A united left, what would it look like, what would it mean?

[demsRus]

Each time * assaults the environment I think finally the left will pull together. Each time * assaults workers rights I dream of the left pulling together. As this assault on healthcare unfolds I hope for the unity of the left to turn the assault into a retreat. As our relationship with the rest of the world deteriorates before our very eyes I find myself almost ecstatic that the left will finally get their stuff together. I've seen more leftist accomplishments undone in 3 years than I've seen completed in 50 years. What will we look like and how will we act when we finally find union amongst ourselves? Or will we? If we do what will it mean?

[vi5]

1. It looks like sasquatch, crossed with Santa and God...

I think you get the picture.

The left is made up of one issue people demanding ideological purity. It is both our blessing and our curse.

[Homer12]

2. We can win and still be more decenteralized than the right

The right wingers wear jack-boots and goose-step becuase they like to follow, were as the left disgaree's, argues, etc... about every thing.

The minute the left crushes dissention and individual thought within the ranks, is the second we become like the right.

The right is changing the rules to win, we have to start changing the rules of a republic back to what they were. This is why we have been at a disadvantage.

[demsRus]

5. Dissent is the hallmark of the Left and of our country

I would never encourage or accept any attempt to stifle it. That being said, what will be the magic that will unite the left as in national governance that allows the flourishing of diversities and mutual considerations? I don't agree at all that because we are diverse we are bound for doom. As lefties we simply must protect our rights to be different, to disagree without being disagreeable, to advance progressive and intelligent ideologies, to truly demonstrate compassion. Are you getting my drift?

[tom_paine]

10. WAS the Hallmark of our Country

The Hallmarks of Imperial Amerika are aristicrocy, police state injustice, obedience, and hypnotized apathy...

[terrisel]

3. It would have a sub-leader for each important issue

That person would be the spokesperson on that issue. The so-called Left has a strength that is underutilized. We have experienced capable leaders who speak well, and with passion, and have a depth of knowledge. These people need to hold an important issue portfolio and act as spokespersons-Is Harkin good on Medicare, for example? Let him have that portfolio and a budget from the DNC.

Do you notice how many people have been impressed by Al Sharpton once he got to be heard by running for president?

The "left" has thousands of people like this. They are not being utilized. We seem un-unified because people have to speak out on their own and figure out on their own how to get the attention of the public. If the DNC refuses to fund these portfolios maybe Soros or another entity will but it needs to be an entity we can all feel a part of.

[rucky]

7. I Agree....Division of Labor

will make this machine work

[demsRus]

31. But we can only have one President, am I correct?

nt

[Hep]

4. There will never be a unified left.

IMO

[terrisel]

13. No unified Left?

If there is no unified "Left" soon, there will be no left at all, and no Constitution of the United States.

The Medicare vote is a case in point. The Republican Revolutionaries sewed up that vote skillfully. They co-opted the AARP a few years ago. No one on the left realized it. They sewed up the bribe money from their constituencies a few years ago. They used their propaganda mill... and when they knew they weren't going to win with an open debate they used the element of surprise-unleashed Novelli's support at the last minute and held a quick vote with little debate.

Get unified and hang together, or hang separately. It's our choice.

There is nothing so unifying as facing the fact that you have an enemy and that enemy is willing to fight you to your death.

[Hep]

14. Yeah, it's not that I'm not worried

But look at this forum. Look at how downright MEAN people get here. There will never be a unified left, because there's nothing to unify us. Even the evil of George Bush isn't enough to keep people here from lying, attacking, misrepresenting, etc. I just don't see it evre happening. And it's scary.

[terrisel]

22. Directing the Anger

There is a lot of emotion and anger. We need to help it get directed to where it will do good.

Part of Hitler's skill was to reinforce the pride of the German people and direct the anger of the German people to target the enemies he saw, rather than where it could be a force for good.

I think the Republican Revolutionaries think they can direct the anger in the US at the targets they choose-they have had success. Liberals are irrationally hated in some quarters.

Our task is to reinforce our American pride in our Constitution and our country and to direct the anger to the right targets. People are feeling angry now; they are not feeling proud. We need to feel confident and proud.

A lot of people on the Right are now trying to claim John Kennedy as a hero of Conservatives--that should tell us a lot about what people are hungry for in their spirit.

Few people are proud right now of our role in Iraq. They are angry.

Whoever shows them how to regain their pride and direct their anger will win the future of the US. We don't have to "win" in Iraq at any cost to do this.

[prolesunited]

6. Our inability to unite

will certainly be our downfall. When I was in D.C. last month for the protests, I had the chance to visit the Holocaust Museum (highly recommend it) for insight and inspiration.

The section that most caught my interest was the one documenting Hitler's rise to power and the parallels between then and now are shockingly, vividly similar. There were more people and groups in Germany that opposed him than supported him, so why did he ascend into leadership?

The groups on the left were unable to coalesce and put aside their differences to present a unified front. They could not see that the danger this man and those who supported his regime were more important than whatever divided them and focus on removing him as their primary goal.

Once Hitler was in power, he used it to CRUSH his opposition. If you recall, they did not only target Jews, but also the liberal elite, dissidents, gays, etc. and these were the groups he went after first so there was no one to object when they pursued their ultimate goals.

My only hope is that we learn from history and don't repeat it.

[demsRus]

8. What's that old line, They came after X but I didn't say anything

because I wan't an X, they came after Y and I didn't stand up because I wasn't a Y, do you know that old quote? Please pardon my very poor recollection.

[prolesunited]

11. Here's that poem

First They Came for the Jews

First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

Pastor Martin Niemöller

[demsRus]

12. That is exactly it. Thank you, thank you

:-)

[Guaranteed]

9. Like...was it Kucinich?...was saying...

we have to unite around economic issues. It has to be the people vs. the corporations. That's awful Marxist, but, it's really just that simple.

[sandnsea]

16. RFK, Jr. - Corporate fascists

That's what he called them in the Salon interview. He also put in a new angle on corporations and the free market. When corporations produce their goods and pollute to do earn their profits, that's not a free market. That's forcing local, state and federal tax dollars to be used to clean up their messes and pay for health care instead of them. I would add that when corporations pay less than living wages because they know food stamps, housing, energy assistance, etc., will make up the gap; that's not a free market either. We're paying a large portions of the costs for corporate products and the profits are going into the pockets of CEO's and the investor class.

And now the taxes for these programs are being shifted to the working class; justified in large part, it seems to me, because the working class is seen as the beneficiaries. So the wealthiest win again. Corporations pass on the real cost of their products to the taxpayer, the profit-takers pass on their taxes to the workers whose low wages gave them their profits in the first place.

Maybe the only way to really break corporatism will be to present the problem in economic terms that working people relate to.

[Guaranteed]

19. Yup.

Marx said it was fate.

[SharonAnn]

34. Isn't that called "Spillover Costs"? Someone else pays the cost?

Not sure, but something like that.

Yes, they take our clean air, "spend it", and return to us dirty air. We've paid for something with our clean air.

[terrisel]

17. I don't think it's Marxist, It's Capitialist

Out of Control Corporations that dominate markets by bribing politicians to pass laws in their favor are not free enterprise.

If a law is passed to require us to purchase medicine at a high price in the US when we can get it cheaper in Canada, we are not operating in a free enterprise system.

Free enterprise happens when the drug companies sell more product to more people at lower profit per unit. They could do that now by selling to billions of customers around the world-but that takes ingenuity in marketing and its easier to bribe Bush and Congress to force us to purchase at inflated prices.

These aren't free enterprise business people running these companies.

[sandnsea]

32. NAFTA - free trade medicine

Why don't people get the same benefits from NAFTA as corporations? And Mexico's medications are just fine too, by the way. My parents have been buying their medication in Mexico for years. It's usually the exact same stuff with a spanish lable.

Free trade for the people too!

[demsRus]

33. Now that's a concept I can get my head around!!!!!!

That's what was promised, isn't it?

[WilliamPitt]

15. Victory

[demsRus]

21. That's what I like about you, WilliamPitt

You can paint a word picture like few can. SALUTE

[KG]

23. thank you.

[Scott Lee]

18. Statist democrats won't like the looks of a united Left

The United Left would have these elements:

The antiWar contingent that may get in the way of a future Democratic president's war

Vegetarians who hate the carnivores

Carnivores who hate the vegetarians

Vegans who hate them both

Pacifists who would sooner sit in a concentration camp than raise a hand in defiance

Weapons nuts that produce on line books on how to make kitchen dynamite

Dreamy progressives who want to change the world, one Starbucks latte at a time

Angry and anxious revolutionaries who want to start the calendar year 1 after the revolution

And the list goes on....



The greatest wonder and energy in the Left is it's diversity. It's also the very reason why it can never unify to the degree you imply.

[prolesunited]

20. We have these:

Weapons nuts that produce on line books on how to make kitchen dynamite

Who knew? I thought that was the RW militia people. :shrug:

[Guaranteed]

24. Oh sure.

You can find plenty of very passionate support for the 2nd Amendment here on DU if you coax em out.

[prolesunited]

27. Supporting the 2nd Amendment and

"Weapons nuts that produce on line books on how to make kitchen dynamite" aren't exactly equal in my book and implying that DU's gun aficionados are on this level is disingenuous at best.

[Scott Lee]

37. Thank you. Count me as one of the passionate DU 2nd amendment

supporters. Not because I love guns so much - but because we must be ready to defend ourselves from the fascists if or when they get frustrated enough to make their final play.

Sorry guys, that's reality.

[Scott Lee]

36. True - but remember "The Anarchist Cookbook"?

That wasn't a righty who authored it.

[terrisel]

25. I disagree a bit on pacifists

Non-violence won the civil rights movement. It won the freedom of India from British rule.

True pacificism is the ultimate bravery. It is willingness to be injured, imprisoned, and killed for the greater good. It is both a strategy and a calling.

[sangh0]

35. SL thinks MLK and Gandhi did nothing but sing Kumbayah

when I asked SL how they won their battles singing Kumbayah, he went silent.

[Scott Lee]

38. Silent, or did you run away from the argument?

we know it's the latter.

[WoodrowFan]

26. what it would look like (alas)

[demsRus]

28. I really don't know how to react to that

But I hope you're wrong. btw, I did get the humor but I just don't find our political estrangements to be funny at all.

[WoodrowFan]

29. I don't find the situation funny either either

My choice of graphics was more bitter than anything. By the time we get a candidate ideologically pure enough to satisify the far left here we'll lose the centrists and 90% of the votes. maybe we should ask what it would look like to unify MOST of us.

[demsRus]

30. I've been told that some of my personal ideology is Far Left

I've also been told that I'm too much of a moderate/centrist. Go figure? I did appreciate the graphic.