How will the loss of key Kerry campaign staff affect his support

[KaraokeKarlton]

outside of DU? Clearly most of those who support him who post here are so deeply involved in the race that most won't jump ship over this. At the same time, I'm guessing it might look bad to the average voter who is sort of watching but not really following as closely as those here. I tend to think this really hurts him.

For the record, I support Dean and am no fan of Kerry. I do think this is a valid question and it's not inteded to be inciteful. Obvioulsly I'm hoping that some who were looking at Kerry will look at Dean instead, but that's a given.

So, do you think this hurts him, to what extent and how do you think he's going to deal with the upheavel within' his campaign at such a late point in the campaign?

[blm]

1. It didn't hurt Gore when he did it, when Dean did it, when Clark did it.

Clearer skies ahead.

[pruner]

6. none of them changed hi-level staff at this point in the race

n/t

[blm]

9. Gore did. Clark did it last month.

And Kerry is in 2nd place in NH withOUT tefloncoated media attention. Dean has had so much media focus for so long, he should have had this race sewn up by now. If he had a real resume and a record to back up his populist rhetoric, he would have.

[flpoljunkie]

11. Hell, Ronald Reagan shook up his campaign as voters went to polls in NH!

Kerry's campaign chairman, Jeanne Shaheen, and others in the campaign felt that the campaign structure was too unwieldy," like an ocean liner", and that his campaign is being streamlined so that it could "turn on a dime."--according to Ron Brownstein of Los Angeles Times.

I think that replacing DLC types Jim Jordan and his male cohorts with Mary Beth Cahill, chief of staff for Ted Kennedy, and Stephanie Cutter, Communications Director for the Democratic Convention, will accomplish this goal and shake up his campaign at the same time.

Savvy liberal women running the Kerry campaign--sounds like a plan to me!

The campaign is moving forward. Kerry's new campaign ad, "Carrier", is up and running in Iowa and New Hampshire and is getting attention already--It led off "Inside Politics" today and was shown and discussed in a later segment. It also got Tweety's attention on "Hardball" tonight.

[KaraokeKarlton]

14. Don't you think most people won't realize the meaning behind all that

though? That's sort of the point I was making. To just a semi-curious voter reading the paper, it sort of looks like Kerry is difficult to work with. This is just a guess as to how these kinds of potential voters might be looking at this. Personally, I think Kerry's campaign has been seriously screwed up throughout and that there were too many Chiefs and not enough Indidans. I still don't like him, and I'm not going to pretend that I do because that would be dishonest. At the same time, I'm not saying this stuff just to irk Kerry supporters either...which I admittedly sometimes do when I get fed up with the same kind of treatment.

I guess I'm thinking in the short term it might hurt him and that if the new staffers don't pull things together quickly and concisely he's not likely to be able to get on any kind of solid footing.

[welshTerrier2]

2. too soon to tell ...

the problem with the question you've raised is that it looks at kerry's change of staff as an end in itself ("how will this loss of key Kerry campaign staff affect his support") rather than as a process that will perhaps effect changes in Kerry's status ...

do you really believe that democrats, most of whom can barely even name any of the democratic candidates, are going to put much emphasis on whether Kerry has new people running his campaign? he would be lucky if they even noticed him as a result of this ...

the more important question is, what changes will the new staff make and what effect will those changes have ... and, imho, it's a little too soon to tell ...

[KaraokeKarlton]

15. I'm going by the articles in the papers

which you have to admit really makes Kerry sound like he's less than amiable to work for or with. In that respect, I do think it could hurt him. Are the staff better? Probably, although I still think whoever told him to go around NH touting gun control is a complete idiot. I can't imagine Shaheen advising him to do that because she knows full well that's a sure fire way to lose NH. I've been thinking for quite some time that someone working for him isn't really "working for him", if you catch my drift. Some of the mistakes have been so sloppy.

[eileen_d]

24. Do you go by "articles in the papers" that paint Dean as

angry, unstable, confederate-loving and ultra-leftist? Maybe you Dean supporters are just mad that Kerry's actually getting headlines.

[KaraokeKarlton]

42. this was actually one of my most mellow Kerry posts ever

I wasn't even being the least bit naughty at all. Dean was my gov. for a long time. I don't even look at the press as a guide for his personality because I don't need to. They're usually wrong, by the way. As for my local papers, they know Dean too and they don't do the labelling thing on him because we all already know him. It would be a waste of news space, ya know?

[Hieronymus]

3. I think it hurts him.

I liked Kerry a while ago, but his siding with Bush and giving him a blank check on Iraq, blew it for me. He's going down more daily.

[UTUSN]

13. There's That "blank check" Thing, Like "GORE Invented the 'net" n/t

[KaraokeKarlton]

16. Well, that's not really the issue at the moment

We all know about the vote and that it upset a lot of people. Whoever takes issue over that wouldn't have been voting for or supporting him anyway if it was that big of a deal breaker to them. What I was interested in looking at is how the campaign staff break up/shake up (or whatever you want to call it) is going to affect the average voter's perception of him.

[MagicMan]

4. The number of people

paying attention to these campaign details at this time are such a minority of the voting public and even the primary voters that it will have all of no negative effect in an of itself, nor positive effect.

The only effect that will be caused by this is by those who fill the vacancies. Positive or negative is still to be seen.

Personally, I think he is done. And have thought so since he said "Dean is imploding."

Kerry could only wish for such an implosion.

[Jacobin]

5. I don't think its the end of the race for him.

It's a bump in the road.

However, I don't think he has the groundswell of support that Clark and Dean have. It's gonna take that kind of passion to unseat AWOL in the face of the media blitz that's coming both paid and unpaid.

Kerry doesn't inspire passion and appears passionless. He will be absolute anathema in the midwest and south.

To top it all off, he's on the wrong wrong wrong wrong side of the invasion resolution and that is going to get much MUCH worse before it gets better.

I wish he would drop out now and go find his soul that he sold when he decided to enable AWOL's invasion (and THIS from a fricking Vietnam vet.....horrific and ghastly stupid mistake).

(If you can't tell I support Dean and hope Clark becomes his VP but will support Clark if he gets the nomination. I will support NO warmongers.)

[DrFunkenstein]

7. You Haven't Been Watching The Debates

Kerry has consistently been in the top two performances of the last month of debates. When the field breaks down - it will - he will get a better chance to show off his stuff. Until then, he's coming off as strong, loose, funny. Outside of Sharpton, he's been scoring the best one-liners. And he's looked Presidential, where I think Dean has floundered - and showed a temper distinctly un-Presidential.

[blm]

10. Dean didn't win ONE debate. The media acted as if he won them all.

Just like they did with Bush. Except then we ALL noticed the truth about the media. Now...

[KaraokeKarlton]

18. I tend to agree

I think he plays things too cautious and that does diminish the appearance of passion. I also think everytime he attacks Dean it only gets people talking more about Dean and less about the others. Not a wise move. I too think he's not going to recover, but for a combination of reasons, not just the IWR vote or this staff change. I certainly don't think either help him. Ironically, I think what will hurt him most is all his recent gun control talk in highly pro-gun NH. If he doesn't do well there, I do think he's essentially finished, and even NH Democrats know better than bringing up gun control. It's an issue they try very hard to avoid discussing if at all possible. I have no idea who made that call, but whoever it was made a huge mistake..

[DrFunkenstein]

8. Kerry's House Is No Longer Divided

The Boston people - the true Kerry people - won the day. You will see a much more confident and sharper candidate in the next few weeks.

[UTUSN]

12. "The average voter" Doesn't KNOW the Candidates Even NOW

and won't until it is one name against Shrub every day in the network news. This is not "an upheaval." The top spots have already been filled by seasoned people hitting the ground running. What's the problem?

[WilliamPitt]

17. What I worry about

is that the press will cover "The Troubled Kerry Campaign" instead of "What Kerry Believes In And Will Fight For."

[KaraokeKarlton]

19. Yep, that's exactly what I'm seeing in the local paper here so far

Since I live right along the VT/NH border, the newspapers here cover both states and national news. That's just how it's being portrayed and I think to some extent it's probably going to hurt him. As I've consistently said, I think all the talk about gun control in NH is going to decimate him. That issue is part of the reason Shaheen lost against Sununu. Guns are really, really big in NH, and in VT and Maine as well.

[flpoljunkie]

20. Like "Kerry Campaign Has Hit the Reef and is Sinking," Will?

[WilliamPitt]

21. DU is soooooooooooooooo mainstream, like the Boston Globe

Yeah, man, I really rocked the world with that thread. Didn't I? Changed the world? Read by millions of people? Wasn't it? Eh?

Methinks you overstate the impact of one thread in 100,000 on a web forum.

Care to comment in the substance of my post in this thread, or are ya gonna be all snarky and shit?

Edit: I'm in that picture, by the way. Upper left corner leaning against the pole.

[DrFunkenstein]

22. I Thought That Was You

I never trusted you, Judas!;-)

Pitt, follow your conscience. I hate to lose such a respected voice for Kerry if you do move on, but I'll know that you did so thoughtfully. You've been a great supporter for Kerry, and I hate to see people get snippy with you (we are, naturally, a little shaken ourselves, so don't take it too personally).

I have a feeling that if the ship goes down, I'm going with it. I honestly have a tremendous amount of respect and admiration for Kerry, and although he has never done anything personally for me (besides sign my book!), I feel a strong, strong sense of loyalty to him.

If he goes, ultimately I will certainly support the other candidates, but I really feel that he is one of the best things that could ever happen to this country, and that it is something like (corny, I know) love of country that binds me to him.

I'm not a zealot or anything - it's not like I think he can do no wrong or anything - but after months of getting to know him and his record more intimately, I have developed...I don't know...loyalty in a deep sense of the word.

I guess I'm saying that I understand and respect your decision, whatever it may be, but I'm going to be in it for the long haul. I believe in the guy, what can I say?

[ibegurpard]

23. Heartfelt sentiment

Do you even have a clue how much more effective what you just said was to get someone like me to relate to both you and the candidate you support than the daily anti-Dean diatribes you post? Something to keep in mind.

[eileen_d]

26. Yeesh, get over it!

Dean is actually running with opposition, I'm sorry if that inconveniences you or makes your tummy upset.

[ibegurpard]

28. With all due respect

You can sit and spin. I was attempting to let Dr. Funkenstein know that what he just wrote did WAY more to get me to see both him and Kerry in a more positive light than the usual crap he posts. If you don't like it when someone attempts to convey some positive reinforcement then you can just fuck off.

[WilliamPitt]

31. "positive reinforcement...fuck off"

hee hee hee hee hee... :)

[ibegurpard]

32. the positive reinforcement was directed ABOVE her.

the fuck off stands.

[eileen_d]

33. That was positive reinforcement?

Fooled me.

"With all due respect... fuck off" - now *that's* positive reinforcement! LOL

[ibegurpard]

34. Well, I thought I had made it apparent that I was voicing approval

towards what someone ELSE had written. You on the other hand, had the comments coming to you.

[WilliamPitt]

25. I AM NOT GIVING UP MY SUPPORT FOR KERRY

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[KaraokeKarlton]

27. I swear you're the male version of me

I'm much cuter, though. ;)

When your posts piss everyone else off I'm laughing my bum off at them. At least someone on here appreciates your sarcastic wit, Will.
If you ever visit Vermont I'll have to take you out to my favorite Karaoke bar and show how to sing like a man. :D

[WilliamPitt]

30. My best song is 'House of the Rising Sun'

Just fyi. :)

[KaraokeKarlton]

35. Do you karaoke?

I'm almost embarassed to admit, that as a petite little woman I can actually pull off the deep parts of "Elvira". But shhhhh...don't tell anyone, it's a secret! My best song at the moment is "Underneath Your Clothes" by Shakira. Luckily I don't ONLY sing bass. ;)

[WilliamPitt]

36. Hell yes

Charlie's has Karaoke on Tuesdays. 'House' and Steppenwolf and whatever Doors I can get my hands on. Enough tequila and I do Rage Against the Machine. :)

[KaraokeKarlton]

38. Awesome!

I don't even need any tequila...I get up there stone cold sober! In fact, I have my own set up at home and about 1000 songs. Seriously, if you ever go to the Upper Valley area of NH or Vermont, PM me and we'll do a duet. Can you do Tom Petty? ;)

[WilliamPitt]

39. So let's get to the point, let's roll another shnaaaaaa...

Sorry. I always got a kick out of the radio edit for that song. They blurred the word 'joint' and it came out like "So let's get to the point, let's roll another shnaaaaaa..." Always made me giggle.

Consider it a date. For my own data, what part of the state enjoys the Upper Valley area?

[KaraokeKarlton]

40. Do you know where Dartmouth College is in NH?

Hanover and Lebanon NH or White River Junction area of VT. It's around the center of both state right along the border. There's a Dean campaign office nearby, too...hehehe. We can pop over there after the Tequila and I'll get Becky to take a picture of you with a Dean bumper sticker stuck to your forehead. :)

[WilliamPitt]

41. Eeeeeexcellent...

:)

[flpoljunkie]

43. I know you were there, Will.

And you well know that you are an influential voice here at DU; Your "sinking ship" post garnered well over 200 responses, as I recall.

I just think your fears are premature at this point. Why don't you wait at least a couple of weeks and see how the restructured Kerry campaign fares in New Hampshire?

[HighNoonMeetUp]

29. I think it hurts him bigtime

As I see it Kerry is now out of the race. It's all over except for spending some more catsup money for naught.

[LittleDannySlowhorse]

37. I don't think it matters outside of DU

Only us political junkies are paying attention at this point. The average person very often doesn't even know that anyone is even running until the primaries.