I was leaning to Kerry but I did not like his bulldog attitude....

[kentuck]

toward Howard Dean. It did not come across very well. He looked like some right-wing talk show host trying to pin somebody down. He just can't seem to find the right combination. Obviously attacking Dean is not the answer. But he appears to be getting a little desperate. He needs to loosen up a little.

[HFishbine]

1. Yep

"Answer the question! Answer the question! Answer the question!" is never a good debate tactic. The audience even snickered when Kerry began one of his answers with "I want to go back to something Dean said..."

Too bad. Kerry is emmenently qualified, and I had hoped that the talk of late about refocusing his message might salvage his campaign. But alas, Dean is so far up his craw there seems to be no hope.

[killbotfactory]

8. Kerry Mason?

Is that his old lawyer ways coming to the front?

Kerry: "I want the truth!"
Dean: "You can't handle the truth!"

[agingdem]

23. The media...

The way I see it is this...if the media does for Dean in '04 what it did for Bush in '00, then maybe Dean will win.

[cindyw]

19. Anyone remember Bush crying foul when Gore tried to debate him?

Dean will not look good if he keeps looking like Bush the crier in the debates. Dean thought he showed up to press conference and when a debate broke out he called for the teacher.

[blm]

39. Yes...it does remind me of Bush in 2000, and the press

is acting their same parts. Kerry = Gore and Dean = Bush. Till the general.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

2. If you don't want a candidate who is willing to attack the frontrunner

then you have to be for the frontrunner.

You can't win in politics without criticizing your opponents. It's like saying I don't like that boxer because he keeps hitting his opponent.


I suppose you don't want the Dem. nominee to be a 'bulldog' either and attack Bush? :eyes:

[killbotfactory]

11. If you want to be the frontrunner

Don't act like a depserate asshole.

[HFishbine]

16. Yes and no

You definitely want someone who can call his opponent on bullshit. But when that becomes the overriding message, it's a mistake. Kerry has a great record, some good ideas, and years of experience. But that's getting lost because of his focus on Dean. In the next debate, he should vow not to mention Dean, by name or inference, at all. Stick to Kerry, Kerry, Kerry.

Look, nationally and in the early primary state, about 25% to 35% of voters remain undecided. Which votes will Kerry have an easier time picking up, those who favor another candidate, or those who are undecided? I doubt if there are many undecideds who will think, "You know, I'm gonna vote for Kerry because I really like the way he goes after Howard Dean. That's what we need in a president: someone who can challenge Howard Dean."

[Feanorcurufinwe]

27. Gimme a break.

Who's gonna tell the voters about Dean's record besides his opponents? He's sure not gonna do it.

[HFishbine]

29. Um, er

Kerry's shrill demands of "Will you slow the increase in medicare spending? Will you? Will you? Answer the question? Answer the question?" were not about informing the voters of Dean's record.

But like I said, even if there is some grave misunderstanding among the population about Dean's record, and even if the only way it's going to be exposed is by Kerry's hounding, that still doesn't give people a reason to vote for Kerry.

So in essence, what Kerry is trying to do is knock people off Dean instead of giving the undecideds a reason to vote for Kerry. It's stupid really. He's fighting an uphill battle that has as much chance as sending voters to Clark or Gephardt as it does anything else, and it comes at the expense of appealing to undecided voters. I'm not sure what Kerry's motivation is, but it sure doesn't seem to be garnering votes.

[caledesi]

3. I found Kerry very disappointing tonight.

He just wanted to start sh*t w/ Dean.

Enough. I know there are going to be disagreements, but he was a weasel tonight

On the other hand, Edwards proved to be a classy guy.

edit: usual stuff.

[quinnox]

4. The problem was the satellite hookup was a bad idea

It was very awkward. I think both Edwards and Kerry should have skipped the debate tonight.

[Snellius]

5. Kerry has been a huge disappointment

I'm not bashing. He started out as my favorite candidate, especially because he was the only one who seemed to hold out the environment as a forefront issue. But since his illness, he has become a kind of creepy caricature, to the point he may be the only contender who may permanently harm his career by running.

[cindyw]

17. Dean is more and more dissapointing

I started off considerating Dean as my choice, but then I saw what a Real President looked like. That is why I support Kerry. If winning means taking on your opponent, and it does, then it doesn't bother me that Kerry is willing to take on Dean. I can't wait for him to take on Bush.

You say that you are not bashing, but you say that he is creepy? Would I be bashing if I said that you were creepy? I would probably get my post removed if I did that.

Kerry is still making the environment a big issue. The media distorts the candidates messages to suit their story. Just wait to see how they will treat the victor of the primary.

[HFishbine]

22. You make a good point

The media does tell the story the way they want to. That's why debates are unique. They are a chance for the candidates to tell their own story. Kerry squanders this opportunity when, time after time, he uses his debate time to talk about Howard Dean. It's dumb on a strategic and a tactical level.

Frankly, we've been warned that a campaign of simply attacking Bush will not be enough. Kerry is demonstrating that he is an attack dog, but he's terrible at putting forth a message. I dread seeing that against Bush. He'd lose.

[blm]

41. No, he's GREAT at taking on Republicans.

He's lousy at attacking other Democrats. It's not natural for him. But, he's always shined debating Republicans. His series of debates with William Weld were a debate afficionados dream, and widely considered the best debates in recent history.

Dean has lots of experience attacking Democrats because he aligned so often with Republicans as governor and mocked the Democrats openly. He doesn't think twice about it.

[elfin]

6. He HAS to beat Dean in Mass.

if not New H. Getting frantic. Trying to be a "bulldog" - not working. He is enormously qualified, but has run a bad campaign thus far, given his promising beginning. Too bad, but I think he is out of it now - between Dean and Clark as I see it.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

7. Kerry doesn't understand that it isn't Dean he needs to stand up to

it is Bush. Bush, Kerry. Bush.

Wake the hell up.

[quaker bill]

9. Kerry attacking Dean is the answer

for Dean. It is not the answer for Kerry. It is not clear that there even is an answer for Kerry. But if there is, it will not include attacking Howard Dean.

The attacks from all sides put the focus on Dean, a position he uses to great advantage.

Kerry may have typecast himself. If so, then there is little that can be done now. He needed (or perhaps needs) to sell us on voting for him. Driving people away from Dean may only benefit Clark. It might not help Kerry at all.

[DrFunkenstein]

12. Yes, Clark Is Huge In New Hampshire

Kerry just might sew it up for him in January.

[DrFunkenstein]

10. Damn Those Spineless Cockroaches!

What has Dean ever done to deserve this kind of Washington claptrap? Just because Clark was a Republican and Kerry was Bush-lite and the real anti-war candidates were second-tier and irrelevant, that doesn't give them the right to bring up the credibility gap between Dean's stump speech and his actual record!

[ThorsteinVeblen]

26. right...

[blm]

13. Kerry and Gephardt are stuck doing the media's job for them.

They are highlighting Dean's inconsistencies on important issues hoping to make news. I don't think they like doing it anymore than we like hearing it, but it's either they force the press to examine what Dean's actual positions were and are, or keep letting Dean disingenuously beat on them for their IWR vote.

[flpoljunkie]

21. Democratic candidates can't rely on the media to examine Dean's record...

It ain't gonna happen. They gave Bush a pass, and they are giving Dean a pass. All of the candidates' records should be examined. Our media is basically worthless, in this regard.

[Scott Lee]

25. Ummm, Dean *IS* a Democratic candidate.

You're welcome.

[Jacobin]

14. Kerry is trying Hail Marys and he's looking desperate

Stick a fork in him....er, actually he stuck a fork in himself with the IWR....he's done.

Losing in his home state.

[0007]

15. Ya know Kentuck I agree, I started off at first liking Kerry, now..

..now I lean toward Dean. But anything can change.

[oasis]

18. So Kentuck, to which other candidate do you find yourself gravitating?

[kentuck]

32. I started out liking Dean...

But I have not been impressed with him lately, even though he is raking in the money like crazy. I still like Kerry but I think he needs to attack Dean in a more subtle manner, sort of like a straight razor instead of a sledgehammer...just my opinion.

I have been impressed with Clark. Once he gets his feet on the ground and gets his message down, he will be a formidable candidate. He is starting to sound almost as liberal as Kucinich. :) That said, I still think Kerry has a chance, but he needs to change his tactics.

[AmericanDem]

20. I "was" a big fan of Kerry

After watching his behavior throughout all of the campaigning, I have to say I lost alot of respect for him. It wasn't jus the attitude he tries to put across ( very similar to Lieberman ) but I also seen him steal other candidates lines as well. One for instance was taken from Clark, dealing with guns. Clark said he hunted and people should be able to own guns etc. but if you want assault weapons join the Army. Words to that effect anyway. Kerry used that during one of the debates.

[blm]

30. That saying about guns and Go join the army has been around for years.

I think Bob Kerrey used it in regard to gun control back in the early 90s.

You might want to reconsider your outrage.

[LeftPeopleFinishFirst]

34. blm is right

I don't think Clark exactly trademarked and copyrighted that little phrase.

[JI7]

36. i always used that when debating gun control

never found it to be anything new and recent. but it's a VERY good pro gun control point that anyone who is pro gun control is likely to use.

[LeftPeopleFinishFirst]

33. Well, Kerry does hunt too nt

[Scott Lee]

24. The behavior of a desparate man

That's what Kerry typifies at this point. And what's worse, few of his pals in the ruling DNC elite seem to be willing to come to his rescue. This has really got to suck for them. They wanted Kerry to be "The Guy" all along, but he's proving daily that he just doesn't have the right stuff.

You know in some ways it reminded me of Bush The First, when he ran against Clinton. Bush Daddy was getting so nasty and desparate toward the end that he was down to huffing and puffing about the size of Clinton's nose (calling him "Bozo"). I remember watching that speech and thinking to myself "my Gods, did he really just call him 'Bozo'?"

And the rest is history.

[KittyWampus]

28. Why Does Kerry Do It?

Why doesn't he essentially ignore Dean and dazzle us with his credentials?

I don't understand. He could address Dean tangentially and appear less acrimonious.

[HFishbine]

31. Exactly

What is his strategy at this point? Is he trying to win some votes? A third of the electorate is still undecided. Is he bound and determined that he's somehow going hammer Dean supporters into supporting him in stead of appealing to the undecideds?

For those who defend Kerry by saying he has to expose Dean because the media won't do it, I have one question. How does this help Kerry?

[nomaco-10]

35. This is the most ASSinine campaign season ever.....

Kerry needs to pull the fork out of his ASS, he's done already. Dean stays busy pulling buckshot out of ASS and Lieberman was just on Hannity and Colmes kissing Sean's ASS. Al Sharpton's still lamenting that tired old 'slapping the donkey's' ASS line. I really wish our candidates would stop all the infighting, concentrate on the issues and attack bush instead of each other, enough already it's hurting the party.

[welshTerrier2]

37. slick marketing, a script and a little makeup

i wish there was much less focus on campaign styles and much more focus on the issues ...

i saw that frank luntz piece with an audience of democrats ... most thought either clark or dean won the debate ... whatever ... but their reasons were very disturbing ...

those who thought Dean won thought he won because "he was attacked but he didn't get angry" ... those who thought Clark won thought he won because he came across as strong and confident ...

we're talking about electing a President here ... scripted conduct during a debate should NOT be a significant factor ... and neither should having a "bulldog attitude" ...

candidates should be measured based on their positions on the issues, their personal qualities, their experience and their vision for the future ... i have no problem putting a small degree of weight on your perception of a candidate's demeanor during a debate ... but this should be a very tiny issue among so many far more important factors ...

[RevolutionStartsNow]

40. You're absoultely right, Terrier

It's ridiculous that there is so much emphasis on demeanor in these debates.

[Walt Starr]

38. That's funny because Kerry has been looking better to me

I had put him to the head of the IWR yays just behind Braun on my list, and he pulled up one slot further today after Clark's statement about letting them do software in India.

[poskonig]

42. The attack dog Kerry is annoying.

I liked the statesman-like Kerry I saw a debate or two ago. Since then, he's been acting strange from his bizarre appearance on Leno to his Hannity imitation today. I was leaning towards him, but marketing Kerry as a kiddie-candidate defeats the entire point of Kerry's campaign, which should be based on experience, professionalism, and competence.

[UTUSN]

43. Experience, Professionalism & Competence

sounds good---------no, wait, why should we elect somebody on THOSE criteria.

[Jim Sagle]

46. Kerry on Leno? That must've been a real chinfest.

;-)

[IndianaGreen]

44. Bulldog? Kerry was more like a yapping Chihuahua!

It did not escape me the symbolism of having Kerry and Edwards's images on TV screens on the stage. Too bad no one changed the channel on them!

[UTUSN]

45. Well, Alrighty Then, Let's Gear Up for 4 More Yrs of Shrub

There's nobody better.

[bpilgrim]

48. you got a crystal ball or sometin?

where'd ya get it?

peace

[bpilgrim]

47. yep, dean is the bulldog here...

even kinda looks like one ;->

he 'capitalized' on the massive dissent to neoCON policies that was OBVIOUS for anyone to see with an internet connection let alone a staff and he has been smiling all the way to the bank since and to be honest i like his instincts which so far have proved benificial beyond most pundits expectations.

the only way to distingish yourself in this 'market' is to be precieved as an 'outsider' a 'rebel' and most important for the PEOPLE.

ask auhnold... he'll tell ya

peace