Independents...people who don't know what they stand for? Discuss.....

[Sperk]

n/t

[LastKnight]

1. some... not others...

i used to consider myself an independent (but leaning left) before bushco started the oil crusade. no canadate or party really fit in with what i was looking for, i was without affiliation simply because what either side had to say wasnt much an issue to me. plenty of people like that.

then the war started...
i was pushed farther tward the left every day.

then may 1st mission accomplished bs...
hell by this time im about as far left you can go without pushing for anarchy. (no offense to anarchists out there)

-LK

[Sperk]

2. How does one vote for "the man" when all repugs seem to vote

together?

[OneBlueSky]

3. probably a lot of people . . .

who don't see a whole lot of difference between the parties on the issues that really matter . . . in some respects, I agree with them (e.g. issues like corporate governance, corporate welfare, US imperialism, etc.) . . .

[Blue_Chill]

4. Could they be people that agree with parts of both parties?

just a thought.

[paulsbc]

5. that is me

and i'm actually moving more centrist than left lately, especially w.r.t. Iraq and the amount of reading and comparisons in history that I've been doing..

What attracted me to the Democratic party has been fairly deflated in the debate watching, reading this board, and discussing politics more intensly with my friends, family and neighbors. While most here continue on the trend line against the administration, Iraq, and how to handle the country with support of Dean and Clark, I find myself moving more towards Lieberman's views and (gasp) some within the current administration...

[Silverhair]

24. Exactly correct.

[sujan]

6. you mean the centrists/moderates?

[Room101]

7. I'm an INDY

"Independents...people who don't know what they stand for? Discuss....."

How annoying and Condescending

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[paulsbc]

9. what a stupid post

to think you waited to post that 1 post and this is what you come up with? how sophomoric.....

[nccamel]

10. cute!

How can you not know what the parties stand for? How can you not know the core principles of each party and correlate them to your own?

I get it!

Add a little Leiberman, add a little Bush, a smidgen of Pope John II, and a pinch of Hunter S Thompson.

God I wish it were that easy

[Room101]

26. paulsbc - look in the mirror

If the original poster would have posed the question why are independents independents?
I would have been more receptive to answer instead us Indy’s get a condescending they don’t know what they believe in. To the contrary we Independents have strong believes and I would argue we are more clear about what we want as opposed to people who conform to two in the box special interest lying parties that don’t have their best interest integrated in their policies. We have had a two party installed dictatorship installed on our fading Republic eternally holding up the carrot on the stick

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. Voting Democratic over and over again and expecting them to really represent you, I wonder who knows what they believe in? If you need a case study of the Democrats look at the last three years the Donkeys have been carrying the elephants on their backs.

I don’t vote for someone solely because they have a party label next to their name, I evaluate each candidate in each election to determine who has my best interest integrated in their policies. I know exactly what I want and what I believe in.

Many Democrats and republicans I know vote on partly lines, and in many occasions I ask them why they voted for a particular candidate they answer because I’m a fill in the blank party. These people are conditioned to vote simply on party affiliation, completely bypassing studying and investigating the candidate and issues. Us Indy guys look at each candidate and issue through a cynical investigative lens. While alot of party liners look at the canidates and issues through a faith based lens.

[ComerPerro]

11. You make a good point

One that I have felt since, well, as long as I have been interested in politics.

I really liked the "high school all over again" line. I completely agree, that is how many people vote.

Actually, I feel a lot of moderates voted for Bush because they felt he was a "badass" or that he was someone they they weren't intellectually threatened by. I have actually talked to people who have said this.

Thank you for posting something constructive.

[sandnsea]

13. I agree

Fence sitters and people who don't want to be part of the 'unpopular' crowd. Independents annoy the goddamn hell out of me.

"However, it seems to me, if you pay any attention to the politics of this country for at least a month - how can you be "independent"?"

Exactly. Pick a side already!!

Now off with you, I picked my side and you're not in it!

[Room101]

27. sandnsea - are you being Sarcastic ?

Fence sitters How about independent freethinkers who decide elections your so cute you are blissfully convinced the Democrats represent you. Silly rabbit faith based politics does much to sooth the heart of emotions and passions leaving reason and logic in the unattended dust. Have you been paying attention lately forget about three parties hell I want a second party.


Pick a side already!! Why so the democrats can act like they deserve my vote as opposed to wanting my vote?

[FDRrocks]

14. Why are you afraid of Hillary?

[economic justice]

12. Independents

I think many of the so-called "independents" that I talk to are some of the most thinking people I know. They know exactly how they feel but they simply cannot be pigeon holed. There are people who don't want to be Democrats because of what many see as all the silly politically correct BS that cause people to roll their eyes with every pander (in an effort to be "inclusive" and "non-offensive); yet the same people don't want to be Republicans because they work for a living and can't support the consolidation of wealth and power into the hands of fewer and fewer people.

What I just described is the typical "independent" voter that will vote by weighing the emphasis given by X and Y candidates to whatever issues that most affect them at the time. It's not a matter of not knowing what they believe, it's a matter of two parties who both have "walk in lockstep" thinkers (tell me what they think on one issue and I'll tell you what they think on most every other issue). To be "independent" is to be free of shackled thinking....and voting.

[SahaleArm]

15. Libertarians.

Many Libertarians lean toward social freedoms and free markets. Democrats are seen as the social freedom party and Republicans are perceived as the economic freedom party.

[FDRrocks]

16. Libertarians seem to...

stand on no principals anymore, at least the right-leaning ones. The Democrats not only allow for social freedom but also spend less government money than the Republicans.

[SahaleArm]

17. Principles versus reality.

Neo-Con Republicans are hyper-spending, tax-cutting idiots. Since FDR the Democratic party has been associated with willingness to raise taxes for social programs. You're confusing balanced budget with less spending. Spending caps aren't a core Democratic value if they interfere with social welfare, hence tax increases. Then again the Republicans were once the party of Lincoln.

[mmonk]

21. libertarians

are people who generally believe in practically little government. Isolationism, no regulation, anything goes. Its pretty extreme. Seems they only believe in functions of government to be to provide police, military, and a currency.

[jonnyblitz]

18. As soon as the DEMs actually become a left wing party.

I will become a DEM. Otherwise I will remain an Independent no matter how many insults you DEMBOTS hurl at me! :) If I WEREN'T principled in my views it would be no problem for me to be a DEM but I don't have any intention of joining a party that is so far to the right of me.

[izzie]

19. Now that was good.

I always voted as my family did, then one day I said what do I really believe and who is near to it. I found I was a liberal and not how Gore run but a real Liberal. So how to handle that. Nafta ? no but there was congress voting for it.As I went through it all I came up with Dem were as near as I could vote for what I liked in the over all picture and vote Green in local stuff. In a society like ours we need groups to pay for the interstructure, as this society could not run with out this interstructure, so need taxes, to buy them. It is not a cowboys world where every one makes it on their own and any one that thinks they did it on their own is nuts. Go down the list and see how the group has only made these things open to all. You could start as you get out of bed. Lights, roads, schools, college, land( needed army to take it from the Indians) water lines, tel. lines and the list goes on and on. I do not wish to have to fight a corp that will skin me alive to take every cent I have to use these things, after my tax money put them in, in the first place. If the Christian right do not wish to do things fine but do not make laws do I cant, on top of that. So we do not watch what is going on and vote or who we like even if it does hurt us at times.Let the Freepa stay on, he is good to getting you thinking.

[Samaka 3ajiba]

20. Independents and third parties

If independents believed fully in the platform of either major party, they wouldn't be independent now, would they?

I would also add that members of other political parties and ideologies (Green, Libertarians, Reform, Natural Law...etc.) get lumped into the "independent" category partially due to the bias of our two-party system which tends to regard any party outside of the GOP and DNC as an "illigitimate" semi-present nuisance.

Truth is though, the members of the third parties are only "independent" when they are allowed to be framed as such within the context of a polarized political system. In any other country with a partliamentary or multi-party system, they wouldn't be "fence sitters", but simply Libertarians, Greens, Reform Party members...etc.

[mmonk]

22. Independent

is supposed to mean they do not follow ideology of the parties. That in itself is a stance of sorts.

[REP]

23. I'm An Independent Who Votes Dem

Why am I an Independent? Because there is no party that really addresses my stance (which would be Fabian, if fucking 'New" Labour hadn't hijacked it). The Democrats reperesent me better than any other major party, so they get my vote, even though I am more to left socially and more to whatever direction ending corporate welfare and other corporate entitlements is.

Another reason I'm a registered Independent is because in my state, Independents are allowed to vote in state primaries, which I do - for the sorriest loser the Repubs run, and then I vote against him (it's always a "him") in the general election. If the Repub is running unopposed in a primary, then I vote in the Democratic one for the best candidate. There has been too much at stake in the last few elections to dare vote other than straight Demcratic ticket. The Dems aren't perfect, but they're a million times better than what the Repubs have to offer.

[The Backlash Cometh]

25. You all need to get over this belief that Independents are not

politically saavy. They are very saavy. They just lack your faith in a party member's ability to keep his or her promises. So they judge each election, case by case.

[PVnRT]

28. Maybe some

Others I think just want to hear what the candidates have to say before the vote.

Most independents, though, probably just call themselves that because they don't want to be affiliated with one party or the other, when, in fact, they will vote mostly R or D almost all the time.

[election_2004]

29. I find this entire thread insulting...

I've voted for both left-of-center and right-of-center candidates based on how they publicly conduct themselves, what issues they run on, and the drawbacks of their main opponent.

Sometimes I've regretted it, and sometimes I haven't.

I have also voted for third-party candidates when I felt the two major-party candidates were incompetant.

Anyone who says Independents "don't stand for anything" are probably partisan loyalists who only stand for what their bureaucratic party machines tell them to.

Making black-and-white statements to voters like "pick a side" or "you're with us or against us" are hardly conducive to the type of free democracy (or at least, the concept of one) that you partisan Democrats claim to support.