The stupid religious bigots

[laconicsax]

I'm not talking the big time ones, I'm talking the average joe kind.

At my school, there're several Christian organizations. They aren't funded by the school (public university), but they're everywhere. There are a ton of people on campus who are a member of one group or the other.

What gets me about a lot of the people who are involved with them is the bigotry that they practice. They claim to be (and probably think that they are) open and accepting of everyone, but at the same time, they act towards non-Christians the same way that some of the worst "trying to hide it" racists act towards non-whites while in public or around each other. (yes, that made little sense, I'll elaborate)

It's disgusting. I can be talking with one of them and carrying on a great conversation, but if they know that I'm Jewish, the minute that another member of their Klan Evangelical Christian Organization shows up, whoever I'm talking to pretends like they don't even know me and have never and would never talk to me.

If I ever make a mention of it or flat out call them on their bigotry, they try to turn the tables and attack me for being a bigot towards them. When I make a logical argument, all they do is repeat back to me what I said and walk away like they won the argument.

Gaaah. The worst part is the damn arrogant attitude they carry with them, especially after 'winning' an argument with a heathen. They walk around with this look of "Wow, I'm better than everyone--you're all going to hell and I'm going to laugh."

GAAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!

[LibertyorDeath]

1. Don't waste your time or breath they are unable to think for themselves

Thats why they love being told what to think and say they feel comfortable with this if it means claiming to be a Christian while acting like a bigot then their down with that because their down with anything as long as they get to belong to the group and fell superior and protected.

They are in reality insecure frightened people who will do anything to compensate for their inability to think for themselves.

Talking to one is like conversing with a brick . It's pointless.

[Name removed]

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[JNelson6563]

5. Oh, I don't know about that:

Some of the "godless", "weak" ones had rules even before those you subscribe to, here's an example:

1. Trust good character more than promises.
2. Do not speak falsely.
3. Do good things.
4. Do not be hasty in making friends, but do not abandon them once made.
5. Learn to obey before you command.
6. When giving advice, do not recommend what is most pleasing, but what is most useful.
7. Make reason your supreme commander.
8. Do not associate with people who do bad things.
9. Honor the gods.
10. Have regard for your parents.

Unlike the Commandments of Moses, none of these is outdated or antithetical to modern moral or political thought. Every one could be taken up by anyone today, of any creed--except perhaps only one. And indeed, there is something much more profound in these commandments. They are far more useful as precepts for living one's life. Can society, can government, prevail and prosper if we fail to uphold the First Commandment of Moses? By our own written declaration of religious liberty for all, we have staked our entire national destiny on the belief that we not only can get by without it, but we ought to abolish it entirely. Yet what if we were to fail to uphold Solon's first commandment? The danger to society would be clear--indeed, doesn't this commandment speak to the heart of what makes or breaks a democratic society? Isn't it absolutely fundamental that we not trust the promises of politicians and flatterers, but elect our leaders and choose our friends instead by taking the trouble to evaluate the goodness of their character? This, then, can truly be said to be an ideal that is fundamental to modern moral and political thought.

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/features/2000/carrier2.html

I can't imagine completely disregarding another human because of their religion or nationality. Perhaps you consider that righteous and maybe you even believe your god does too. I should think that if there is a god he/she would think of us all as their children and, as a mom, I do not tolerate my children mistreating each other. Hard to believe a being more enlightened than myself would either.

Julie

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Kinkistyle]

17. Yeah, I would have done things differently too.

Like not introducing evil into the world in the first place. Sheesh, I am a better Supreme Being than god himself.

[Spentastic]

11. Oh Yeah

Christians get cancer. Are they bad Christians?

Or is your God not very nice?

[Bridget Burke]

12. Nature does indeed mete out her own discipline....

There are better reasons for doing the right thing than fearing you'll burn in Hell forever.

The fellow who started this thread was not, in fact, claiming to be Atheist. He's Jewish & he's objecting to the hypocritical super-evangelistic "Christians" who give good Christians a bad name.

A word of caution: You speak of "Nature" and "her own discipline" in a way that sounds almost Pagan. Some of your "Christian" co-religionists might take issue with that sort of language.

[PsychoDad]

13. I would disagree.

One's religous orientation does not graft morality upon a person. If that were the case, all Christians, Jews and Muslims, among other belief systems would all adhere to those moral codes of their faith. ie: All christians would love their neighbor, regardless of who or what he or she is, All Muslims would give all they could spare to care for the poor and all Wiccans would "Harm none".

Seems to me that your argument goes the other way, that having a defined moral code embedded into a religion should provide a beacon for conduct for the adherants of said religion. From your argument the "Godless" folks don't know any better, but we who follow a faith certanly should...

Yet on the whole we are at least just as sinful, maybe more if we count pride. And you are quite right, we have no excuse.

An atheist carries with them the same "moral compass" that everyone else does. The bearing on that compass (IMHO) relies more upon how we view others, and their rights as fellow humanbeings, than any religion. And the standard of that compass should be, as the prophet Jesus (saw) advised, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you".

Just my 2 cents (usd) worth.

[kcwayne]

15. Drivel

Your post encapsulates morality as where and how often a human chooses to touch another in a sexual way. You take delight that there are "rewards" of misery for those that do such things.

This isn't morality, its vengeance, and its pathetically weak minded drool for imbeciles.

While logical comprehension is not a trait found in the deeply dogmatic, try to comprehend that Atheism no more equivalent to promiscuity than Christianity is to stupidity, although you are doing your best to disprove my latter point.

[Kinkistyle]

16. More blatant assertions. Atheists actually MORE moral than Religionists.

Atheists do not engage in whatever the hell they please. You are just making baseless assertions. They are no more immoral than regular god-fearing religionists and are probably MORE moral. Most atheists behave ethically and follow the law out of a feeling of social obligation. Behaving lawfully and working together benefits society, which in turn benefits the individual. Its the classic case of "The Prisoner's Dilemma".

On the other hand, Christians behave morally because god tells them to. God commands his followers to do as he says, on penalty of burning for an eternity in hell. In other words, Christians only behave morally only out of fear.

Let me ask you a question, is the only reason why you don't steal and murder because God told you not to? If God said said it was ok to rape women, would you do it?

[BiggJawn]

18. Boy, are YOU wrong.

"it is the godless folks who are the weak ones."

What a load of hooey. So, I'm "weak", is it?
Tell me, which one of us is standing on his own 2 feet and which one of us is standing with his deity myth CRUTCH?

Y'know, just because I CAN " engage in whatever twisted behavior they desire for awhile..." Doesn't mean I do.

I have morals, and when compared to the morals of some of chrisitanity's more illustrious sales reps (Jimmy Swagart, Amy Semple McPherson, etc) who have publicly exhibited the moals of a jack rabbit, I have to laugh at you.

[LeahMira]

20. Wow yourself...

The fact of the matter is....it is the godless folks who are the weak ones. The basic reason for this is they have not taken any moral stands.

That's a broad brush you're painting with. Since you don't personally know all the "godless folks" out there, maybe you're generalizing on the basis of those two "godless folks" you actually know personally? Then, of course, there's the idea that if I were one of those "godless folks" you speak about I don't imagine I'd spend a whole lot of time discussing my moral stands or the way I arrive at them with you since it certainly seems that you've made up your mind that I haven't any moral stands. Pearls to pigs, y'know.

Funny how life is. If you sleep with anyone you please at any time, nasty little consequences like AIDS, divorce, insecure children, and broken lives can make life a 'hell on earth'. Nature kind of metes out her own discipline during life.

Well, you have that right. Thing of it is that I call that force that metes out the rewards and punishments "nature" and you call that force "G-d." Either way, and by whatever name, that force never stopped anyone from sleeping with anyone they pleased if that's what the person set their mind to do.

[Tyler Durden]

24. YOO HOO! This is an obvious TROLL!

Why not ALERT and stop giving clowns like this bandwidth? There is precious little to spare these days.

[BiggJawn]

34. Bandwidth is a finite commodity?

I don't buy it. Sounds like those ham radio clowns I had to put up with 20 years ago who turned the deviation on their radios to +/- 1.5 KHz to "conserve bandwidth" on a system designed for +/- 5 khz deviation. Net result was the "conservationists" were difficult to hear w/o turning the volume up full.

Tyler, don't preach a gospel of "scarcity", that's the Con's job. "We have to charge so much for everything because everything is in short supply!"

And WHY is it in short supply?

Market manipulation.

[BloodyWilliam]

27. Saying you need religion to have morals...

Is like saying you need a '90 Ford Escort to have transportation. There are other vehicles out there, y'know. Philosophy has produced some far more reasonable and, in my opinion, moral codes of conduct and thought than conventional religious thought ever has.

On edit: If being "Godless" makes you weak, then I'm stronger than you. You have just one, I have... I dunno, five or six so far. Still recruiting though! :evilgrin:

[progressiverealist]

28. mods please tombstone this one

x

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

29. No! Don't!

Stupidity should be on permanent, prominent display for all to see!

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

33. Aw s#it. They deleted it. MODS READ

Now people miss the opportunity to see stupidity in action. I'm serious, such posts are actually educative, they shouldn't be deleted. Well, that's just MHO.

[progressiverealist]

30. as a Lutheran and a college professor at what sounds like a similar school

let me say that I can really empathise with you. We've got a shitload of this type of fundie moron and they drive me batty.

[leesa]

32. What an ignoramous you are. What does morailty have to do with

evangelical christianity??? You advocate murdering people on a daily basis in Afghanistan and Iraq, but you haven't sinned because you haven't had sex before marriage. You guys are sooooo screwed up. You declare yourself "saved" and then you proceed to lie, cheat , steal and murder with a clear conscience like the fake christian George W Bush does. You are all disgusting hypocrits! The worst Pharisees.

[dfong63]

2. reality check

read through your post, swap "Jew" with "Christian", and ask yourself how you'd feel if someone posted it that way. my guess is that such a post would be deemed unacceptable, anti-Semitic, on this board.

yes, there ARE Jews who act in a very similar way to the Christians you described.

i don't think anti-Christian rants should be any more acceptable here than anti-Semitic ones.

[Enjolras]

3. Who else is proselytizing?

Actually, we "seculars" have no problem with people being devoutly and proudly religious, it's just all the damn proselytizing that gets our undies in a bundle. I've never seen Jews -- or anyone else, save some radical Islamic fundies -- try to convert everyone who isn't one of them. Apparently, they understand religious tolerance. That's why the Evangelical Christians are the targets of out ire. Evangelicals are just very high pressure sales people.

Jesse Ventura was not wrong when he said "Organized religion is a crutch for weak-minded people who need strength in numbers". He was just politically incorrect.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

8. this is one of those things that really tweeks my cheeks this early...

in the morning! I am already at work, so don't have too long to write, but here is something about the whole proselytizing thing :

What many people misunderstand, is that when Christ left us (meaning those who have come to believe) with the Great Commission to go out and spread the word and convert, the whole point was 'saving people' out of the love God has for each of us. I don't honestly think that the loving God Christ embodied intended for the current day or latter day Christians go to around starting wars, forcing conversions through threats, intimidation and down-right murder or through some cosmic guilt trip or fear. The Commission was about bringing people to Christ to share in the love and forgiveness of sin...what pisses me off about the whole thing is how people pervert it into the gross misuses that it seems to have today.

I share my faith with whomever will listen. I will tell them about the changes that it has made in my life and the peace that I have because of it. But, ya know, I am not about to try to scare the hell out of someone to try and get them to 'play on my team'. What sort of faith is based on fear???

OK...rant off but I just had to get that off my chest. Not all of us 'whacky' Christians subscribe to the abuses of many sects out there today.

TheProdigal

edit for the typical typos, misspellings and grammatical errors

[varun]

19. as an agnostic (of Hindu background)

and living in the southern U.S. (the Bible Belt), I am tired of all the evangelist types trying to "convert" me.

I just tell them, I worhip Kali (the Hindu goddess shown below)...



and show them an image. Thats enough to make them run - screaming "Devil Worshipper"!

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

23. Jesse Ventura said THAT? WOW!

He earns my respect! Links?

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

22. There IS a nontrivial difference

between being in the powerful majority and in a vulnerable minority. The subject and object of a sentence matter. Roles reversed are most often false analogies.

Laugh at Bush because he stumbled on his Segway is ok. Laughing at a street beggar because he stumbled on the sidewalk is not.

[JNelson6563]

7. Keep in mind it is their fear

and insecurity. Some sects of Christianity are kept in such a fearful state that to interact with anyone who is even remotely different (belief-wise) is terrifying for them.

I am sure it is difficult but I urge you to pity them, in spite of how their actions hurt you. Just imagine yourself living in such a state of fear!

My apologies to you for the behavior of some of our fellow humans. Forgive them their ignorance, "they know not what they do".

Julie

[Blue Gardener]

9. How about the ones at my door?

I try to ignore them if they are pounding on my door, but then they leave their propaganda literature in my door. What a waste of trees. I find it very offensive that they think I'm too stupid to make up my own mind about what I choose to believe, so they have to bother me in my home to try a convert me. Assholes.

[JNelson6563]

31. It is easy to mistakenly direct your

frustration at these folks at your door. One group, famous for their door-to-door efforts, Jehovah's Witnesses, truly believe that if you aren't one of 'em, you're doomed. They zealously believe the end is near, as in any day now.

also, social standing within the congregation is often (at least partially) based on the members' recruitment efforts. The more time put "in service" the more "devoted" this person obviously is to "the truth".

These folks should be pitied as they are brainwashed into dedicating their lives to promoting, in the case of JWs at least, a prinitng corporation that has their members convinced they speak for their god.

Julie

[Malva Zebrina]

14. I have never noticed much difference in the way an atheist lives

a way of life, compared to that of a believer. Atheists are moral people, ethical people, kind people, compassionate people and respectful, law abiding people. They raise good and wonderful families as good as any believer could claim to--in fact, I am trying not to say this for fear of coming close to bigotry, there are times when I can perceive that atheists are more moral and ethical than believers . I would challenge any believer to point out a difference in life lived by an atheist and that of a believer, for there is none, except for the belief in an afterlife lived in a heaven with the god--

Atheist divorce rates are lower than that of believers, and prisons are filled up with a whole lot more Christians than atheists--who constitute the lowest number of prisoners.

I have always been puzzled by the fact that an all knowing god needs all of this help to be "sold" to others--arrogantly and aggressively-if this god is so great, why does he need all of this used car type salesmanship and help?

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

25. Shed thy fear, o girl

I am trying not to say this for fear of coming close to bigotry, there are times when I can perceive that atheists are more moral and ethical than believers.

Compared to what radical Christians and radical Muslims think of people not of their faiths, that's the the tamest of tame. Why fear saying it loud?

Edit: square brackets for HTML. D'oh.

[msmcghee]

21. Prosyletizing can be a pain in the butt . . but . .

. . in a free country we often have to put up with speech that is rude, distasteful and obnoxious. That's the price we pay. It's the other side of the coin of being able to pretty much say what you want, when and where you want to.

OTOH - You evangelicals should know that very few of us atheists fall for the "just want to save your soul" schtick. You are infected by the God meme. Like all highly infectuous memes it requires that you spread them to others - like a virus.

Do you find that offensive? Then you know how offensive it is to have someone tell you that you are not a moral person because you don't believe in their God.

Even though (some obnoxious)) Christians continually offend me with that bigotted message I don't hate you. I put up with you because I love my freedom to say what I want - as I am doing here. I have nothing against Christians per se. All of us carry illogical ideas (usually infectuous memes of some kind), myself included. I even like some of you and call you my dearest friends - even though you can be a pain in the butt at times. Besides, I know you're sick (infected). I am not saying this to demean your beliefs. I really believe it. Of course, I can't pray for you - but I do hope you all get better someday.

BTW - In my whole life I have never had a Jewish friend try to convince me that his or her religion was the only true religion and that I should sign up if I didn't want to spend eternity in hell.



O8)

[LeahMira]

26. Find some nice, well mannered friends...

It's disgusting. I can be talking with one of them and carrying on a great conversation, but if they know that I'm Jewish, the minute that another member of their Klan Evangelical Christian Organization shows up, whoever I'm talking to pretends like they don't even know me and have never and would never talk to me.

I hope you aren't talking religious beliefs with them because by now you should know that they aren't interested in hearing about yours... only interested in telling you about theirs.

Meanwhile, there are people who talk with you and then proceed to ignore you when one of their friends shows up and they aren't all Christians. They are just all rude.

Don't even feel that you need to interrupt their conversation with each other to politely say good-bye and move on. Just move on. They probably won't even notice and you don't need to impress them with your good manners because they are not capable of learning manners if they haven't learned any by eighteen or twenty. I'm sure you have lots of good friends.