Beware! * means to let the PATRIOT Act expire

[librechik]

then the attack.

then he blames the Dems.

Then the Nazis "win" in 2006, and nobody questions the theft--again.

Just occurred to me while listening to the reasonable Senators on CSpan wonder why Shrub doesn't allow a 3 month extension.

:tinfoilhat:

[calico1]

1. Would not surprise me at all. n/t

[havocmom]

2. My daughter is taking a flight next month...

to San Francisco.

I am sweating bullets here.

We all know, deep down, that the only way Cheney can save his ass is to demolish ALL vestiges of democracy in America. He is not the sort of chap to throw his hands up and surrender then the posse has him surrounded. The only way for him to pull off his own rescue is through Martial Law and the only way that happens involves a pretty big trigger event.

Yeah, there be trouble ahead. Doesn't take tin foil to see that.

[givemebackmycountry]

3. EFFING BINGO!! ---I WAS THINKING THE SAME THING....!

And I mean exactly the same thing.
They are smart enough, and just crazy enough to do something like this.
The Democratic party would be marginalized for decades.

Remember they have a stated goal, these neo-con whack-jobs.
They don't only want to stay in power, they want to stay in power forever.

That makes them capable of doing most anything.

[helderheid]

33. I had the same thought - we NEED an ad campaign explaining that if it

expires, the blame lays squarely with * because he chose not to extend it. WE NEED this ad campaign.

[Atman]

4. Of course, that is what he PLANS to do

But his plans, as we know all too well, never seem to work out for him. Let's help him bat 1000 and make sure his illegal spying on American citizens is the reason why the Patriot Act deserves to expire until we can have a trustworthy government again!

[global1]

5. Exactly - It Will Be the Dems Fault......

the Dems are trying to put the burden on * though. They are saying they are only asking for a 3 month extension so that the Patriot Act can be cleaned up into something that they can support for the long haul. Frist and * won't have that. So the Dems are saying if the PA expires - the blame if any falls on * and the Repugs.

Then I saw some Repug senator push for a 1 year extension - which I thought might give * and the Repugs the PA beyond the Nov '06 elections. I began to suspect that that is what they wanted all along.

No matter if the PA gets extended or not - * will do as he pleases. I'm so frustrated.

[tularetom]

6. I wouldn't put it past 'em

but how can the subject be raised without being accused of being a conspiracy nut. The only thing that would stop it is the fact that these guys screw up everything they do, it would take a lot of people working together to orchestrate a fake attack and they'd probably fuck it up like 9/11, Katrina, Iraq etc. etc.

:tinfoilhat:

[helderheid]

34. You don't - you run ads (if he lets it expire) that say HE let them expire

[Norquist Nemesis]

7. Martial law next?

Wasn't there something a couple of days ago about the House declaring martial law in order to have the ability to pass a bill, then lifting it immediately after voting? :shrug:

Who declares Martial Law?

[pepsirum739]

8. Liberal chick you make a very good point

[peacetalksforall]

9. And this time the perpetrators will be from Iran. Or -

Iran plus Syria Venezuela Bolivia and Cuba.

Good-by familes, lives, bodies, careers, immune systems, mental health.

Welcome to all the new media moguls who will sell their souls once more to the right wing cabal of sinister thieves, liars, deceivers, deluders, hate festering, war mongering inhumans from George, WHIG, PNAC, and the reverends on down the line.

[Protagoras]

14. It doesn't matter where they are from

They weren't from Iraq on 9/11...

Right now this country is still acting like the proverbial frog in slowly heated water, we'll never hop out. Maybe we can't wait for more heat to tell us what to do.

[madeline_con]

17. Right, they can tie the whole bunch together by secret ...

phone calls they can't release due to "national security" and "protecting the American people". :puke:

[mattclearing]

10. So we should let the Patriot Act renew to avoid Bush's nefarious plan?

:eyes:

[librechik]

35. I'm not in favor of keeping the act

I WANT A STRAIGHT UP OR DOWN VOTE!!!

by letting it expire, (i.e., NOT voting on it because the Pukkkes know they can't win it) we are letting them "win" in a smarmy, passive-aggressive way. That will allow them to whine all sorts of nonsense.

[mattclearing]

50. Well, it got extended.

Crisis delayed. Happy?

[NNN0LHI]

11. Where are those two British SAS guys?

[madeline_con]

18. They're helping with Iraqi elections. n/t

[mikehiggins]

12. This assumes, of course, that the Dems would be such total assholes

and morons that we would let this argument stand. Of course, going by what has happened since 9/11 i expect it will take a widespread series of spinal implants to get our "leaders" to stand up and say this is bullshit and that Bush/Cheney is lying.

Why do the Dems find it so hard to just say that flat out? BushCo has been lying all the way down the line and the American people have been buying those lies one after another.

Just this week I had a short flamewar with another individual and I simply told him that he was full of crap quoting the Bushoid nonsense, and that he knew it. Haven't heard a word back since.

How hard is that?

Why doesn't someone tell Tweety and co that what they are spewing on the air is bullshit plain and simple? Is it that wonderful to get your face on the tube that you have to collaborate with the liars?

[hlthe2b]

13. Someone well known needs to loudly and publically voice this

thouht in the media. Then the discussion will be all about what a nut that person is and the long knives will be out to discredit, but the fact is just saying it vocally will neutralize the possibility.

Alternately, maybe we need to flood the media with our concerns, so that they at least have to report on it.??????????????

What think you all?

PS, if we do a mass campaign, I think it important not to tie any other conspiracies to this (i.e., anthrax, 911, or anything else, for fear of it just being discounted out of hand). The bottom line, a VP that uses fear to control the public and their emotions, who argues so vociferously for limitless pResidential powers at the same time he condones and advocates for the worst forms of torture can not be trusted not to consider (or to actually commit) what we are suggesting. That is worth pointing out, I think.

[Wordie]

15. It is BUSH who says he won't compromise and sign the extension, so he may

threaten that, but he must know he could never pull it off.

Of course, there are so many things that we all have presumed that Bush "must" know...

[madeline_con]

16. What will they blow up this time? n/t

[Johonny]

19. You know

If there is another massive attack (by massive I mean 20 people armed with razor blades) and the American people blame the minority party that is not in control of a single branch of the American federal government. Don't you think the American people deserve what they get.

[librechik]

20. don't get me started

on the stupidity, apathy and acquiescence to authority that describes the vast majority of Americans. I have to watch and listen to the call-ins on Washington Journal every morning just to convince myself, it seems so unbelievable on its face.

Yeah, if we let this happen AGAIN we will deserve it, sadly.

[schmuls]

21. see if this makes any sense or is it too far fetched?

http://www.infowars.com/articles/ps/patriot_act_intended_to_fail.htm

[librechik]

26. it makes a lot of sense

better add another layer to my tinfoil

[FreedomAngel82]

37. I think that's the case too

There is a reason why they're doing the talking points besides bullying them to get what they want. I still highly believe Bush did 9/11 through the neocons and PNACers. And they've been using that San Francisco incident as "proof" "they're" still out there wanting to "hurt" us.

[newportdadde]

22. So he wants it renewed but not an extension?

Is this correct? That seems really strange.

[walldude]

23. But.. We're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them

over here! So we can't get attacked, we are fighting them over there.

[FreedomAngel82]

38. It's all about chaos

Remember chaos is their best friend. As long as that's going on they can slip under the radar with their real agendas. Global power to make more money. It's all about being rich and powerful. Not about anything else.

[ProfessorGAC]

24. Methinks You Think Too Highly Of Them

They would love to leave the pat act as is. I don't think they're anywhere near as clever as you make them sound.

Besides, since everyone agrees that the pat act does almost nothing to improve intelligence gathering that they couldn't already do, (including most semi-intelligent repubs), then that is a horrible excuse.

Besides, all they've got left is the "more secure" parrot-line. If we get attacked, THEY HAVE NOTHING!
The Professor

[librechik]

28. I hope you are right

However,Professor GAC (whose intelligence and knowledge I respect) if the act DOES expire, what do you think they will do? Blow it off as ineffective an unnecessary after all their shrieking? With Karl calling the shots?

seriously, what are the options for these criminals after that?

[FreedomAngel82]

39. Here's the memo going around

with the talking points. It's worth a read: http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/november2005/121105newterror.htm

[ddeclue]

25. Stop being so conspiratorial

LET the DAMNED PATRIOT ACT expire!

Bush won't be able to get away with any crap because he's such a screw up.

They don't want a 3 month extension because they are arrogant bastards who have a my way or the highway mentality.

[librechik]

30. excellent point--I hate the damn thing too!

and they are just assholes enough to be simply demanding their way. I don't know.

I'm just saying, watch out!

[helderheid]

42. I'm with you on this - I hope I'm wrong like you do!

[CabalPowered]

27. Another reason could be Fitz

There was a thread awhile ago that detailed some of his comments on the Patriot Act and how he thought it was useful tool. Perhaps Fitz has been using PA tools in his investigation? How ironic would that be?

[FreedomAngel82]

40. I didn't hear that

But that would be pretty funny.

[Armstead]

29. Bring it on!

I hope he does, and I hope he attacks the Democrats fulkl frontally. Andf I hope the Democrats punch back with equal force, and explain in clear, unambiguous terms WHY Bush let it expire, and why THEY believe it had to be debated further to protect liberty and freedom.

I can dream can't I?

[FreedomAngel82]

31. I do wonder about that myself

It could work either way in their favor. If it does pass they can spy and do what they've been doing all along all in the name of "terrorism." Than if it doesn't pass he can attack the democrats for being weak and all this nonsense. *sigh* I'm so tired of this.

[helderheid]

32. we are totally on the same page!!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5658377

[librechik]

36. heh--we're not a conspiracy, we're a movement!

great minds etc.

:loveya:

[helderheid]

41. K & R

[Hardrada]

43. This is using up all my tinfoil

and duct tape.

[MODemocrat]

44. Gosh, wouldn't that make it look a little too obvious

It would seem that they allowed the attack to happen, just as many have suspected about 09-11. :shrug:

[helderheid]

45. not if they blame the Dems "playing politics"

[MODemocrat]

48. It's true, they always have something up their sleeve

I keep thinking that one of these days the democrats will fight back, and maybe they are starting to, It's just that the Bush regime is doing so many things so fast, it is getting harder and harder to keep up with them.

[LittleClarkie]

46. All or nothing

They say without the Pat Act we will be less safe on Jan 1. Without an extension, they will make sure of that.

[Junkdrawer]

47. And who would question the Presidential Authority to invent laws...

Signs are bad.

The 'terra attack' danger for then next few months will be high...

[meisje]

49. Hate to crumple your tin foil, but it has been extended for 6 months