I saw a book in Borders today that enraged me.

[hippiegranny]

Right as I walked in the door, right at eye level. The title is "Losing Bin Laden: How Bill Clinton's Failures Unleashed Global Terrorism" by Richard Miniter.

This is what we are up against. Blatant lies, right in your face. I was so pissed, I turned around and left the store without purchasing what I went in there for. Now that I have calmed down (ever so slightly) I will call the store and let them know why they lost my business.

[liberalcapitalist]

1. woah, woah, woah

You're going to boycott a store becuase they carry conservative propaganda? The store cannot be expected to only stock leftist books, or even to only stock books that are remotely truthful. If you boycott the store, you're behaving like a conservative.

http://www.godhatesbush.com

[Skittles]

4. the book is trash

but they'll promote it in a way that legitmate books do not receive. It IS blatant propaganda.

[hippiegranny]

10. no, i'm going to boycott them

because of their extremely bad judgement in product placement. that kind of inflammatory horseshit does not belong where it is the first thing you see when you enter the store. that is what i am protesting.

i will defend to the death any retail outlet's right to carry whatever book they want to, that is what free speech is all about, even if it is not true speech. but politics and religion are now very volatile subjects, and the more polarized our nation becomes, the more offensive this kind of in your face taking of sides becomes.

you're right if you assume i wouldn't have been angry enough to leave had it been al franken's book, but i bet somebody else would have. that is my point.

[liberalcapitalist]

13. okay, I misunderstood

The volatility wouldn't concern me, but the unbalance would (in terms of the placement).

[JanMichael]

40. No. Boycott it because there's a strike that started recently.

Here's the DU thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=106&topic_id=3781

Here's the union site: http://www.bordersunion.org/

They have my support.

On a side note I worked at a Borders in Tampa several years ago, they were nutty union busters (Ther was zero real activity) there even though we're in a "Right To Work" state...

[Catherine Vincent]

2. Doesn't it just irk you that these right wing pricks get away with this?

There are more too. I'm waiting on left wing writers to do the same and put the blame where it belongs in the first place...and that is on GEORGE W. BUSH.

[wryter2000]

8. It is frustrating

They lie and lie and get away with it. However, there are a bunch of great books that tell the truth now, and lots of people are reading them. Ivins, Hightower, Franken, Krugman.

[donotpassgo]

23. No 9/11 was blowback pure and simple...

for Poppy Fuckwad and Diaper Dandy Reagan's lovely Afghanistan policy in the eighties. It was the unintended consequence of winning the cold war and not having insight into what the world would be like AFTER Communism fell.

Look at the Al Qaeda tapes when they were training in Afghanistan. Look how precise and effecient they are. All that CIA training they recieved made the quite the killers.

[RapidCreek]

52. Careful there

"The Afghanistan Policy" you speak of was originated by Zbigniew Brzezinski in the form of CIA intervention and signed off on by President James Carter. You will find information on it here and here.

9/11 is indeed blowback...but the source of that blowback was hardly originated or caused exclusively by neocons.


RC

[LoneStarLiberal]

3. When I Finish My Book...

When I finish my follow up book, "Creating Bin Laden: How Ronald Reagan's Foreign Policy Enabled Jihad Inc." then all will be back in the balance.

Republicans just need to learn that you can't blame Democrats for not following them around and cleaning up all their goddamned messes, although they sure would like it that way.

[Mz Pip]

5. Why would anyone pay money

for that book when you can get it for a buck from the conservative book clubs. These folks buy up these books in bulk to make it look like everyone is reading them.

THey probably mostly end up in landfill.

MzPip
:dem:

[Langis]

6. I have seen this guy on CNN/MSNBC/FAUX

And he is a moron. For example he says that in 1998 I think it was that someone(he doesn’t know who) called the Whitehouse(again he doesn't know who was called at the white house) and the unknown person #1 offered Bin Laden to Clinton.

That sure is irrefutable evidence that Clinton lost Bin Laden.

[The Magistrate]

12. Indeed, Sir

The reference is to a fairly well-known occurance towards the end of Bin Ladin's influence in the Sudan. There was nothing too solid about it.

The fellow is a very low-grade operative, with little by way of either knowledge or skill.

[rumguy]

7. It's not the fact that they carry that book that's enraging...

It's the fact that they shove it right in everyone's face as they walk in the door. No balance...just propaganda. Everyone that comes in will see that garbage...and some will begin to believe it...

That book was out months ago and has largely been forgotten by everyone save the freeper types. It's factual assertions have been proven false...the guy who wrote it just sold out for the money...so there's no reason (save for propaganda purposes) to have it at eye level when one comes in the store...no logical reason...

Side-note - do publishers pay to get books displayed there, at those central locations right past the door in a bookstore? If so, then it proves it's nothing but paid for right-wing garbage...

[wryter2000]

9. That can happen

Publishers do pay for some things related to shelf placement. If you see one of those cardboard dumps with about 12 cubicles to hold books in them, that's paid for by the publisher.

Was this a chain store or an independent?

[hippiegranny]

15. chain store

borders. i usually shop independents but i knew they had a french verb book i needed for school, so i was there to buy it.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[rumguy]

16. No one is talking about banning books...

That's a repuke specialty...

[Wickerman]

14. Hey, Its Boycott Borders week

Post yesterday by bordersunion that while they are seeking a contract with Borders we should try to avoid Borders, Amazon, etc.

http://www.bordersunion.org/
More than 9 months of bargaining have yielded no contract

Thursday, October 9, 2003

BY CATHERINE O'DONNELL
News Business Reporter
Ann Arbor News

Unionized employees of the Borders Books & Music store in downtown Ann Arbor have voted to authorize a strike.

If the union representing workers at the East Liberty Street store sanctions the strike, it could occur in the next several weeks. After more than nine months of negotiations, Borders management and workers have failed to reach a contract agreement. The union was voted in last December, and represents about half of the store's 60 employees.

[elfin]

17. This calls for Guerilla Book Replacement

Put Franken's book on top of the pile - or Madeleine's or Hillary's or Corn's - you get the idea

[SayitAintSo]

21. See I KNEW there were more of us ....

I like that "Guerilla Book Replacement" ....

[Carolina]

49. I know of armies of guerilla warriors

who misplace, bury, and otherwise reorganize the rightwing propaganda pollution in bookstores all the time. Reagan books go to the HEALTH/Alzheimer's section or better still to the TRUE CRIME area. Bush books go to HORROR. Books that support or justify the Iraq war go to FICTION. It's great therapy, and creative and fun, too.

[theemu]

53. Yeah, it makes us sound like...

we're guerillas, fighting a war against big-money publishers by putting up books by other big-money publishers, sometimes even the same ones!

I was too busy being revolutionary to find my Che t-shirt.

[NewJeffCT]

51. good idea...

never thought of that - but, my local Barnes & Noble had smiling Bill O'Reilly out front, and no Al Franken...

[Noordam]

18. Go back to Borders they are NOT like Barnes and Noble

I went into B&N to buy Hillary's book when it was new. While they had every right winger wack job book as you walked in, no Hillary. I ask and they had ONE copy in the back of the store in Biography section. Not up front in the NEW Bio section but in the OLD Bio section.

Walked into Borders and they had it as you walked into the store.

Also, I hear that stores have a Left/Right section :evilgrin:

[ZenLefty]

22. There's a reason B&N didn't have it

Speaking for one of the big stores in Denver, the manager there tells me they sell Left books like hot-cakes, and the right-books clutter the shelves until they send them back to the publisher unsold. He likes to keep both in stock, so no one can accuse him of bias, but it's more difficult to stock Al Franken and Hillary because they sell PDQ.

[Noordam]

19. PS that book is no longer on the top 35 at NYTs

:evilgrin:

[SayitAintSo]

20. Engage in a little passive resistance ... Book Burying !!!!

Me and my dem friend will take tripe like that and do one or all of the following: 1) move it to the fiction section, 2) cover it with a good liberal author (Begala, Ivins, Franken ....) 3) turn it upside down (like a crucifix :)). Oh we have a good ol' time! Never destroying anything mind you... only performing this maybe 'not so subtle' form of protest against the lies and tripe that trash the hallowed isles of politics and popular culture at our favorite book haunts. And you know what ? There are good many of us out there doing this too ... We've seen the evidence ! Pretty soon it may even be on the evening news ! "Liberals book burying wreaks havoc in local book stores... developing....."

I know that I am incurring the wrath of a good many librarian types, but heh ... I'm willing to pay the price.

[rumguy]

24. Bin Laden remains lost...

of course the administration and their propagandists have to try and blame Clinton for it.

[Logansquare]

25. Get a sticker that says "Penis"

And stick it over the word "Failures." That's what they're obsessed with anyway.

[Grins]

26. Get on Amazon...

and WRITE A REVIEW!!!!

Walking out the door won't help, and it had nothing to do with the bookstore, so don't get mad at them. But, if you can write a review on Amazon you may be able to do some damage. If you do, take them on for distorting history and use FACTS - the other side doesn't so you have a good shot.

Another poster here printed a review of Krugman's books on Amazon by one from "the dark side". You had to laugh looking reading it because of all the misspellings, lousy punctuation, and blithering nonsense he spewed.

Come to think of it, that may not be a bad tactic! Write a review praising this book for its accuracy and give bogus crap to justify it. Use stuff the average (God help us) reader will quickly know is false. Use so much crap the sane will figure the book is written for people like "you" and run like hell from the store just like you did! (It’s really low, but remember how angry you were.)

[leftyandproud]

27. over-reaction..

dude, its a free country...People can write whatever they want. Personally, I enjoy reading the stuff by our enemies...Sometimes they have good points...At other times, its utter nonsense, but I don't judge people until I actually see what they have written. I respect all viewpoints that are well formed and backed up with facts and strong justification...In addition to three left wing magazines, I also subscribe to the weekly standard and national review...just to keep tabs on the right.

"Those who don't know the arguments of their enemy can never fully understand their own."

[rumguy]

30. Are you Alan Colmes?

This isn't about respecting another's opinions...it's about a third rate freeper handjob of a book being placed in such a prominent position. This book has been out a long time, it's only a fav. amongst the right wing fringe... many coming into the store will see it displayed prominently and could assume either that it's a bestseller with actual merit - which is absolutely false. It's aleady a forgotten book, the only reason to put it there is for propaganda pure and simple.

[CBHagman]

28. You can at least demand that they have balanced displays

And if you would, shop at the independent stores. I'll be overjoyed if you do. :loveya:

Seriously, if they are only stocking one type of book, then ask for more variety. If it's not your regular store, you could at least send them a polite note or postcard about why you are withholding your hard-earned cash.

[ShaneGR]

29. I always grab some Liberal books and cover up the right-wing crap

Annthax was a big target of mine a couple of months ago. I made it a habit to cover up the books with Hillary ones.

Yes, childish... but effective.

[dobak]

31. Whoa!! Settle down....

I work at a Borders and I can guarantee that alot of the company's employees are liberal.

We get all sort of right-wing wacko books in and many of them end up on the new release tables which are located near the front of our store.

Maybe there is a conservative at that store who decided to put the book right there. Maybe it was an apolitical employee who just put the book there without even paying attention to the title.

The liberal books get just as much front of store placement as the right-wing ones do. They probably get more because the staff is likely liberal and gives the liberal books a little more favorable placement.

Either way, I think you handled the situation very poorly and calling the store is not going to make anything better.

relax

[dutchdemocrat]

35. Read Julia's Story below

Relax? Here's how I found out about "Julia and Borders"

Like SGT. ROBERT FERRIOL
Former Marine Corps Intelligence Analyst

Spoke out against Bush

FIRED

http://www.theitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20031107/OPED01/111070006

[dobak]

37. I've heard all about it...

I've heard it from customers

I've heard it from employees

I've heard it from corporate

----

I think it is nothing but a typical corporate response to an incident that could result in lost business.

That doesn't mean that I think it was the right move. I just don't think it is anything overly alarming either.

----

At the risk of sounding like a company man, I think that Borders is one of the more "liberal friendly" companies around.

- They offer benefits to same sex partners
- They offer $$$ to to same sex partners to help with adoption
- They were named one of the top companies for women to work at
- They have a fund to help employees or employee's familys with financial stress (medical, emotional, etc...)

While they are opposed to unions (my store is 1 of 2 stores that are organized). Almost all large retail companies are opposed to unions, so you can hardly blame just Borders.

[dutchdemocrat]

32. Boycott the store for this if anything

And yet another unknown story is of a struggling solo artist by the name of Julia Rose who tours the northeast playing her guitar and singing in bookstores.

She made a lone comment regarding President Bush and is now banned from playing in every Borders bookstore in the northeast. And what was her terrible comment that led to her banishment? Nothing more than the President has "chicken legs."

[dutchdemocrat]

33. She does not have KFC legs that's for sure!

Entertainer banned after Bush remark

Singer Julia Rose, displaying her abs, says she was banned from Borders for saying President Bush needs to pump some iron.


CLICK FOR PIC
http://www.fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2003/072003/07252003/1048083/rosepic250


Are Bush's legs chicken? Is our skin thin?

By MICHAEL ZITZ


Date published: 7/25/2003

Apparently, it's become un-American--or at least highly controversial--for a woman to publicly say that the president of the United States' body is less than perfect.

A Baltimore acoustic artist has been banned from playing the Fredericksburg Borders Books & Music store--apparently because she made fun of President Bush's legs between songs in her show Friday night at Central Park.

Julia Rose, a singer-songwriter and a fitness advocate who often shows audiences her six-pack abs, told a Fredericksburg Borders audience Friday: "George Bush has chicken legs. He needs to pump some iron."

"I never bashed Bush as president. I merely said his lower body needs some serious definition," Rose explained later.

She said most of the audience laughed. But a few were offended and reportedly contacted Amy Korsun, area marketing manager for Borders Books & Music, to complain about Rose making "political" comments.

SNIP



http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2003/072003/07252003/1048083

[dobak]

34. I agree that it was handled poorly...

But, if any business receives complaints about a performer, it is much easier to solve the problem by asking her not to perform there anymore.

They should of just talked to her and mentioned that they received complaints and asked her to refrain from political comments.

Obviously it was some reactionary conservatives who complained, but almost all large companies would have done the same thing.

[dutchdemocrat]

36. Large companies do the Same?

The woman is an artist.

Playing original songs.

Bad decision - Not on the companies' part for dissing her but on you for defending Borders with such a lame argument.

[dobak]

38. I think it was a poor response...

They should have just discussed it with her and let her continue playing there.

If you want to blame someone, blame the assholes who complained about such a minor comment.

[dutchdemocrat]

39. No - blame the Area Marketing Manager

Amy Korsun, area marketing manager for Borders Books & Music opted to ban her in what is turning out to be a PR meltdown for Borders.

And it's all over the net and print media picked it up. Good for her. I hope her career moves because of this blatant censorship (in a bookstore of all places).

[dobak]

41. ok, she was at fault also...

It is not all over the media though...

The story made a small splash in some local media and some small press way back in July and died out quickly.

Stupid move by Borders, but no reason to boycott them.

Write a letter or send an to corporate and tell them you thought it was a bad move.

Boycotting them will only hurt the low paid workers.

[dutchdemocrat]

46. "Julia Rose" "Borders"

Google

"Julia Rose" "Borders"

228 sites. No not all over the net but a little more play than you think.

People should have the right to ban any business they deem contrary to their ethics or beliefs. I don't wear Nike for instance because of the "sweatshops" in the East.

I also go to one bike store instead of another on the main street near my house because one owner made some snide comments about me being American (I am not) and I don't prefer to do business with people who don't like others based on their nationality. He and I may be on the same political end of the spectrum, but I will never know.

It's a fundamental right to choose where you want to spend your money and because Borders exploits their workers with low, unfair wages is actually more of a reason I would boycott them if there was one nearby.

Sorry, But that's how I feel. I really do.

[devinsgram]

42. They lost my business along time ago,

I now go to Amazon.

[dobak]

43. and?

How is Amazon any different from Borders?

They are both big corporations?

[Carolina]

50. not much

BUT if you access Amazon via a portal from Bartcop, for example, Bart gets a few coins tossed his way. I think some other progressive sites have the same deal with Amazon. So that is a difference.

[Deja Q]

44. Anybody else think we haven't been in a "cold civil war",12 years running?

Anybody else think we haven't been in a "cold civil war", with the pukes firing against the Dems for over 12 years running?

Holy shit, that is one of the bigger lies the repukes have ever pulled - and it's out of desperation as well. If people bothered to think, they'd see how much of a menace Bush is. And the Dem who replaces Bush had better keep his head up for any possible attack because Bush HAS created new terrorists worldwide. We've just been lucky they haven't found a way to unleash their justified fury. Yet. (And we're ALL guilty if WE THE PEOPLE don't stop that idiot* here and now. That's how the rest of the world will see us and we, the people, need to take responsibility too. Can we wait until 2004? You tell me, especially when mass killings of American citizens begin because of Bush's mishandling of the peoples of the world. Gee, did that already happen? (batting eyelashes innocently )

Bush is unleashing global terrorism here and now and heaven help the people when the next attack comes and they then believe all the "Clinton made it possible" bullshit. Anything about Clinton is nothing more than castrated conjecture.

I was at Borders tonight and I didn't see it anywhere. I saw their NY Best Seller list, and new DVD titles, but not that atrocity.

[dobak]

48. I am not suprised you didn't see it...

It is an old book that sold very poorly...

I am guessing that the copy that so offended the thread's author was the result of a conservative employee or a lazy staff that does not change their books around very often.

[Padraig18]

45. Shameless plug

Precisely why you should support your local independent book store/news dealer, like me. I won't carry such trash. :hi:

[dutchdemocrat]

47. Yes

Finally.

Thank you.

[Alex146]

54. Cover it with a copy of Lies or Bushwacked.

lol