The Seminal Confederate Flag Poll

[DemocratSinceBirth]

Take Dean out of the equation....I am certain he wasn't defending the flag or what it represents but what disappoints me is that some folks here are defending those who fly it....

As someone who has lived in Florida since 1970 when I was a little boy I am confident that most folks who fly that flag know exactly what they are doing...... They know it offends alot of folks in this country expecially African American folks but they keep flying it....

They say it's about "heritage not hate".... A right wing talking point if I ever heard one...A "heritage" that slavery was a large part of.... What was so distinctive about antebellum America besides slavery....

Here's the poll....

[JohnKleeb]

1. I dont understand it honest to god so I voted for your 4th opition

I hate the rebel flag honestly, I truly do, it represents to me, slavery and opression. I am a southerner well lol I am a Yankee at heart damnit. I don't understand the rebel flag honestly.

[pinkpops]

2. (other)

they are simply ignorant and don't think about much of anything.

[Catch22Dem]

4. Other

Agree completely

[DemocratSinceBirth]

3. Other Has Four Votes/Please Explain..... I'll Add More Options...

Regardless, when you fly that flag you are pissing African American folks off....

[JohnKleeb]

5. Yes I agree with that setiment entirely

[RapidCreek]

28. You'r e pissing off caucasion American folks as well

In fact I'd hazard to say you are pissing off Americans in general as the flag is Anti-American. If it were up to me anyone flying the un-patriotic piece of shit would be having their ass sent to Gitmo, right quick. Perhaps time in a cage draped with their beloved cultural icon, sans any dignity or human rights, might give them time to consider the implications of the culture they so fondly seek to identify with, in a holistic fashion.

RC

[killbotfactory]

6. Some are racist, some aren't

I think it's a symbol of racist traitors, some people don't.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

8. I Think Alot Of The Folks Who Fought Under The Banner Of The

Confederacy one hundred forty years ago were misguided....


But anybody who glorifies that effort in 2003 is a racist....

[mlawson]

31. I agree: no one group is ALL anything.

I hate that fucking flag, and would like to see all of them floating downstream in a sewer. But I DO know people who revere the damn thing, and I KNOW they are not racist; they have advanced degrees and are not 'trailer park' types by any means. So what is up with that?? I believe it's a reaction to those of us who hate the flag, and would like to see them all destroyed; the more we insist that the flag is a symbol of evil (which I believe it to be), the more SOME of its wavers will revere it.

But I agree that *most* flag wavers are racist to some degree. But not ALL of them.

[xultar]

7. They are trying to hold on to a dying culture

The are afraid of change. A small minority do use the flag to intimidate African Americans...but the vast majority are just simply white-knuckling it to the bitter end. I actually feel quite sorry for them.

[FDRrocks]

9. Thier heritage...

involves a treasonous attempt to cede from the union and violent oppression of minorities. Fuck the confederate flag.

[IndianaGreen]

10. I don't why someone would fly the flag of a bunch of losers!

But I suspect that different people have difference reasons for flying the Confederate flag.

There is a story I saw on a PBS show a while back about soldiers traveling in trains across Florida on their way to invade Cuba in the Spanish American War. Throngs of people came to wave at the troops as the trains went past towns and train stations. One little boy realizing that the soldiers were wearing blue ask his grandfather why they were cheering the Yankees. The grandfather replied that they were all Americans.

[billbuckhead]

11. They fly it because they hate America.

:puke:

[JVS]

12. People flying that flag should be shot!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. I Wouldn't Go That Far But The Votes For Option One Scare Me

I'd like to know what part of antebellum America Confederate flag devotees find so compelling....

[Forkboy]

23. lol

That's a mighty progressive outlook :eyes:

[mandyky]

14. Other

Not all people who fly the CF are racist. Some are proud of their southern herirage, some to be rebelious, some to send threatening racist messages, and yes some even to offend people who take offense.

I do not believe the flag should be flown on public/government property, but private usage is a matter of free speech.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

15. I Don't Buy The Heritage Argument....

Here's Why...

The Swastika was to the Third Reich what the Confederate flag was to the antebellum South.... Now I will admit you can make a decent argument that the Third Reich was more odious but what is admirable about the antebellum South...

[DoNotRefill]

35. Was Sid Vicious a Nazi?

He wore Nazi symbols. He did it to piss people off. It was a giant "F*** you!" to people, intended only to shock them. He wasn't particularly anti-semetic or anti-communist, at least according to what I've read.

I think you need to look at each individual case. If you did, I think you'd find ALL of the reasons represented. Some people wear it to piss people off, some people wear it because they're racist, some people are actually genuinely into the "heritage, not hate" bit, and some people wear it for other reasons. There's no one all-encompasing "right answer" for all situations.

[Maddy McCall]

18. Yeah...proud of their southern heritage of being racists...

I live in Mississippi. The rubes I know who fly the flag or have the stickers on their vehicles are racists, pure and simple. Half of them don't know diddly about the Civil War and the true causes of it. They are mad that blacks are in their schools, that blacks can vote, that blacks are "welfare queens" who their taxes support, that black men are all criminals, on and on ad nauseum.

They don't do it to celebrate southern heritage--most of them know nothing about southern history. IF they did, they would be pissed off that their share cropping great great grandaddies were used by the south's big planters and ruling elite. But their ignorance shields them.

I see this one on the front of trucks all the time:



What I want to know is why they can't forget something they know so little about.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. What Was The Other One?

If your heart isn't in Dixie get your ass out....

[Maddy McCall]

26. Or "You wear your X, I'll wear mine"

With Malcolm X on the front and a Confederate Flag X on the back.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

30. That's A Cute One Too....

Or a picture of Klansmen with the caption "The Original Boyz In The Hood"....


I live in Cen FL .... I hardly see this stuff..... It's rare cuz most folks even if they harbor these thoughts don't want to be seen as total yahoos....

[Maddy McCall]

33. Here's another...

In response to "It's a black thing, you wouldn't understand" Malcolm X tee shirts, white boys started wearing shirts that said, "It's a white thing, and you used to pick it." Had a boll of cotton on the back.

Pretty disturbing, huh?

[Atlant]

16. I voted for "Counterculture Rebels", BUT...

I voted for "Counterculture Rebels", BUT I wouldn't have phrased it
that way; I probably would have phrased it "F****** A******s".

At least that's what it seems to be among Confederate flag fliers
here in the Northeast; I can't speak for other parts of the country.
It's a good bet that a pickup truck with that flag on it WILL
cut you off or run the red light.

Atlant

[snoochie]

17. I think they're ignorant and callous.

It's sad that people fly that flag, knowing it is hurtful to others, but I think some are just that stupid, that they think it is being a 'rebel' or being proud of their 'heritage'.

edited to remove insulting verbage

[frustrated_lefty]

20. Your first option proposes

"they are showing reverence for their culture."

I'm from the south, I'm not sure I would ever wave a confederate flag...

Part of me thinks it isn't about revering your culture, it's about recognizing your history. I am, in part, proud to come from the south. Good things came from the South, they continue to do so.

The American south is not entirely about racism and slavery. We have to grow beyond our limitations. This is a process the American South and East Germany are both undergoing.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. I'm From The South Too And Proud Of It

but I don't revere the Confederate flag or the antebellum South which it represents....

[frustrated_lefty]

22. Again, I don't think reverence

is the right word.

Yes, there are assholes who spout the rebel yell, who revere the "good ole days."

I think southerners need to accept responsibility. Part of accepting responsibility is accepting your history, the good and the bad. I think that's the best way to accomplish something productive. Anyway, those are my thoughts.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

24. As An American I Accept

responsibility for slavery and it's legacy even though my ancestors didn't arrive here until the the early twentieth century...

[frustrated_lefty]

29. That's admirable

From what you say, it's not in any way your fault. But that's how you fix things, somebody accepts responsibility and tries to fix it. Good for you and more power to you.

[Vis Numar]

25. WOW

I can't believe a majority of the Democrats here think white folks actaully are racist who put this sticker on their trucks, cars... Really? Come on people, wake up! 95% of these folks are rebels, not racists!

[RapidCreek]

32. Why not fly an American flag?

It represents rebellion against feudal monarchy. Flying the traitors flag is hardly rebellious....it's a tangible representation of those who desire to return to that feudal monarchy, which truly patriotic Americans fought to escape.

RC

[KG]

27. if someone flys one outside their trailer or sticks one on thier

mud boggin' pick-up to show the world what morons they are, - well that's free speech, i guess.

but it's long past time to get the battle flag off state flags and gov't property, a practice that was exhumed during the 60's in response to the push for integration in the south.

edit for clarity

[ForestsBeatBushes]

34. Excellent point.

While reading through this thread, I had forgotten about the fact that the confederate flag was in fact not fashionable at all until African-Americans began to make strides in the 1960's; until blacks and whites marched together for more. All of a sudden, and continuing through the present, the confederate flag has been re-packaged with all this 'heritage' crap.

Frankly, KG, I'd like to see a good lawyer argue that rather than free speech, it is akin to yelling fire in a crowded theater, thus disallowed as an exception to the first amendment.

[Woodstock]

36. My thought has always been

this flag is SO offensive to one group of people who were so SEVERELY wronged during the time this flag represented the region, that this outweighs the others just wanting to see it flying there for reasons of history

the people who want to fly this over state buildings should be compassionate and come up with another symbol of their heritage