3 "Godfathers" mentioned. I remember two names: Traficante and Marcello (spelling?).

The government – including the Kennedy brothers -- were aware that there were plots to murder John. There had been two mob attempts on JFK's life prior to Dallas: Chicago and Tampa. Tampa was the one that the Secret Service took most seriously. When John survived Tampa, there was a sigh of relief, and some in the Secret Service let their guard down.

In Dallas, when shots first were fired, the motorcade slowed down. People have wanted to know why. According to Hartmann's and Waldron's interviews with the driver of the President's car, He (the driver) saw the flash from the gun -- in front of the car. "Kenny" in the passenger seat in front yelled to the driver that they were driving right into an ambush. That's why they slowed down.

RFK didn’t know who had killed John, but he and John had a contingency plan to cover up any murder of a U.S. official. They were aware that Castro could find out about their plot to overthrow him. They felt if a murder did occur, it could have been carried out by Castro in retaliation for that plot. If the American people thought that Castro had done it, there would be intense pressure to strike back against Cuba, which could have escalated, with both counties possessing nuclear weapons, into WWIII.

In order to prevent a third world war, it was decided that they would just frame a patsy. That turned out to be Oswald.



President Clinton began unsealing Kennedy records during his first Administration. Hartmann and Waldron conducted YEARS of interviews and poured over stacks of documents obtained through FOIA requests.

=======

Anyway, that’s what I remember from the interview.

[FreedomAngel82]

20. I'm going to go listen!

:D Can you find his book at any book store or do you have to special order it?

[FreedomAngel82]

21. I can't listen cause you have to pay

:cry:

[yasmina27]

24. Just started the book

after hearing parts of the show. Very slow reading, as you want to absorb every sentence. I respect Mr. Hartmann's intellect so much - he is so incredibly knowledgeable that I don't want to miss a single nuance of his book.

I was only 4 mos. old when Kennedy was asassinated, and therefore have no memory of the actual event. However, what I've learned about it over the years is that the official story never made any sense.

The theory proposed makes more sense than any I've heard.

At over 900 pages and $33.00, this is a book to savor!

[sojourner]

27. hmmm...maybe I'll get the book. n/t

[Zen Democrat]

26. Hartmann has it wrong. He claims the Mafia did it.

Unless the Mafia controlled the CIA, the Pentagon, and the Secret Service, I'm not buying it.

[vonslagle]

7. Bush would soon as

Recount all the Florida 2000 votes than re-open that case. Too much to lose.

[DemonFighterLives]

12. I agree!

Welcome to DU!

[vonslagle]

15. Thanks

I'm happy here!

[FreedomAngel82]

23. Oh I'm sure

Didn't he send a memo to Kennedy warning him not to go? Now what did he know and when did he know it?

[MisterP]

17. one anti-conspiracy book was praised as being "comforting" on the jacket!

not "true"--comforting!

[Zen Democrat]

29. Here's a link to a recent 3-hour interview with Joan Mellen

http://www.takingaim.info/

Click on "Program Audio Archives" on the left and find the Joan Mellen interview near the top of the archives page.

There's lots of info on RFK here -- as well as discussions of new witnesses she found in Louisiana and Florida. It will blow you away. After hearing this interview I got the book, "A Farewell to Justice" and it has even more information. She began seven years ago to write a biography of Jim Garrison, and ended up with a blockbuster book with new testimony and new evidence.

If you're interested in the Kennedy assassination, give this a listen.

[DemonFighterLives]

35. Thanks for your additions here

I will for sure check that out.
:toast:

[Jose Diablo]

71. Here is a very revealing interview of Jim Garrison

From the Playboy Oct 10, 1967 issue:

http://www.jfklancer.com/Garrison2.html

If you read all 3 parts you will come away with what I believe is the truth on the Kennedy assassination.

Note how the media was doing all they could to smear Garrison and otherwise discredit him and his investigation into activities of the anti-Castro Cubans training to assassinate Castro. We see the same thing today indicating a government agent propaganda operation still in power within the media.

The FBI busted and confiscated the weapons at a camp being used to train these anti-Castro people, located just across the lake from New Orleans. The FBI was under orders from JFK to stop the assassination attempts on Castro as Kennedy was about to make peace with Cuba. The mafia didn't want peace with Castro as he had busted their gambling, prostitution and drug operations in Havana. Nor did various factions within the CIA operating in Central/South America as these people were protecting the interests of fruit, sugar and oil companies. In addition, there were various military weapons suppliers that had big money invested in keeping us at war with communism. The last thing they wanted was a world at peace.

Kennedy made a lot of enemies, powerful enemies. It was Garrison's conclusion that these powerful people used the anti-Castro Cubans to snuff Kennedy. These conclusions make sense to me. The untimely death of many witnesses to the assassination would indicate an intense black bag operation to clean-up 'loose-ends' after the assassination.

Our country was taken over by these powerful interests shortly after WWII. We have never really been 'free'. The cover of the 'cold war' was used to keep us in a military state before most of us were even born. When the cover of the 'cold war' end with the fall of the Berlin Wall, a new enemy was needed. Key the terrorist, stage right, a la Sept 11, 2001.

This is what these powerful interests want, a state of perpetual war. Anybody that gets in the way of this agenda will be killed. Thats why Kennedy was killed. Thats why RFK was killed. And with MLK's rainbow coalition about to unite people against the powerful/wealthy to form a new populist movement, thats why MLK was killed.


"I watched the glee while your kings and queens fought for
ten decades for the Gods they made
I shouted out "Who killed the Kennedy's?" when after all
it was you and me"

[Ladyhawk]

30. I'm probably a minority, but I DO think Oswald alone was responsible.

The explanations put forth to explain the conspiracy theories make sense to me. The trajectory of the bullet was correct considering the angle from School Book Depository window and the positions the president and governor were in when the fatal shot was fired.

The explanations seem more plausible to me than the various theories. Like it or not, Kennedy was most likely taken out by a lone nutjob.

[Zen Democrat]

31. Obviously you haven't read much about this subject.

Because the magic bullet theory has been soooooo discredited. The bullet that supposedly went through Kennedy and Connally left more metal in Connally's wrist alone than was missing from the bullet. Without the magic bullet theory, there's another shooter.

If you just read CIA-asset Gerald Posner, or watch shows on the mainstream media, you're getting the cover-up.

[misternormal]

32. Book... High Treason

[Ladyhawk]

34. Actually, I have done some reading on the subject.

No, I haven't just relied upon the MSM. I've done research online as well.

If you'd like, give me something to read or watch (preferrably online). I wouldn't mind doing a bit more research if I get the opportunity, but the online naysayers make more sense than the conspiracy theorists from what I've seen so far. However, I'm always open to more information.

Hell, you don't go from fundy freeper to liberal atheist if you don't open your mind, eh? :)

[DemonFighterLives]

36. I hear ya Lady!

Congrats on the transformation. :hug:

You can look at the Warren Commission that flew with the magic bullet theory and most witnesses to the opposition had accidents.
There was a select committee on assassinations that basically found that there were more than one shooter and therefore a conspiracy took place. If you get a chance, watch the History Channel (The Men Who Killed Kennedy) it is in like 5 parts now, maybe six. Great information and living witnesses.

[Zen Democrat]

47. I hear ya, Ladyhawk. As to online research ...

McAdams pays Google and Yahoo to list his website first when "Kennedy Assassination" is searched. McAdams is actually a pseudonym. Somebody pays him for this. He's spent many, many years attempting to quell the truth, but to little avail. Polls show that upwards of 75% of the American people believe there was a conspiracy to murder John F. Kennedy.

There are many, many great websites for online researchers. One site with lots of resources and links is Lisa Pease's site:

http://www.webcom.com/~lpease/index2.htm

Click on "Site Map" at the left and follow the links to the Kennedy Assassination.

http://ourworld.cs.com/mikegriffith1/id35.htm
http://history-matters.com/jfkmurder.htm
http://www.geocities.com/verisimus101/
http://www.webcom.com/ctka/index.html

These are just a few I've checked out. Although most of my info comes from the 50+ books I've read about it in the past 30 years. There's a lot of disinformation out there, and some half-baked theories by wannabe researchers -- but the core material doesn't change. And the core evidence points to Oswald being exactly what he said he was ... "a patsy".

[Media_Lies_Daily]

61. McAdams is actually a real person...he is a professor of political....

...science at Marquette University.

By the way, those links that you listed are very good...Mike Griffith is a very meticulous researcher and has written some very good articles and at least one book on the assassination.

I would also recommend every book written by Harold Weisberg. Harold was one of the first JFK assassination researchers who did an amazing amount of ground-breaking research, particularly on Lee Harvey Oswald. He was a tireless investigator, and would go to any lengths to find information on the assassination.

[DemonFighterLives]

33. I'm sorry I can't buy that

Oswald was messing with David Ferie and the other players. I think for some reason that he was used as a patsy. Amazing that no good Jack Ruby killed Oswald before he could say anymore than, "I'm a Patsy".
The shooting scenarios presented for the magic bullet theory do not account for the wounds. He got shot from the side, hence Jackie O. out on the trunk to retrieve his brains.
I was 4 years old when he was whacked and I never saw more people cry in my whole life. JFK was cool to say the least. There is much in the Garrison Book that will relate to the truth.
:hi:

[Media_Lies_Daily]

60. Warren Commission Report = Iraq National Intelligence Summary.....

...both documents used evidence selectively, twisted the truth to suit their respective ends, and flat-out fabricated some evidence.

*There is NO chain of evidence between the wounds in JFK and JC and the bullet later found on a stretcher in Parkland hospital. The so-called "Magic Bullet" found on that stretcher did not have a single trace of fabric, blood, or flesh. Additionally, the "Magic Bullet" is only slightly deformed, highly suggestive of a test round that has been fired into cotton to establish a match with the rifling of the alleged murder weapon, the Mannlicher-Carcano rifle.

*The Zapruder Film clearly demonstrates that the so-called Warren Commission trajectory from the 6th floor TSBD clearly DOES NOT work. If it had worked as claimed by the Warren Commission, the round would have had to enter JFK at the back entrance wound which is approximately 5.75 inches from the middle of the back of JFK's neck and about 1 inch to the right of JFK's spine, then travel UPWARDS to exit the alleged throat wound of exit, then travel DOWNWARDS after leaving the alleged throat exit wound, then CHANGE DIRECTION in mid-air, first to the RIGHT, then back to the LEFT, then strike Connally in the back just to the left of his right armpit, then exit Connally's ribcage under the right nipple pulverizing a chunk of Connally's 5th rib, then exit UPWARDS and to the RIGHT to strike Connally in the right wrist, then travel DOWNWARDS and to the LEFT to strike Connally in the left thigh. And the "Magic Bullet somehow did all of this with no discernible damage.

*If you want to explain JFK's shooting in real world terms, anyone shooting from the 6th floor corner window of the TSBD would have had his first shot BLOCKED by one of the trees that grew in front of the TSBD at that time. If a lone shooter was going to attempt to assassinate JFK from that window, why didn't he attempt to shoot him while the motorcade was still on Houston Street? That would have afforded the best possible shots at the best possible angles for a lone gunman.

*The wound in the FRONT of JFK's throat was one of ENTRANCE as noted in the sworn testimony of the medical personnel that removed JFK's shirt and tie. The wound was small, smooth, and round as noted by the medical personnel. The nicks in the front of JFK's shirt collar and in his tie were caused by the scalpel used to remove JFK's shirt and tie. That is consistent with a shot from the right front of JFK judging by the position of JFK's body in the Zapruder film. The wound was later obscured by the tracheotomy performed by the Parkland staff.

*At the point in time that JFK is wounded, Connally FAILS to react in a way consistent with being simultaneously shot by the same round. When Connally finally does react to being shot, he DOES NOT drop his hat which is in his RIGHT hand even though his right wrist is allegedly shattered. He continues to hold his hat until it appears that he is struck a SECOND time, this time in the right wrist.

*By my count, that is two hits on JFK, and two hits on JC. The presidential limo also had what appears to be a through-and-through hole in the front windshield, and a circular dent in the chrome framing above the front passenger seat. That's two more rounds fired, isn't it? An additional bullet was a complete stray and struck the curbing on the left side of Elm Street causing a fragment to cut the cheek of a bystander. That's seven documented hits as found in the backup records to the Warren Commission Report and the House Select Committee on Assinations, and still no head shot on JFK.

*The FBI firearms experts refused to fire the alleged murder weapon, the Mannlicher-Carcano rifle, until certain repairs were made to that rifle. The bolt action had a tendency to stick, the trigger had what amounted to a two-stage action making the rifle unpredictable as to the exact time the weapon would fire, and the scope was loose and had to be shimmed to allow it to be used properly. None of the FBI firearms experts were able to duplicate the feat of firing three shots at a moving target from the Mannlicher-Carcano in the time allotted by the Warren Commission.

*Within a very short time after the assassination, Lee Harvey Oswald was discovered by a Dallas police officer to be sitting in the 2nd floor Texas School Book Depository drinking a soft drink. According to the police officer's testimony, LHO was not out of breath, and he was not sweating.If he was the shooter in the 6th floor corner window of the TSBD, how did he manage to hide the rifle, get down the steps, and get into the 2nd floor lunchroom before the police officer discovered him?

*Speaking of Lee Harvey Oswald, were you aware that he was a radar operator while he was in the US Marine Corps. Did you also know that he was assigned to the U-2 Program at the Atsugi Air Force Base in Japan, and that he held a "Crypto" security clearance, one of the highest clearances one could have back in the late-1950s? And just how do you explain the fat that LHO had a CIA 201 Personnel File? How do you also explain his alleged defection to the Soviet Union when he had knowledge of the U-2 Program? How then do you also explain his return from the Soviet Union with a Soviet-born wife and child?

"Lone nutjob"? Not with LHO's background.

[David Zephyr]

37. The case has long been cracked.

Who had the means? Who had the opportunity? Who had the motive? Who had the most experience with political assassinations and subsequent cover-ups?

Allen Dulles is one name that would come to mind. After that, the list becomes very, very thin...if not non-existent.

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Kingofalldems]

40. What case would that be?

[DemonFighterLives]

42. What was decided?

Welcome to DU!
:dem:

[Kingofalldems]

44. I decided something when I read the Ted Kennedy post

Pretty obvious.

[DemonFighterLives]

46. I was behaving.

:rofl:

[DemonFighterLives]

41. He is definitely a player

and he did a helluva job. That terrible report still is believed by some. Now replaced by the 9/11 Commission- another terrible miscarriage of justice.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

63. Dulles was but one of several prominent people at the time who had....

...the motive and the means to carry out the killing.

The planning was probably done at a very high level among a very small group.

The execution of the plan was probably carried out by two or more contractors who had no clue who they were actually working for.

The cover-up had to have been implemented at the highest levels of the U. S. Government by one or more people.

[Kingofalldems]

43. Coast to Coast AM tonight

A discussion of the JFK assassination with at least two of the authors mentioned here. Should be good.

[DemonFighterLives]

49. I'm not having any luck with that

If you listen, let me know, OK.

[Kingofalldems]

72. Heard the last half hour with Joan Mellen

She believes Garrison was on the right track. She says she has a loan application for David Ferrie which was cosigned by Clay Shaw, who always claimed he never knew Ferrie. The loan was for an airplane. If true, this is huge.

[dbeach]

50. "The Kennedy Curse"

JFK BK MLK
Many mysterious plane crashes and suicides.

11/00
9/11/01
3/11/04
11/02/04
7/07/05
11/09/05

All are coups by the controllers.
all designed to divide and conquer while the same criminal syndicates move on to their next crimes.
Loooting the treasury of EVERY nation on this planet and letting the US taxpayer pay for their very own demise
is their evolving agenda.

I pause to remeber cuz I will NEVER forget 11/22/63 when it began.

"The Kennedy Curse
Joseph P. Kennedy Jr. died in 1944 when his U.S. Army bomber heavily laden with explosives blew up over the English Channel.
Kathleen Kennedy died in a plane crash in 1948. (Her husband, William John Robert Cavendish, the Marquess of Hartington, was killed in World War II.
Patrick Kennedy, son of the president, was born prematurely in 1963 and died two days later.
President John F. Kennedy was assassinated in Dallas in 1963, three months after the death of Patrick.
Sen. Robert F. Kennedy of New York, former U.S. attorney general, was assassinated immediately after winning the California Democratic presidential primary in 1968.
David Kennedy, son of RFK, died of a drug overdose in 1984.
Michael Kennedy, another of RFK's sons, died in a 1997 skiing accident in Aspen, Colo.
In July 1999, John F. Kennedy Jr. dies when his Piper Saratoga aircraft crashed in the ocean near Martha's Vineyard. Also killed in the crash are his wife and sister-in-law.
The family has also suffered two serious automobile accidents: Edward Kennedy's 1969 Chappaquiddick accident, and a 1973 accident involving RFK's son Joseph that left a female passenger paralyzed for life."


http://www.sptimes.com/jfkjr/tragedies.shtml

[struggle4progress]

51. Of course, Jackie, Tricky Dick, and LBJ planned the whole thing. eom

[DemonFighterLives]

52. Trying to find more on the conference

http://www.aarclibrary.org/notices/Cracking_the_JFK_Case_Announcement_10-29-05.pdf

Cracking the case

I'll try to find a report of the conference.
Cyril Wecht rocks
:yourock:

[rasputin1952]

53. The one thing I am sure of is that Oswald didn't kill Kennedy...

or Tippet for that matter.

Two things lead me to these conclusions:

1) When Oswald is paraded in front of the Press, he is asked if he has been charged in the murder of the president. The hesitsation and the look on his face speak volumes. He also has the presence of mind to say this is the first he's heard of the charge. The look of shock is almost palapable...he knows at this point, he is a sacrificial
lamb, or "patsy" as he put it.

2) Tippet was found in the street with several spent cartridges in the vicinity; Oswald had a revolver. Automatics expel cartridges, in order for Oswald's revolver to leave cartridges, he would have had to clear the weapon on the street, something no witness says happened.

Those two items alone destroy the notion that Oswald shot Kennedy.

[Johonny]

74. He sure seems guilty to me

Had the weapon. Was easily traced to him. Was seen bringing it into the building. But who was he and did he act alone?

[Octafish]

54. Poppy knows. He told FBI he was in Dallas the day JFK was killed.

Coincidence Theorists! Behold, the FBI memo dated 22 November 1963:



Read and learn:

http://www.internetpirate.com/bush.htm

A few questions:

1. Why didn't George Herbert Walker Bush report his suspicions before the assassination?

2. Why has Poppy failed to mention where he was that day?

3. Why hasn't he been asked to testify about this before any government body?

4. What was his reason for being in Dallas that day?

5. Was he working in the CIA then?

[DemonFighterLives]

56. Good Questions

1. Uh
2. He was not asked by the right people
3. Uh, they don't want to die?
4. Oil business?
5. not anything that anyone can talk about.

:thumbsup:

[Media_Lies_Daily]

64. Go back to the Bay of Pigs invasion, and check the names of a couple....

...of the landing craft, the Houston, and the Barbara. Then note that the Bay of Pigs had a codename of "Operation Zapata".

Coincidence? I think not.

[DemonFighterLives]

66. I was going to mention the ships, but didn't remember all the names

at the time. poppy had his fingerprints on the invasion plan and was among the pissed off rogue cia that helped with the assassination.

There are reasons as to why this case is not clearing up. High level co-conspirators, cia and mafia, all with their own little plans for the nation. I was fixed on Nixon for the longest time, until I learned more of the poppie stuff. I also do not give Johnson a pass.
One thing that Garrison always said, was you had to look at the pictures of who surrounded JFK and who benefited. You wll see Tricky Dick in the background longing for his shot at the presidency and lo and behold with Kennedy's death, it came to pass. Of course it is not beyond poppy to enable another criminal to make it and thus increase his stature among crooks and eventually make his own way to the big house. (WH)

I wish someone would be rotting in prison for this crime.
The Neocons have really cleaned up their act- now they practice bloodless coups -see jr. as pResident.

:rant:

[Jara sang]

73. George H.W. Bush: the only person who doesn't remember where they were

when Kennedy was shot.

[DemonFighterLives]

55. Update from the Post

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/21/AR2005112100801.html

clip
The Warren Commission concluded in 1964 that Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone gunman and squeezed off just three shots at Kennedy's motorcade from the Texas School Book Depository overlooking the plaza. A 1979 report by the House Select Committee on Assassinations concluded Oswald probably did not act alone _ a contention supported by a majority of Americans polled in 2003, the 40th anniversary of the assassination.

A conference dedicated to "Cracking the JFK Case" recently drew roughly 100 people to a Bethesda, Md., hotel. Sessions covered everything from the CIA's monitoring of Oswald in the months prior to the assassination to what a Dallas police audio tape may _ or may not _ prove about the numbers of shots fired.

Former Sen. Gary Hart reminded participants that his own investigative foray into the case, as a member of the Church Committee that met in 1975 and 1976, revealed both the Mafia and the Cuban exile community had ample reasons to want Kennedy dead.

Meanwhile, the cadre of conspiracy theorists is growing older and grayer and sources are dying off, further slowing progress, conference participants said.

Hey now!
:freak:

[Jara sang]

59. George & Herman Brown killed Kennedy.

I'm at about %80 on that. They were the founders of Brown & Root, now Halliburton. They had the most to gain from the assassination. They had to get their boy Johnson in there. Brown and Root made serious bank in Nam. Read Caro's biography of Johnson to understand how the Browns owned Kennedy, Johnson, and Nixon.

[Bushy Being Born]

67. What rationale is behind the thinking of the 75%?

Presumably a substantial part of those 75% don't subscribe to the lone gunman theory, so why wouldn't they want another investigation? Waste of taxpayers' money, since the truth will never come out no matter how many are conducted?

[DemonFighterLives]

68. Good Question

Welcome to DU!
I think it is bogus that "the People" don't want an investigation. Many want to get to the truth.

[MadHound]

70. Deep and desperate cynicism more than likely

After watching the initial investigation of the Warren Commission turn into a whitewash and cover-up, and then watching as 16 years later the House Assasination Committee reluctantly admit to a conspiracy, and then do nothing, people have simply come to the conclusion that another investigation, especially at this late date will simply be an exercise in futility.

Why spend a few million dollars when the investigators will simply gloss over everything by saying there is too little evidence left, and too few witnesses left alive to come to any sort of conclusion. And for the most part, I agree with that assesment. While I would love to see a free ranging, no holds barred investigation, due to the nature of the JFK assisination I know that we'll never, ever see one. Too many people are still left alive who would be damaged and discredited, too many dirty secrets to allow out in the open. So why bother, it will simply wind up being another feast day for the coincidence theorists:shrug:

At best what I'm hoping for is some sort of death bed confession of some sort, or that finally something will slip out of the grasp of TOP SECRET, CLASSIFIED file. But other than that, the Kennedy assisnation will have to be solved by the historians of one hundred years from now, when the JFK murder has ceased to be a political time bomb.

[DemonFighterLives]

76. Good analysis

and you could be right.
I would like to have straighter answers in my lifetime.
The nation needs a good cleansing.

[DemonFighterLives]

69. kick

:kick:

[Realityhack]

78. I read a book once called "Mortal Error: The Shot That Killed JFK"

Read it with several other JFK books close at hand including a summary of the warren report.

Anyway I thought it made a fairly coherent argument. Not saying its proven... my guess is too much is already destroyed for that to ever happen... but it was quite well argued and internaly consistant.