What's with this SEIU controversy?

[Skwmom]

SEIU Steps up Attacks on RN Practice

http://www.calnurse.org/102103/seiuattack.html

Once again, SEIU, a generic healthcare workers union, put its employer partner and other staff ahead of the interests of RNs and patients. Last year, for example, SEIU co-authored a pilot project with Kaiser providing bonuses to call center clerical staff for limiting patient referrals to RNs and reducing medical appointments

What's the deal with this union? Is anyone familiar with this controversy?

[Hep]

1. All I know is

if they endorse Dean, they are evil and worthy of discrediting on any and every level.

[slinkerwink]

2. yep, how dare the SEIU endorse Dean, not Gephardt?!?

Darn that Dean! Grrrrrr......he makes me sooooo angry with all those endorsements he's getting from unions that rightfully belong to Clark!

[Demobrat]

6. Ummm...the unions do not rightfully belong to Clark.

The unions rightfully belong to Gephardt. The anti-war vote rightfully belongs to Kucinich. The military and Republican vote rightfully belong to Clark. Only the queer vote rightfully belongs to Dean.

[Hep]

13. God knows

people should be single issue voters. Pick one issue and stick to it. That's what I say.

[Duder]

3. Could have to do with this...

CALIFORNIA NURSES ASSOCIATION LOSES BID TO STOP RNS FROM UNIONIZING

Labor Board Decision Affirms SEIU Agreement Enabling Employees at HCA-Owned Hospital to Unionize

LOS ANGELES—The California Nurses Association (CNA) has lost its bid to stop nurses and other health care employees at the nation's largest health care company from forming a union with the Service Employees International Union (SEIU).

A recent decision by the National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) upholds an agreement between HCA and SEIU, the nation's largest union, that enabled registered nurses and other health care employees at HCA-owned Riverside Community Hospital to join the union.

The agreement, which set guidelines to minimize tension between employees and managers during union organizing, was challenged by the CNA as part of that organization's ongoing effort to stop nurses from joining SEIU at all costs, even if it delays nurses' efforts to choose a union. The labor board rejected CNA's argument that the SEIU-HCA agreement violated Section 8 (a)(2) of the National Labor Relations Act.


http://www.seiu121rn.org/ourlocal/press.cfm?pressReleaseID=888

[hedda_foil]

4. Bwahaha!!!!

Dean basher foiled again.

[Skwmom]

7. The issues discussed in the link provided

deserve more than a "bwahaha" response. This isn't the first negative information that I've seen on SEIU which makes me wonder what kind of union it is.

[Hep]

14. And rightfully so

And there's no reason for there to be a red flag just because the people that are being criticized tend to be D's.

[Zomby Woof]

12. where's the bashing?

What is all this talk about "bashing"? The poster raises a legitimate concern about the ethics of a union, and yes, that uniom endorsed Dean - but if you REALLY care about Dean, don't you want to make sure a good union endorsed him? Instead, you have taken the "lalalala I can't hear you!" approach. DEAN BASHER DEAN BASHER!!! LALALALALALALA!!! lol

Had the union endorsed some other candidate, I strongly suspect you would be all over their ass, lacerating them and the candidate both. But because they endorsed Dean, they must be allll goooood and a-okay! :eyes:

[Skwmom]

19. The Republicans could not beat AARP so they effectively

took control of it. I think it's a valid concern that they could be trying to do the same to the Unions.

[Zomby Woof]

24. exactly

Unions have their fair share of selling out and corruption in their ranks, and I am PRO-union, just not blindly so.

Before this election, I have never known any of the candidates from either party to consider an SEIU endorsement that big of a deal. But you'd think once Dean got it, the heavens opened up and angels were singing to the skies. Like it was the greatest, most coveted endorsement in the world. They need to get a grip, but I won't hold my breath.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

26. Yep. A very real concern. eom

[Skwmom]

5. This doesn't answer the concerns

discussed at the linked site. For example:

"SEIU Blocks California RN-Patient Enforcement Bill:

SEIU worked to kill a major bill, AB 253, intended to beef up enforcement of RN-to-patient ratios - and impose meaningful fines on hospitals that willfully violate the CNA-sponsored staffing ratio law.

AB 253, sponsored by CNA, would have set $10,000 fines on hospitals that repeatedly violate the ratio law, and, for the first time in state history, establish $5,000 fines for other patient safety violations. At present, state health officials are only able to levy fines of $50 per patient in the affected unit, if a hospital fails to comply with its own plan for correcting unsafe conditions. The bill also would have extended the ability of state health officials to conduct unannounced inspections.

[madfloridian]

9. I see what you mean. Like they are working against member interest

I will read it again and see. Not a nurse, but it sounds like that.

[Duder]

18. Two bills...

'Intense lobbying by the California hospital industry stalled the Safe Ratios Enforcement Act (SB1005, Dunn) and killed a similar bill (AB253, Steinberg) in the final hours of the legislative session. SB1005, sponsored by the Service Employees International Union (SEIU) Nurse Alliance, would have required unannounced hospital inspections by the California Department of Health Services (DHS) to enforce nurse-to-patient ratios and other patient safety regulations.

“Patient advocates will be back next year to win enforcement of the new nurse-to-patient ratios. We won’t let the high-priced hospital lobby buy its way out of enforcement,” said Luisa Blue, RN, President of the SEIU Nurse Alliance in Southern California. “California needs SB1005 because we can’t let hospitals off the hook for allowing unsafe staffing to put hospital patients at risk.”

The Safe Ratios Enforcement Act (SB1005), now a two-year bill, puts teeth into enforcement of the minimum nurse-to-patient ratios that all hospitals in California will be required to implement January 1, 2004. Among its provisions, the bill requires unannounced hospital inspections and tough fines for enforcement of ratios and other patient safety regulations.

The California Nurses Association, sponsors of AB253, a narrower and less comprehensive bill, played into the hospital industry’s hands by refusing to work together with SB1005 supporters to ensure that both bills could move forward this year.

The hospital lobby opposed SB1005 because it would require inspections to determine whether hospitals “are meeting ratios that they cannot possibly meet.” The position states hospitals’ intention to not only to break the law requiring minimum nurse-patient ratios, but to subsequently duck any enforcement of the law as well.'

http://www.nurseallianceca.org/press/release.cfm?ID=1112

[drfemoe]

8. more ...

CNA's pending actions before the NLRB are delaying union elections for thousands of Tenet nurses and other health care employees in California.

"It's time for the California Nurses Association to get out of the way and allow these nurses and other hospital employees to form a union so they can improve patient care and work standards," said Luisa Blue, RN, president of SEIU Local 121RN. "CNA leaders should put their personal agenda aside and do what's right for health care employees and patients."

CNA's decision to oppose organizing agreements has been sharply criticized by a wide range of California union leaders. In a May 22 letter to CNA, the California Labor Federation's Executive Council urged the nurses' association to withdraw its charge against the Tenet agreement and said, "We were surprised to learn of your organization's 8(a)(2) charge in view of your past conduct. Two years ago, CNA signed a private election agreement with Catholic Healthcare West, giving your organization exclusive organizing rights for registered nurses in their hospitals."

[madfloridian]

10. Now I am confused.

:shrug:

[Skwmom]

11. Maybe CNA was worried about the "type" of union doing the

organizing:

Continuing to Erode RN Contract Standards:


"SEIU has negotiated substandard contract language that permits staffing decisions to be based on employers "business needs," authorizes restructuring, including replacement of RNs with LVNs, ties bonuses to employer financial performance and restricts RN patient advocacy rights through "confidentiality" gag clauses."

If this is true, it doesn't sound employee friendly to me (or good for patients!). AARP is no longer protecting the people it pretends to represent so it doesn't seem unconceivable that the same thing could be happening with the Unions.

[Cocoa]

15. the nursing profession is seriously threatened

by the increased use of lower paid health care workers.

This looks like an incredibly complex issue, but I bet that's the basic conflict.

But the Dean factor I think is going to prevent a good discussion. There's going to be a lot of "bwa ha ha" stuff.

[Hep]

17. It's kind of a shame

that a persons record of seeking out anything at all that might damage Dean would become the focus. :shrug:

[Hep]

16. Maybe, but

none of the literature I have found has included a discussion of the shortage of RN's in this country. How does that play in?

I did notice that the CNA was exceited about Arnolds appointment of the new Health and Human Services secretary, a former Pete Wilson appointee.

[drfemoe]

21. What "type" is it ?

:scared:

[drfemoe]

20. calnurse spends a lot of web space

making the SEIU look like evil doers, no doubt about that.
It's clearly a case of union competition, with a lot of sour grapes thrown in. I'm not going to become an expert in RN policy in order to judge who is right or wrong. Nurses can decide for themselves.

I will observe that SEIU is
committed to the same "issues" we are.

The SEIU Nurse Alliance
The largest, fastest-growing, most effective national union for nurses

Tell President Bush: Patients and Caregivers Need Overtime Protections
Under new rules proposed by the Bush Administration, nurses and other health professionals can be forced to work overtime without extra pay--even if it means they can’t possibly provide the care their patients need. Both the House and Senate have voted to block Bush's overtime takeaway, but Bush is threatening to veto legislation that would stop implementation of the new overtime rules. Tell Bush to withdraw his rules and respect the needs of caregivers and patients.
http://www.seiu.org/health/nurses/
....
They are politically active
....
Take Action!
Safe Ratios Save Lives
Understaffing is a national problem that needs a national solution--it's time to call on Congress to set safe staffing standards all our hospitals must follow. You can join the nurses from coast to coast who are sending a message to their Representatives and Senators that "Safe Ratios Save Lives." Tell me more
http://www.unionvoice.org/campaign/nursesweek2003
....
Take Action to Stop the FTAA
Flawed trade policies like the Free Trade Area of the Americas (FTAA) trade away millions of American jobs and put downward pressure on U.S. wages and working conditions. On Nov. 20-21 in Miami, trade ministers from 34 nations will discuss whether or not to approve the FTAA. Ensure they hear from working families and not just Big Business. Vote online today, and join tens of thousands of ballots opposing FTAA passage.
http://www.seiu.org/
....
They are running tv ads
....
View AHC's television ads--aimed at presidential candidates--that recently hit the airwaves of Iowa and New Hampshire. RNs Marietta Yoder and Brooke Gurley, mentioned below, are featured.
http://www.seiu.org/action_center/issues_and_action/health_care2/
....
Online videos
....
WATCH A ONE-MINUTE MOVIE ON...

America has lost 3 million jobs on President Bush's watch. Bush administration economists tell us a "recovery" has begun, but the number of unemployed Americans keeps growing...
{Also Health Care, Immigration, Worker's Rights, Education, Public Services}
http://www.fightforthefuture.org/
......


http://www.1199seiu.org/action/


They seem okay to me.

[sandnsea]

22. Different goals

The SEIU advocates for the down on the totem pole people, like LPN's and CNA's. The CNA is RN's. The SEIU is advocating to get more respect and work for its members. The CNA is saying that this is eroding working conditions and patient care that they have already fought to get years ago. I see both sides.

http://www.calnurse.org/cna/calnursejunjuly01/seiu.html

[drfemoe]

23. Just to clarify

RNs are also members and leaders within the SEIU. It is not reserved for "down on the totem pole people". *see list below*

The Nurse Sector Council has 15 RNs from a total of 19 on the council. Their membership is open to other health care occupations.
http://www.seiu.org/health/nurses/about_the_seiu_nurse_alliance/council.cfm

They bargain for a more diverse group, including RNs. Evidently CNA wants to keep bargaining rights for RNs separate, for themselves.

There are a lot of similarities in their goals, from what I've read; and I've read a lot because it is important to understand what's going on. They both criticize the Hospital Industry for trying to dodge laws designed to enforce union contracts and patient safety, which both unions support.

"In California, the SEIU Nurse Alliance is:
More than 30,000 registered nurses and 5,000 licensed vocational nurses at dozens of hospitals and health care facilities statewide.

SEIU Nurse Alliance members include public health nurses, nurse anesthetists, nurse practitioners, and nurse midwives.

The only union for registered nurses with members in other health care occupations, including staff physicians, radiologic technologists, licensed vocational nurses, respiratory therapists, pharmacists, certified nurse assistants, and every other type of health care profession.

Affiliated with the 1.5 million-member Service Employees International Union (SEIU), the largest health care union in California and the nation. "
http://www.nurseallianceca.org/about/

[sandnsea]

25. Different goals

Seems to me. The SEIU is a union that represents more fields with less education requirements in general. I can see where people with lesser skills might want to gain more credibility and/or be willing to settle for less wages and benefits, just due to general economic conditions. I can also totally see where an RN only union would be very concerned that people were selling out for less than they had to and ending alot of benefits RN's have worked for all these years, as well as putting patients at more risk. It seems like a bit of a class struggle and I kind of have the feeling that the SEIU is on the wrong side, to be honest. It's almost like a union busting coming from the most unlikely place, another union.