How long would war last if the ruling class had to serve and sacrifice?

[Q]

- I'm sure you've noticed by now that the 'war' in Iraq was started by "chickenhawks". Chickenhawks are described as those who promote war but never served or avoided getting anywhere near a war zone. They usually accomplished this dubious feat with the help of cash, social status and political connections.

- Dick Cheney had better things to do. Rush Limbaugh had some sort of growth on his butt that prevented him from putting his life on the line for his country. Some Chickenhawks insist they wanted to serve, but that minorities had shoved them aside and taken their spots. Others got into the guard using political connections and then deserted while thousands died in Vietnam.

- But what if the sons and daughters of Chickenhawks had to serve? Would that make the ruling class chickenhawks think twice before they started wars? Would sacrificing the lives of their own give them pause and send them on a path of peace and diplomacy?

- It's one thing to sacrifice the lives of our children in defense of country. It's quite another to send them to die in foreign lands in a preemptive, aggressive war based on lies, deceptions and greed. Even worse is that many Americans know this war was unnecessary for the defense of our country but still support the Chickenhawks who started it.

- Our children are dying in Iraq so Bush* can dress up in a flight suit and play the role of a 'brave' Commander in Chief. They're dying so that friends of Bush* can become even richer as they keep their own sons and daughters safe at home. They're dying to keep oil pipelines safe for Bechtel and Halliburton. They're dying...not in defense of our 'homeland'...but because the Bushies wanted war instead of peace.

- This war is not only wrong...it's a crime against humanity and everything that used to make America great.

[Military Brat]

1. About as long as it takes for someone to ask that question

eom

[Q]

2. Military Brat

- What are your general feelings about the invasion and occuption of Iraq? Do you think it was 'necessary'? Are you offended that the Bushies lied to push us into this war?

- The Nazis were prosecuted for this type of aggressive war. Do you believe the Bushies are war criminals?

[THUNDER HANDS]

3. wars would never start

They'd pay off the terrorists first.

[11 Bravo]

5. Exactly!

Ya beat me to it.

[Q]

6. Those dying in Iraq in defense of Halliburton...

...are mostly from poor and middle class families. Seldom do you see the sons of daughters of the very rich and socially connected put their lives on the line in war...at least not in this new generation of wars started by chickenhawks.

- If Bush* believes this 'war' is just...why doesn't he send his daughters to serve?

- What kind of sacrifices are the rich making as the poor become cannon fodder in THEIR wars?

[Silverhair]

14. Wrong. More wars would start. Paying off the terrorists would

result in more terrorists demanding even more payoffs and the already paid terrorists coming back for more. It would quickly drain even the most wealthy. Terrorists have to be fought.
That does not mean that this war in Iraq is right.

[ScreamingMeemie]

4. What war?

;) There wouldn't be one.

[Silverhair]

15. Really? Then what would you do when some other country

invaded and wanted to annex part of your country? It takes two in agreement to make peace. Only one of those can decided for war, and war it is.

[grannylib]

7. I believe there should be a service requirement for all, either military

or Peace Corp-type stuff, similar to what they do (or used to) in Germany and Israel - I think everyone should be required to give back to the country in some way. For those who did not choose military service, some kind of local, state, regional, national or international community service would be required.
IF the reqirement were that ALL serve in one or another branch of the military and the ranks were full of the sons and daughters of these chickenhawk warmongers, we would have a lot less warmongering...
I also agree with Carol Moseley Braun's statement on Hardball the other night, that if women were equally represented politically, we would see the nation and the world taken in an entirely different direction (NO hateful slam against men in general, I am not trying to piss anyone off here! Thanks!)

[Q]

8. Service to country...

...and fighting in an illegal war are different things. Our 'superpower' military is being misused to fight unnecessary and immoral wars that take thousands of innocent lives.

- The Bushies had to INVENT reasons to attack Iraq that were outside international law or for the defense of our country. This is called AGGRESSIVE war and is illegal.

[grannylib]

11. Oh I agree...this war was totally unjustified...

And I do think our service men and women are being used by this misadministration. Not to say that they haven't been before too...

[rwork]

9. Good post Q. Al Gore served in Vietnam,

but the republican pundits shamelessly say he only served for 6 months. I believe if Jesus or Ghandi were Democrats and had served in Vietnam, they would be slimed by the right.

[Q]

10. And Gore is on record...

...saying that this war is wrong on many levels.

- Yet...here we are playing politics...with the Bushies saying that we 'hate' them if we oppose their horrible and unnecessary wars. The truth is that the Bushies LIED about the reasons for invading Iraq...and even the Democrats refuse to take him to task for his war crimes.

[It was not a pretzel]

12. They fought in WWI

They thought it was great fun at the time.

IMHO Christmas 1914 almost ended the war, as troops on both sides put down their weapons and met in no mans land. On several points of the front it took several days and threats of execution to quell the threat of peace.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

13. In my fantasy world

a vote for war on the part of any Congresscritter or Senator would result in the immediate drafting of that person's closest draft-age relatives: children, grandchildren, nieces, nephews, grandnieces, grandnephews, whatever they had.

In that case, each legislature would know that voting for war would be the same as sending draft notices to the young people in his or her family. They would be forced to consider whether the proclaimed cause was worth sacrificing their own relatives for.

[Ronnie]

16. About...

...thislong.

[Tellurian]

17. But doesn't the war....

provide a venue as a means for implementing the Republican plan for Middle Class cleansing?

The whole point of the Rethuglican agenda is focused on using taxpayer dollars to fund their International business ventures lining their pockets using the federal dollars that would be spent funding education, veteran affairs, rebuilding national infrastructure, public assistance programs for the poor and needy and on and on...

[tom_paine]

18. Wouldn't ever have started

The only wars fought would be "just wars"...and those are few and dmaned far between.

The Great American Patriot Marine Gen. Smedley Butler said this with his famous "War is a Racket" quote.

[JNelson6563]

19. War? What war?

;-)

[zbdent]

20. Here's a true Repuke hero - Van Hileary of Tennessee

was on record on a "Larry King" type show in the late 90s. Talking about one of the "Clinton distractions from the impeachment process".

He served in Gulf 1. Did he do it because Saddam was a slaughtering dictator? Did he serve because of the invasion of Kuwait? Did he do it because he was moved by the tale of Iraqi soldiers dumping newborn Kuwaiti babies out of their incubators so that the Iraqi babies could use them?

No. As he put it, he served in the war because the war in the Middle East would cause a great economic meltdown. Not exactly those terms, but the vein was that it was going to cause global economic chaos.

Seems he also voted against Clinton's 1993 budget because it would cause a horrendous recession and great economic chaos and unimaginable deficits as far as the eye could see.

[Scott Lee]

21. "Babies being dumped from incubators" was a huge lie

Courtesy of a D.C. PR firm hired just to sell the war to Americans. Just a note.

[zbdent]

22. That was part of my point - he never claimed that he was doing

it for the human rights, even to the point of trying out that debunked old lie.

[ShaneGR]

23. He was right on #1, wrong on #2