Have we completely lost sense of reality?

[dobak]

Some things to think about:

- The Democratic Party is not on the verge of civil war, nor is it close to dying.
- 95% or more of the people here are ABB.
- All 9 candidates are good men/women.
- Democratic primaries are always nasty affairs.
- Not a single primary vote has been cast.
- Bush sucks.

Folks, get a grip on reality here. Maybe alot of us need a short break, or need to spend less time here (I am one), because I think it has distorted our perception of what most Democrats across the nation are thinking.

There is no war between the candidates. The war is here between the supporters, where it should be. It is that time of year to back your candidate and fight like hell to get them the nomination. Until that nomination, the other candidates should be viewed as unworthy of your vote.

[WilliamPitt]

1. Kick for clarity

[dobak]

6. thanks

I appreciate your attempts to put a perspective on things here.

[Jack_Dawson]

2. Yes. Yes, everyone calm down

ABB is in the hizzouse.

[Charlls]

3. wise words

hope everyonelse regain its perspective as you just did

[Gringo]

4. I'm not dispirited by DU

as much as I am by the national media.

Their endless pro-GOP spinning and Saddam-gasms, along with rpediciting landslides for Dumbya has just got me in the dumps. I'm just so damn sick of it.

You know, even if Al Gore gets his lib cable network off the ground and it's available on my cable system (doubtful), I just KNOW that the next time some tinhorn president like Dumbya wants to gin up a phony war, the "liberal" channel will jump right on the bandwagon just like CNN and almost all the democrats in congress did. If hardly anybody on OUR side will even stand up, what's the point?

[proud patriot]

5. Amen n/t

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

7. I agree with this post fundamentally

But I am more and more concerned with the big picture and the big picture is the dirty pool by all the major campaigns right now demonstrating a deep division. All of the top runners are destroying the party to save it each time they play dirty. The recent Dean commercial by the so-called progressive group was about the dirtiest I have seen yet and I am not on record as being a huge Dean supporter.

I am posting this not just to the DU community but to everyone that reads this site and this thread. We are LOVE CANALING our own. The damage to the party is incalculable. And the cost of this is that those people who wish to see an opposition party in at least ONE HOUSE....ANY OF THE FUCKING houses....are the ones that will be most disappointed.

[Virgil]

8. the disinformational campaign

If you have studied any on the War on Drugs you know that the government lies regularly in a well-funded campaign. Remember the Washington Post poll in early September saying like 69% of Americans thought Saddam was involved in 9/11 which is an absolute falsehood.

There is a huge disinformational campaign by the USG in many areas with media complicity. People would do well to remember that anyone can get in here and stir up shit.

I do not think Bush has a chance as he lost the last election and that was before he went on to be the worst president ever. The one thing we have to overcome is the media and the general perception in lemming land that the media is concerned with reporting the news. Everyone should point out that it is always the news talking to a government mouthpiece to put officialdom into everyones brain. People would do well to read Chomsky's "Manufacturing Consent" and talk authoritatively to the lemmings/sheep.

Now think on this. A person in a USG office can register here and talk shit and go over to FR and bash some gays and shout down evolution and move on. You can believe that there are paid people on here stirring things up.

I am for Kucinich all the way. I have never studied issues so much in my 50 years as in this election and I have never been so certain in the choice of a candidate. He is quite electable as is Dean and I say more so because he lacks the arrogance. But actually, I think that they cannot lose to Bush if we all get educated and tell people their thoughts are being herded to manufacture consent. The unelectability argue is bullshit as I do not see how a Democrat that wins the nomination can lose to the worst president ever that destroyed the economy, our freedoms, our environment, our dollar, the future of the courts, and the reputation of the United States abroad.

I think the Republicans that know, know Bush is going to lose and that Dean is the Democrat they want in there and try to slash the spending before the ship really does sink. I am for impeaching Bu$h on charges that have been published and floated over the Internet. I certainly would not vote for that POS. He is not electable. All we have to do is vote. We need a record turnout to show that democracy will be defended and that we recognixe the Bush Cabal and PNAC for the treason they are.

[Melodybe]

11. Right on Virgil, I agree with every word

I am talking to the Community Library about showing Manufacturing Consent, Roger and Me, and Unprecedented. We are looking for some other documentaries and if you have a suggestion, I would appreciate it. I am avoiding Bowling for Columbine b/c Moore too often looks like an ass and it is a tad polarizing.

I have been telling people to print up 100 copies of articles that actually are true (Diebold is a great one) and hand them out or just leave them some where. Plus National Freeway Blogger Day is Jan. 2, 2003 and that is always an exhilarating rush. There are so many things that we can get done, if we all just did one little thing.

I also think that their are people getting paid to stir up shit at sites like this one. I am very suspicious of the poster that only has a few posts and comes here spouting junk like "Clark sux", or "Dean is the nominee, everyone else should just drop out now." I think most real democrats realize that we have to unite to defeat Bush and that picking favorites is fine until the primaries.

[Kerridwyn]

13. Articles

I like the article idea, I'll definitely do that. Any other suggestions for particularly good ones? I think things that are no longer than 2 pages are best, preferably even one, so people bother to read them.

I'll leave them on the bus, and in the library, and cafes. :)

Oh, and what is National Freeway Blogger Day? I did a Google, but it didn't come up with anything.

[stickdog]

9. Perhaps fewer Rovian smears and slurs and a bit more

legitimate analysis and discussion would be helpful.

[knight_of_the_star]

10. I think this one just feels nasty

Because blows in this primary can be exchanged almost instantaneously, something that couldn't have been done in 1992, the last time this party had a fierce primary.

[TreasonousBastard]

12. I keep saying...

some people here take far too much of this stuff far too seriously.

As Mark Twain sort of said-- the announcements of the demise of the Democratic Party are premature. It's always been this way, and probably even more rancourous in the past when we had to contend with the Dixiecrats who are now mostly Republicans (except for Miller). Democrats have been going after each others throats since day 1, and it won't stop.

Will Rogers said he belonged to no organized Party-- he's a Democrat.

Politics is a sick, dirty business, and nothing's gonna change that. I forget which roguey old House Speaker said it, but one called it the only real adult game in town.

Like all real games, whining for Mommy when the other guy doesn't play fair just doesn't work. You pick your ass up, lick your wounds, and fight back. There are no referees to call fouls.

It's about winning, and assume the other side WILL NOT fight fair. Your only choice is how to deal with it.

Fighting over it here is stupid and a waste of time. Everyone here knows the candidates and issues, and most have pretty much made up their minds. It's that mass of millions OUT THERE who have to be brought into the voting booths, and that's where the real fight is.

The more time you spend here arguing, the less time you have to talk with the people who really count.

[cthrumatrix]

14. it's an "elite war" who doesn't want to lose power and flame any candidate

who threatens the PNAC agenda.

This week its dean..next week it could be clark.

Either way...lies are a way of life for the "evil ones" (PNAC and elite)